[Canola] when will be realeased the new update?

[biquillo]

I love Canola, and I use as a my primary Multimedia App in my beloved Nokia N800 even it has some small glitches.
At the moment my most hated bug is the problems with the ID tags, all the rest I can survive with :)

I love show my photos to my friends using Canola, all of them ask my where I bought this device they want one :)

1) So, when will be released the new update?
2) and the version with the bindings to help developing Canola with plugins?

I have lot of ideas I would like to implement. I use my tablet as a dictionary a lot but don't like so much the interfaces of the existent applications so I would like to get the backends of them and use them in Canola. When I would be able to do it? :)

I think the future of IT tablets is in Canola, not in Maemo... hopefully in one of the next tablets we could see Canola installed by default on it. I mean, I like as well Maemo but Canola is much user friendly and has more UI love.

3) Are you going to add support for Asian characters? at least display them using manually installed fonts. I have some music with tags in Japanese and cannot see them.

Greetings from Tokyo, and keep on with the good work!

[munky261]

there is no problem with the tags if you go and edit everything manually like i did , all my tags and album art is correctly displayed

[handful]

Hi Biquillo,

We are a little bit more careful with telling dates, because of the whole delay thing, but we do have plans to release an update this week. We are just closing the last bugs / packaging and it's going to be out.

A lot (and I mean a lot) of bugs were solved, Podcast was really improved (new download manager) and a lot of more things were worked on. I will wait for the release to put the real changelog also in the website.

So, question 1 was answered, and the question 2 with this release it's even near, but this time we focused more on the bugs (actually the plugin development is under work since the beginning) and I think we are approaching it =) but no promises.

Asian caracters is also under work, so don't worry that we will also fix this soon!

BR

Marcelo


I love Canola, and I use as a my primary Multimedia App in my beloved Nokia N800 even it has some small glitches.
At the moment my most hated bug is the problems with the ID tags, all the rest I can survive with

I love show my photos to my friends using Canola, all of them ask my where I bought this device they want one

1) So, when will be released the new update?
2) and the version with the bindings to help developing Canola with plugins?

I have lot of ideas I would like to implement. I use my tablet as a dictionary a lot but don't like so much the interfaces of the existent applications so I would like to get the backends of them and use them in Canola. When I would be able to do it?

I think the future of IT tablets is in Canola, not in Maemo... hopefully in one of the next tablets we could see Canola installed by default on it. I mean, I like as well Maemo but Canola is much user friendly and has more UI love.

3) Are you going to add support for Asian characters? at least display them using manually installed fonts. I have some music with tags in Japanese and cannot see them.

Greetings from Tokyo, and keep on with the good work!

[biquillo]

Really nice news! :)

Marcelo and the Canola Team, thank you very very much for giving this gift to IT users :)

[sxm]

We are a little bit more careful with telling dates, because of the whole delay thing, but we do have plans to release an update this week. We are just closing the last bugs / packaging and it's going to be out.

this week? Thanks for the heads up =)

[handful]

Yes, the update is coming =) We are freezing it tomorrow, testing as much as possible and if everything goes right... you will be able to update on friday =)

Lot's of fixes =)

[s2k]

Does it support video podcasts subscriptions as well by chance?

[handful]

S2k,

No, as we said before this is a "Bug fix" one. Really need to solve bugs on the current version, after bugs are ironed out we are going to start releasing new features.

The video podcast depends on the download manager to be as good as possible ... so we are working first on podcast, once it's right then you will get the videopodcast =)

Also, on the oven is one more video application!

BR

Marcelo

[BoxOfSnoo]

Does the podcast download manager include a "download all" button?

[dburr10085]

Yes, the update is coming =) We are freezing it tomorrow, testing as much as possible and if everything goes right... you will be able to update on friday =)

Lot's of fixes =)

Will this be available to N770 users also?

[TTgowings]

Thanx so much for the constant updates you and your team have been providing us all with. I too eagerly await the addition of the video podcast implementation and hopefully either with this bug fix or with the final release the DL (podcast/video cast) option won't time-out or error out so frequently. Thanks again for your continued efforts.

[handful]

Dburr, this is a surprise still =) maybe yes.. maybe not =) it only depends on the 770 software being nice to our build for him =)))

Box : not in this fix, as I said we are adding features to the podcast now, so some of them will be on the next release (feature release) that our plan is to release in maximum 3 weeks. Once the update is out..we will also launch the roadmap for the next 2 releases so you will be able to keep track!

the features are based on requests / matter to the concept. So podcast will have some nice additions requested (like dir choose, queue, auto download, downloading list etc) and so on... As well we have plans of course to add the zoom to the pictures, better cover art support and choose, compilation album wizard, and so on.

So please remember : this is a bug fix release, most of the things will be "transparent" but canola will work a lot better overall, after this one we will be able to really work on features (we already started) and things will be a lot better !

Br

Marcelo

[rene_canlas]

it probably won't but any chance that wma is supported in the upcoming release?

[handful]

Hi Rene,

Yes, WMA is supported already by the scanner. But I will not hide from you : it's a little bit tricker to have the tags the right way (then it is with mp3, etc) but it's there. Maybe it will be a little messy with somebody's library but then we will be able to fix it once you guys use it and report to us what's happening.

So an update on time frame :

1) We decided to use 1 more day ( friday ) so our release date is now monday.

The good news is that we are already testing the 770 version! So give us one more day and we will be able to release this waited version!

BR

Marcelo

[rene_canlas]

Hi Rene,

Yes, WMA is supported already by the scanner. But I will not hide from you : it's a little bit tricker to have the tags the right way (then it is with mp3, etc) but it's there. Maybe it will be a little messy with somebody's library but then we will be able to fix it once you guys use it and report to us what's happening.


Yes! My large wma collection and I thank you and the canola team! More power!

[handful]

But Hey rene,

Maybe the wma support is not perfect in this release but we count on users like you with huge libraries to help us get it right. as it uses a different system for tag, or at least we need a diferent lib to access this tags, maybe something goes wrong in the first update, but with our 2 to 3 weeks updates release plan things will be fixed a lot faster.

BR

Marcelo

[BoxOfSnoo]

Thanks for being so open about all of this.

I realized I'd like to see some album info for podcasts... I am currently downloading some that are 10-11 mp3 files per "issue" and I don't see them grouped in any way on Canola.

That's for the feature list though. This is looking very nice. Thanks.

[handful]

Hi Box,

This is something new (in the podcast) can you please send me an URL of a feed with an example so I can study and see how can we do that?

The downloader is now much more reliable and our plan is for the next (not this on monday) to release the auto download, current downloads, queue... but if this is also a high demand we can try to include it.

BR

Marcelo

[Laughing Man]

I look forward to testing the next update. :D

[mrtn]

What's about release?

[KAYZAI]

Been waiting for the release too.

i hope it's ready!

[handful]

hey =)

final testing, site is ready, all basic packages ready.. we are just installing, testing uninstalling, installing testing...
Now we have 2 more devices to test =)

770 gregale
770 HE

=)))))

But it's early in morning here in Brazil, we hope to release it end of the day (6pm brazilian time) or even earlier. (no more 00:00 brazilian time releases)

BR

Marcelo

[mrtn]

Are these minutes last minutes of waiting?)

[KAYZAI]

Still waiting for the update,,,, MUST..BE..PATIENT


Handful, Rapidinho!!! :)

[handful]

Hi Mrtn,

Better not wait for today. Everything was "Ok" but in the last round of testing we still have 1 critical bug:

1) Download manager (Podcast) is not working on BORA (770 and N800)
We are on this one, and we set up noon tomorrow as the deadline to fix it.
Bora is giving us a lot of headaches, but we will find a way of supporting with the needed quality

Please remember that this is critical for us, we don't want to mess with people's installation thus we are testing more than ever this time. Sorry for the delays, but we prefer to delay it than release it and have bad surprises.

BR

To let you guys know what's in this update :

So what in this update?

Features:

770 Support: for gregale and HE*
- Small issue with Dbus and non UTF-8 chars on file name still there
- Small hack to install on HE still needed

IRadio:
- Support for ASX feeds
- Support for .ram files
- HTTP redirection
Download-manager:
- Better error reporting for downloads.
- Implemented in Python in this version
Settings:
- "Refresh all" : Forces a rescan on the media library
- "Multiple albums entries" : Help fixing duplicated album issues.
- Simplified Media Library folder selection (two states, larger icons)
Player:
- Scrolling song title

-- Bugs reports from garage closed in Canola2 beta2:

1790 Album names are listed several times
1791 No Album Art displayed (Canola-tuning updates)
1792 Videoplayback: toggle fullscreen with thumb-press doesn't work properly
1796 Only pictures in view are cached
1798 Locking Keys stops playback
1802 Entry Text Field for "Add URL"
1803 Scanning media sometimes does not work immediately
1804 Problem starting slideshow
1805 wrong photos displayed inside selected directory
1808 UI freezes when connection is lost
1811 Artist is not pulled from ID3 tag correctly
1817 Canola blocks keys in other applications
1821 Lock screen and listening to music
1822 handling accents (locale fr_FR) in paths
1825 Default download directory?
1827 Podcast download stops when you navigate away to another screen
1832 Cannot navigate below the top-level media watch folders when connected via USB cable
1833 Canola 2 misses files changes when made from a USB connected PC
1837 Play/Pause Display incorrect
1838 Podcast Support Broken
1839 Incorrect audio playback in "all songs" mode.
1843 incomplete library
1845 Internet radio channels do not play
1846 Podcasts no longer stream
1849 keyboard becomes crazy
1851 Media Player "Mute Audio" Option, impacts Canola
1856 volume between tracks
1859 volume level coming out of pause
1860 Resuming playback by d-pad center button after seek causes track to restart at 0:00
1861 Existing volume setting ignored if new track is selected.
1873 video: play/pause inverted if clicked fast and twice
1874 broken redraw of interface
1877 Audio player should get missing covers from internet
1880 Scan works differently according to the selected folder
1888 Downloads of audiocasts does not work very well
1895 Error while downloading podcasts
1903 Filenames and folders with accent(s) not supported.
1906 Screen Lock stops Music Play
1908 Video list not updated
1913 & Symbol causing issues in title bar
1914 Albums with lowercase letters appear at end of list
1915 Different case tags for same album seen as different albums
1920 Music not found on 128mb SD Card on internal slot
1931 Audio Bookmarks
1932 ID3 tag v2.4 support?
1935 screenshot of multiple copies of compilation album
1937 radioparadiseinternet radio does not display song info. Default media player works fine
1941 will not find photos in certain folders on sd card
1945 no media found
1946 Canola2 stopped working...
1953 Sampler like Album floods Album views
1954 idea: please allow me to handle my own cover images
1955 to small area for tracknames
1958 Internet radio: adding streams without .m3u should be possible
1965 audio files problems
1971 Screen dimmer does not shut down with a slide show.
1989 lack of album thumbnail in album cover selection mode
2012 Exception thrown within Photocast plugin
2014 Exception thrown within Photocast plugin when quickly clicking next
2038 Incorrect display of albums with multiple artists
2044 N800: Inserting external MMC blocks viewing of Podcasts on internal MMC
2045 Backlight turns off in slideshow
2046 Locking screen pauses playback
2053 audio output drops dramatically when tablet display turns off

Marcelo

[handful]

Still waiting for the update,,,, MUST..BE..PATIENT


Handful, Rapidinho!!! :)

Tá complicado : / Bora tá matando a gente :///

Estamos pensando em soltar um release chinook only, mas não sei se isso adianta alguma coisa.

Abs

Marcelo

[mrtn]

Sorry for the delays, but we prefer to delay it than release it and have bad surprises.

Despite of delays I must agree: this is a right strategy. But waiting of such great thing like Canola is like suffering ))

[KAYZAI]

OMG!!!

You guys closed that amount of bugs? ,,, Since the last release???
Very impressive.

Well, we don't have much choice but to wait.

Well done guys...BEM FEITO!!!!

[zeez]

Any news 3 hours after deadline ?

[handful]

Hi Zeez, the deadline was for the devs =) but we are still working on the problem (I said in other thread) the download manager in Bora. At least is not crashing anymore... for sure I will keep updating here..

Br

Marcelo

[mrtn]

is there any hope that it will be released today?)

[sxm]

I am sure that many many people are waiting for the update to be released.

Ive been checking this site a couple times a day for the release since friday, but i realize we have to be patient.

Handful seems to me posing here on a daily basis. Handful, is it possible to just make a new thread in itt.com forums to announce the update?

[dburr10085]

I took his email this morning to mean it was being released today by noon. He came back and said that was a dev release. Maybe we'll get more info tomorrow. I'm a 770He user, so I'm really dying to see this for the,first time.

[handful]

Hi Guys,

It's always pain to come here and post about delays etc, but we know how software goes, you have a choice: release it as it is, or try to give that last help to fix something.

The thing is we really want everyone with support. And we are very glad to say:
It's working nicely on the 770, but apart from 770.. theres one special problem with BORA (2007 and also HE) : a really nasty DBUS bug in the download manager. It simply doesn't work as expected, it crashes easily, and after 2 days of not only investigating but testing / experimenting with that we are giving in our last try: dealing in the DBUS level (not on canola anymore) So now not only the canola team, but also our friends on platform development are focused on solve this.
Chinook is working perfectly (for what we wanted in this release)


I would like to hear from you: Do you think is better to wait a little bit more and have a global update with all the features working or..

Do we remove podcast feature from BORA (and gregale) and release it as it is?

To be really honest, We all want to try a little bit more in solving this **** issue, and release a nice version for the 770 users. We are all committed to that, we are happy to have the packages for the 770 owners, but this issue is really killing us and as you imagine it's hard to be able to change a old version of software : /

Also, if we think it stills a little bit suspicious we would ask some of the brave ones here to help testing it on their 770... before releasing it

Hope you guys understand it : /

BR

Marcelo

[Capsule]

Hi. I have been a long time lurker here. I registered just to beg you to release it now. :D Please please release it now!!

[dburr10085]

Handful - thanks for the update and all of the work you guys are putting in.

theres one special problem with BORA (2007 and also HE) : a really nasty DBUS bug in the download manager.

What exactly wont work?

[Nif]

I am not sure how many people have the 770, 800 or 810, but I guess the ones with the 770 are the people of the first hour, and a common release (time/date) for all, with common features would be nicest/cleanest.

Personally I can wait a little longer, even though I have the 800 ;-)

Really appreciate the regular updates!

[zeez]

Release it now! Chinook is the most up-to-date os version, so it's the most important one. If anyone hesitates to move to chinook, fine but they will have to deal with not being the main focus. (I know a few people think that bora is "better", or at least certain aspects of it, but i think the more people move to chinook, use it, report bugs, the faster all issues are resolved.)

[naovouporai]

as a 700 (OS2006) user i would say, release it now!

as a 800 (OS2008) user i would say, yeah, release it now!

why? you said you are planning on having regular updates from now on... so... let them come when they come, we are very anxiously waiting for them! =)

if i didn't have the n800 i would love to get my hands on canola2 for the 700 today... oh yeah... too long to wait since christmas... and there are a lot of 700 users out there.

Continuem com o excelente trabalho :D

[dburr10085]

Release it now! Chinook is the most up-to-date os version, so it's the most important one. If anyone hesitates to move to chinook, fine but they will have to deal with not being the main focus. (I know a few people think that bora is "better", or at least certain aspects of it, but i think the more people move to chinook, use it, report bugs, the faster all issues are resolved.)

ZEEZ - As I mentioned in a previous post (N770 - the forgot tablet), people fail to remember that the 770HE software is the latest software for many of us. We are not able to use Chinook. As a "senior" member, you should know that. Unless you have forgotten about the N770.
Handful - please advise us forgotten tablet users what will be lacking in our version of this software if released now. Once again, I appreciate your teams continued efforts to work on a release for us that is comparable to the others.

[zeez]

@dburr
I do know about the 770. And you will get Canola2... however you have to accept that the 770 is not the primary focus anymore. So why should others have to wait ?

[malong335]

I would like to hear from you: Do you think is better to wait a little bit more and have a global update with all the features working or..


Marcelo, I'm a 810 user so the 770 functionality isn't important to me, but I appreciate you wanting to get that right. Even though I would love to have the update today, I think that you need to be comfortable with the release before making it.

Thanks again for all your work on Canola, it's definitely my killer app for media. All the others that I have tried don't even come close.

Thanks,

Mark

[biquillo]

For respect to 770 users I would say wait until is done, but since the Canola team is going to release versions frequently is worth it release this version as it is and let the users find bugs and report them.

Why cannot release the actual version and then when the bugs will be fixed release another more?

Many of us want to help your team with bug hunting, isn't folk? :)

Well, I'm going to bed it's already 31th, here in Japan we are living one day in the future :)

See you tomorrow and hope to find a little surprise in the morning :)

[dburr10085]

@dburr
I do know about the 770. And you will get Canola2... however you have to accept that the 770 is not the primary focus anymore. So why should others have to wait ?

So why should others have to wait ?

Because one day your device won't be the primary device either. We are either going to be a community that sticks together for the good of ALL, or only cater to those privledged enough to own the latest and greatest. What would you like to happen when your device is no longer the latest and greatest??

[Mythic]

I say release now working versions and try to fix the 2007(HE) one.
If the bug is somewhere lower in libraries (as you suggest), there is a great chance that a new release of faulty library is needed and that can take days or weeks for Nokia. (if ever)

[Mythic]

dburr10085: if you have noticed, they try to fix the version for 2007HE too, so it is not about separating the community. (If I remember correctly, version for n770 was not even planned from the beginning.)

Actually, if one thinks about it, there will be quite a lot of irritated chinook users, who has to wait. So the community will split IF canola is not released soon :-)

[zeez]

So why should others have to wait ?

Because one day your device won't be the primary device either. We are either going to be a community that sticks together for the good of ALL, or only cater to those privledged enough to own the latest and greatest. What would you like to happen when your device is no longer the latest and greatest??

I honestly wouldn't care. It's nice if you still get support/software/updates etc for your device once it's a bit older (and in the IT world devices become old very fast). But i think the focus should alway be on the latest, don't leave out features/functionality because they wouldn't work with old devices. This kind of thinking is exactly what got Microsoft stuck with that unmaintainable piece of $%&/ called Windows.
I mean here it is not even the case that 770 users are left out, they'll just have to wait a bit longer. But i think if everybody else had a chance to already testdrive the new release and find/report bugs, 770 users would profit in the end as well. (And they don't profit one bit from a general release).

[lbattraw]

So why should others have to wait ?

Because one day your device won't be the primary device either. We are either going to be a community that sticks together for the good of ALL, or only cater to those privledged enough to own the latest and greatest. What would you like to happen when your device is no longer the latest and greatest??
Understood, yet this is the way of device support in general, and Nokia has certainly made a good-faith effort to try and ease the pain of the users of older devices via the HE and support for issues and releases of new software like Canola.

The only problem with waiting for all OS versions is that it makes no sense to punish those who have devices that will work with it now, waiting for some future date when the old OS version is completed. If the situation were reversed and only the older OS versions worked you'd have the same whining, it'd just be from a different crowd.
As long as there is still a commitment to work the bugs out of the older OS versions I don't see a drawback in releasing immediately.

Larry

[hyartep]

my opinion is to release now, without dbus fix.
disable podcasts for os2006 and os2007.

this way os2008 users will get updated canola2 and os2006, os2007 will get canola2 too (better crippled than none).

i as os2008 user, have to live with broken/unusable podcast downloads in recent version anyway.

[dburr10085]

Several people have talked about punishing OS2008 and Chinook users. What about 2007HE users who haven't seen this application AT ALL yet? I would'nt say we are being punished, but you other users have certainly had more than we have.
We are not Microsoft - we shouldn't tell our users and supporters that just because they don't have VISTA, they are going to be left out. I expect better of Linux devotees. Linux is a community - we will not be infiltrated by Microsofts vision of "upgrade to the latest and greatest or be left out". Linux is a community - if you don't understand that, then you don't understand what Linux is about.

[Mythic]

dburr10085: This is that famous "linux community": if I cannot play with it, you are not allowed to play with it too? The fact that version for chinook is released or not, does not influence your chance to see it sooner.
I do not know, what country you are from. I am from rather a small country (Czech Republic to be precise) and the state of linux (gnome, kde, whatsoever) translations is lacking in contrast to english. Should we say, that naehe, you should not release a newer version of your software until it is perfectly translated to Czech? C'mon, we are community.

[hyartep]

dburr10085: i would put it other way. why should everybody wait for one problematic bugfix, that affects just one part of the community? i recommended releasing for older systems without podcasts, so you can use it as well. without waiting for dbus fix.

anyway handful said that they will release frequently, so podcasts for 770 will come, although later.

i've thought they (indt) meant bazaar model (release early, release often).

[Capsule]

I am not certain, but . . .I don't think releasing it now is going to hinder efforts to get it working on the 770.

So . . .I can't think of a good reason not to release it now.

Please release it now!

[dburr10085]

dburr10085: This is that famous "linux community": if I cannot play with it, you are not allowed to play with it too? The fact that version for chinook is released or not, does not influence your chance to see it sooner.
I do not know, what country you are from. I am from rather a small country (Czech Republic to be precise) and the state of linux (gnome, kde, whatsoever) translations is lacking in contrast to english. Should we say, that naehe, you should not release a newer version of your software until it is perfectly translated to Czech? C'mon, we are community.


Mythic - good point. I didn't think about it that way. I do get frustrated with the way the N770 gets treated in general. I am reluctant to upgrade my device because I fear that older devices are forgotten about or not cared about because they are no longer the primary device. I've been through the PC era of buying a machine and by the time you get it home, it's already obsolete. I have learned my lessons from that time. I hope others will not so quickly suggest that the way to solve problems is to upgrade, as this means that some marketing machine is working hard to part you from your hard earned money.

Handful - my vote is to release now

[Nif]

It seems that as long as there is a clear roadmap for the remaining bug fix, people are happy with releasing now. I am therefore happy to go with that and will be watching this space for the announcement ;-)

[mikeob]

[QUOTE=handful;136155]Hi Guys,


I would like to hear from you: Do you think is better to wait a little bit more and have a global update with all the features working or..

People need to have patience. This "got to have it now!" attitude some people have turns rather quickly into "Why won' it work?" Please take the time to do it right.

[handful]

Hello everyone,

Thanks for the comments, and I think the opinions are valid from all sides. I actually would like to know the user base of each device x OS version, not to filter, but to have a understanding of what to aim first at several decisions.

The focus for now of course is the 770 (don't matter if 2006 or HE) Why? Because we made a promise.

So, I unfortunately need to take a action because I can't hold all the team in one issue for too long, we need to get it going. The plan is clear now :

We have all the workforce, (ok, almost all - youtube and last.fm and more formats support are under development) working on the issue, but.. if we cannot make it until tomorrow, we will release it (the updated version) for everyone but lacking podcast for the OS2006, HE and Bora for both n770 and n800. Chinook users will get the podcast feature.

But the sad part: if the bug is not under our realm (eg: the python bindings of DBUS) we will be out of luck, and unfortunately the BORA and Gregale users will have no updates in "That" front. It will like the others, receive all others updates, but if the problem is in the component level in the platform where we cannot fix it : / we will focus on the future and newer devices :/

I know that sounds bad, but people need to remind that there's a huge gap between BORA and chinook, and I can tell you Nokia did a great job on chinook fixing so much bugs that our life is a lot easier with that.

Anyways great to hear from you, and at least we were able to improve small bits in the meantime =)

BR

[sxm]

I vote to release now

n800 user w/ os2008

[e-motion]

So why should others have to wait ?

Because one day your device won't be the primary device either. We are either going to be a community that sticks together for the good of ALL, or only cater to those privledged enough to own the latest and greatest. What would you like to happen when your device is no longer the latest and greatest??

This doesn't really make sense to me. Once my n810 is not the latest and greatest, I expect to not be the main priority any longer, just as it always is with any electronics for as far as I can remember.

I say release it now so the 770 users can help you debug that version and get to enjoy what is working, then add those features when they're ready for that version. That way, everybody gets to enjoy something NOW as opposed to everybody WAITING for an undetermined amount of time. Common sense to me.

[Capsule]

I vote to release now

n800 user w/ os2008

[hfw01]

looking forward to seeing it as soon as you release.

I would vote for it to be released now. OS2008 users get the new version. I am currently not using Canola2 because of how it is handling the tags I've got. I hope that the update fixes enough of it to make it usable. I also need wma support to make it a viable candidate for me to adopt. 770 users get something they haven't had available to them, even if it is not perfect.

This will still be beta, correct? I see no issue with releasing with a known bug.

OS2008/N800

[Wavy]

N800 w/os2008

[jer006]

I would love to see this released right now and more frequently in the future, it is still in beta so surely the more people using and testing it will result in more bugs being found and a better quality end product! Surely a Beta phase is used to test new features over a wide audience with frequent releases to take care of bugs (and/or feature requests) as and when they arise...

I for one would like to test out the new features and start using a more fully featured media player than the built in player - the built in does a good job of albums with multiple artists (and real player streams) while I wait on Canola to get updated.

It is important for love to be shown to all tablets (I also have a 770 running the latest HE but my primary table is an n800 with OS2008) but can you not set up the repository so that the chinook tree is up to date and the bora and greagle/mistral trees will be updated once the dbus bug has been ironed out.

However devices and technology move on and sometimes you need to upgrade or be left behind - to continually work on older technology just for the sake of the community can cost more man hours to ensure backward compatibility at the cost of new functionality/features... Remember the currently nokia supported 770 OS is OS2006, the HE version is not supported or endorsed by nokia!

I love my 770 but the n800 is so much better and was well worth the upgrade!

[dburr10085]

N770 Os2007he

[bthessel]

I vote for now.

N800/OS2008

[Nif]

Hi,

I almost tend to forget that this is still beta indeed. Please focus your efforts on releasing now.

N800 with OS2008

[dburr10085]

Jer006

In reference to:
However devices and technology move on and sometimes you need to upgrade or be left behind

I agree, but please take into account that Nokia has released 3 devices in about 2yrs. The N770 was released November 2005, so lets say 2006, then they released 2 devices in 2007, each time they told you "this is the device you need to have". The've released these devices so close, that you have to assume that while they were selling you on how great one device was, they were already getting themselves set up to sell you something else again telling you the same story. The reason that we are in the predicament that we are in now is because Nokia obviously spent minimal time in getting it right so that even older devices could upgrade (sure I would expect to see a slowdown), but this is like buying a PC and not even being able to install the latest version of windows at all. We all know that you can install any version of windows that you want, but you may be slower with some versions. Nokia is not focusing on software operability, instead they are focusing on putting anything out there that they can sell. Nokia also promised that they were working on a version of OS2008 for the N770 - anybody hear anything about that lately?? That would solve this problem. Seems that the root is Nokia actually taking a vested interest in it's product and seeing it through.
Sorry to rant - but I'm angry at NOKIA. I think the people who take the time to ensure backwards compatability deserve a big THANK YOU, and Nokia should be paying you to do what they obviously forgot about.

[N770-Freak]

I also vote for now.

N800 w/ OS2008

[loughmillermedia]

I have an n800 with OS2008

[handful]

Hi Guys,

So we decided, tomorrow you get it. Working ot not the podcast. Actually the podcast issue doesn't help the more people test it, it's just there and it perfectly reproduceable, but indeed we need more bugs from the fixeds =)

So you will get it tomorrow, and we will be happy to receive a lot of bugs, but next week is carnival in Brazil, so be patience with the following update =) ( lol )

As promised, we are indeed going to publish our desired roadmap in the website, but I can already say something now :

For the next release, scheduled for the last week of february first weeks of march :

+ Lot's of bug fixes
+ Youtube plugin (streams video, search, featured, bookmark your favorite videos)
+ Last.fm plugin (Audioscrobble support)
+ Zooming on Image (under evaluation) but is in the plans
+ Podcast improvements
+ More file formats Supported

Also, but not promising the 2 biggest features in our opinions could be on this one, to start testing right away :

+ Upnp (Using Brisa)
+ Third Party Plugin Support + docs

But of course this is a "plan" and we are sharing because you all can influence the priorities, but this is of course based on the request x our current plans / resources.

We are now much faster than in Canola1 to implement those, and yes we do plan to release often as much as possible. The plan is to release at least monthly, due to the amount of testing needed today (3 devices, 2 or 3 software versions etc)

BR

Marcelo

[ghoonk]

Sorry, can't agree with you here.

If you bought a car today, and the manufacturer released a new model next week with more power, better handling and braking and the fuel efficiency of a diesel engine, would you go back and demand to have the latest engine management system, the improved brakes and suspension?

When we bought our tablets, we bought a snapshot of what could be achieved then. Back in 2006, before the N800 or N810 was made/sold, did it accomplish what it was supposed to do? I'm sure it did, or you would not (or should not) have bought it.

New models come out ever so often in today's consumer-driven society, and it would be dead unreasonable to expect manufacturers to stand obliged to upgrade previous generation device. Why? Because the device that the sold you in the first place worked as it said on the box. If your needs had changed, then expect to shell out for the next generation device.

Your example with the PC is a good one -- Guess what, the very expensive notebook I bought early last year isn't Vista-compatible, but XP Professional that came with it works perfectly well. Are you saying that I should go back to Lenovo and start ranting that they SHOULD BE OBLIGED to MAKE my notebook Vista-compatible, and that I am very ANGRY with them? I don't think so :)

Maybe someone should offer a leasing option for consumer devices such as iPods, notebooks and Internet Tablets. It would be a perfect option for consumers who think like you. ;)

[Lost]

Just registered to vote: Release yesterday, PLEASE!

770 / 2006 & 2007HE

[TTgowings]

Handful, all I can say is wow ! It's so nice to hear from and get input back and forth from a dev, unlike other devs/publishers who for some reason think that any information they provide is some kind of national secret and we as consumers should feel privileged to even use their products in the first place.

This has got to be one of the best user based communities out there, and to finally have 1 media center/player to rule all on the NIT will be great. (with the additions you spoke of, youtube integration etc)

[dburr10085]

Sorry, can't agree with you here.

If you bought a car today, and the manufacturer released a new model next week with more power, better handling and braking and the fuel efficiency of a diesel engine, would you go back and demand to have the latest engine management system, the improved brakes and suspension?

When we bought our tablets, we bought a snapshot of what could be achieved then. Back in 2006, before the N800 or N810 was made/sold, did it accomplish what it was supposed to do? I'm sure it did, or you would not (or should not) have bought it.

New models come out ever so often in today's consumer-driven society, and it would be dead unreasonable to expect manufacturers to stand obliged to upgrade previous generation device. Why? Because the device that the sold you in the first place worked as it said on the box. If your needs had changed, then expect to shell out for the next generation device.

Your example with the PC is a good one -- Guess what, the very expensive notebook I bought early last year isn't Vista-compatible, but XP Professional that came with it works perfectly well. Are you saying that I should go back to Lenovo and start ranting that they SHOULD BE OBLIGED to MAKE my notebook Vista-compatible, and that I am very ANGRY with them? I don't think so :)

Maybe someone should offer a leasing option for consumer devices such as iPods, notebooks and Internet Tablets. It would be a perfect option for consumers who think like you. ;)

If you bought a car today, and the manufacturer released a new model next week with more power, better handling and braking and the fuel efficiency of a diesel engine, would you go back and demand to have the latest engine management system, the improved brakes and suspension? Yes i would if the manufactuer assured me that I was buying the best they had to offer and then soon after released something better - that means they wanted to profit for me buying the car on the first lie, and then come back and purchase based on the second lie - Nokia is actually on their 3rd device within less than 3yrs. Besides I mentioned already that I would expect a performance gain from a new machine/car, but don't make it a whole new car and still call it the same thing.

As far as the PC - No I would not be mad at Lenovo - they are not responsible for software in any form. Here Nokia is responsible for the software and the hardware. They need to support both.

[handful]

Well,

I'm not a Dev, but actually interaction designer =) And I think apart from Fads or trends I do believe in one thing : User Centered Design. And for me this is user centered design : letting you guys now, influence and actually change the course of development.

EG: As I am responsible for choosing the features, etc I felt that the need for more formats supported was bigger then the expected, so you will notice the difference now on, as we plan to support almost all formats in a short time frame. Also it was clear that more then bugs there are design issues, and thus I really need real feedback to create solutions, and we are very happy to be able to receive it and communicate better.

Last but not least, I think being closed source kills a lot of contribution from the developer point of view, thus I personally advocate for more freedom in the User space, where you guys contribute by using and criticizing and we answer back with clear honest feedback and patches when needed.

This will help us and most important : will keep the team "motivated" because believe me: it's all about the feedback you guys give. It looks just like game development, our goal is really to have people using. Reviews? will be different from gamer to gamer but in the end, if you can have fun with it and the "replay" factor is high we got there...And there's a long road to reach that.. but we have fuel =)

BR

[ghoonk]

Mate, at the time of advertising, yes, the Nokia N770 WAS the best that Nokia had to offer. It's not as though you were born yesterday, and not the first time you have purchased a consumer device (e.g. mobile phone, MP3 player, PDA, etc), so please, understand that there is always something else better down the line in a couple of months. Nokia sold you what they sold you -- an N770 running OS2006. That's what you paid for. Did you pay for upgrades? Is it stated anywhere in writing that you are automatically entitled to an upgrade? I didn't think so.

So what if Nokia is in their 3rd device in less than 3 years. You bought what you bought when you bought it and no one put a gun to your head to buy a tablet. And to be more accurate, while Nokia released the N800 and N810 after the N770, these two devices were targeted to different segments of the market.

If you really want to use a computer as an example, Apple would make a wonderful example of how you are not entitled to an software upgrade when new hardware is released. Remember the PowerPC? Remember how much those machines cost? I'd bet a lot of people were bummed out when Apple announced the G3 processor and how their spanking new OS would not run on PPC. But guess what? That didn't stop the PowerPC Macs from working, did it? Then people who bought G3s later realised that the Leopard only worked with the G4s. Oops, but hey, my iBook G3 still works - email, web, etc. And today, with the new processors, well, let's just say that the new OS isn't backward compatible with the G5s either.

Another example: Mitsubishi launched the Lancer Evolution (10th gen) recently. The Evolution IX was around from 2005 (and I had one), but I don't hear people complaining that their cars have stopped working or that they have suffered any performance degradation since the introduction of the new car. In fact, I drive a track-prepped Evolution VIII today, and the last time I checked, everything still works.

There's always something new announced every other day, so you can either choose to wait it out or buy whatever suits your needs today. With what people are demanding out of software these days, no software developer working on any complex piece of work would (in their right mind) develop anything based on the hardware lowest common denominator (N770). If you want good functions, then suck it up and shell out for hardware that the software can use to give you the user experience that you want.

Trust me, I can feel that you're bummed out, and I would be too, but that's the way the world turns. If you don't like it, start up your own company and lead the charge. We'll be right behind you. :)

[Nif]

Dear Handful,

I will be looking forward to tomorrow's release, and wish you and your colleagues a well deserved carnaval!!

[ghoonk]

Aye, I'm waiting for tomorrow's release too. Am converting all my files to MP4 format, so that I can get Canola 2 to use the default media player for playback of audio AND video files.

[jer006]

Agree completely with ghoonk, there is always something newer and better coming out - look at windows (3, 3.1, 95, 98, 98SE, ME, 2000, XP, Vista etc) or OSX or even linux for that matter, they are on release cycles of 1-2 years (for the most part without delays), Leopard just came out after all which was a $129 upgrade and tiger was released not so long ago - my wifes 1 year old ibook struggled with leopard at times without a memory upgrade, I dont think apple would have automatically exchanged the laptop because of this.

Also good luck with the car analogy you previously used, there are new models each year with newer and better features and there is not a dealer in the world who would just exchange your 2007 for a 2008 model because you complained about it... All products evolve, it is just part of the cycle. If they do not they grow stale and die!

Nokia did change the processor model in the IT's which I guess led to the current compatibility models but I am not complaining on my new N800 at all as performance and multimedia capabilities are much upgraded. Its not like intel which has pretty much had compatibility since the 286 (or 8086) - remember compatibility usually comes at a price (higher development costs or Bloat...)

Some times you just got to bite the bullet!

Handful thank you for the updates, they are much appreciated... I am looking forward to getting and using this and all future updates. It is a great product. Hopefully there will be no repository issues this time around! :)

[ghoonk]

At some point in time, Nokia's going to release something even nicer, and when that time comes, I've got two choices:

1. buy the new one, retire the N800 willingly (yay, new toy)
2. stick with the N800 - it still plays DivX, AVI, MP4, MP3s etc, downloads my video and MP3 podcasts, lets me browse the web, etc etc.

[e-motion]

Marcelo, any way you could implement the N810's headset button to be a pause when playing music or video ? I'd love to have that just as in Kagu...

[handful]

Hi emotion,

Headset button ? What button is that? in n810 you have

TOP : Fullscreen button, then + and - (zooming or volume) the powerbutton and lock button

face: Menu Button, Back Button

Slide:Rocker (4 way, center select), Menu button.

Which one you call the headset button?

Br

MArcelo

[e-motion]

Hi emotion,

Headset button ? What button is that? in n810 you have

TOP : Fullscreen button, then + and - (zooming or volume) the powerbutton and lock button

face: Menu Button, Back Button

Slide:Rocker (4 way, center select), Menu button.

Which one you call the headset button?

Br

MArcelo

The one on the headset wire that comes with the N810 (and I assume the N800 also). It's not only a mic, it also has a button :)

[handful]

AHHH =)
Wait! gustavo asked to do something =) I will ask him this =)

Actually he's optimizing the home screen, but everyone liked the suggestion emotion (can you believe that we didn't have any headset with us?) but it's a little bit more than just a single event, but we will implement it for sure!!!

Thanks, very very nice suggestion...

BR

Marcelo

[sxm]

At some point in time, Nokia's going to release something even nicer, and when that time comes, I've got two choices:

1. buy the new one, retire the N800 willingly (yay, new toy)
2. stick with the N800 - it still plays DivX, AVI, MP4, MP3s etc, downloads my video and MP3 podcasts, lets me browse the web, etc etc.


by then there will be even more video codecs which require better specs than the n8xx or something new in flash comes alongs which cant run on the n8xx

and nice new canola font. is it new?

[hyartep]

as for headset, stop/play would be great (i really want that), but is there possibility to have headset with volume control as well?

[ghoonk]

by then there will be even more video codecs which require better specs than the n8xx or something new in flash comes alongs which cant run on the n8xx

and nice new canola font. is it new?

Last time I checked, AVI, DivX, MP4 and MP3 have been around for the last couple of years. I don't see MP3 going anywhere else in the next 2 to 3 years, and MP4 either.

Fact is, as long as I have either of the 2 video converters (NITVC and N800VC) that I use regularly, I can convert any file (except MKV, which only N800VC can convert to MP4) that I can playback on my PC/Notebook and play it back on the N800, so it is NOT obsolete, i.e. it still plays back the same codecs as when I paid for it.

Point is, if I really wanted the new codecs that could not be played back on the N800, then I would reassess my needs and buy what I need, be it the N9xx or a dedicated portable media player.

[handful]

Hi!

"as for headset, stop/play would be great (i really want that), but is there possibility to have headset with volume control as well?"

When implementing the play pause, we will do it the "right" way. If there's a way of people using one with volume control we will try to support it. Does anyone use a headset with volume support today? Can you send us the spec?

Other thing is the bluetooth stereo headset with controllers, we are optimizing it as much as possible (in the bluetooth side) to have not only the a2dp running nicely but also controlling the basic if you have the device. But no promises when this will be released : / still a little bit too high on the cpu usage.

Br

Marcelo

[hyartep]

i do not know the specs for headset controls, but i would probably use something like this http://europe.nokia.com/A4688201

[hyartep]

well and full compatibility with http://europe.nokia.com/A4486274 (hs-44) or http://europe.nokia.com/A4487137 (hs-45) would be complete (nokia) nirvana :-)

[handful]

nice= ) I will try to get one to see if they are supported in the Maemo platform =)
if so.. =)

BR

MArcelo

[bluey]

Reading through the posts, is the new version going to be released today?

Been eagerly awaiting the new release.

[dburr10085]

so - is this being released today?

[zeez]

They said so...

[jer006]

Headset with volume control? I know this is not what you are really wanting but most 3rd party after market headphones (sony etc..) come with a small volume control slider on the cord... However this does not control the volume at the device just at your ears!

A remote control in the headphones is a nice to have but it is usually tied closely to the device itself - I had a panasonic walkman years ago with a remote control in the headphones and it had to have a special jack just to work with the device... The nokia headset which comes with the n800 does have a button but what can you really do with that, one press to stop, one press to start etc unless we get into a form of morse code with it for more complex functionality!

Nice to have but definately would not rank too high on my list of must have features!!!

[handful]

Jer : Is not too high, but as it will take just a little bit of work, it can be included in the other release.

Zeez: This time it's coming don't worry =)
I've just tested the final build, and EVERYONE is downloading podcasts right now for testing it.

The good news: it SEEMS that we are going to release it complete for all the devices. But also being honest, we cannot handle this kind of 1 week bug too many times for the legacy devices : / It will be harder and harder in the future to keep doing a lot of workaround for the older devices / versions. We will do our best but we will not stop running with nice features for the 2008 users because of serious problems.

Gladly we chose python, that we have also the control of the language porting and binding thus we can do a lot of fixed, and python is actually well supported across the platform. But I really cheer for no more serious bugs like this one related to specific version of software .. or we will be in deep trouble!

BR

[dburr10085]

Handful - thanks for the update. Do you think we will see this today or do you have another time in mind?

[mrtn]

hope i can see c2 today =)

[handful]

It is today. As said, we are already in the final test. Anyways I said also yesterday even if the bug was still there we would release it. I think you guys here will be the first to know.. I came back with the update and website online!

Br

[loughmillermedia]

Is this update going to be Canola 3 or Canola 2 with some bug fixes? Will we need to uninstall the current version or just update it?

[mrtn]

Canola 2 with bug fixes. No uninstall i guess.

[handful]

Hi Guys,

This is a Canola2 bugfix update. I has been only one month from the release so there was no way we could have something like a version 3 =)

When ready, You just need to go to application installer and check for updates.
Actually you will also need to update canola-tuning to get all the changes :

* canola tuning now reads the covers from embedded, file in album folder, and internet.

Next release, is schedulled for the end of february, beginning of march and this one will bring new features, like Add ons for youtube, last.fm, Upnp, Third party application support and we expect browse by folder among a lot of other fixes that will be needed after the update today.

BR

Marcelo

[e-motion]

When ready, You just need to go to application installer and check for updates.
Actually you will also need to update canola-tuning to get all the changes :

* canola tuning now reads the covers from embedded, file in album folder, and internet.


Marcelo,

Will that work for people like me that had to use a backup repository created by a member here (forgot his name) in order to install Canola2 ? The "official" repository, as you know, was not really working...

[Wavy]

Perhaps I am doing something wrong, but if I go to the Application Manager and check for updates I don't see either a Canola or Canola Tuner update.

[Laughing Man]

I don't think it's released yet. I believe handful meant that when it was released that's how you'll update it.

[hfw01]

Is canola-tuning in a repo, or do we have to install it from the .deb?

[dburr10085]

I'm supposing that we will get detailed instructions when it's time, but I dont think the new version is released yet.

[krbvroc1]

Hi Guys,

This is a Canola2 bugfix update. I has been only one month from the release so there was no way we could have something like a version 3 =)


What about my bug 1830 - the most basic of all requirements for a media player - the ability to 'queue' multiple songs to play. I notice the bug was assigned to you on 12/21/2007 and no action has been taken. About a week after Canola2 initial beta release I uninstalled it because without this basic ability, it is no better than the built in media player.

Something so simple not being included, gives me the feeling that the software design was not made with this in mind. That does not bode well for the future.

[dburr10085]

What about my bug 1830 - the most basic of all requirements for a media player - the ability to 'queue' multiple songs to play. I notice the bug was assigned to you on 12/21/2007 and no action has been taken. About a week after Canola2 initial beta release I uninstalled it because without this basic ability, it is no better than the built in media player.

Something so simple not being included, gives me the feeling that the software design was not made with this in mind. That does not bode well for the future.

Dude??????

[handful]

Well Let's go =)

@e-motion:
It works ok, but I recomend you to disable or remove the old repository and add the official ones back, as we are uploading there the update packages.

@hfw-01 : it's a deb, unfortunately is not on any repo still, mainly because we will integrate most of it's features in the future also. So this is like a temporary solution.

@Krbvroc1 : There's something called "individuality" which I respect pretty much, and makes me fell pretty confident about my job, because I know how to keep "My needs" out of the projects I'm working on. Why? Because most of the time.. what we think is correct for us, may.. may not work for everyone.

I do agree with you that is a "Basic" thing. We want to do it, but the right way... and when deciding priorities things came first. You may use any argument against it, and you're mostly right for your side because this priority list caught you on some basic needs. But I need to say that unfortunately users have requested other things first and when we measure : effort to develop it correctly x time available we need to decided when to do it.

I would say to you that most of people that I know are the random mode people. They never do playlist, queues, nothing. Just hit random and then go freak on the next button. Believe me there's a lot of people like that. There's also people that even on desktop don't use queues, and if I would count the emails with request to canola I would say that people that don't use a way bigger in number than those that Use.

But don't get me wrong, We designed a party mode, we designed a playlist editing (simple one) but it's still on the queue.

At the same point, I would say to you that I don't understand for example how a player can do queue in such a level, that you need to create one to play a single song.

So, in the end.. it's again the old time problem, but reading you text, and imagine you kind of use I don't think our idea of queue will be yours favorite but we will try to get the real need satisfied at least in a "basic level".

About the bug, I have just been "called" (hey dude look at your bugs in Garage) and I am sorry that I didn't answer this there but I will close / follow my bugs better now :)

And speaking about the future, we needed exactly that: a very powerful and flexible infrastructure to build upon, and now we will be able to do that and other real complicated stuff the right away.

As you probably know if you read this forum, by no ways I want to be rude or negative, but once you put your argument as "something so simple not being included..." and" does not bode well for the future" I felt that I could answer in the same "level".

Resuming: what's right and needed as a first thing for you may not be for a lot whole more of people ; / and We try at least to do them in the long run, but we cannot run more than we are running now :/

[Tabster]

Marcelo - when it is released, will there be instructions on if canola tuning is required and how it is used.
I see that Canola Tuning is a "Python scripts to tune Canola". Not sure what that means!
So is Python required to be installed also for Canola2 to work? Or just this tuning thing?
thanks.

[krbvroc1]

Well Let's go =)

@Krbvroc1 :

I would say to you that most of people that I know are the random mode people. They never do playlist, queues, nothing. Just hit random and then go freak on the next button. Believe me there's a lot of people like that. There's also people that even on desktop don't use queues, and if I would count the emails with request to canola I would say that people that don't use a way bigger in number than those that Use.
:/

The problem is that I was looking for Canola2 to provide an improvement on OS2008 versus the other media player offerings. None of the other offerings provide this so I thought Canola2 would address it to differentiate itself. And I assumed the lack of this feature in other offerings was due to immaturity of those applications.

Let me be specific about my use case.

I download MP3/podcasts (or stream them). I like to listen to them at night and fall asleep to them. Before I lay down, I want to navigate to various MP3 files and 'Add to playlist'. Perhaps I will only add 2 tracks. These files are normally talk shows, not music. Currently these tracks are via UPNP (which I understand is being added by a third party which is another discussion).

Specifically for Podcasts, why would anyone listen to them in random order? Why cant I just select a podcast and select 'Add to playlist' so I can add 1 or 2.

As far as desktop users, I use winamp. When I listen to my media library, I sometimes use random/shuffle mode. However when I download new music or podcasts, I typically browse to the folder and select 'Enqueue in Winamp' to add to the current playlist. Its hard for me to imagine that this is such an obscure use case. I must be too old.

One user on here mentioned an app called Mediastreamer that supposedly handles this, but it never worked for me on OS2008. I really looked for Canola2 to be the OS2008 platform media player since I think it caused a lot of developers to pause interest in updating their own media players to run on OS2008.

As far as 'does not bode well for the future', what I meant is that if the dev team could not add this easily, I have a feeling that the software architecture is not setup for this type of user operation and I am going to be waiting a long time. This is just my gut feeling as a software developer myself.

[handful]

@Tabster:

Canola tuning is on garage (it was a .deb install) using application manager, and creates 2 shortcuts for you :

Album Covers and Video Thumbnailer.

You click, hit start and wait.

We are actually adding it to the maemo extras repos to make it easier.

In the future the plan is to integrate most of the things (everythiung except the download of covers which is a legal issue)

About python, Canola2 uses python in almost all it's code. So the whole application is python (almost hheeh) the LMS scanner is in C because it needs to be really fast... as the drawing routines (EFL 16 bits) are also in C. The rest is pure python + EDJE (EFL UI scripting language)

----


Hi krbvroc1 ,

Actually you need the add to playlist then (I think we will "suffice" your need.. but the problem was not the dev team, and there's a little bit of difference of "simple" to fast to do.

But here comes the thing: if you ask me, it's was not developers fault. It was more design issue (myself on blame). Why? Because, instead of just going there and doing something like crazy (to be fast we need to do that sometimes) I really wanted to have time to do it the best way, not only to solve Add to playlist problems, but also prevent canola of becoming a bloat of features in what was mean to be a simple UI.

Adding the playlist support, ask for the "edit" mode. So instead of adding one more button in all the list users browser daily we will do a "Edit" mode, where you can create a new playlist, and browse your songs to add items to it.

But It does take time to do the right way, to provide the same feature for third party developers, and in the end... it was more about "Is anybody free to do that?" .. and we were fixing dbus bindings bugs, music playback volume oddities, scanner not finding formats, etc etc.

I can easily go for my team buddies and say that the architecture does support it quite easily, but it takes time to design a integrated solution, that doesn't interfere with other things. and we are lacking times for the basics :/

But, don't worry if it's on the list will be done before we hit the "final" what we call "no beta" release. (march)

: Believe there's a lot of people that don't use the "Enqueue".
=)

[sxm]

What about my bug 1830 - the most basic of all requirements for a media player - the ability to 'queue' multiple songs to play. I notice the bug was assigned to you on 12/21/2007 and no action has been taken. About a week after Canola2 initial beta release I uninstalled it because without this basic ability, it is no better than the built in media player.

Something so simple not being included, gives me the feeling that the software design was not made with this in mind. That does not bode well for the future.

booo~!! go get an ipod touch~!!

[MikeL]

Tabster:

Canola tuning is on garage (it was a .deb install) using application manager, and creates 2 shortcuts for you :

Album Covers and Video Thumbnailer.

You click, hit start and wait.

We are actually adding it to the maemo extras repos to make it easier.

In the future the plan is to integrate most of the things (everything except the download of covers which is a legal issue)

About python, Canola2 uses python in almost all it's code. So the whole application is python (almost hheeh) the LMS scanner is in C because it needs to be really fast... as the drawing routines (EFL 16 bits) are also in C. The rest is pure python + EDJE (EFL UI scripting language)Hi Tabster

I recently included a page in my own "Canola2 Beta Howto" blog thread of six pages to show with a few screen grabs, what happens when using these tuning plugins here (http://mikesl300i.blogspot.com/2008/01/canola2-beta-howto-plugins-page-6.html)

[dburr10085]

am i missing something? has it been released?

[handful]

not yet, but it will today! =) don't worry =)

[krbvroc1]

booo~!! go get an ipod touch~!!

Boo on you. Why would I want to support Apple and their product lockin?

I want to support a Linux based open platform which is why I spent my money on Nokia N800 and followed the rules by submitting bug reports and communicating my needs to the developers.

[mrtn]

But how soon, Marcelo? =)

krbvroc1, fully agreed with you.

[sxm]

Boo on you. Why would I want to support Apple and their product lockin?

I want to support a Linux based open platform which is why I spent my money on Nokia N800 and followed the rules by submitting bug reports and communicating my needs to the developers.

ohh please, but you were so quick to off canola from your list. I guess you didnt realize that this is mainly a bug update and not adding new features. Your remark was not very encouraging to the developers. Try supporting them next time.

[Tabster]

Hi Tabster

I recently included a page in my own "Canola2 Beta Howto" blog thread of six pages to show with a few screen grabs, what happens when using these tuning plugins here (http://mikesl300i.blogspot.com/2008/01/canola2-beta-howto-plugins-page-6.html)

thanks - I'll take a look

[mrtn]

still hope that i can get release today. is anybody hope so too?

[Tabster]

I didn't realize this. I thought I didn't have Python installed on my N800 when I had the first beta installed. Looks like I did as Canola worked for me.

@Tabster:

Canola tuning is on garage (it was a .deb install) using application manager, and creates 2 shortcuts for you :

Album Covers and Video Thumbnailer.

You click, hit start and wait.

We are actually adding it to the maemo extras repos to make it easier.

In the future the plan is to integrate most of the things (everythiung except the download of covers which is a legal issue)

About python, Canola2 uses python in almost all it's code. So the whole application is python (almost hheeh) the LMS scanner is in C because it needs to be really fast... as the drawing routines (EFL 16 bits) are also in C. The rest is pure python + EDJE (EFL UI scripting language)

----


Hi krbvroc1 ,

Actually you need the add to playlist then (I think we will "suffice" your need.. but the problem was not the dev team, and there's a little bit of difference of "simple" to fast to do.

But here comes the thing: if you ask me, it's was not developers fault. It was more design issue (myself on blame). Why? Because, instead of just going there and doing something like crazy (to be fast we need to do that sometimes) I really wanted to have time to do it the best way, not only to solve Add to playlist problems, but also prevent canola of becoming a bloat of features in what was mean to be a simple UI.

Adding the playlist support, ask for the "edit" mode. So instead of adding one more button in all the list users browser daily we will do a "Edit" mode, where you can create a new playlist, and browse your songs to add items to it.

But It does take time to do the right way, to provide the same feature for third party developers, and in the end... it was more about "Is anybody free to do that?" .. and we were fixing dbus bindings bugs, music playback volume oddities, scanner not finding formats, etc etc.

I can easily go for my team buddies and say that the architecture does support it quite easily, but it takes time to design a integrated solution, that doesn't interfere with other things. and we are lacking times for the basics :/

But, don't worry if it's on the list will be done before we hit the "final" what we call "no beta" release. (march)

: Believe there's a lot of people that don't use the "Enqueue".
=)

[e-motion]

Isn't it technically tomorrow already in Brazil time ?

[handful]

not =) 15 minutes, but you can hit refresh.. it's there =)

[e-motion]

not =) 15 minutes, but you can hit refresh.. it's there =)

Do you guys ever go party ? :D :p :D

[handful]

Also, we are updating the site, please forward to new users as theres a little bit more of tutorials for the first timers, as well tips and tricks on several issues!

Canola official website (update) (http://openbossa.indt.org.br/canola/index.html)


Thanks guys for the patience! I hope it works well on your devices, and of course we will be looking for a lot of bugs reports from you so we have more than just features to do to the next release, already scheduled for the end of this month / first week of march!

About parties : We work hard, (sometimes I think a little too much, but everyone likes the job...) but we also PARTY HARDDD =) and today is the official beginning of Carnival!

I'm heading now to the old center of Recife, to hear some nice music and party with a million of other people!! lol



BR

Marcelo

[pablob]

Hi!

I've found it in the repo (beta2!), and installed in my 770 with OS2007HE. It must be the 8x0 version, because it dies with "Illegal instruction". Is there a different repository/version for the 770? Or some slight hack like downloading an "extra" 770 compiled binary?

I thought this would be the time to try Canola 2, but I might have to wait a bit more...

Thanks for the work!

BTW, enjoy the Carnaval! :-)

[ganske77]

The anticipation is killing me. And I dont even have a tablet but I think I am going to buy one tomorrow now. I had a 770 back when they first came out. Then I went to a N95 but now that work bought me a BB 8320 that is so locked down I cannot install 3rd party apps or setup my own email and mandates I carry it all the time, I am looking to get either a N810 or a HP iPaq 211 for my personal stuff. I have watched the Canola2 video's and am pretty sure that Windows mobile does not have any offerings close to Canola. I cannot believe how good the UI looks in Canola.

[handful]

Hi Pablob : go to the website :

http://openbossa.indt.org.br/canola/index.html

There's a special instructions for HE users ok?

Hope this helps!

Marcelo

[handful]

Hi Ganske77,

Thanks for the nice words dude. This is the fuel for us, and believe us.. we are just starting and we will make it improve even more in the future. If it had a little bit more performance we would be really smooother, but I think we can still improve it a little.

Let's see how can we proceed with the following update.

Youtube is almost ready, next is last.fm (at least scrobbling) and more!

The next sprint has begun. (lie: it's only after carnival now) =)

[absolofdoom]

Um...I updated it, and when I tried to play a song, it just froze...So I uninstalled it, and did a fresh install, but it still does the same thing. Am I doing something wrong?
EDIT: I'm using an N810, btw.

[e-motion]

Installed and rocking it :)

[handful]

@absolofdoom
Did it froze with each file format? is this mp3? we found some problems with m4a, and things like that but it was not supposed to : /
Do you have mplayer?

But hei! send us more info : / did it worked correctly in the previous version?

Guys : If a critical bug appears, please let me know on email (sending a private message) because if that happens I will gather the team and we will release a fix for it even on the weekend!

Br

Marcelo

[e-motion]

Love the scrolling titles and very useful for me, as my live shows were just too long to display more than Trance-Sciss when it should be Trance-Scission XXX (Liquid.fm) XX-XX-XX.

Marcelo, if you guys need to party on some other music, you're more than welcome to join me when I'm live every thursday :) Incidentally, that radio streams very well with Canola and my phone as a modem via Bluetooth :)

[handful]

Hi emotion,

Did you experienced any lock up? I'm really worried with that ://////
This will blow out my (and my buddies) weekend if it's a serious bug :/

[bluey]

Just updated, photos and video play fine but playing mp3s it locks up and freezes running os2008 on a n800.

[handful]

UPDATE

Guys it seems that you need to reboot the device after installing (so canolad can start the new version and other things) We already looking into that.. but seems that you need to restart so the deamons are all right also.

PLEASE REBOOT after updating!!

[absolofdoom]

@absolofdoom
Did it froze with each file format? is this mp3? we found some problems with m4a, and things like that but it was not supposed to : /
Do you have mplayer?

But hei! send us more info : / did it worked correctly in the previous version?

Guys : If a critical bug appears, please let me know on email (sending a private message) because if that happens I will gather the team and we will release a fix for it even on the weekend!

Br

Marcelo

The music files I tried are mp3, and no, I do not have mplayer installed, because it does not play my videos correctly (both in and out of canola) for some reason (it just locks up). The previous version of canola played these files without any problems.
EDIT: I rebooted it, and it still freezes.

[cmarcelo]

Could you folks that have problems with lockups try to restart the device and test again (and report)?

There's a chance that if canola helper daemons (like the atabake media engine) were running before the update, an old version is still running and is incompatible with new canola.

btw: Thanks for testing Canola :-)

[handful]

It seems that the deamons need really to be restarted. Can you please reboot it (without the power cable on) and see if it helps?

BR

* the problem with your video I think is solved, that specific format plays using the default player now.

Marcelo

[absolofdoom]

I rebooted it yet again, but no joy... No worries, I have a lot of patience.
EDIT: Videos have worked fine with the default player, I was just saying that mplayer apparently doesn't support the video format I'm using, so I just uninstalled mplayer, and all is well.

[handful]

yeah, but now it detects the videos that mplayer can't play and use the default player.

Absolofdoom, can you send us some logs? trying running canola on terminal and when it freezes you send us what happened in the term.

I know it sounds dummy but : did you reboot with or without power cable on?

Br

Marcelo

[absolofdoom]

Launched canola with xterm, made canola freeze, and looked at xterm, but got no feedback--is there a command-line argument to make it verbose or something?
My n810 isn't plugged in.

[Reggie]

SInce Canola2 Beta2 is now out, I have created a new Canola2 Beta2 feedback thread. Please continue the discussion on that thread from now on:
http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16047

This thread is now closed. Thanks.