The maemo Wikipedia Improvement Project

[GeneralAntilles]

So back in January I decided to take a stab at improving the woefully neglected Wikipedia articles on maemo and the tablets (particularly maemo), and didn't get much further than putting together a sorry looking software stack table (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo#Software_stack) for the maemo article and a bit of general cleanup on the tablet articles.

I gave up pretty quickly, hoping that my small edits might kick-start some miraculous flurry of improvements—but no dice. :D So I've come back 4 months later to find there's been practically no improvement to any of the articles. That's a shame.

Anyway, I've got a bit more drive this time around, and would really like to see some real improvements take place. So I figured I'd try and drum up some support with something of a wiki-improvement notes and requests thread.

To begin:

Content on the tablet articles isn't bad, but they're still in need of a bit of cleanup and unification. Style, structure, and term usage (ITOS2008, OS2008, OS 2008, Internet Tablet OS2008, etc.) and need to be consistent across all articles.

The maemo article is the worst of the bunch. It has basically zero content and half again the organization. I'm planning on splitting the article up like this:


Overview
Internet Tablet OS

OS2005
OS2006
OS2007
OS2008

maemo development platform


For now, my only requests are default-configuration screenshots (800x480, good quality) of OS2005-2008 (I have the equipment here, but not the willingness to nuke two devices ;)) (Edit: Got all of them. Thanks, Firebird8!) and some time investment in whatever way you see fit to any of the articles.

[walshga]

Word GA!
I appreciate your generosity and determination re NIT Wikipedia articles. I'm a devoted Wikipedian, and would be glad to help. I've got three devices running OS '06, '07 (770 HE), & '08. Not clear on screenshot needs - by configuration, do you mean the default Home View, or the sequence of pages when first configuring a device (or both)? Also, which screenshot app do you think would work best? I've rarely used any of them. If you want to reply off list, drop me a line on my Wikipedia talk page (UN = walshga).
Peace,
Jim

[GeneralAntilles]

Not clear on screenshot needs - by configuration, do you mean the default Home View, or the sequence of pages when first configuring a device (or both)?


Basically, I'm looking for a newly flashed device just booted to the desktop with only default applets. I'd like to put together a timeline and update the OS screenshot to OS2008.


Also, which screenshot app do you think would work best?

Personally, I just use x11vnc (plus a sweet Quicksilver-hot-key invoked bash script that automagically crops, compresses, names, uploads, and sticks the URL into my clipboard :D), but osso-screenshot-tool should work fine, too.

Reading over some of the stuff I wrote last night, I see I should probably stick to editing when awake. Consistence and clarity seems to suffer a bit. :D

[GeneralAntilles]

Alright, the first thing I'm willing to call a first draft (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo) is up.

The ITOS section (and subsections) are now at a minimum content level. In particular, more discussion of the major API, package and feature changes is needed (a little more content for each ITOS release than the Hacker Edition subsection would be good, I think).

The SDK section still needs to be created, but I'm mildly under equipped (having never actually used it, lacking well-supported hardware ;)). I'd say three, maybe four, paragraphs should be the minimum for the final product (overview, technical/component details, usage).

[GeneralAntilles]

Another update.

Added some more screenshots and updated the article screenshot to OS2008. ;)

Few touch-ups here and there, added a stub for the SDK, still need lots more content.

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, I can see meanwhile has contributed his unique brand of ******** to the maemo wiki page. :\

Edit: Wow, worse than I thought at first glance. The article has pretty much been completely screwed over. Several sections of steaming horseshit were added and there seem to be two intermingled (and overlapping) footnote numberings going on.

[GeneralAntilles]

Evidently technical terms are now "buzzwords". . . .

Article is mostly cleaned up and back in some semblance of shape. :\

[brontide]

Well, I can see meanwhile has contributed his unique brand of ******** to the maemo wiki page. :\

Sniff sniff... that BS smells familiar. (http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19074)

[tabletrat]

OK, I just went and read it and I think it would be better having left it as a stub, as now it is just an article about how insecure the NITs are, with no actual information apart from the ramblings of a demented *****.

It would be nice if he went and got another platform to 'support'. It is lucky noone believes anything they read on wikipedia, as this matches!

[meanwhile]

Evidently technical terms are now "buzzwords". . . .

Article is mostly cleaned up and back in some semblance of shape. :\


And someone should read his user page and the wikipedia guidelines...

[meanwhile]

OK, I just went and read it and I think it would be better having left it as a stub, as now it is just an article about how insecure the NITs are, with no actual information apart from the ramblings of a demented *****.


Yes: quoting Nokia's tech docs is completely insane. **Obviously**.

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, he's officially lost it.

He's pulling a vandalism charge and threatening to have me banned from wikipedia.

This guy is a menace.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk:GeneralAntilles&redirect=no

OK, I just went and read it and I think it would be better having left it as a stub, as now it is just an article about how insecure the NITs are, with no actual information apart from the ramblings of a demented *****.

It would be nice if he went and got another platform to 'support'. It is lucky noone believes anything they read on wikipedia, as this matches!

meanwhile reverted my cleanup and is now accusing me of vandalism.

[qwerty12]

**** it, General, I'm supporting you.

At least you aren't full of ****.

[tabletrat]

You are saying that nokias tech docs go into rants about how insecure their operating system is against non-existant viruses, how trivial keyloggers are to write, and how they could be stopped by these super software firewalls that are indestructable somehow.
Indeed, I am also suprised they go into detail as to how insecure the system is compared to say, palms or pocketPCs who have a huge market share with the same securty models and no malware.

I am not trying to say security is brilliant, as it clearly isn't, but when dealing with a threat it is important to devote appropriate resources to a problem, and in your case you are putting a huge emphasis on a very hyperthetical case that while not impossible is so impractical it is not going to happen, while your examples of how to fix it would provide no extra safety and possibly reduce both functionality and security.

So you have edited that article to say that the only thing of significance about the nokia internet tablets is that they are security problem. Nothing else.
I don't understand why you have one if they are so completely useless?

Edit:

BTW, I didn't call you insane.

[qwerty12]

I would like to know why you think a thread full of ******** which you started is a credible source:

However, ITOS also lacks the defenses that desktop computers typically employ. Currently no virus checker is available for the platform. Although ITOS does contain the usual Debian Linux firewall, but this can only be accessed by advanced users capable of writing their own scripts, and would probably be ineffective as a means of preventing malware from forwarding confidential data from the machine, due to the role of daemon processes as forwarders of such messages. (Malware could use a firewall approved daemon to send data out, by-passing the need to get permission itself.) [2]

http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19074

When the first ARM virus (because I don't think you know, that even if there was a Linux virus, it would have to be recompiled for OS2008) is made, that's when you will get your "virus checker"

[GeneralAntilles]

Go for it, have me banned, win your crazy little power play. Honestly, I could care less. Wikipedia will officially be a lost cause when **** like this is allowed to happen. :\

[meanwhile]

Well, he's officially lost it.

He's pulling a vandalism charge and threatening to have me banned from wikipedia... this guy''s a menace.


Actually, I specifically said I wasn't reporting you - although I did warn you that persistent wiki vandalism is an offense, which is what I'm supposed to do as a wiki user, if I don't want to get heavy and take you to a Higher Authority. Vandalism being defined as deleting sourced relevant material without using the discussion page and civil, sourced, discussion.

You *might* be right to delete some or all the material - what I wrote might be factually incorrect. But you need to source and discuss and generally obey the rules that you signed up to when you opened a wiki account. Calling someone a "menace" in a forum follow of your friends because they are asking you to live up to standards you agreed to may make you feel better, but it isn't terribly helpful or mature.

[qwerty12]

Go for it, have me banned, win your crazy little power play. Honestly, I could care less. Wikipedia will officially be a lost cause when **** like this is allowed to happen. :\

You know, you will get banned if you only them hear one side of the story.

[TA-t3]

For what it's worth, I'll have it on record that I'm firmly on GA's side on this - if there's anything there that's got the smell of 'vandalism' about it it's mr. Meanwhile's article changes, as well as that rant on the discussion page. Sheesh.

[qwerty12]

I know this defeats the point of wikipedia but why not make 2 seperate articles on your security views.

[GeneralAntilles]

You know, you will get banned if you only them hear one side of the story.

Honestly, I don't really have the interest or energy to fight nonsense like this.


You *might* be right to delete some or all the material - what I wrote might be factually incorrect. But you need to source and discuss and generally obey the rules that you signed up to when you opened a wiki account. Calling someone a "menace" in a forum follow of your friends because they are asking you to live up to standards you agreed to may make you feel better, but it isn't terribly helpful or mature.

Wikipedia is not your little soapbox. If you want to provide useful information to the subject at hand, fine, but you mostly just seem to want to rant on the "security" topic more than any other part of the article. Internet forums are specifically recommended against as "sources", especially using topics filled with your own assertions to back up your own assertions.

I'll also note that the "Future" section is utter nonsense, and Nokia has come out and stated that the Trolltech acquisition doesn't have a damn thing to do with maemo for the foreseeable future (aside from the possible bundling of Qt libraries sometime around the end of this year).

I'm too dumbfounded and disturbed at the moment to try and knock down your arguments point by point. Suffice to say, it's incredibly disheartening that a simple attempt to improve a wikipedia article could descend into being accused of vandalism and bribe taking (FULL DISCLOSURE!!! I'M ABOUT TO RECEIVE A FREE MAEMO T-SHIRT FOR MY WORK ON BUGZILLA!!!!!!).

[tabletrat]

Or even link to a separate security article and use the maemo article to actually say something of use about the platform

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, there's the warning. I wonder if they actually bother to investigate vandalism claims or just go with whatever random people tell them.

I'm done, if anybody else wants to fight this out, feel free.

[TA-t3]

Well, if meanwhile doesn't reverse changes himself I'll volunteer to undo them again, and again, for as long as it takes, if noone else beats me to it. That'll let GA free to concentrate on adding useful contents, as he's been doing so far (unlike meanwhile). I'll check back on the wiki page after the weekend.

[qwerty12]

Well, if meanwhile doesn't reverse changes himself I'll volunteer to undo them again, and again, for as long as it takes, if noone else beats me to it. That'll let GA free to concentrate on adding useful contents, as he's been doing so far (unlike meanwhile). I'll check back on the wiki page after the weekend.

If he tries banning you and succeedes , i'll take over.

I don't even contribute on wikipedia and I'm gonna change isp's soon so I don't really give 2 ****s if I get banned.

[brontide]

I have reverted it again with a note to take this to the discussion page as well as a note in the vandalism section backing up GA's edits. Meanwhile made his edits in bad faith and this should be hashed out on the discussion page before being applied to the article.

[brontide]

Looks like GA is prevailing.

Any vandalism here was not done by GA, but by the other user who is pushing a myopic view of the maemo platform. He has already trolled the iTT forums and has decided to take out his anger on the maemo page. GA has been attempting a good faith cleanup of this page, nothing more. Brontide (talk) 16:21, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
I recognise when I make a wrong decision, i'll leave it as is. Sorry, CycloneNimrodtalk? 16:24, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
Thanks, I will try and do an unbiased review of the diffs and see what NPOV materal can be salvaged Brontide (talk) 16:28, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Either way the policy is very clear that this was not vandalism on either side, NPOV and nonsense edits maybe, but not vandalism.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:VAND#NOT

[qwerty12]

Proof that meanwhile is a knob.

[brontide]

I've added my comments on the talk page. If I don't get any comments I'll go ahead and reapply the sections/text that I think are NPOV.

[GeneralAntilles]

The fact that wikipedia editors seem to respond to vandalism charges without any sort of review or verification is a bit disheartening and rather sours me on the whole project.

Well, one good thing came out of this mess. It seems to have gotten Quim involved a bit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Maemo#maemo_software_architecture).

[fms]

Meanwhile, I would like to bring it to your attention that your edition of the article is incomplete. For example, you are not mentioning that OS2008 has no sufficient protections from the Flying Spaghetti Monster attacks. Also, you have completely avoided the fact that a hit with an OS2008-based device properly directed at someone's head can leave the victim incapacitated for the rest of his or her life. Finally, you have failed to mention that consuming a shredded OS2008 printout mixed with tabasco sauce causes severe diarrhea in users.

My personal opinion is that unless you add these and other important facts to the article, your edits should be rejected for not completely reflecting the truth i.e. biased. But I am also sure you did not have in mind to be biased, so, please, continue working on the article, enriching it with these and other priceless factual tidbits.

I wish you success.

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, after a night to cool down and thanks in no small part to Sr. brontide for his level-headedness my reason has returned to me and I've decided not to abandon the project and done some more edits today.


Did a bit of cleanup on the NPOV stuff that was merged by brontide and fixed the references provided for that stuff.
Improved the formating and consistency on the existing references.
Fleshed out the OS200[58] subsections a little so they at least don't look completely stupid.
Changed ITOS to OS per Quim's recommendation and fixed up consistency on that point a bit.
Removed the software-stack table for the time being until it can be updated and simplified (any volunteers? :D Wikipedia's table formating is an epic PITA).

I've also added a stub for MicroB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MicroB) (if somebody wants to go through and make sure all mentions of MicroB or that Firefox/Gecko-based browser in the maemo-related articles point to the new article it would be much appreciated). There'll be more coming there later today.

[qwerty12]

Ok, I've made all plaintext Microb's link to MicroB wiki page in the Maemo page and I've added Microb in brackets to all Gecko references in n800 and n810. I plan on writing a extensions/plugin section in the Microb article. I did my edits on n800 so feel free to cleanup.

HTH

Edit, The Sword Project lists it is for maemo too, the other listed platforms have names of programs so I added Rapier in brackets for maemo. I'm a Muzza so I've never used rapier, can anyone confirm Rapier uses Sword? :)

Also, I don't seem to have upload permissions on wikipedia but maybe, if this is of any value, this screenshot is nice?

[GeneralAntilles]

Ok, I've made all plaintext Microb's link to MicroB wiki page in the Maemo page and I've added Microb in brackets to all Gecko references in n800 and n810. I plan on writing a extensions/plugin section in the Microb article. I did my edits on n800 so feel free to cleanup.


Thanks! I went in and unified them with the text. No sense in parenthetically mentioning the name. :p

Also: me want plugin section NOA, qwerty12! :D

Did a little more MicroB (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MicroB) cleanup and expansion. Quim popped up again to correct me (:D), so I integrated most of his recommended changes. Although I'm still not 100% how to rectify the naming issue (see the talk page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:MicroB)). :\ The History, Architecture and Introduction sections have been created/expanded. I'll be adding more to the architecture section based on the the "Mozilla based browser for maemo" (:rolleyes:) whitepaper soon.

Did some more term unification on the rest of the articles. Still not all the way there, but closer.

[brontide]

I have reintegrated the following sections with as much source material as I could find; Updating the OS, Security, and Future Releases. If people could try and flesh these out some more it would be appreciated. I will not stand for attacks on unix, native code, or mobile computing security in general as opposed to maemo specially.

[GeneralAntilles]

Good stuff, brontide! Touched up and unified formating and term usage (I'm going to avoid using ITOS for the time being as it's unofficial and rather clunky). Expanded and clarified just a touch the future sections just a touch.

We still need somebody to flesh out the SDK section, though. :D

[GeneralAntilles]

Somebody added a company called "Imendio" under the developer line in the infobox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo). Personally, I've never heard of them before. According to the linked PDF, they've done a bit of development for the platform but should they really be included there? :\

[tabletrat]

Well, according to their website, they claim to have written a large amount of it. If what they say is true it is reasonable for them to be there. I guess the only people who can say is people from inside nokia.
I hadn't heard of them.

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, according to their website, they claim to have written a large amount of it. If what they say is true it is reasonable for them to be there. I guess the only people who can say is people from inside nokia.


I suppose you could make that argument, but most developer infoboxes only contain a single developer, and that's the primary one (which is most certainly maemo/Nokia). See the GTK page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gtk), Debian page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian), Firefox page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firefox) or many others. There are most certainly other developers who have contributed to these projects, but only the primary developer is listed.

[brontide]

Looked up Imendio and they may have been a contracted to work on some pieces, but to what extent is vague at best. Press releases back to 2005 and none of them are very specific.

Looks like the page is coming along. Still need a lot of meat in the SDK area, but otherwise it's refining nicely. Maybe GA made up this whole vandalism business to get us all worked up and working on the the page ;) :cool:

[GeneralAntilles]

Maybe GA made up this whole vandalism business to get us all worked up and working on the the page ;) :cool:

Hey, when reasonable requests fail to generate interest, you know a bit of drama always will. :D

So, at the start I primarily intended this to be focused on the maemo page (with a bit of work on the tablet pages), but as we seem to have managed to get the maemo page more or less up to snuff, I believe it may be worthwhile to focus a little effort on some of other articles for things related to the platform. In particular, I'd hope for some expansion on the Hildon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hildon), Matchbox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matchbox_%28window_manager%29), OMAP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omap), and (possibly, although I'm not sure it makes sense) a new article for Xomap.

We could probably use an article on Modest, too.

[GeneralAntilles]

OK, here's my abortion of an article on Modest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modest_%28application%29). As it turns out, my knowledge of Modest is essentially non-existent. History section in particular needs some TLC, as it's just embarrassing at the moment. :D

Tinymail article is also in the works.

[sjgadsby]

OK, here's my abortion of an article on Modest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modest_%28application%29).

A link to this should probably be created in the Diablo section of the maemo page. I tried, but I'm somehow not understanding how to set it up right.

[GeneralAntilles]

A link to this should probably be created in the Diablo section of the maemo page. I tried, but I'm somehow not understanding how to set it up right.

Internal links (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Link#Wikilinks) on wikipedia are done like so:

[[page|optional alternative title]]

For Modest:

[[Modest (application)|Modest]]

Added another abortion, Tinymail (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinymail). The references should provide an interested party with all the information they need to flesh out the article if they wanted to try, I'll probably get around to making it useful later this week if not. In particular, though, I'd like somebody to confirm that my IPA pronunciation isn't completely bogus.

[sjgadsby]

Internal links[/URL] on wikipedia are done like so...

Thanks. I somehow misread Wikipedia's documentation and thought I should be using a colon, not a pipe, as the separator.

I'm new to this, but I'll catch on eventually. I hope.

[GeneralAntilles]

I'm new to this, but I'll catch on eventually. I hope.

I'm not exactly a veteran myself. ;)

You catch on as you go along. Their documentation is fairly straightforward, but looking at existing articles for examples is a good method for learning.

Out of interest, who is the unregistered personage who is contributing all those wonderful grammar and spelling fixes? :cool:

[sjgadsby]

Out of interest, who is the unregistered personage who is contributing all those wonderful grammar and spelling fixes?

Well, that would be me, learning. I hope you're not too upset with what I've done! *hides*

[speculatrix]

I added a few bits and pieces to the maemo page, the n800 and a tiny bit ot the n810. As I think of more things I will put them in. Worth raiding sections of ITT's wiki to go on?

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, that would be me, learning. I hope you're not too upset with what I've done! *hides*

Excellent! Seriously helpful stuff. You should consider registering (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup&returnto=Main_Page), though. ;)

I added a few bits and pieces to the maemo page, the n800 and a tiny bit ot the n810. As I think of more things I will put them in.


I noticed, and thanks! The little stuff is particularly easy to miss. :<


Worth raiding sections of ITT's wiki to go on?

Probably not. Pretty much all of the information we need is available from more official and static sources, but if you see something you want to add, feel free. It can always be modified later if needed.

[GeneralAntilles]

*sigh*

meanwhile's back up on his soapbox. :\

Apparently we're all professional PR plants from Nokia trying to undermine his valiant attempts to protector users and developers by exposing maemo's horrible security. :rolleyes:

[geneven]

I fixed some spelling in the Maemo artcle. I'm registered, but I don't sign in for minor correx I find.

[Benson]

I thought he had said something to the effect that the inept way we were hacking the article proved we weren't PR pros?

[GeneralAntilles]

I thought he had said something to the effect that the inept way we were hacking the article proved we weren't PR pros?

I dunno, maybe he changed his mind. :D I can't really bring myself to read his nonsense closely. :\
i. It doesn't quite say that, and given the obvious effort to put in spin into the article discussed above (often showing a very professional level of PR writing...) this requires disambiguation.

Man, he is quick with the vandalism charge. None of what has gone on has constituted vandalism. Using editors to push your viewpoint is certainly an impressive tactic.

[brontide]

Not only has he completely re-added his nonsense, he has totally reworded the discussion page.

[GeneralAntilles]

Not only has he completely re-added his nonsense, he has totally reworded the discussion page.

Which, actually, reading the wikipedia:vandalism page, technically constitutes vandalism. :rolleyes:

[geneven]

Yes, his comments on PR were contradictory, I noticed that too. He claims you have a stake because of money or emotion, but his comments show that he has a big emotional stake -- they are filled with typos and sometimes completely don't make sense. This indicates that he is writing quickly and not rereading, or simply doesn't know English well.

[brontide]

I reverted the damage only to have him tag me as a Vandal too despite clearly stating my reasons for removing and reverting the text. I have given up and added the original research tag since this is nothing more than a rant against native code and/or cell phone attached compting and since NONE of the NIT's even have phone hardware I'm having a hard time understanding how this relates to maemo.

[GeneralAntilles]

I believe johnx had the right idea. Let him play out his power trip for a week or two and fix it once he's gotten it out of his system.

. . . tag me as a Vandal too . . .

Does this mean we get to go sack Rome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sack_of_Rome_%28455%29)? :D

[chlettn]

That Umptious/meanwhile is one piece of work apparently...

[tabletrat]

Unfortunately one of the problems with a user contributed encyclopedia is always going to be that someone with an axe to grind, or a problem understanding really simple logic is going to add things as they feel they have something to add.
I doubt he would get bored of it, as noone else believes him anywhere, so I guess he needs a soapbox for his ramblings.
I was going to add a change or a request for citation to his 'most mobile platforms' bit to point out that most mobile platforms don't have any restrictions so maybe it would be nice to know what the 'most platforms' means but I don't know if it is worth arguing with the hard of thinking.

[brontide]

Hahaha.. Don't do that! Really, dont'.

[Benson]

WP:TE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:TE), anyone?

No, I didn't just write.it as a portrait, but it couldn't fit better if I had.

[GeneralAntilles]

Hahaha.. Don't do that! Really, dont'.

I've never actually seen an attribution on this one, but I originally heard it from the president of Ambrosia Software, Andrew Welch. They're words to live by. ;)

Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.

WP:TE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:TE), anyone?

No, I didn't just write.it as a portrait, but it couldn't fit better if I had.

Goodness, that is a disturbingly good fit. It's almost as if they wrote that just for this situation.

[ragnar]

It's comforting to know that soon there will be "loss of life" because of Maemo.

[GeneralAntilles]

Anybody else catch the sneak attack (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Maemo&oldid=207689252)? Haha

[sjgadsby]

The "Nokia IS a phone company" bit amuses me. The Nokia IP2255 doesn't seem to have a SIM slot, it lacks decent PIM software, and its battery life is terrible.

[GeneralAntilles]

The "Nokia IS a phone company" bit amuses me. The Nokia IP2255 doesn't seem to have a SIM slot, it lacks decent PIM software, and its battery life is terrible.

I think we've gone well past the domain of OR and non-NPOV and entered . . . The Twilight Zone (http://youtube.com/watch?v=NzlG28B-R8Y).

[GeneralAntilles]

To anybody that wishes to comment or contribute, please register (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup) and login if you can.

[brontide]

The "Nokia IS a phone company" bit amuses me. The Nokia IP2255 doesn't seem to have a SIM slot, it lacks decent PIM software, and its battery life is terrible.

GM makes jet engines and railroad cars... obviously we need to discuss the issues of trains going at 300 mph!

[briand]

You can:

1) continue reversing his edits (and, optionally, complain about it in this topic), ad infinitum, or

2) report his repeated (mis-)behavior to the wikipedia admins, and get him banned.

also available: #2, followed by #1

[brontide]

2) report his repeated (mis-)behavior to the wikipedia admins, and get him banned.

I requested editor help this afternoon... might take a while before they get around to the page.

[Benson]

Umm... Why register? Never saw the point, for casual editing.

[GeneralAntilles]

Umm... Why register? Never saw the point, for casual editing.

Because they prefer that you do. :p Comments on the talk pages tend to have a little more weight when they're not from an IP.

[Aisu]

Added a little bit that I thought was important (at least for geeks exploring the page ;)). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo#Alternate_Desktops

Edit: Cited everything.

[GeneralAntilles]

I requested editor help this afternoon... might take a while before they get around to the page.

I'm hoping they get there soon, we've definitely got a 3RR on our hands here if nothing else. :\

[Texrat]

Trolls love this sort of PR. :D

[brontide]

I'm hoping they get there soon, we've definitely got a 3RR on our hands here if nothing else. :\

I am really at a loss as to what else to do. This person believe we all work for Nokia; Really, if that is the case, I'm wondering where my paycheck is!

2. Nokia have a department aimed at influencing developers to act as evangelists for them. They hand out free hardware and special access to future OS developments (potentially very financially significant if the platform succeeds - and GA has made posts boasting of such information) and jobs to evangelists who please them. Even if none of these people work for Nokia, I'm not sure that they are sufficiently disinterested so that they should be editing the wikipedia article - they all have a potential financial interest and Nokia is trying to actively use them as PR tools.

I guess nobody can ever comment on the SONY page then... their products are in everything!

[Texrat]

Wow.

Just... wow.

I must be screwing up somewhere-- I'm not getting paid for ANY of my evangelism! In fact, too much of it and I risk my current job.

Wow.

[GeneralAntilles]

I am really at a loss as to what else to do. This person believe we all work for Nokia; Really, if that is the case, I'm wondering where my paycheck is!


His pretense at reasonableness seems to be falling apart.

This does NOT mean "If you and your friends who have all invested time and money in a platform and have received gifts and services from Nokia gang up to edit wikipedia, then your will shall prevail". It's talking about about the overall view of informed majority sources trumping that of eg a group of Debian hacker wannabe fanboys.

Then you don't understand what NPOV is. You appear to think it means "Saying things I, GA, don't like". It doesn't. It means using biasing adjectives, spin, or concealing facts.

. . . and apparently anybody that disagrees with meanwhile is a vandal. :rolleyes:

[brontide]

His pretense at reasonableness seems to be falling apart.

Actually there is a much larger issue with reasonableness. On April 18th the Admins referred him to mediation which requires all parties to agree to be mediated.

He chose to ignore that advice and revert the page after several more days worth of edits.

[briand]

Perhaps you should turn his own argument back on him.

Maybe he's a paid heckler, funded by the iCorporation in iCupertino, or the MSCorporation in MSRedmond, to cast fear, uncertainty and doubt about any platform, gadget, or operating system that potentially threatens the monopoly he's working for... ;)

[brontide]

He tried posting a security section on the iPhone page but got shot down there as well for being out-of-date.

[briand]

As long as his coding ability is at least as inconsistent and syntactically incorrect as his English writing style, we won't have to worry about him authoring any of the potential virus or security hacks on the NIT, in any case.

[Texrat]

Meanwhile/Umptious is absolutely the most difficult sort of editor/conversant IMO. He relies heavily on logical fallacies while completely failing to recognize he is doing so-- and simultaneously implying or even overtly claiming that others are doing so.

I'm not saying this to be mean to meanwhile... if he is completely sincere in his efforts, then I suspect he may truly be unaware of his recent disingenuity and that's unfortunate. The reason I am butting in with this is to get people to realize that their expectations of productive dialog with him at this point may be in all probability unreasonable. He either will not or cannot see his fatal errors in logic. Trying to convince him of his being at odds with reason is an exercise in futility at best. He is dug in and determined to defend his position.

Regrettably, pointing his actions out to editors and/or admins may be the only recourse it appears. Regardless, no one should be able to use Wikipedia as a platform for hatemongering, ad hominem attacks, misrepresentation of facts or spread of FUD. Period. That's not what it's for.

EDIT: I realized I was being ironically condescending and removed/changed some verbiage. I apologize to anyone offended, especially meanwhile. I don't really hold any ill will toward the guy, and really wish he'd step back a bit and realize he's going a bit overboard. He certainly seems intelligent and passionate enough... just a bit misguided.

[brontide]

All I can do is keep plugging away. Maybe admins will intervene eventually.

[Benson]

Yes, but reasoned dialog, even if it doesn't actually help, is an important part of the process, and skipping out on it before the requested cavalry arrive makes one look churlish and/or easily discouraged not possessed of infinite patience.

Spectating can be fun, though; watch the incredible resilience of someone who can be *****x-slapped with logic and sense indefinitely, and still... The bite-covered wiki troll rises from the dead.

[Texrat]

I agree Benson, I'm just suggesting that the reasonable effort be made up to a point and then shifted to an alternative when it's patently obvious the instigator has no interest in listening. Of course, I'm guilty of violating my own advice on a regular basis so just ignore me. :p

Quick Edit: and maybe it's best to take a more objective approach and not even respond to the instigator-- but rather, to his work.

[fms]

Yes, but reasoned dialog, even if it doesn't actually help, is an important part of the process
It is only true if the patient is holding his finger on the Red Button or preparing to jump off the roof. The first is unlikely, and the second seems almost desirable in this case, so there is no point in continuing to treat him as a reasonable human being.

[brontide]

Quick Edit: and maybe it's best to take a more objective approach and not even respond to the instigator-- but rather, to his work.

As you can see I'm clearly laying out what I am going to do and why in the talk pages. If he can't source his assertions I will continue to remove them. Wikipedia is not a dumping ground for un-sourced allegations.

If he follows his usual pattern he will show back up in a week and crap all over the pages again.

[Texrat]

As you can see I'm clearly laying out what I am going to do and why in the talk pages. If he can't source his assertions I will continue to remove them. Wikipedia is not a dumping ground for un-sourced allegations.

Agreed. You're doing well.

[briand]

Didn't the Romulans use an early- (or isn't it actually later- !!)development version of what (decades later [or, earlier]) became (or always was) the maemo development platform to plan and nearly carry out an infiltration of the Federation? How come there's no mention of this anywhere on wikipedia?? Are all wikipedians actually Romulans or Romulan sympathesizers?

[Texrat]

You will be assimilated. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.

[brontide]

You will be assimilated. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own.

I though that was Google's line?

[Aisu]

Bah, a floating cube of bot-thing? Wusses. Couldn't even assimilate a butterfly if they tried. But... Ever tried to wrestle a freakin' tribble? ;)

[brontide]

Any people wish to expand on the QT section?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo#QT

[GeneralAntilles]

Any people wish to expand on the QT section?


Thanks! Expanded it a little bit, but if somebody maybe wants to clarify the implications a little (it's a touch heavy) and maybe expand on the S60 bit it'd be good.

Any deadlines on the rest of the nonsense-sections? :D

[brontide]

Thanks! Expanded it a little bit, but if somebody maybe wants to clarify the implications a little (it's a touch heavy) and maybe expand on the S60 bit it'd be good.

Any deadlines on the rest of the nonsense-sections? :D

Slow and steady, I would rather leave them in another day with the templates than be accused of being hasty. Under that same issue, can you source a developer or the S60 code sharing comment?

[GeneralAntilles]

Under that same issue, can you source a developer or the S60 code sharing comment?

Actually, in both the maemo.org announcement citation a sentence before and Quim's blog a sentence after. :D

[GeneralAntilles]

Looks like InternetMeme did us the favor of splitting the articles (InternetMeme, do you haunt here?), so we now have maemo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo) (thanks, also, to InternetMeme the faceless IP for that cool {{lowercase}} trick) which covers the maemo project and SDK, and Internet Tablet OS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Tablet_OS), which covers just ITOS.

It also looks like someone besides Brontide stepped in to remove the nonsense "Possible Use of Internet Tablet OS on Phones (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Internet_Tablet_OS&oldid=208049222#Possible_use_of_Internet_Tablet_OS _in_phones)" section. Many thanks! Security (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Tablet_OS#Security) still needs some love, though.

As it stands, the maemo articles is in need of the most care. We still need somebody to step in and clean up and expand the SDK (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo#Maemo_SDK) section. If you need to go technical, go technical. The rest of us can distill it down later if need be. We could also really use a history section on the maemo page, but I haven't been able to dig up any good references to work from.

[qwerty12]

Anybody willing to confirm this:
3rd party media players can access GStreamer directly or via "osso-media-server".[citation needed]?

I'm sure it's true but I'm not so sure on the osso-media-server part.

Meanwhile (no pun intended),
I've added Internet Tablet OS to the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aircrack-ng page. I didn't just want to say N800 because it's too specific and runs on 770, N8*0.

I'd appriciate (spelling) it if someone adds http://www.mulliner.org/nokia770/ as a reference.

[sjgadsby]

Looks like InternetMeme did us the favor of splitting the articles...

Thanks, InternetMeme, wherever you are! I was ascared to try the split myself, and the lowercase trick is indeed quite spiffy.

[GeneralAntilles]

I'd appriciate (spelling) it if someone adds http://www.mulliner.org/nokia770/ as a reference.

I generally do it like this:

<ref>[URL title]</ref>
But I'm not sure if that's entirely "correct", and whether it'd be worthwhile for somebody to go through and use the citation template (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Cite_web) instead.

{{cite web |url= |title= |accessdate= |format= |work= }}

[sjgadsby]

But I'm not sure if that's entirely "correct", and whether it'd be worthwhile for somebody to go through and use the citation template (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Cite_web) instead.

Hey, that sounds like my sort of thing. If you'd like, keep making your references the quick way, and I'll follow along behind and convert them as I have time.

[GeneralAntilles]

OK, started merging the software sections into the main article. Still a little messy right now. I'm gonna leave the 770 and N800 articles as they are for the time being, at least until the main article gets up to speed.

[Benson]

(thanks, also, to InternetMeme for that cool {{lowercase}} trick)Don't think that was him; or else he forgot to log in.

[GeneralAntilles]

Don't think that was him; or else he forgot to log in.

Ah, right you are. Faceless IP. Well then, thanks to Mr. Anonymous IP!

[GeneralAntilles]

Little more improvement. I changed all the relevant links to maemo over to Internet Tablet OS (and cleaned up a lot of stuff around those links :\), so everything should point to the right place now. Still could use a History section for the maemo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo) article.

Digging around the Special:WhatLinksHere/Maemo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:WhatLinksHere/Maemo) page I noticed some of maemo-related articles are in particular need of attention. Articles like Canola (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canola_%28software%29), FBReader (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBReader), Scratchbox (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scratchbox), Hildon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hildon), etc. So I was thinking, since the forums and the talk pages over on wikipedia pretty much suck for any sort of real coordination. So I started pondering on what we might use that would be better. Initially I was thinking maybe a WikiProject (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Council/Guide), but that is obviously much larger in scope than what we're after. Reading up, I found out about Task Forces (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Council/Guide/Task_forces), which would be exactly the right fit.

So it looks like a "maemo" task force under the Linux WikiProject (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:WikiProject_Linux) would be appropriate. Question is, do we have enough interested people to get something going (5-10 is a good number)?

[GeneralAntilles]

Added an Internet Tablet (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Tablet) to make linking to the devices easier "Nokia [[Internet Tablets]]" instead of "[[Nokia 770]], [[Nokia N800|N800]], and [[Nokia N810|N810]] Internet Tablets". It also provides a nice overview of everything (well, will, once it starts to not suck).

For now, it's very light on everything, but it's there and anybody's help fleshing it out, citing stuff and fixing it up is (as always! :)) much appreciated. Anyway, I'm going to bed. ;)

[GeneralAntilles]

More updates, the Internet Tablet OS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Tablet_OS) section has been cleaned up quite a bit. Thumperward stepped in as a neutral party to clean up the Security section and things are currently looking up. Many thanks to everyone involved!

Despite the impressive improvements to the Internet Tablet OS article, the maemo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maemo) article is still suffering after the split. Please, please, [i]please[i] could we get someone with good knowledge of the architecture and setup of maemo in there to expand the SDK section of the article? We could also use a bit of history and background for the maemo project, too.

[brontide]

Thanks GA, I would be willing to be part of the Task Force, but I'm not sure how much time I would be able to contribute. I was the one that started to go through some of the sub pages and tagged canola as out-of-date.

[Texrat]

I'd be willing, but I know so little about wikipedia editing...

[GeneralAntilles]

Thanks GA, I would be willing to be part of the Task Force, but I'm not sure how much time I would be able to contribute.

As they say there is no deadline (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:DEADLINE). I'm not worried about a big time investment from anybody. Even if you only have the free time to fix a misplaced comma or two once a week, it's still useful to have an extra pair of eyes and another few pounds of gray matter occasionally looking over things.


I was the one that started to go through some of the sub pages and tagged canola as out-of-date.


Yes, thank you. Getting everything tagged and the problem areas marked is a particularly helpful first step towards improvement.

I'd be willing, but I know so little about wikipedia editing...

Well, the good news is that it's fairly easy to pick up as you go along. ;) You can get a good overview here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:How_to_edit_a_page) and links to more good articles here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Introduction). Edits will, of course, be eyeballed by a number of editors who can correct any mistakes, and wikipedia is very tolerant of newbie mistakes.

[GeneralAntilles]

OK, held off on the update spam for a while, but I figure it's been long enough. ;)

Still more expansion and improvement on the Internet Tablet OS article, it's actually starting to look pretty decent now!

Few minor edits and improvements elsewhere, but nothing major. I put in a request for information for a maemo task force in the WikiProject Linux page—we'll see if it actually goes anywhere, things seem a bit dead.

Started work on a release history chart (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:GeneralAntilles/Sandbox), but lack of date information on releases and incomplete version information on OS2005 releases in particular is making things hard. I was hoping to get something out of thoughtfix's timeline, but he didn't get that detailed.

If anybody knows all the dates and wants to fix the version numbers on OS2005 (and the OS2006 beta), it'd be much appreciated. Also need to fix and expand the release notes.

[GeneralAntilles]

OK, the release history chart is up, thanks to a lot of help from Jaffa and milhouse.

On another front the move to the new mediawiki is ongoing on maemo.org, and dneary, X-Fade, Jaffa, Navi, myself and others have been working on getting things rolling. To that end, I started what I'm preliminarily calling the 'Maemowiki Action Group (https://wiki.maemo.org/index.php/Maemowiki_Action_Group)' (if you've got a better name, I'm all ears ;)), so join up and help out! I'm hoping to make it into a central organization point for all maemowiki improvement.

[Benson]

I'd say "Maemowiki Action Generating Group Or Team". That's what you get for seeking input. :p

[GeneralAntilles]

Well, just got done updating most of the Maemo articles on wikipedia to comply with the new branding (thanks, brontide, for fixing my block!). Should mostly be in good shape, though I may have missed some things, so I'd appreciate it if some interested folks could go give it a once-over.

[twaelti]

While reading the articel on Wikipedia, I've added a reference to What is maemo (http://maemo.org/maemo_training_material/maemo4.x/html/maemo_Getting_Started/Chapter_01_What_is_maemo.html). This gives a great overview of the plattform.