First N900 Review

[ColdFusion]

More questions answered by Eldar how many more Maemo Devices by year end ?
1.... 2 devices in next 9 months
N900 will be the highest one that we will see til the end of this year?
N900 - yes other is just a variant
From
http://forum2.mobile-review.com/showthread.php?t=69892&page=294

The N920 as far as I understand...

[mrojas]

So maybe the N920 is:

a) The tablet version (A keyboard-less version of the N900?)
b) ????
c) Profit!

[danramos]

So maybe the N920 is:

a) The tablet version (A keyboard-less version of the N900?)
b) ????
c) Profit!

Non-cell version.. for $300-400 less, hopefully.

[dansus]

Non-cell version.. for $300-400 less, hopefully.

I guess a non kboard version with larger screen.

I think you can give up on the idea that Nokia will ever produce a product without a cell radio from now on.

[dansus]

hmm, im hearing rumblings of a third device based on Intels Menlow MID chip will be announced at NW.

Hope so.

[mrojas]

hmm, im hearing rumblings of a third device based on Intels Menlow MID chip will be announced at NW.

Hope so.

A third? What would be the second?

If they were to release a netbook with touch screen which I could swivel/fold over the keyboard, I would buy it instantly.

[dansus]

N900, Booklet and a third device possibly the one talked about when the Intel partnership was announced in June.

[attila77]

N900, Booklet and a third device possibly the one talked about when the Intel partnership was announced in June.

Err... IIRC Menlow is the platform name for Atom, so that would be the booklet.

[mrojas]

Oh sorry, I misread, I thought it was a 3rd device that was also based on Atom (ie: 3 Atom devices).

[dansus]

Err... IIRC Menlow is the platform name for Atom, so that would be the booklet.

Yep, except the booklet isnt a MID. ;)

[Espoo888]

With the n900 or Marina Harisson?

Both now I come to think about it :p

[vkv.raju]

http://forum2.mobile-review.com/showpost.php?p=814858&postcount=14708
----------------------------------------------
EldarMurtazin
Mobile Review team

Posts: 2,228
Location: Moscow
Phone: PIXON12, N97, N900, N920

Another Maemo device not will be available shortly for sure.

My hints oftenly are controversial from post which i see from other people

---------------------------------

His phones list say N900, N920!!
I am then wondering what is N920??
Can this be a possibility?
N900 - No keyboard
N920 - Keyboard

[volt]

N920? Could that be the RX-56 he mentioned?

Wort: "So the high end Maemo or N920 will be announce later in the next spring? (...)
N900 will be the highest one that we will see til the end of this year?"
Eldar: "wort
(...)

N900 - yes :) other is just a variant"

He also says 1 maemo device this year, 2 within 9 months.

[Cruelkix]

7 more days .... the anticipation is the killer really:p I love how we are all just too damn impatient to wait for the actual announcement. Nothing like consumerism havingus by the short ones haha.

[chilko]

some new details from twitter (http://twitter.com/lvargasl) :)

is testing the new & amazing Maemo platform on Nokia devices, thoughts? Nokia is taking UI experience to a whole new level..

Q: what's your impression so far of the Maemo Freemantle UI? Any basic UI elements you like in particular, calling, messaging etc....

A: most impressive feature is the multi-screen element, mind-blowing.. browser, but Nokia will launch firefox on the next maemo device

[aikon800]

mind-blowing.. browser, but Nokia will launch firefox on the next maemo device

Good to hear the browser is stable and working fluidly. But "Nokia will launch Firefox on the next maemo device" what does this mean, I thought we are suppose to get Firefox 3 with fremantle ? ?:confused:

[mikkov]

Good to hear the browser is stable and working fluidly. But "Nokia will launch Firefox on the next maemo device" what does this mean, I thought we are suppose to get Firefox 3 with fremantle ? ?:confused:

Would you really like to use Firefox 3 with touchscreen device? Maybe something Firefox 3 based is more realistic.

[qwerty12]

There was me thinking that Nokia were financing hackfests in Copenhagen for Fennec and Mer only to "include" Firefox...

[korbé]

There was me thinking that Nokia were financing hackfests in Copenhagen for Fennec and Mer only to "include" Firefox...

And Opera will request a selection screen for web browser on first start?

[danramos]

Good to hear the browser is stable and working fluidly. But "Nokia will launch Firefox on the next maemo device" what does this mean, I thought we are suppose to get Firefox 3 with fremantle ? ?:confused:

I thought that that's what Fennec was.

[aikon800]

Would you really like to use Firefox 3 with touchscreen device? Maybe something Firefox 3 based is more realistic.

That's what I originally met...
A mobile version of Firefox 3 ;)

[yerga]

Another "marketing" (or photoshopped!) photo for the "N900":
http://www.begeek.fr/une-autre-photo-du-nokia-n900-3518

[mrojas]

Hmmm Google Talk with presence...

[Texrat]

My hints oftenly are controversial from post which i see from other people

Tell Eldar welcome to my (former) world. ;)

Although his limb is a lot longer than mine.

Wait-- :eek:

[sirhunter2010]

I just saw the pricing on the 900 ... Ouch! 550 euros! I live in Canada and it converts to $853 cdn. That is not on! They are going to have definitely rethink that pricing. BTW.. I'm drafting this response on my Archos 5 IMT.

[mobiledivide]

Now there is a video

http://www.begeek.fr/maemo-du-nokia-n900-en-video-3522


edit: !!! my bad french, its just a compilation of screenshots from mobilereview that we have already seen :confused:

[YoDude]

Now there is a video

http://www.begeek.fr/maemo-du-nokia-n900-en-video-3522


edit: !!! my bad french, its just a compilation of screenshots from mobilereview that we have already seen :confused:

WooHoo! @ 2:42 "Add Widget"...

[dansus]

I just saw the pricing on the 900 ... Ouch! 550 euros! I live in Canada and it converts to $853 cdn. That is not on! They are going to have definitely rethink that pricing. BTW.. I'm drafting this response on my Archos 5 IMT.

Why is 550e an unreasonable price?

We all want it to be less but it seems a fair price for a top of the range device with the latest technology that will empower your mobile life. I cant afford to buy it today but im gonna save every penny and sell my old junk to get one on the day of release.

I just got the E63 to go with my E71 and both will be on ebay if need be. :D

[jandmdickerson]

I just saw the pricing on the 900 ... Ouch! 550 euros! I live in Canada and it converts to $853 cdn. That is not on! They are going to have definitely rethink that pricing. BTW.. I'm drafting this response on my Archos 5 IMT.

Where is the price? Is it official? What is the US dollar price?

BTW how much is your Archos with all the works?

[YoDude]

Where is the price? Is it official? What is the US dollar price?

Let me Google that for ya. :)

550 Euros = 786.99500 U.S. dollars :eek:

I have a company supplied phone. I have an N810 that tethers to it just fine when I need net or stored info when I'm out and about for pleasure...

I'm thinkin' my next gadget will be the Booklet 3G for when I travel for business. + I'll end up saving 37 bucks. :cool:

Also: If I can connect to the company intranet and asset management software with it; BONUS! Paid for by my employer or at the very least a tax deduction. :)

[jandmdickerson]

Let me Google that for ya. :)

550 Euros = 786.99500 U.S. dollars :eek:



So are you saying every euro price Nokia can be calculated this way? I think most international products are priced regionally....hence, there is no straight "google" conversion method to use. But thanks anyway I just thought that since official pics were out then perhaps a price may be out also.

[dansus]

Another "marketing" (or photoshopped!) photo for the "N900":
http://www.begeek.fr/une-autre-photo-du-nokia-n900-3518

I cant stop staring at it, looks so sweet.

http://mobiletechaddicts.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/Nokian900.jpg

[YoDude]

So are you saying every euro price Nokia can be calculated this way? I think most international products are priced regionally....hence, there is no straight "google" conversion method to use. But thanks anyway I just thought that since official pics were out then perhaps a price may be out also.

No I'm not saying anything of the sort and I don't presume to speak for Nokia.
Call me Richard but I'm not trying to be a Dick here... Why would Nokia sell a product below "fair value" in the US? Unless you are suggesting it is over valued in the European market.:confused:
Besides, the World Trade Organization (http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/countries_e/finland_e.htm) would kind of frown on that sort of thing. Don't you think?

BTW, the large font used in the conversion was what was returned by Google. I just cut it from the results page and pasted it in my post.

[jandmdickerson]

No I'm not saying anything of the sort and I don't presume to speak for Nokia.
Call me Richard but I'm not trying to be a Dick here... Why would Nokia sell a product below "fair value" in the US? Unless you are suggesting it is over valued in the European market.:confused:
Besides, the World Trade Organization (http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/countries_e/finland_e.htm) would kind of frown on that sort of thing. Don't you think?

BTW, the large font used in the conversion was what was returned by Google. I just cut it from the results page and pasted it in my post.

Okay I really don't known what your saying. But I will assume your trying to tell me you don't know the official price yet. Thanks

[Peet]

The new Nokia netbook has 3G/HSPA built-in - what a surprise!

http://europe.nokia.com/find-products/mini-laptop

If it's a computer and its portable then built-in cellular radio is now a minimum requirement :cool:

Seriously though it looks pretty sweet - they will sell a lot of these through and subsidised by the wireless operators - no more stupid dongles.


A lot of people here at the "Maemo Talk" (only recently renamed from Internet Tablet Talk) are not quite convinced yet that they need a 3G radio (which adds to cost and generally requires a separate data plan each) in every portable device. At least not in most markets today.

Most people even considering the Nooklet are likely to have a data-ready mobile in their pocket already. How many different 3G radios along with their restrictive pricing plans are people willing to carry?

The popular use of Nokia's Internet Tablets has been - besides WIFI of course - as a companion device to a mobile phone via tethering.

The N900 bundles the two in one package - at the expense of tablet experience but hopefully providing a better mobile phone experience. Yet possibly at the price of the two...

[dansus]

The popular use of Nokia's Internet Tablets has been - besides WIFI of course - as a companion device to a mobile phone via tethering.

The N900 bundles the two in one package - at the expense of tablet experience but hopefully providing a better mobile phone experience. Yet possibly at the price of the two...

Maybe, but im not going to use this as a phone. Its a MID with 3G data to me.

Tethering was never my favourite pass time.

[Naranek]

Why would Nokia sell a product below "fair value" in the US? Unless you are suggesting it is over valued in the European market.:confused:

Well it happens anyway. For instance I looked into buying the Dell 2209WA monitor.
It costs 375,76 € in Finland. Unfortunately I can't find it anymore on the US site, but it was something like $250 there. I think that it's quite common that the prices change radically in different parts of the world. I won't go into reasons though :)

[benny1967]

Maybe, but im not going to use this as a phone. Its a MID with 3G data to me.

I can't see me using it as a phone, either. It looks way too big. (Hope I'm wrong.)

OTOH, for a MID it's too small. Also, its user interface is too restricted and "phone-like".

I'll probably buy it only because I feel I should as a member of this community, but it'll need to fill yet another niche... somewhere between a phone and a MID.

(I'm surprised about people making statements here about the looks of the device. What kind of an attitude is that? Or is this the niche it's meant for: to be put on display in the living room because it looks so sweet?)

[fms]

I can't see me using it as a phone, either. It looks way too big. (Hope I'm wrong.)
You are probably wrong. Here is the size comparison against N97 Mini:
http://www.mobile-review.com/review/image/nokia/n97mini/pic16.jpg
Of course, N97 Mini itself is not the smallest handset on the market, but it is not unbearably large either. It is said to be about 1cm shorter than N97 and you can see that N900 is even shorter than that (but, of course, wider, to accommodate wider screen).

[Kozzi]

eh that's weird, with n900 having 3.5" screen and 5:3 ratio, I though it won't be as wide as n97 mini 3.5" 16:9 screen.
[¡]nvm n97's screen isn't 3.5"[/i]

[Espoo888]

Apple iPhone - 115mm x 61mm x 11.6mm

Nokia N900 - 111mm x 59.7mm x 18mm

[eltinio]

It's about the same size as an Nokia E71 (except for the thickness)

e71: 114 x 57 x 10 mm

And the e71 is a normal phone for calling.

[benny1967]

All these phones - iPhone, N97 (incl. mini), almost all E- and N-series devices - are too big for me. I couldn't imagine carrying them around comfortably.

To give you an idea what we're talking about here: The Nokia 6320 was almost ideal in terms of size and weight. That's what I expect a phone to be.

For everything that doesn't fit this form factor (like a large screen for videos and browsing), I want a secondary device that I take with me only when needed.

[chilko]

Nokia bets on Linux in iPhone battle: sources (http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSTRE57P1SG20090826?feedType=RSS&feedName=technologyNews&sp=true)

[Espoo888]

N900 recap - what we "know" - please add or correct as appropriate.

Specifications:

Dimensions: 111mm x 59.7mm x 18mm
Screen: 3.5" 800x480 resistive touch, proximity sensor, accelerometer?
CPU: OMAP 3 600Mhz–1Ghz
RAM: 256MB (+750MB virtual)
Storage: 32GB internal (+microSD)
Battery: 1320 mAh
OS: Maemo 5
Camera: 5MP Carl Zeiss dual LED - video capture at VGA 30fps
Browser: Fennec?
Flash/Java: full support
Communications: 3G, HSPA, WiFi, Bluetooth, A-GPS, FM radio/transmitter
Connections: Mini(?) USB (for power and data), 3.5mm audio/video out
Format support: Extensive - MPEG2, DIvX, etc.


Applications:

Maemo community apps - how many? which good ones? backwards compatibility with Maemo 4 apps?
Nokia(?) Maps
Nokia PIM apps
Nokia Media Player
E-mail - Nokia app? Nokia mail for exchange?
Nokia camera app
Nokia profile and phone settings apps
more confirmed or expected apps?

[vkv.raju]

gps (or a-gps?), accelometer, ambient sensor, dual-led flash

[Espoo888]

thnks - I added your specs - is the accelerometer confirmed?

[fms]

"Browser" is apparently Fennec. AGPS (not GPS). UI is based on heavily modified GTK+. Low level phone stack is based on oFono (developed together with Intel). The device has got video out and (apparently) builtin FM transmitter. The battery is 1320mAh.

And yes, you better put this all into Wiki, unless somebody has done so already

[Espoo888]

"Browser" is apparently Fennec. AGPS (not GPS). UI is based on heavily modified GTK+. Low level phone stack is based on oFono (developed together with Intel). The device has got video out and (apparently) builtin FM transmitter. The battery is 1320mAh.

And yes, you better put this all into Wiki, unless somebody has done so already

Great idea :) How do I do that! :o

[fms]

All these phones - iPhone, N97 (incl. mini), almost all E- and N-series devices - are too big for me. I couldn't imagine carrying them around comfortably.
Ah, come on, you are being far too selective about this whole phone thing :) Just get yourself a cheap E51 phone, carry it with N900 for a few weeks, then discard the phone as you adjust to a slightly bigger device and no longer feel like using two gadgets at the same time.

[ysss]

Nokia bets on Linux in iPhone battle: sources (http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSTRE57P1SG20090826?feedType=RSS&feedName=technologyNews&sp=true)

Good article.

"The Finnish group has dabbled with Linux since 2005, using it in "Internet tablets" -- sleek phone-like devices used to access the Web that have failed to gain mass-market appeal in part due to their lack of a cellular radio."

Good thing the same mistake is not to be repeated ;)

[allnameswereout]

Serbia will catch up eventually; just a bit slower than most of Europe :) I found there were tons of open WiFi APs as well.

I'm sorry but Vodafone and "unlimited internet" cannot appear together in the same sentence.
if "Fair usage" means "strictly limited to 1G, no voip, no instant messaging, no whatever we don't like today", isn't really unlimited, is it?It is called Vodafone Zorgeloos Online here ('without worries online'), and the FUP means that you're not allowed to use 10x as much as the average person. But I know cable corporations here who apply the same. In its essence it is fair 99% of the customers do not pay extra for 1% of the heavy users. But the secrecy surrounding it I don't like. IM is allowed as it seems (also read earlier quote). Not being allowed X can be circumvented with VPN (except this increaes latency), and I'd like to see such tried in court. I don't think it will hold any legal bearing. Look at Apple pooping its pampers for FCC saying they're still 'reviewing' Google Voice. The argument against Skype is that is uses a lot of P2P data traffic. If that is true, I can follow the reasoning. It means a Skype user is not giving the mobile telco any direct profit while DoSing the rest of the users. That is not the behaviour you want on your network.

IMO the secrecy and disallowing certain services should be made illegal by law, while customers pay more precisely what they pay for/use without worrying.

Remember back in the days how expensive always-on leased lines were. If you had some kind of all-you-can-eat subscription your employer pays for then they cut a deal for X subscriptions. They certainly pay for the data you use one way or another. Perhaps they apply the 10x as much as average to the rest of corporate users of the deal. So if your colleagues burn tons of GB as well you can be sure they will calculate that in the lunch. TANSTAAFL 101.

I get max HSDPA with my E71 as well, but I still have a FUP. Here you can get all-you-can-eat subscriptions with lower max speed. You can also get strict MB bundles. T-Mobile even has web'n'walk with good speed until you get over 1 GB or sth after which you get heavily capped. Or you can buy an iPhone (or corporate bundle) with a so-called unlimited usage. But you pay a lot for that subscription every month; there the limit is your wallet. There is always a catch, a limit, somewhere!

A compare with 56k6 goes moot because those weren't flat-free and had different speed. Dial-up is more akin to how cellphones usage was a few years ago: low speed, non-flat free, for things like WAP.

What we have mostly (with countries such as Serbia still catching up to this trend) is an always-on, national covered network which you can use for certain ordinary tasks most people do on the Internet (e-mail, news, social networking, IM, maps, youtube) with exception of heavy bandwidth things like downloading a DVD or latency related things like FPS game. I say national because for it to be usable international the prices are too high.

[vkv.raju]

Good article.

"The Finnish group has dabbled with Linux since 2005, using it in "Internet tablets" -- sleek phone-like devices used to access the Web that have failed to gain mass-market appeal in part due to their lack of a cellular radio."

Good thing the same mistake is not to be repeated ;)

Well, I am not sure if it was a mistake (including a cellular radio) or a conscious decision. Else, they had 3 full years (since 2005) to realize it and introduce one cellular radio either in N800 or N810. Nokia seems to know what it is doing!

[Espoo888]

Updated with forum member additions...

N900 recap - what we "know" - please add or correct as appropriate.

Specifications:

Dimensions: 111mm x 59.7mm x 18mm
Screen: 3.5" 800x480 resistive touch, proximity sensor, accelerometer?
CPU: OMAP 3 600Mhz–1Ghz
RAM: 256MB (+750MB virtual)
Storage: 32GB internal (+microSD)
Battery: 1320 mAh
OS: Maemo 5
Camera: 5MP Carl Zeiss dual LED - video capture at VGA 30fps minimum (based on N97 performance)
Browser: Fennec?
Flash/Java: full support
Communications: 3G, HSPA, WiFi, Bluetooth, A-GPS, FM radio/transmitter
Connections: Mini(?) USB (for power and data), 3.5mm audio/video out
Format support: Extensive - MPEG2, DIvX, etc.

Applications:

Maemo community apps - how many? which good ones? backwards compatibility with Maemo 4 apps?
Nokia(?) Maps
Nokia PIM apps
Nokia Media Player
E-mail - Nokia app? Nokia mail for exchange?
Nokia camera app
Nokia profile and phone settings apps
more confirmed or expected apps?

[benny1967]

Ah, come on, you are being far too selective about this whole phone thing :) Just get yourself a cheap E51 phone, carry it with N900 for a few weeks, then discard the phone as you adjust to a slightly bigger device and no longer feel like using two gadgets at the same time.

Trust me. I tried bigger models (like the Xperia X1), I just cannot handle them. (Also the touch-screen makes me go nuts. I need keys.)

And I'm not going to make any compromise only because marketing droids and bored tech journalists want to make us buy bricks instead of mobiles.

[ysss]

Well, I am not sure if it was a mistake (including a cellular radio) or a conscious decision. Else, they had 3 full years (since 2005) to realize it and introduce one cellular radio either in N800 or N810. Nokia seems to know what it is doing!

I beg to differ here.. if they did know what they were doing, they wouldn't have let their marketshare slid down that far.

[vkv.raju]

I beg to differ here.. if they did know what they were doing, they wouldn't have let their marketshare slid down that far.

Probably they waited for a killer device like N900 to bring their market share back. And it took them this long. Btw, wouldn't you agree, it's worth the wait for them?

[manda]

Camera: 5MP Carl Zeiss dual LED - video capture at VGA 30fps
Ahem.. dear to share source of your info about this 'VGA 30fps' part? I was searching this info for a loong time. Until now I only saw HD camera in specs.

[Espoo888]

"Browser" is apparently Fennec.

The N900 browser screenshots that Eldar posted don't match the Fennec Beta or does that just mean that Nokia are using the Fennec browser with their own custom skin?

[ysss]

Probably they waited for a killer device like N900 to bring their market share back. And it took them this long. Btw, wouldn't you agree, it's worth the wait for them?

Well it seems better than what the previous models in their high end line up are (not really best selling model in that categories compared to their competitors), or compared to the previous NIT (technologically inferior, dated).

And frankly... we're rght in the middle of a product launch hype. So, the honeymoon hasn't even begun :)

[fms]

The N900 browser screenshots that Eldar posted don't match the Fennec Beta or does that just mean that Nokia are using the Fennec browser with their own custom skin?
No idea. I just remember that long time ago somebody from Nokia said that the plan is to use Fennec in Fremantle.

[Espoo888]

Ahem.. dear to share source of you info about this 'VGA 30fps' part? I was searching this info for a loong time. Until now I only saw HD camera in specs.

No source :eek: This is the N97 video capture spec and it has the same camera module as the N900. It is possible that the N900 will record in a higher resolution and even slightly possible that they could offer a super high frame rate mode.

I will edit the summary sheet to say "VGA 30fps minimum" :D

[GeneralAntilles]

"Maemo Talk" (only recently renamed from Internet Tablet Talk)


Actually, it was renamed to "maemo.org Talk" or just "Talk" if you want to be accurate.

[attila77]

Serbia will catch up eventually; just a bit slower than most of Europe :) I found there were tons of open WiFi APs as well.

Yes, we're just a solid 3-4 years behind the curve in most regards, in some issues more, in some less :) In any case, never-ever use roaming for internet. For voice calls, your hands might be tied, but for data it almost always pays off to buy a PAYG SIM and throw it away (or keep it as a souvenir as I do :D ). Case in point - my latest trip to Montenegro: The cost of a SIM with a 250MB package is 15 euros (or 2GB for 30), no strings attached. Now, calculate how much roaming megabytes does 15 euros buy you.

IMO the secrecy and disallowing certain services should be made illegal by law, while customers pay more precisely what they pay for/use without worrying.

THEY are who are cheating and trying to weasel out their way out of it. Say it's X bandwidth, or X amount of data and charge it accordingly. Do not say unlimited when you are limiting it (regardless of the reason). Otherwise, it's misleading at best and fraud at worst.

[GeneralAntilles]

"Browser" is apparently Fennec.

Better source this one. This doesn't connect with what I know about MicroB in Fremantle, and it certainly doesn't match the screenshots we've seen so far.

The N900 browser screenshots that Eldar posted don't match the Fennec Beta or does that just mean that Nokia are using the Fennec browser with their own custom skin?

Well, MicroB and Fennec are just Firefox at the core, so, technically, yes, Nokia is just using a custom skin.

No idea. I just remember that long time ago somebody from Nokia said that the plan is to use Fennec in Fremantle.

I'd like to see this sourced, as it doesn't fit with what I know about Fremantle and MicroB.

[Andre Klapper]

Going to "about:" in Fremantle it says "MicroB".

[sachin007]

Well it seems better than what the previous models in their high end line up are (not really best selling model in that categories compared to their competitors), or compared to the previous NIT (technologically inferior, dated).

And frankly... we're rght in the middle of a product launch hype. So, the honeymoon hasn't even begun :)

The n900 is definitely the best phone in the market in terms of specs and the OS. I think nokia did always want to include phone capability on maemo, but they just had to take a longer time to the market. They chose to deliver a perfect device rather than update mms or copy paste features. Well the iphone still doesnt have multi-tasking and not many people with a sound knowledge of mobile technology will agree that the iphone is a smartphone. And the n900 is definitely not hyped up. It is what it is unlike what some rabid iphone users think that it is the jesus phone. So u are 100% wrong in saying that nokia never got it.... infact they always got it... they just waited for perfection, although i like to have the latest and greatest just to take care of my techie itch

[ysss]

Wow sachin, you sound very objective today :) Exactly someone I'd like to get sound product analysis from..

If you want to call other rabid fans... make REALLY sure you're not a rabid fanboi yourself please :D

[volt]

A word on price.

In my opinion, the closest competitor to the N900 is the HTC Touch Pro2.
Leaked price: €385 link (http://gadgetophilia.com/htc-touch-pro-2-price-leaked/)
Announced price: €670 link (http://www.unwiredview.com/2009/04/16/htc-touch-pro2-priced-it-will-retail-for-about-880/)
Current price: €510 link (http://www.clove.co.uk/viewProduct.aspx?product=C64E151D-03FE-49D1-8412-C266A9D3D48B)
Current price, my country: €670 inc. vat.

Another comparable product is, of course, the Nokia N97. It'd be unrealistic to believe the N900 wouldn't be more expensive than the less omnipotent N97. And here's the thing.
Announced price: €550. Apparently exclusive vat. link (http://thenokian97.com/nokia-n97-price-announced/)
Current price: €490 link (http://www.clove.co.uk/viewProduct.aspx?product=1099F531-512C-43CB-98FC-225DD0E36503)
Current price, my country: €580 inc. vat.

We can also compare the product to the older SE Xperia X1, also with a keyboard and 800x480 pixels.
Leaked price: €800. link (http://tamsppc.tamoggemon.com/2008/06/27/sony-xperia-x1-official-euro-price-leaked/)
Announced price: ? See leaked price.
Current price: €445 link (http://www.clove.co.uk/viewProduct.aspx?Manufacturer=SonyEricsson&Item=SonyEricssonXPERIAX1(ArcSlider)-BLACK&Product=4736E0FA-6F0F-459D-95CF-5614049B7B38&Category=D179C153-030B-46E2-835D-0464ACDA9F6A)
Current price, my country: €450.

So, is the price of the N900 so bad?
Leaked price: €550. It is the same as the announced N97 price. For a far more powerful device.
Edit: Announced price: €500 ex. VAT

I do realize that lots of people don't want a N900 phone, but instead a N900 tablet. Well, that would have been cheaper. But this N900 is a cellphone, too. So, considering what it actually is, instead of what it could have been...

I don't think it's fair to complain about this price.

[anidel]

Did anyone notice that the screenshots are ALL 500x300 ???

They don't see to have being reduce.

I strongly think this is just a NEW phone with Maemo, but it is NOT a new Internet Tablet.

[volt]

Did anyone notice that the screenshots are ALL 500x300 ???

They don't see to have being reduce.

I strongly think this is just a NEW phone with Maemo, but it is NOT a new Internet Tablet.

If you're talking about the screenshots in the review, they are made/published by the same guy who said
"The phone’s 800x480 pixel resistive screen (pretty responsive, by the way) is great for watching videos and the kickstand mounted on the N900 only helps the experience."

[attila77]

Did anyone notice that the screenshots are ALL 500x300 ???

They don't see to have being reduce.

I strongly think this is just a NEW phone with Maemo, but it is NOT a new Internet Tablet.

Note that direct 800x480 screenshots look HUGE on monitor DPI, so don't rule out resizing.

[theflew]

I beg to differ here.. if they did know what they were doing, they wouldn't have let their marketshare slid down that far.

I would argue back in 2005 when the 770 came out mobile linux was ahead of it's time. Nokia has pushed a lot of code into open source making mobile linux possible. Who knows where the Pre, Android and Pandora would be if the 770 didn't exist.

Maybe with the N900 Nokia feels there is enough of a solid base with maemo to build a line out of, thus the cellular radio.

[Espoo888]

Better source this one. This doesn't connect with what I know about MicroB in Fremantle, and it certainly doesn't match the screenshots we've seen so far.



Well, MicroB and Fennec are just Firefox at the core, so, technically, yes, Nokia is just using a custom skin.



I'd like to see this sourced, as it doesn't fit with what I know about Fremantle and MicroB.

So we don't know for sure what browser the N900 will ship with right?

What about other apps? Apart from all the stuff Nokia will port over from S60 (PIM, Maps, Camera, etc.) what apps from the N810 era are you guys excited to see running (or upgraded to run) on Maemo 5 and the improved CPU?

[kenny]

It's possible that Nokia made the change to a 3.5 inch screen in order to make this thing more pocket-able (and gain more acceptance.) I almost never saw a 800/810 review or reference that stressed the pocket-able factor. People always just lump them into the Tablet or MID category. In theory and in Nokia's marketing, the 800/810 were pocket-able devices, but in actual use I think they were just a little too big for most people's pockets.

[eltinio]

500 is 62,5% of 800 and 300 is 62,5% of 480.

It looks like they were shrunk to 62,5% of the original for viewing purposes.

[volt]

Maybe, but im not going to use this as a phone. Its a MID with 3G data to me.

Tethering was never my favourite pass time.

Good article.
..."Internet tablets" ... failed to gain mass-market appeal in part due to their lack of a cellular radio."


First, a few words about the N810 from my POV:

This - the lack of a cellular radio - almost kept me from buying the N810. The low price of the N800 nudged me in the right direction yet it was the hardware keyboard that made me go for the N810.

Deciding factors were:
- the 800x480 resolution. My windows mobile had a nonstandard resolution that prevented some programs from working, and it was too small to read even soccer results on.

- browser got good review. I would have gone for Opera Mobile as well.

- The hardware keyboard, I have never gotten any fast with txt msgs.

- Bluetooth audio. I found some proof of working A2DP, and imagined myself using a A2DP headset. Also, with my A2DP car stereo. Well, disappointment. Pretty much giving up on A2DP.

- Bluetooth networking. I imagined it'd be easy to pair with my WM6 cell phone. Again, disappointment. Though there is a hack available, it's too cumbersome and I rarely if ever use it over GSM. Easier with WM5.

- I checked if people were using it for eBooks, and they were.

Initially I thought of the lack of cellphone functionality as weird. Pretty much every single person I've mentioned this device to, has believed it's a touch screen cell phone. I have to tell them repeatedly, it just doesn't register with them because the device is, well, a Nokia. So, I figured I didn't really need cellphone functionality, I could just pair it with my WM6 phone. But that hardly works well for me. Nothing like how well WLAN works. To get it working better, I'd have to ditch WM6. But I'm reluctant to having a phone with no smartphone functionality. And lately Nokia phones has been known to not work well with my bluetooth car stereo. So I was looking at a scenario where I'd have to replace, well, all my devices.

...And then a few words about the N900, from my POV.

Compared to what I have now, the N900 gives better connectivity to internet, better chances of getting updates that can make it work with my car stereo than a non-open phone, and one less device to carry around. I too can see the desire to have a phone as slim as i.e. the 5630, 18mm doesn't sound that tempting. Yet, it's about the same as my Ipaq 514 so, I think I'll live. Also, it's supposed to weigh less than the n810, which I also appreciate. But then the keyboard has lost too many keys, that's not good!

For me, this is a quite interesting device. I DO want to carry my tablet with me everywhere, I already do most of the time. I DO NOT want to fiddle around with tethering (for minutes) or installing hacks that eats battery which again requires installing other hacks to open up root access, etc, just to be able to get net access.

This device's screen is not quite as good as the N810 when it comes to size for books or video. I assume other things about the screen is improved, though.

The device is a bit chubby. But not as chubby as the N810 plus any cell phone.

And I hope, but do not trust, that A2DP works better with this new device.

I have never spent that much money on a cell phone. And these days a coworker of mine is struggling to return a N97 he just bought and hates. I will require some good reviews of it, by current NIT owners, before I decide. But...

I think this device looks quite promising.

Nokia had better get it out in the stores before I discover an Android phone with keyboard and 800x480.

[froid]

Damn leaks and having to wait for the N900 to show up now. Now I keep noticing little things that bug me about my E65 and N810 that annoy me. I can't wait to make the transition!!!

[ysss]

Is there a poll about the current interest for (purchasing) n900 yet?

- buy
- buy if the reviews are positive
- buy if my personal test drive is positive
- don't know yet
- i'm sure i won't buy n900

[volt]

What about other apps?

Pidgin (or similar)
FBReader (or similar)
VNCViewer
Canola (or similar)
KeePassX - in theory... I install it and then do not transfer my passwords to it
alternative browser (just in case)

[dansus]

Damn leaks and having to wait for the N900 to show up now. Now I keep noticing little things that bug me about my E65 and N810 that annoy me. I can't wait to make the transition!!!

My E71 has been playing up since the N900 was leaked. I think its jealous... lol.

[vvaz]

Canola (or similar)


From screenshots looks like most features of Canola were integrated in default media player.

[nilchak]

It's possible that Nokia made the change to a 3.5 inch screen in order to make this thing more pocket-able (and gain more acceptance.) I almost never saw a 800/810 review or reference that stressed the pocket-able factor. People always just lump them into the Tablet or MID category. In theory and in Nokia's marketing, the 800/810 were pocket-able devices, but in actual use I think they were just a little too big for most people's pockets.

More importantly the N810/N80 was too big for phone use - to hold by your ear side.

So any phone that any company makes has to take into factor the size limitations.
Just lumping a GSM radio into a tablet doesn't a phone make.

[dormant]

Is there a poll about the current interest for (purchasing) n900 yet?

- buy
- buy if the reviews are positive
- buy if my personal test drive is positive
- don't know yet
- i'm sure i won't buy n900

How about:

- buy even though I don't really need it and to heck with any reviews.

It's not going to be available here in Trinidad and I don't have a data plan, but I'm still looking to get me one.

[korbé]

The question I ask myself, it's:

How much of the Maemo N900 will be Free and open Source?
Which parties will be proprietary?
-----------------------------------------

Edit: Remove the last question. My English is too bad to be understandable. So to avoid any misunderstanding of my remarks, I delete this.

[dormant]

I have two Nokia phones and both cause me a problem. I can't use them properly without wearing my spectacles. And I don't like to wear my spectacles all the time so I often end up using the menus by memory. The set-up has some options to change font sizes, but nothing that makes the whole interface bigger.

If the n900 has the capability to have a large-font interface, making it suitable for those of us with bad eyesight, I'll fight my way to the front of the queue.

(I've never checked if this facility exists on any smartphones, so may be being dumb here.)

[ColonelKilkenny]

Edit. korbé edited his/her post so I'll remove this too.

[vkv.raju]

They are probably at this very moment having a private party where they bath in money, drink Cristal, project maemo.org threads on wall and laugh evil laugh while rubbing their big sweaty bellies.

I honestly didn't understand what point the poster was trying to make by asking about nokia laughing at the community. Moreover, I didn't what you were trying to answer??

[zerojay]

The question I ask myself, it's:

How much of the Maemo N900 will be Free and open Source?
Which parties will be proprietary?
Did Nokia laugh at the community of Maemo?

aaaaaaaaaaaAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR GHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!

JAY SMASH

[dormant]

Will I be able to do everything on the n900 using vnc from my computer? Including access to all the phone functions?

That could be a good selling point. People spend a lot of time navigating through menus on their phones to change settings. Surely they'd be blown away by being able to do it in a window on their computer.

[korbé]

Sorry, I update my reply.

[ysss]

How about:

- buy even though I don't really need it and to heck with any reviews.

It's not going to be available here in Trinidad and I don't have a data plan, but I'm still looking to get me one.

that'll be the 1st choice (buy, period) and i think i'm in that category as well cause i'm a gadget freak :D

[livefreeordie]

Will I be able to do everything on the n900 using vnc from my computer? Including access to all the phone functions?

That could be a good selling point. People spend a lot of time navigating through menus on their phones to change settings. Surely they'd be blown away by being able to do it in a window on their computer.

Even better, you'll be able to ssh in and use the command line!



P.S. Yes

P.P.S. Another one for buy it on day one and screw the reviews.

[deadmalc]

No idea. I just remember that long time ago somebody from Nokia said that the plan is to use Fennec in Fremantle.

I think this is confused I seem to remember someone from mozilla saying that Fennec would be in Fremantle, which confused me at the time.
I assumed this mean't it should be ready for full release at the time of Fremantle, and if it was it would likely replace the current version.

Fennec isn't yet ready and Fremantle is knocking at the door...

[mrojas]

Checking again the N900 pics, it seems that the BL-5J battery is similar in size to the BP-4L, anyone has the dimensions? I think one could probably fit a BP-4L in the N900 without any major issues.

[mikkov]

Checking again the N900 pics, it seems that the BL-5J battery is similar in size to the BP-4L, anyone has the dimensions? I think one could probably fit a BP-4L in the N900 without any major issues.

"similar in size" :) If there's even 1mm difference some place you have major issues fitting it in.

[Phen0m]

Does anyone know if the Ram is indeed 128 instead of the sometimes listed 256?
Also, have the dimensions leaked yet?(wondering if the screen is wider than the traditional narrow screen's Nokia tends to release)

[nilchak]

Does anyone know if the Ram is indeed 128 instead of the sometimes listed 256?
Also, have the dimensions leaked yet?(wondering if the screen is wider than the traditional narrow screen's Nokia tends to release)

You will get most of the specs (including dimensions) here in this thread (http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=315621&postcount=554).

[volt]

http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/23639-Nokia-N810-vs-N97-vs-Nokia-N900

Sizes.

[fms]

Better source this one. This doesn't connect with what I know about MicroB in Fremantle, and it certainly doesn't match the screenshots we've seen so far. ... I'd like to see this sourced, as it doesn't fit with what I know about Fremantle and MicroB.
Not insisting on this piece of information. In fact, it may be something in between, using mobile-optimized rendering engine from Fennec with MicroB application code on top of it. One way to know for sure would be to find out what packages are included into actual Fremantle firmware.

[Khertan]

More importantly the N810/N80 was too big for phone use - to hold by your ear side.

For you ... for me it s the perfect size !

[danramos]

I just saw the pricing on the 900 ... Ouch! 550 euros! I live in Canada and it converts to $853 cdn. That is not on! They are going to have definitely rethink that pricing. BTW.. I'm drafting this response on my Archos 5 IMT.

Cell phone radio will do that--also, cell phone lock-in. I can't wait for this thing to finally get released.. mostly because I want to see whether or what kind of bull____ we're going to see getting pulled this time with yet another hot smartphone.

Why is 550e an unreasonable price?

Probably because it's a WHOLE lot more expensive than its previous bretheren Maemo devices that weren't cell phones. Hell--it's more expensive than any of the similar current generations of competing products despite these whiz-bang (and screeching crash) new features that can be added easily to most other devices with an accessory (i.e. modular, plugin-in devices).

So are you saying every euro price Nokia can be calculated this way? I think most international products are priced regionally....hence, there is no straight "google" conversion method to use. But thanks anyway I just thought that since official pics were out then perhaps a price may be out also.

Maybe--but it certainly gives you a very good idea of the general vicinity of the pricing.

I cant stop staring at it, looks so sweet.

IT'S A TRAP!

A lot of people here at the "Maemo Talk" (only recently renamed from Internet Tablet Talk) are not quite convinced yet that they need a 3G radio (which adds to cost and generally requires a separate data plan each) in every portable device. At least not in most markets today.

Most people even considering the Nooklet are likely to have a data-ready mobile in their pocket already. How many different 3G radios along with their restrictive pricing plans are people willing to carry?

The popular use of Nokia's Internet Tablets has been - besides WIFI of course - as a companion device to a mobile phone via tethering.

The N900 bundles the two in one package - at the expense of tablet experience but hopefully providing a better mobile phone experience. Yet possibly at the price of the two...

I couldn't have said it better--but I'm sure I've said it more often. :)

Good article.

"The Finnish group has dabbled with Linux since 2005, using it in "Internet tablets" -- sleek phone-like devices used to access the Web that have failed to gain mass-market appeal in part due to their lack of a cellular radio."

Good thing the same mistake is not to be repeated ;)

Yeah.. God forbid they should make a new class of device that they could have pioneered and been recognized for with the right advertising and support instead of yet another smart phone. Whew. Dodged that bullet.

The N900 browser screenshots that Eldar posted don't match the Fennec Beta or does that just mean that Nokia are using the Fennec browser with their own custom skin?

I thought gecko was the engine and Fennec was the interface? How can you still call it Fennec if you're using a different interface?

Actually, it was renamed to "maemo.org Talk" or just "Talk" if you want to be accurate.

Internet Tablets are soooooo 2006.

The n900 is definitely the best phone in the market...

Soooo.. you admit it's not a new tablet, it's a cell phone. I accept your apology. ;)

Wow sachin, you sound very objective today :) Exactly someone I'd like to get sound product analysis from..

If you want to call other rabid fans... make REALLY sure you're not a rabid fanboi yourself please :D

Yeah.. why aren't I being asked my objective opinions? :D

[sirhunter2010]

I paid $299 canadian for the Archos 5 IMT 120, $30 for the mini dock and $40 for the codecs I wanted (totally pissed that Archos charges for mpg2\vob and h.264 codecs) but damn does this thing work well. So well infact that my HP 2140 is sitting idle since I bought my Archos 5 in late July. My biggest gripe about the Archos 5 is the closed nature of the Linux variant that Archos has deployed for its IMT product line.

[dansus]

From twitter.com/lvargasl

"Tomorrow the official announcement for the new Maemo device from Nokia!!"

[zerojay]

From twitter.com/lvargasl

"Tomorrow the official announcement for the new Maemo device from Nokia!!"

Yes, I wouldn't put any validity into the statement. I think it's someone that was confused over when Nokia World was.

[Texrat]

"Internet tablets" -- sleek phone-like devices used to access the Web that have failed to gain mass-market appeal in part due to their lack of a cellular radio."

Ooo... don't get me started!

Lack of a cell radio at best was a tiny part of the failure. I think we can safely say that (1) poor marketing and (2) frustrating out-of-the-box experience were the biggies.

A cellular radio should not be a diehard requirement for a handheld computer.

[GeneralAntilles]

Lack of a cell radio at best was a tiny part of the failure. I think we can safely say that (1) poor marketing and (2) frustrating out-of-the-box experience were the biggies.


I think the real key, though, is that Nokia didn't particularly want mass market success with the models released so far. It was an R&D platform that was mostly used to help development and generate a community (which it'd be really sad to see them toss away with with the Maemo 5), and it's only now starting to move into the big leagues.

Now, whether that was a wise decision is certainly up for debate, but it seems like Nokia's market position so far has been exactly where they wanted it to be.

[Texrat]

I think the real key, though, is that Nokia didn't particularly want mass market success with the models released so far. It was an R&D platform that was mostly used to help development and generate a community (which it'd be really sad to see them toss away with with the Maemo 5), and it's only now starting to move into the big leagues.

Now, whether that was a wise decision is certainly up for debate, but it seems like Nokia's market position so far has been exactly where they wanted it to be.

I agree of course, since I've said the same myself, but that's motive and I was focusing on means. ;)

[Espoo888]

Will the N900 be able to play DivX and Xvid videos such as one might download ;) - e.g. c.350MB TV shows - without any transcoding?

With all that storage (64GB) that would be quite handy - I am not aware of any other smartphone that can nope with these videos without transcoding or downloading special .mp4 versions.

[volt]

I just saw the pricing on the 900 ... Ouch! 550 euros!


Cell phone radio will do that--also, cell phone lock-in.

It is €550 or phone lock-in. You only accept phone lock-in because you get a significantly better initial price. If you, like me, care about the lifetime cost, you pay full price for a unlocked device and pick a cheaper subscription elsewhere.

Nokia isn't like Apple, you can always buy their phones without going through a carrier.

[volt]

Will the N900 be able to play DivX and Xvid videos such as one might download ;) - e.g. c.350MB TV shows - without any transcoding?


The short answer is 'yes'.

[Espoo888]

The short answer is 'yes'.

That's fantastic :cool:

I really can't think of any other smartphone that can do that. Top Gear, The Wire, Lost, Battlestar Galactica, here we come :D

[volt]

This is a good year for smart phones.

I just cannot believe Android phones do not also play Xvid. And I know for a fact that Samsung I8910 Omnia HD can, I read a review of it that praised it to 6/6, pulling out video playback (TV series in particular) as one of it's strengths. That's a Symbian S60 phone.

Xvid support is getting fairly mainstream.

[Espoo888]

Yes, the Omnia HD can play back DivX - I forgot about that one - but I don't know about any others - in any case hardly mainstream yet in the phone world and a great feature to have.

[VDVsx]

From twitter.com/lvargasl

"Tomorrow the official announcement for the new Maemo device from Nokia!!"

Interesting, there's more people saying the same, but suddenly all twitts were removed :eek:

The proof ;)
http://www.valeriovalerio.org/images/maemo5.png

[chilko]

i smell conspiracy
:)

[ysss]

What a happy day, today is the Maemo launch :D

[jsa]

There it is! http://conversations.nokia.com

[Jaffa]

See also http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=316081#post316081

[Jaffa]

Why is 550e an unreasonable price?

Official prices, according to the press release (http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1337594) is 500eur (excl. sales taxes). Not much more than the N810's launch price, IIRC.

[fpp]

Depends on where you sit, obviously. In France, 500€ excluding VAT means 600€ in the shop. Launch price for the N810 was 499€ tax included.

[froid]

What countries will it hit at launch? I have to plan my vacation if it doesn't come to Canada right away.

[kenny]

I think the real key, though, is that Nokia didn't particularly want mass market success with the models released so far. It was an R&D platform that was mostly used to help development and generate a community and it's only now starting to move into the big leagues.

Now, whether that was a wise decision is certainly up for debate, but it seems like Nokia's market position so far has been exactly where they wanted it to be.
Now that they are going mainstream with a phone included, I sure hope they've got it right. Ease of use is paramount. The smartphone expectations of the general public are now very high but the their ability and/or desire to operate a convoluted device is very low. Considering the shortcomings of some recent Nokia releases (N97, Ovi in general, etc.), I'm not overly optimistic about the N900 being a huge success. Nokia's market share of smartphones may continue to drop.

[jandmdickerson]

Yes, I wouldn't put any validity into the statement. I think it's someone that was confused over when Nokia World was.

I guess this person had inside info.

[barry99705]

Man, this thing might bring me back to Nokia hardware!!

[samyuktha]

Its the pleasant review ....