well respected reviewer "eldar" throwing caution to N900

[bugelrex]

well respected reviewer "eldar" throwing caution to N900.

I wonder if Eldar is the only "non Fanboy" with his hands on the N900? I trust his reviews completely and has no reason to tarnish his reputation.

He's basically saying that the N900 at Nokia world was a special firmware build. I "think" he's updated with a newer firmware and still seeing stability issues. Anyone familiar with software engineering will know bugs/crashes are normal during development, but to have ANY "easy to reproduce issues" weeks from release is a sign of worry and poor code quality/integration.

With such an "open" O/S you cannot code/test all integration/use case possibilities so easily.

BTW, I tested the device at the Nokia store for 10 mins 2 weeks ago and it seemed pretty stable to me. But Eldar has the thing 24x7.

Heres original link
http://eldarmurtazin.livejournal.com/497512.html

google translated:
http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Feldarmurtazin.livejournal.com%2F497 512.html&sl=ru&tl=en&history_state0=

[Texrat]

Here we go again...

[zerojay]

His claims of "PR firmware" are... well...

I think he sees how much excitement is around the N900 so being really negative about it now (after being so positive about it in his review) means getting more hits and you're helping to reenforce that. :)

[TA-t3]

There is already a thread about this.

[bugelrex]

His claims of "PR firmware" are... well...

I think he sees how much excitement is around the N900 so being really negative about it now (after being so positive about it in his review) means getting more hits and you're helping to reenforce that. :)


Seriously, this guy is so respected that I seriously doubt it. His reputation is worth more than a "few bucks" from web hits.

C'mon if he really cared about webhits his posts and website would mainly be in English not Russian!

[Viipottaja]

He is respected by leak hungry forum goers, true.

[Jack6428]

this time i will reply with a poem (took me 5 minutes):

Eldar this, Eldar that.
If we listened to him every time,
we would be just sitting home on our butts,
becoming lazy to stand, becoming fat.
On the other hand, if what he says was fact,
me and everyone else would get pretty mad.
That being said, i have nothing to add.
Eldar, please stop becoming our dad,
it's really boring and sad.
Fact.

:D

[Bratag]

Well given that I cannot make head nor tails of the translation I cant comment on the review itself. That being said I KNOW that others have prototypes 24x7 and this is the first I am hearing of BAD stability issues.

[bugelrex]

I'm surprised by all the Eldar hate. He's simply saying what every software developer is aware of:

Building a complex system is difficult, there will be bugs and issues. Its how those bugs are managed and expectations that lead to an actually release.

Turning features off/special builds are common in software development for demos.

BUT in my experience, for large projects, random crashes or easy to reproduce crashes WEEKS before release never end well. Ask any C/C++ developer with more than 10 years experience and you will get the same answer.

Either Eldar is lying about the stability, has faulty hardware or simply pushes his N900 harder than others.

I hope he has faulty hardware

[Texrat]

Reputation??? Didn't he leak details of a prototype device?

And don't confuse the responses thus far with hate, bugelrex. Let's please avoid exaggeration.

[nowave7]

With such an "open" O/S you cannot code/test all integration/use case possibilities so easily.


What on earth are you talking about!?:mad:

[Jack6428]

What on earth are you talking about!?:mad:

which language do you want me to translate it to ? xD

[mece]

Uh-oh sounds like someone's had a dip in the development software pool. Perhaps it would be better to test the stable branch?

[SubCore]

Eldar doesn't have an official prototype, so it's highly likely that he has an even older hardware version than the one nokia sent out to their stores and "official" reviewers.
flashing that with some OS update (where'd he get that??) is by no means a reliable source of information.

i don't take that guy seriously at all, if i want random rumors i read tabloids, those are at least entertaining.

[allnameswereout]

I read Ari Jaaksi's blog when around the time of Nokia World, and right before Nokia World he spoke about receiving a new firmware update OTA, and how comfortable such updating was. IIRC was on Twitter or small blog post. In any case that confirms there was a firmware update right before Nokia World. So what? Doesn't sound like some Evil Thing.

[danramos]

With such an "open" O/S you cannot code/test all integration/use case possibilities so easily.

That wasn't at ALL a blathering statement dripping with ignorance. Has he never used a desktop PC running Linux or a server running Solaris. Oh hell.. hasn't even used GOOGLE before? I hear they're running an open OS on their systems too. What does he have against "open" operating systems? I just as likely to point out that in a "closed" operating system, you cannot have enough people involved in vetting the software to test all integration/use cases.

[edgar2]

several people tend to defend eldar and claim he's so 'respected'. well there are some things that for sure would increase my respect for him:


show nokia some respect as well, i'm thinking about the pre-review of n900 (http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-rx51-n900-en.shtml) and the question marks regarding how he obtained the n900 (http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=327737&postcount=19)
i often find eldar's opinions and insights interesting, but i'd respect them more if, for example, he'd be open about what firmware he's using. NUMBERS, not 'the latest' (http://translate.google.com/translate?prev=hp&hl=en&js=y&u=http%3A%2F%2Feldarmurtazin.livejournal.com%2F497 512.html&sl=ru&tl=en&history_state0=). update: well according to this (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4318646063), it might be 34-14FW?


eldar recently tweeted:
Have to delete some of 300 screenshots of maemo5, may be limited them around 200. review 10 pages long :( Done it.

so we'll soon be able to look not only at his opinions about maemo5, but also how he takes the context into consideration.

[allnameswereout]

Well his statement is correct when considering 3rd party addons (community supported repositories). But that counts for any OS.

Also, given he is running an unknown hardware and unknown software version (with god knows which fixes are made for by Nokia inbetween) we cannot take his comments too serious. Given the device us not released yet it is actually good beta testers experience bugs. That way they can be fixed before final release.

Would like to see dmesg and software version and such...

Man I just tried a beta of Windows 7 on this stolen netbook here. I'm not telling you which versions of hardware and software, but believe me, the kernel keeps crashing. What a **** products. Don't buy 'em. While you're at it please click on some ads on my site. Kthxbye...

[frals]

eldar recently tweeted:


so we'll soon be able to look not only at his opinions about maemo5, but also how he takes the context into consideration.

Wow - already done with a review (no p right?) before the product is finished, that's just awesome! ;)

[dansus]

He said previously that he received his hardware in May, who knows whats changed since then and he might just have a dodgy unit anyway.

I respect Eldars views but dont take them as gospel. Same for any reviewer and the final word comes from my own hands on, i never buy a device without testing it first. Hence why i didnt buy the N97. :cool:

[Rauha]

Wow - already done with a review (no p right?) before the product is finished, that's just awesome! ;)

Almost all of his reviews could/should be renamed previews.

[bugelrex]

Wow - already done with a review (no p right?) before the product is finished, that's just awesome! ;)

they are very helpful actually, it helps make the choice of preordering and waiting to try it out in the store before purchasing.

Thank god for N97 previews, would have kicked myself for preordering that pile of crap

[kopte3]

I respect his opinion.
BTW from his twitter: So for person who are so afraid that my FW N900 not so up to date. I renew FW several times per last weeks from 34-14FW, HW is final.enjoy

[NvyUs]

why does everyone keep saying hes well respected, if he was not getting leaked prototypes nobody would even visit is site.
he does not get respect for is writing as far as I'm concerned, its more about people wanting to see is new leak.
i have read some real crap reviews on is site slamming stuff whats gone on to sell a million units a month.
The way i look at it is eldars site is the equivalent of a trashy tabloid what likes to shock for sales. sites like AAS are like the classy broadsheet and i cant wait for there Maemo site to launch

[Ovek]

Ahh... Eldar I do like his reviews but after reading his twitter posts he just comes off as some whinny little arse. His reasons for not liking the n900 now seem to change from one tweet to another.

My guess he's just jumping on the Nokia hate wagon with all the other major tech blogs. Don't expect good reviews from Slash Gear, Engadget or Gizmodo either ;)

[wazd]

Ahh... Eldar I do like his reviews but after reading his twitter posts he just comes off as some whinny little arse. His reasons for not liking the n900 now seem to change from one tweet to another.

My guess he's just jumping on the Nokia hate wagon with all the other major tech blogs. Don't expect good reviews from Slash Gear, Engadget or Gizmodo either ;)

The screen is resistive, how on earth Engadget and Gizmodo reviews can be positive?!

[qole]

Eldar confessed to Tim Samoff on Twitter that he has an unauthorized prototype (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4031346321), and he doesn't want Nokia to be able to track it down (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4031319820).

update: well according to this (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4318646063), it might be 34-14FW? so now it should be possible to rule out the possibility of old firmware being the reason for bad experiences.

That's actually quite old; older than Nokia World firmware (which was not crippled for PR reasons, what a load of crap).

[zerojay]

it might be 34-14FW? so now it should be possible to rule out the possibility of old firmware being the reason for bad experiences.


No, it doesn't.

[Bratag]

Eldar confessed to Tim Samoff on Twitter that he has an unauthorized prototype (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4031346321), and he doesn't want Nokia to be able to track it down (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4031319820).



That's actually quite old; older than Nokia World firmware (which was not crippled for PR reasons).

Nokia 1 Eldar 0

And "respect" he had previously with me - just went the way of the dodo

[Jack6428]

Nokia 1 Eldar 0

And "respect" he had previously with me - just went the way of the dodo

hahaha, just pwned!
i suggest: FINISH HIM !!!

[danramos]

hahaha, just pwned!
I suggest: finish him !!!

friendship! Friendship??

[Ovek]

The screen is resistive, how on earth Engadget and Gizmodo reviews can be positive?!

Indeed... I can't wait for the staged engadget videos of the unresponsive touch screen ;)

[Jack6428]

friendship! Friendship??

if you wish to have mercy... LOL.. but i'd finish him off, just because i want to hear the announcer's voice say FATALITY hahaha...but imagine Eldar in a MK game, fighting Dr. Jaaksi, or better, the N900 itself..haha.. nice to see another MK fan...one awsome series..Sub-Zero is da man!

[JayOnThaBeat]

friendship! Friendship??

http://www.fdmk.net/fdmk_images/encyclopedia/babality.png

|||EDIT
^Lord Raiden as a toddler *tee-hee* :D

[mobiledivide]

It seems that this move by Eldar is a move to get Nokia to send him better prototypes and firmware etc by strong arming them. "I'll release info and stuff from my stolen/leaked stuff, unless you give me exclusive access".

Pretty shady stuff.

[daperl]

BUT in my experience, for large projects, random crashes or easy to reproduce crashes WEEKS before release never end well. Ask any C/C++ developer with more than 10 years experience and you will get the same answer.

Okay, let's ask me.

Easy to Reproduce Crashes: I can easily fix those in less than an hour.

Random Crashes: How random? How often? How catastrophic? Depending on your answers and assuming it's a software issue, the time-to-fix usually ranges from 5 1/2 hours to ∞ - 1. But this topic is too big for this discussion.

Have you ever been part of a successful software project? Good developers don't freak out like you're suggesting. In your context, absolutes like "never end well" are FUD. WEEKS is a long time, and it doesn't frighten a good development group if they're in bug-fixing mode. Sh*tty management is what usually frightens a good development group.

If it's your code, bug fixing shouldn't be difficult. Good design is where all the real work is, right? So, children, the moral of the story is: Worry less about bugs and worry more about design, then things will always (okay, mostly) end well.

Back to the topic:

Nokia needs to find out what happened, having a high profile shoot-from-the-hip blogger as an extended part of your QA department doesn't seem like a good thing. That's what we're here for. And my prototype should be arriving any day now...

[allnameswereout]

Maybe Nokia needs to have a look at which Russian IP addresses tried to grab, and have succesfully grabbed, firmware updates past months. With that (3G?) IP address it won't be too hard to find out the IMEI. Nor hard to track down this person, and prosecute him.

Because... stealing, is theft... and stealing something which is not released yet hence rare, such as Half-Life 2, is usually heavier punished than stealing something from an electronics store.

Anyway, this thread contains all the relevant information to lose your respect for this person... http://talk.maemo.org/images/icons/icon13.gif/

[gerbick]

I guess it's sad that I entered into a slight Twitter convo with him and it went nowhere fast when I asked about what firmware he had and prove it with a snapshot.

His deflection of that the N900 is just like the N97 was weak. Then he accused me of thinking that the N900 was "special"... which to me - unlike many here - it's not special to me. I'm curious, but I'm probably one of the few that isn't sold on the N900 yet; despite me really needing a replacement for my iPhone 3G.

Anyway, I have no respect for somebody with such a dubious inability to supply the normal stuff that people tend to supply on reviews. What version firmware, screenshots, and a reputable account of how they got the hardware/software.

Simply put, I know that hardware sometimes "lands" in people hands. But you have to be honest about even that. If it's not yet the finalized/finished product, you have to state that in all fairness. I review gadgets for companies and for my own site; so I know this stuff intimately.

And every now-and-then, I get some beta, sometimes alpha product, and I cannot fully say that my words are reviews as much as they are a critique of the product at that time.

This person is full of hot air, a rather bad attitude and no proof. My respect... withheld.

[Bratag]

Doesnt sound like this guy IS a part of the QA dept. Sounds like he managed to get hold of a prototype from "somewhere" and he has already twitted that nokia would shut it off if they could

[zerojay]

Gerbick, daperl... we don't generally see eye to eye on very much.

But you two are both 100% correct and I agree with every single word you wrote here. Kudos.

[moot-goner]

I'm posting as a newbie. Before I 'got into' the N900, I knew of his site and had visited it and always had the impression that he was an industry analyst of high stature. I thought he was beyond reproach. Indeed I read and enjoyed his screenshots of the N900 and that was part of the excitement that led me to preorder one. But since then I found his Twitter, where he talks about hiding his device from Nokia, and generally has a combative tone, and my opinion has changed. But let's be honest, even strident criticism can be useful for improving a product, it just takes cool heads on the part of the recipient and the ability to look beyond poor decorum or simply language barriers.

[bugelrex]

Okay, let's ask me.

Easy to Reproduce Crashes: I can easily fix those in less than an hour.

Random Crashes: How random? How often? How catastrophic? Depending on your answers and assuming it's a software issue, the time-to-fix usually ranges from 5 1/2 hours to ∞ - 1. But this topic is too big for this discussion.

Have you ever been part of a successful software project? Good developers don't freak out like you're suggesting. In your context, absolutes like "never end well" are FUD. WEEKS is a long time, and it doesn't frighten a good development group if they're in bug-fixing mode. Sh*tty management is what usually frightens a good development group.

If it's your code, bug fixing shouldn't be difficult. Good design is where all the real work is, right? So, children, the moral of the story is: Worry less about bugs and worry more about design, then things will always (okay, mostly) end well.

Back to the topic:

Nokia needs to find out what happened, having a high profile shoot-from-the-hip blogger as an extended part of your QA department doesn't seem like a good thing. That's what we're here for. And my prototype should be arriving any day now...

I guess I have differing opinions to you about software development. I have been part of several successful projects in group of 10's which the software will sell annually 200-400M dollars to hundred of customers.

A large project which exhibits these behaviors WEEKS before release is in trouble. Even though the bug can be fixed in hours, it introduces risk, QA cycles have to be redone. You cannot be sure your changes have not affected anything else. To think otherwise is "hacker" mentality and not a "software development".

Yes, the developer never freaks out, but its a sign that its too early for release and should be set back. No matter how good QA is, QA cannot fix bad code.

Large projects with only a handful of customers and a limited set functionality may get away with it but I'm talking about O/S type code which is open for any combination of functionality and integration.

Anyway, hoping again the problems are only visible in Eldar's weird unit and not issues being "withheld" by fanboy reviewers (check out how bad reviewers of the N97 were crucified by fanboys!)

[danramos]

I'm pretty certain I won't get an N900.. and I'm not a fan of it as it exists today.. but Eldar even strikes me as an ignorant, and possibly stupid, attention whore. Mind you--I can appreciate and even sometimes like the attention whores--but not when they're ignorant or stupid.

If he's going to claim to have a critical opinion on something, he should be able to at least understand what it is he is talking about and remain open to being asked questions and, on the off-chance, proven wrong himself. Without that, he's not a critic or a reviewer at all and lowers himself well below the level of circus freak. At least the circus freak has some genuinely interesting feature you might want to see.

[allnameswereout]

A large project which exhibits these behaviors WEEKS before release is in trouble. Even though the bug can be fixed in hours, it introduces risk, QA cycles have to be redone. You cannot be sure your changes have not affected anything else. To think otherwise is "hacker" mentality and not a "software development".Yet, we do not know what hardware or software revision this person is running.

What we do know is that Nokia is still putting the final dots on the i (stated several times on Nokia World, in interviews on video). What we also know is that the Nokia N900 release date is changed from 1 oktober to 12 oktober. These are hectic times, with no time to waste. Competition is fierce. We know, for example, Nokia did not have time to spend a lot of dedication to portrait mode. Several times you can find reason for something not implemented is 'time constrains'. However, this community has a lot of power over the software and a SSU is delivered OTA and if I understood Ari Jaaksi's message this is pushed. It isn't uncommon for a final release to get further revisions. Its quite normal.

Regression testing isn't always appropriate, the relevance hugely differs, but thats also why some stuff is not officially supported. The real beta test is the final release, when it goes live to thousands of customers. That is why some people prefer to not buy a new product right away.

[Texrat]

I now find myself in a software/hardware change migration management role-- and can confirm what daperl says. When you operate on the sort of clocks we do, weeks are eternities.

[Texrat]

Anyway, hoping again the problems are only visible in Eldar's weird unit and not issues being "withheld" by fanboy reviewers (check out how bad reviewers of the N97 were crucified by fanboys!)

Have you never seen the zealots erupt when iPhone quirks were discussed?

Nokia fanboys pale in comparison.

[ragnar]

He's basically saying that the N900 at Nokia world was a special firmware build. I "think" he's updated with a newer firmware and still seeing stability issues

On one hand it's amusing, on other hand it's not. I really hope that he didn't think that "PR release" stands for Public Relations release.

Yes, it was running the PR release. PR stands for Product Release.

[Rauha]

Maybe Nokia needs to have a look at which Russian IP addresses tried to grab, and have succesfully grabbed, firmware updates past months. With that (3G?) IP address it won't be too hard to find out the IMEI. Nor hard to track down this person, and prosecute him.


I doubt that Nokia is angry with him. He's been up to these tricks for a long time and despite that:

-The main (russian) version of his site seems to have Nokia as main sponsor (dont remeber ever visiting that site without Nokia advertisement being on top).
-Three interviews with high level Nokia people on front page (Corporate VP Vanjoki , VP of music services and Vp of services).

[Mara]

If this "eldar" is getting frequent SW updates they are almost guaranteed to be frequent interim SW builds that are designed for internal testing, not to be used for public release. Builds that are destined to be released to public will go through many QA steps before they are blessed as stable release. (If you remember from the N8x0 days you may remember that the hot new firmwares were already several weeks old...)

I'm not surprised at all if eldar has found those interim SW builds buggy. That's because lots of new code, changes or new features have been introduced on those with minimal or no QA.

I'm wondering how eldar has access (as he claims?) to those firmware images?

[allnameswereout]

Hmm, maybe time for Lex Nokia ;)

[Texrat]

If this "eldar" is getting frequent SW updates they are almost guaranteed to be frequent interim SW builds that are designed for internal testing, not to be used for public release. Builds that are destined to be released to public will go through many QA steps before they are blessed as stable release. (If you remember from the N8x0 days you may remember that the hot new firmwares were already several weeks old...)

Ahh... the good ol' days, eh Mara? :D

[mrojas]

On one hand it's amusing, on other hand it's not. I really hope that he didn't think that "PR release" stands for Public Relations release.

Yes, it was running the PR release. PR stands for Product Release.

HAHAHAHAHAHA...

Sorry, I even laughed out loud in my cubicle. The PR detail shows the true depth of Eldar's knowledge on the N900.

[timsamoff]

Is it just me or does the English translation of that review sound like something from the annals of Nostradamus?

Tim

[texaslabrat]

Is it just me or does the English translation of that review sound like something from the annals of Nostradamus?

Tim

It is just a literal word-for-word translation without regard to the differences in sentence structure and idioms between the 2 languages. Having a little knowledge in Russian, I recognize the word usage as what I would say in Russian, but it just happens to be printed out using English spelling.

So yeah, it comes out looking a little weird, I agree ;)

[edgar2]

HAHAHAHAHAHA...

Sorry, I even laughed out loud in my cubicle. The PR detail shows the true depth of Eldar's knowledge on the N900.

Is it just me or does the English translation of that review sound like something from the annals of Nostradamus?

Tim

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa250/soulschizm/AngryMobFunRun_1024.jpg

let's not go there.

[Jaffa]

Regression testing isn't always appropriate, the relevance hugely differs, but thats also why some stuff is not officially supported.

At Nokia World, I asked Peter about some of their development processes (my own big bug bear in my professional life) and they're properly agile, with a large suite of automated regression tests being run every night.

This is how you do software right :-)

The real beta test is the final release, when it goes live to thousands of customers. That is why some people prefer to not buy a new product right away.

I bet you'll never find a professional software developer, architect, release manager, project manager, marketing dude or - in fact - anyone who'd admit to even thinking that; let alone believing it.

[allnameswereout]

I bet you'll never find a professional software developer, architect, release manager, project manager, marketing dude or - in fact - anyone who'd admit to even thinking that; let alone believing it.WANTED: Google employee. ;)

Anyway, in reality what I wrote is true even though those whose baby is involved don't want to admit that. Look at the bugs found in Linux 2.6.0.

Heck, I just received a Linux patch for ext4 data corruption... [...]

We knew about that automated test suite btw. At least, I saw some of its statistics before.

[attila77]

It is just a literal word-for-word translation without regard to the differences in sentence structure and idioms between the 2 languages. Having a little knowledge in Russian, I recognize the word usage as what I would say in Russian, but it just happens to be printed out using English spelling.

So yeah, it comes out looking a little weird, I agree ;)

His Russian is very casual/slang rich anyway and that doesn't help translators, human or machine... :)

[kopte3]

"Just called Nokia USA

It seems that the shipping date of the N900 has been postponed to November due to FW problems!

Great, now I have to wait even longer. This sucks"
from Amazon.com
Eat your words.

[jandmdickerson]

"Just called Nokia USA

It seems that the shipping date of the N900 has been postponed to November due to FW problems!

Great, now I have to wait even longer. This sucks"
from Amazon.com
Eat your words.

They told me different.

http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=332413&postcount=158

This (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31711&page=8)may be a better thread for you....

[chilko]

both expansys and play list release date as 19 october

[pycage]

Great, now I have to wait even longer. This sucks"


Either the waiting sucks or the firmware sucks.

[nilchak]

"Just called Nokia USA

It seems that the shipping date of the N900 has been postponed to November due to FW problems!


That's what I heard from the Nokia Store employee too 2 days back.
And they had the N900 locked away too - as they didn't want bloggers reviewing a not-yet ready prototype device.

[Texrat]

One thing to keep in mind is that NoKia production/distribution is very lean and just-in-time focused. We always flashed latest production firmware RIGHT before shipping to trade customers.

EDIT: God forgive me for the earlier typo. Hopefully this correction is acceptable.

:p

[danramos]

That's what I heard from the Nokia Store employee too 2 days back.
And they had the N900 locked away too - as they didn't want bloggers reviewing a not-yet ready prototype device.

Oh God. They're starting to sound like Pandora.

[deadmalc]

I find it strange that this close to a release date that was quoted by Nokia, (i.e. October) there is no word at all from Nokia anywhere.
I would assume unless there is something from Peter and co. that the release date is still in October, but there again so close to October and still no fixed date is strange (i.e. it will ship on October xth) as well.
This just adds to the frustration.

[jandmdickerson]

That's what I heard from the Nokia Store employee too 2 days back.
And they had the N900 locked away too - as they didn't want bloggers reviewing a not-yet ready prototype device.

Looks like Nokia UK may be fueling the release date as November.

http://shop.nokia.co.uk/nokia-uk/product.aspx?sku=6957363&culture=en-GB

I hope that is them being conservative....:D

[bdogg64]

Looks like Nokia UK may be fueling the release date as November.

http://shop.nokia.co.uk/nokia-uk/product.aspx?sku=6957363&culture=en-GB

I hope that is them being conservative....:D

I'd even take the n900 now with unfinished firmware, knowing that it will be finished soon. I know they aren't trying to repeat with the n97, but just get it out there.

[f(x)]

One thing to keep in mind is that Noia production/distribution is very lean and just-in-time focused. We always flashed latest production firmware RIGHT before shipping to trade customers.

*Cough* Nokia *Cough*
I am not aware if the latest name for Nokia changed into Noia in the last moment before you are pressing "Submit Reply"


Ah Sorry , Couldn't resist that

[allnameswereout]

Looks like Nokia UK may be fueling the release date as November.

http://shop.nokia.co.uk/nokia-uk/product.aspx?sku=6957363&culture=en-GB

I hope that is them being conservative....:DOh, thats just British humor. They want you to remember the 5th of November.

[deadmalc]

I see a "Thanks!" button but not a "O! ****ing ****"
This is unbelievable, if this is true maybe there will be someone in Maemo doing a "Guy Fawkes" at Nokia HQ?

(EDIT: Wanted to vent anger more, but decided it's late and I'm tired and there are other devices on the market to look at)

[access]

Perhaps the shipping date is pushed back because so many people have pre-ordered and they can't produce the N900s fast enough to ship it to everyone in October. :D

[zerojay]

I find it strange that this close to a release date that was quoted by Nokia, (i.e. October) there is no word at all from Nokia anywhere.
I would assume unless there is something from Peter and co. that the release date is still in October, but there again so close to October and still no fixed date is strange (i.e. it will ship on October xth) as well.
This just adds to the frustration.

Nokia never came out and announced that it was releasing in October... it was the general feelings of the people involved, not a promise.

Also, if you think no fixed date is strange, you are probably new to Nokia. They *never* announce a specific fixed date for their phones.

[YoDude]

I've been actively involved in the cell phone community for years. I know some of the earliest and most recognized reviewers of cell phones personally. The first I ever heard of this Eldar dude was a short while ago after he posted his first review of the N900...

The thing is, this review/preview of his spoke very highly of the N900. I don't have access to the statistics for this forum but I did perceive a membership jump. General interest was so great for the N900 that a cell site that I am involved in added a new Maemo forum within days of this Eldar dudes preview. Other new Maemo sites also seemed to appear.

Then Nokia "officially" released the N900's specs and more people surface who have tried the phone or are beta testers. Some are known to this forum. No one reports random crashes or buggy firmware.


After all the attention this guy initially got, why did his N900 all of sudden start crashing?

The above^ is my recollection of the time line and is not meant to be a declaration of fact. If my recollection is factually incorrect, please provide the correct information and I will edit my post.

[NvyUs]

Nokia never came out and announced that it was releasing in October... it was the general feelings of the people involved, not a promise.

Also, if you think no fixed date is strange, you are probably new to Nokia. They *never* announce a specific fixed date for their phones.
nokia did say october heres a quote from them

"The Nokia N900 will be available in select markets from October 2009 with an estimated retail price of EUR 500 excluding sales taxes and subsidies. The Nokia N900 will be displayed at Nokia World, Stuttgart, on September 2. More information on Maemo is available at http://maemo.nokia.com"
press release here if you wish to read http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1337594

[zerojay]

After all the attention this guy initially got, why did his N900 all of sudden start crashing?


For the sake of argument, let's assume Eldar's being truthful about his crashes. How is he going to get any help for the issue when he's clearly using very old firmware and doesn't want Nokia to be able to track him down? He can't send in crash reports.

The fact that he's repeating this over and over again when he has prototype hardware and out of date firmware and saying some of the inflamatory things he has been...

Well, remember how glowing his little review was a month ago? That was with even OLDER firmware and yet everything was sunshine and lollipops.

He's full of crap. Please, let's stop paying attention to him... stop feeling the troll.

[zerojay]

nokia did say october heres a quote from them

"The Nokia N900 will be available in select markets from October 2009 with an estimated retail price of EUR 500 excluding sales taxes and subsidies. The Nokia N900 will be displayed at Nokia World, Stuttgart, on September 2. More information on Maemo is available at http://maemo.nokia.com"
press release here if you wish to read http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1337594

Okay.. I forgot about that.. but there's still no specific date there. Things change. Bugs are found and fixed... it's the circle of electronic life.

[VDVsx]

And Elder strikes again: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml (Russian version).

Take a look to his contacts and calendar tasks :D

[NvyUs]

Nokia always give the month of product releases but never what day it will be until that month is here I've noticed from my past experience with Nokia which is plenty as i have 13 nokia devices.
after the hardware problems with 5800's first batch and the lense problems with n97 I'm happy for nokia to delay the product by a few weeks whether it be for hardware or software i don't care as long as in the end I'm getting a better product out the box.
initially its disappointing but the benefits are worth it if it means better quality

[allnameswereout]

nokia did say october heres a quote from them

"The Nokia N900 will be available in select markets from October 2009 with an estimated retail price of EUR 500 excluding sales taxes and subsidies. The Nokia N900 will be displayed at Nokia World, Stuttgart, on September 2. More information on Maemo is available at http://maemo.nokia.com"
press release here if you wish to read http://www.nokia.com/press/press-releases/showpressrelease?newsid=1337594(Emphasis mine.)

So that is for Germany and Italy only. The rest is... unclear. And I have seen Nokia release before for specific date in select markets.

Addendum: I don't think Nokia is after him. Because that shouldn't be too difficult...

http://www.mobile-review.com/review/image/nokia/maemo5/scr/contacts/cont02.jpg
http://www.mobile-review.com/review/image/nokia/maemo5/scr/contacts/cont15.jpg

[sachin007]

So it is confirmed then the n920 does not have a keyboard!

"Entering text. Поддерживается аппаратная клавиатура (в N920 отсутствует), виртуальная клавиатура на экране. Supported hardware keyboard (in the N920 is absent), a virtual keyboard on the screen. Переключение между языками набора текста осуществляется в несколько касаний, не так удобно, как в Apple iPhone, но лучше, чем на S60. Switching between languages is typing is carried out in a few touches, not so convenient as in the Apple iPhone, but better than the S60."

[allnameswereout]

So it is confirmed then the n920 does not have a keyboard!

"Entering text. Поддерживается аппаратная клавиатура (в N920 отсутствует), виртуальная клавиатура на экране. Supported hardware keyboard (in the N920 is absent), a virtual keyboard on the screen. Переключение между языками набора текста осуществляется в несколько касаний, не так удобно, как в Apple iPhone, но лучше, чем на S60. Switching between languages is typing is carried out in a few touches, not so convenient as in the Apple iPhone, but better than the S60."Confirmed by whom? Since when is Nokia N920 confirmed?

[bocaJ]

I saw a DOSbox application in the app list! Should I be getting rediculously excited about what this might mean for legacy game support?

[sachin007]

Confirmed by whom? Since when is Nokia N920 confirmed?

Well the name may not be n920 but the next maemo device releasing in the summer of 2010 is going to be a keyboard less variant according to eldar. Take it or leave it.... but i believe that part.

[allnameswereout]

How would he know that? What is his source for that? What technical details does he know about N920? How do you know he isn't simply guessing?

Journalists state their source and add factual, relevant information. Such as the hardware/software versions used. This isn't journalism, this is gossip and heresay.

[sachin007]

How would he know that? What is his source for that? What technical details does he know about N920? How do you know he isn't simply guessing?

Journalists state their source and add factual, relevant information. Such as the hardware/software versions used. This isn't journalism, this is gossip and heresay.

I am not a devotee of Eldar but summarizing whatever i have read from him since his first review of the n900 and following his twitter i think that is true.

[BaKSo]

I don't believe eldar got the latest FW...

i don't like his recent tweet also... (but i'm following him)

but i think he did the preview even before anybody and proof that he got the device.. i think i will believe this time that he also got N920.. maybe just an early prototype..

His review... i think he is wrong to create a review before the product hits the market.. with his unknown N900 which can be old hardware and un-updated FW...

and i saw the calendar also.. he quote..

"Downloading Maemo 6 build"
"Comparing samsung linux to Maemo 6"
"Call maemo for updated / send bug report"

^^^ now i want to ask you people in this forum.. is this might be true? that he involve in the community that build Maemo OS? sending bug report etc...

[qole]

I saw a DOSbox application in the app list! Should I be getting rediculously excited about what this might mean for legacy game support?

Yes, DOSBox is in the Fremantle repositories. But we already have DOSbox for the N8x0 tablets.

And Elder strikes again: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml (Russian version).

Take a look to his contacts and calendar tasks :D

Hardy-har har. :)

[f(x)]

I don't believe eldar got the latest FW...
and i saw the calendar also.. he quote..

"Downloading Maemo 6 build"
"Comparing samsung linux to Maemo 6"
"Call maemo for updated / send bug report"

^^^ now i want to ask you people in this forum.. is this might be true? that he involve in the community that build Maemo OS? sending bug report etc...

Hahah I blame Peter

http://www.mobile-review.com/review/image/nokia/maemo5/scr/contacts/cont04.jpg

[Texrat]

*Cough* Nokia *Cough*
I am not aware if the latest name for Nokia changed into Noia in the last moment before you are pressing "Submit Reply"


Ah Sorry , Couldn't resist that

Oh my God!!!

I COMMITTED A TYPO!!!

Well, that's it: lock me up. :rolleyes:

[lma]

the n920 does not have a keyboard!

Interesting, so that's a third (rumoured) Fremantle device since the RX-71 does have a hardware keymap in the kernel.

"Switching between languages is typing is carried out in a few touches"

Bummer :-(

[NvyUs]

I don't believe eldar got the latest FW...

i don't like his recent tweet also... (but i'm following him)

but i think he did the preview even before anybody and proof that he got the device.. i think i will believe this time that he also got N920.. maybe just an early prototype..

His review... i think he is wrong to create a review before the product hits the market.. with his unknown N900 which can be old hardware and un-updated FW...

and i saw the calendar also.. he quote..

"Downloading Maemo 6 build"
"Comparing samsung linux to Maemo 6"
"Call maemo for updated / send bug report"

^^^ now i want to ask you people in this forum.. is this might be true? that he involve in the community that build Maemo OS? sending bug report etc...

he is just making fun take no notice of the screenshots.
he also as contact shortcuts to maemo/nokia people obviously just him trying to funny

[f(x)]

Oh my God!!!

I COMMITTED A TYPO!!!

Well, that's it: lock me up. :rolleyes:

You committed a typo! Only a Typo! You murdered the poor 'K' from Nokia! how could you!

Oh well I have a big heart I am not going to scream nor shouting on you.
For now, you are grounded MR. You will never touch any keyboard until you behave (This including but not limited too: Keyboards , Touch screens inputs , Number pads , miniKeyboards , OCR inputs , anything that can behave as an input device like pen and paper)


Self note: I'd better not making any typos in near future ;)

[allnameswereout]

Oh my God!!!

I COMMITTED A TYPO!!!

Well, that's it: lock me up. :rolleyes:http://rlv.zcache.com/go_to_hell_go_directly_to_hell_do_not_pass_g_tshir t-p235560370187647636tr1k_400.jpg

[UCOMM]

And Elder strikes again: http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml (Russian version).

Take a look to his contacts and calendar tasks :D

just looked at the video

hats one smooth browser and a nice interface in general

can't wait to get my hands on it

[Texrat]

Oh well I have a big heat I am not going to scream on you.

...

Self note: I'd better not making any typos in near future ;)

The irony is overwhelming.

:D

[allnameswereout]

he is just making fun take no notice of the screenshots.
he also as contact shortcuts to maemo/nokia people obviously just him trying to funnyNo, he is part of the Nokia QA team :D ..yet he is online on Ovi. Seems he has 2 Ovi accounts btw.

[Texrat]

Interesting, so that's a third (rumoured) Fremantle device since the RX-71 does have a hardware keymap in the kernel.


Isn't the kernel shared across a platform? Couldn't the RX-71 include hardware keymap even though it might not have a hardware keyboard attached? Or would that be excised to create distinct Fremantle kernels per device?

[f(x)]

The irony is overwhelming.

:D

Pointed to me? It seems I can't see that typo :P

[attila77]

Interesting, so that's a third (rumoured) Fremantle device since the RX-71 does have a hardware keymap in the kernel.

If the rumors are correct, this one is RX-56.

[lma]

Isn't the kernel shared across a platform? Couldn't the RX-71 include hardware keymap even though it might not have a hardware keyboard attached?

The Fremantle pre-release kernels contain a specific rx-71 keymap that is different to the rx-51 one (seems to have more keys, but the table is not fully populated yet(?)). I'm hoping for an N810-like (size/form-factor) device personally. See also this (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=27262) thread.

[Texrat]

I forgot all about that silly thread. :D

[YoDude]

For the sake of argument, let's assume Eldar's being truthful about his crashes. How is he going to get any help for the issue when he's clearly using very old firmware and doesn't want Nokia to be able to track him down? He can't send in crash reports.

The fact that he's repeating this over and over again when he has prototype hardware and out of date firmware and saying some of the inflamatory things he has been...

Well, remember how glowing his little review was a month ago? That was with even OLDER firmware and yet everything was sunshine and lollipops.

He's full of crap. Please, let's stop paying attention to him... stop feeling the troll.

Just a side bar here ZJ...


Well, remember how glowing his little review was a month ago? That was with even OLDER firmware and yet everything was sunshine and lollipops.

Um...
That is what I thought I was pointing out with my quoted post.


After all the attention this guy initially got, why did his N900 all of sudden start crashing?

You started your post with that^ quote from me, and you ended it with...

... stop feeling the troll.
Assuming you meant to write "feeding" instead of "feeling"; was that directed at me?

I truly don't understand. I didn't know this Eldar dude was a member of this board so I wouldn't know how to feed him... or feel him for that matter.

Just trying to avoid a misunderstanding. :)

[Laughing Man]

It seems that this move by Eldar is a move to get Nokia to send him better prototypes and firmware etc by strong arming them. "I'll release info and stuff from my stolen/leaked stuff, unless you give me exclusive access".

Pretty shady stuff.

Sounds like something that could get you sued from Nokia even if you do not have an NDA. Not for violation of an agreement but damage to brand name for reviewing an unauthorized device acquired from a source not from Nokia and then critiquing it as if it was the n900 supplied by Nokia. If this is the case then he's lucky Nokia isn't suing him.

Like I said before in the other thread, I have nothing against people doing this sort of thing as long as they point out (depending on the circumstance):

What firmware they're using, and the device itself. You shouldn't be reviewing a beta as if it was the final build. Especially if your device isn't up to date both hardware and software wise. That is an honesty issue.

And maemo/Nokia fanboys are nothing compared to..

1) Apple fanboys
2) Linux fanboys
3) Videogame company fanboys

[zerojay]

Just a side bar here ZJ...




Um...
That is what I thought I was pointing out with my quoted post.



You started your post with that^ quote from me, and you ended it with...


Assuming you meant to write "feeding" instead of "feeling"; was that directed at me?

I truly don't understand. I didn't know this Eldar dude was a member of this board so I wouldn't know how to feed him... or feel him for that matter.

Just trying to avoid a misunderstanding. :)

"Stop feeding the troll" is something I don't mean to you in particular but to the board in general. Us even bothering to discuss some of the crap he's talking about gives him what he wants. :)

This entire thread makes baby Jesus cry.

[vkv.raju]

And maemo/Nokia fanboys are nothing compared to..

1) Apple fanboys
2) Linux fanboys
3) Videogame company fanboys

But people here are not just fanboys. They are admirers of quality, technology, VFM products!

Just saying!

[Laughing Man]

Haha, I differ between fanboys and fans. Fanboys will basically take it up the rear from a company if demanded.

[SD69]

Sounds like something that could get you sued from Nokia even if you do not have an NDA. Not for violation of an agreement but damage to brand name for reviewing an unauthorized device acquired from a source not from Nokia and then critiquing it as if it was the n900 supplied by Nokia. If this is the case then he's lucky Nokia isn't suing him.
Suing? Hah! He's in Russia.

[Laughing Man]

My friend, you underestimate the power of money. Nobody is safe against a corporation or organization with money and a vendetta.

[Texrat]

Suing? Hah! He's in Russia.

In former Soviet Union, prototype thieves sue YOU!





It was going to be said sooner or later. :o

[NvyUs]

eldars new message to us fanboys lol http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4335126478

[gerbick]

I know how Apple has its fanboys... and here, I have to say that it's rank speculation that I see first, not blind fanboy-ism.

Anyway, it's been said in the thread somewhere "...this thread makes baby Jesus cry..."

Amen. I feel like I've given attention to the wrong child today.

[ossipena]

Hahah I blame Peter

http://www.mobile-review.com/review/image/nokia/maemo5/scr/contacts/cont04.jpg

speaking of typos. Who the f.. is Oli ?!?!? Never heard. Maybe Olli's brother or clone?

e: direct translation: oli = was

[deadmalc]

Nokia never came out and announced that it was releasing in October... it was the general feelings of the people involved, not a promise.

It was on there press releases and their marketing staff, maybe you didn't read/listen to those ;-)
But agreed it wasn't a promise


Also, if you think no fixed date is strange, you are probably new to Nokia. They *never* announce a specific fixed date for their phones.

I think it's more the fact that we are drawing close to the possible release date, and it may have been delayed by another month or maybe not. I think the frustration is affecting my judgement slightly.

For shelling out 500 GBP on a device, (plus another 100 on spare battery and sd cards) it would be nice to have some kind of update, as if it is going to be delayed then perhaps I should look at spending my money on some other stuff I need and come back to the n900 later?

Even just a "it's on schedule" would be good, even if we don't have any exact time tables, but pre-ordering possibly three months in advance seems a bit silly as maybe it's just the volumes and the people who have preordered first will get their devices, but that's my real gripe I suppose. We just don't know.

And people moan about Eldar, but he is the only source of real information we have, whether this is reliable or not it his comments compound the situation.

[Peter@Maemo Marketing]

Even just a "it's on schedule" would be good, even if we don't have any exact time tables, but pre-ordering possibly three months in advance seems a bit silly as maybe it's just the volumes and the people who have preordered first will get their devices, but that's my real gripe I suppose. We just don't know.



And yes, what we announced in the Nokia N900 press release is still the plan, no change: "The Nokia N900 will be available in select markets from October 2009..."

[pycage]

Of course October 31st would still be in October.

[zkyevolved]

Of course October 31st would still be in October.

Halloween! <sings> this is halloween, this is halloween, HALLOWEEN HALLOWEEN halloween halloween.

I can totally see myself playing with the N900 instead of handing out candy to little punks :)

[f(x)]

speaking of typos. Who the f.. is Oli ?!?!? Never heard. Maybe Olli's brother or clone?

e: direct translation: oli = was

You are right, I am sure it was a typo (Speaking about typos) He probably meant "Olli-Pekka Kallasvuo" = Nokia CEO.

By the way if Olli can be translated as WAS , I would be happy to take his job* :)



*Not to confuse it with Apple's Jobs (CEO)

[allnameswereout]

Yes, 31 oktober is still oktober. And, the quote is about select markets (Germany & Italy).

Halloween! <sings> this is halloween, this is halloween, HALLOWEEN HALLOWEEN halloween halloween.

I can totally see myself playing with the N900 instead of handing out candy to little punks :)Trick or treat demo with N900 :cool:

[ossipena]

You are right, I am sure it was a typo (Speaking about typos) He probably meant "Olli-Pekka Kallasvuo" = Nokia CEO.

By the way if Olli can be translated as WAS , I would be happy to take his job* :)



*Not to confuse it with Apple's Jobs (CEO)

yes that was only rhetoric question. Bet that if Eldar really knew the guy, he'd know how to spell the name...

oli = was, olli = mans name in Finland.

[pycage]

Halloween! <sings> this is halloween, this is halloween, HALLOWEEN HALLOWEEN halloween halloween.


Oh, so the N900 will become a nightmare before Christmas. :D
I hope it won't be a nightmare.

[pycage]

yes that was only rhetoric question. Bet that if Eldar really knew the guy, he'd know how to spell the name...

oli = was, olli = mans name in Finland.

Maybe the name was transliterated as "оли" in Cyrillic and he just wrote that in latin letters. I don't know.

[f(x)]

yes that was only rhetoric question. Bet that if Eldar really knew the guy, he'd know how to spell the name...

oli = was, olli = mans name in Finland.
I know I said that as a joke. I really doubt Elder know any him or others in reality and the only reason he put their names was for making fun of them.


From now, lets fight fire with fire (spelling his name wrong might be one way)

[buru]

You're missing article's main point: the problem is not the unstable software itself (it will be stable enough for us geeks!), but the fact that lots of ordinary users will buy N900 just because it's Nokia's flagman, and they will compare it to other OS-es they are used to and will find missing features and instability, get frustrated and (likely) move elsewhere. Note that he does not speak of Maemo5 geek-friendly features like being a full Linux distro, command line access, X-server etc.
So, the target audience of this review are ordinary (non-geek) users, and for such users Maemo5 in its current state is not the best solution. Thus, the less non-geeks will buy N900 the better.

[zerojay]

You're missing article's main point: the problem is not the unstable software itself (it will be stable enough for us geeks!), but the fact that lots of ordinary users will buy N900 just because it's Nokia's flagman, and they will compare it to other OS-es they are used to and will find missing features and instability, get frustrated and (likely) move elsewhere.

How exactly is he supposed to assume that when he's testing OLD unfinished firmware on a prototype device?

The main point of the article is "Maemo 5 review", but it's not even done yet... so for him to be blasting away at it for being unfinished when he's testing a firmware release not meant for the public is completely ******ed and is a move designed to generate this kind of buzz. At best, it's completely unprofessional. At worst, he's just an attention whore and we should all stop feeding into it.

[range]

Okay.. I forgot about that.. but there's still no specific date there. Things change. Bugs are found and fixed... it's the circle of electronic life.

Nokia's shop in DE still quotes 12th of October (depending on product availability ...) :rolleyes:

[Jaffa]

My friend, you underestimate the power of money. Nobody is safe against a corporation or organization with money and a vendetta.

It's only worth a corporation going after an individual if that individual has sufficient wealth and assets to make the recompense worthwhile. Otherwise you spend a lot of money to make a point. That may, or may not, be best for shareholder value in the medium to long term.

[buru]

@zerojay the device is not released yet, so final software does not exists. I suppose he had tested a plenty of pre-release devices and knows something about relative instability of different pre-release OS-es. Besides, he also seems to be informed about Maemo updates/releases cycle (talks about Q2 2010 major update), so he could estimate Maemo5 October state with high degree of accuracy.

P.S. I read Mobile-Review regularly and I've never heard anti-Nokia bias from Eldar Murtazin (contrary to that, he seems to be a bit too pro-Nokia). Thus, I think either it's the objective state of affairs or some kind of Nokia's own play to frighten non-geeks from the product.

[range]

Of course October 31st would still be in October.

As would be October 45th :p

SCNR.

[jaark]

Perhaps the shipping date is pushed back because so many people have pre-ordered and they can't produce the N900s fast enough to ship it to everyone in October. :D

IIRC, they had supply problems with the N770. Although I pre-ordered direct from Nokia, I did so slightly too late as I ended up getting one from some second manufacturing run and did not get mine until a few weeks after the initial release

[allnameswereout]

Nokia's shop in DE still quotes 12th of October (depending on product availability ...) :rolleyes:This is what Nokia.de says:
Bei Vorbestellung ist eine Anlieferung voraussichtlich ab dem 12. Oktober 2009 möglich. Dies ist abhängig von der gewählten Versandart und Produkt-Verfügbarkeit. (Source (http://shop.nokia.de/nokia-de/product.aspx?sku=6958534))Expected. I'm sure you cannot claim rights on such. If you want to cancel your pre-order I guess you can do that, but I don't know consumer law on that regard well.

IIRC, they had supply problems with the N770. Although I pre-ordered direct from Nokia, I did so slightly too late as I ended up getting one from some second manufacturing run and did not get mine until a few weeks after the initial release

That device was called Nokia 770, not Nokia N770. The General taught me that :D

P.S. I read Mobile-Review regularly and I've never heard anti-Nokia bias from Eldar Murtazin (contrary to that, he seems to be a bit too pro-Nokia). Thus, I think either it's the objective state of affairs or some kind of Nokia's own play to frighten non-geeks from the product.Possibly. A mature product after geeks finished the sharp edges and after important community supported software is available and stable benefits non-technical end users. For example, Telepathy Haze (IM protocols such as MSN for Telepathy) is something many non-technical end users will want to install right away.

[Crashdamage]

@zerojay the device is not released yet, so final software does not exists
Because of the lead time necessary for production, packaging and distribution, IF the N900 is to be released in mid-October the firmware very likely has been finalized. Serious problems found can be corrected with an OTA update, as soon as a new N900 is activated if necessary.

That doesn't mean Eldar HAS finalized firmware OR hardware, or even if he does have the final firmware that his early hardware runs it properly. IOW, his stability problems could be due to a lot of factors that users of the actual released product won't have.

I'm not a Nokia veteran, but seems like most companies Nokia is perfectly capable of large screw-ups (N97?) so anything can happen. But from all I've seen and read about the N900, and from years of running various Linux distros, I'd be very surprised if the N900 had major stability issues. If so, I'm confident they'll be quickly fixed.

I'm not worried because of what one questionable Russian says.

[jcompagner]

I do trust Michal Jerz of my-symbian quite a lot, loads of experience and loads of reviews done by him over the years and i asked him if he had crashes or stability issues with his prototype that he has now for 3 weeks or so, this was his response:

http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=368144#368144

[jaark]

That device was called Nokia 770, not Nokia N770. The General taught me that :D

:o It's at homes tucked away in it's little cloth bag.

Sir! Sorry, sir. Won't happen again! Sah!

/me salutes & knocks self out.

Conversely, I'm in the habit of calling my N810 just 810.

[zerojay]

Because of the lead time necessary for production, packaging and distribution, IF the N900 is to be released in mid-October the firmware very likely has been finalized.

The firmware is not finalized yet. Eldar's firmware is so old it has cobwebs.

[deadmalc]

And yes, what we announced in the Nokia N900 press release is still the plan, no change: "The Nokia N900 will be available in select markets from October 2009..."

OK my misinterpretation, I assumed (clearly wrongly) that this meant that it would be available IN OCTOBER rather than FROM....

Apologies again and thanks for clearing this up.

Extra time means I can spend the cash on fixing my PC, and get some dev boards and have enough when the n900 comes to release ;-)

[jsa]

The firmware is not finalized yet. Eldar's firmware is so old it has cobwebs.

I've been wondering this for a while. He really insists he has up-to-date software loaded and access to updates. How do you and others know he really doesn't when he hasn't disclosed what version he's running? Now I don't know why anyone won't tell him what the latest version is so he can compare with his own, and stop claiming he has the latest if he doesn't? Obviously he at least genuinely believes it's up-to-date because I don't see any reason why he would lie about it.

And if we talk about the first-look preview article, while I don't think it was not fair to release it so early, he did clearly say it's not based on the final software.

I read the Maemo 5 review(translated from Russian to English so not as accurate as I would've liked) and while it mentioned the crashing, it wasn't the focus. The downsides he mentioned were also nothing new, they have come up on this forum too(the lack of portrait mode, MMS etc.) and I found the overall tone positive.

[GeneralAntilles]

I've been wondering this for a while. He really insists he has up-to-date software loaded and access to updates. How do you and others know he really doesn't when he hasn't disclosed what version he's running? Now I don't know why anyone won't tell him what the latest version is so he can compare with his own, and stop claiming he has the latest if he doesn't? Obviously he at least genuinely believes it's up-to-date because I don't see any reason why he would lie about it.


34-14, I believe he's said.

[zerojay]

I've been wondering this for a while. He really insists he has up-to-date software loaded and access to updates. How do you and others know he really doesn't when he hasn't disclosed what version he's running?

Protip: http://www.eastleigh.gov.uk/meetings/mgCalendarWeekView.asp?MT=8&WN=33&DD=2009&ACT=Later

[allnameswereout]

34-14, I believe he's said.Yup. Quote #1 (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4319966588), quote #2 (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4318646063)...

[GeneralAntilles]

Yup. Quote #1 (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4319966588), quote #2 (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4318646063)...

As this is now week 39, well. . . .

[kopte3]

You should read his Maemo 5 review. Very objective.

[moot-goner]

You should read his Maemo 5 review. Very objective.

I skipped a lot of the text (did read the conclusion, which was that it was not a revolutionary device and he has doubts about Nokia speedily addressing the deficits), but his article dated today has a wheelbarrow of great screenshots.

[qole]

I liked the photos and screenshots, but his "review"? Meh.

[quingu]

[...]his article dated today has a wheelbarrow of great screenshots.
There's a new arcticle from hin about maemo?
? Link please ?

[kopte3]

Here you go mate link(translated) (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&u=http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml&ei=Za67SsXhKYaKngPU3LWgDQ&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=1&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG)

[zerojay]

here you go mate link(translated) (http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ru&u=http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml&ei=za67ssxhkyakngpu3lwgdq&sa=x&oi=translate&resnum=1&ct=result&prev=/search%3fq%3dhttp://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-maemo5.shtml%26hl%3den%26sa%3dg)

.......fail

[kopte3]

What's fail?

[zerojay]

What's fail?

That's the same article most of us have already seen, not a new one as we were expecting.

[quingu]

It's cool, I hadn't read it yet:D

[qole]

"In this article we will focus on software stuffing..." :D

[kopte3]

That's old one day.

EDIT: Translation isn't the best one, but almost everything is quite understandable. If you don't like it, wait for a couple of days coz there is going to be an english version soon too.

[qole]

We will all be old one day.

[zerojay]

We will all be old one day.

And then we will be stuffed.

[allnameswereout]

And then we will be stuffed.With software running on prosthetic bodies. :confused:

[danramos]

ELDAR! ELDAR! The fake reviews man!
He'll review maemo like nobody can!

YAYYY ELDAR! :)

[DaveP1]

With software running on prosthetic bodies. :confused:

Who needs bodies? We'll all live forever in MMORPGs. :cool:

[timsamoff]

And then we will be stuffed.
And then we'll be eaten?

[sevla]

So according to him the device crashes twice a day?

[danramos]

So according to him the device crashes twice a day?

Hell, that's at least still a better track record than Windows all the way up to Windows ME and NT 4. If companies were happy enough to use Windows in their companies during those years... I guess the N900 is a-okay already!

[sevla]

Hell, that's at least still a better track record than Windows all the way up to Windows ME and NT 4. If companies were happy enough to use Windows in their companies during those years... I guess the N900 is a-okay already!

I assume that was sarcasm? I hope it doesn't crash as much as he says. My iPhone almost never crashed and any phone I have I expect to operate in similar fashion.

[danramos]

I assume that was sarcasm? I hope it doesn't crash as much as he says. My iPhone almost never crashed and any phone I have I expect to operate in similar fashion.

"My iPhone almost never crashed".... I assume that was exaggeration.

[sevla]

"My iPhone almost never crashed".... I assume that was exaggeration.

No it wasn't. I hardly ever had to reboot mine and it saw heavy use.

[allnameswereout]

I assume that was sarcasm? I hope it doesn't crash as much as he says.Hardly anyone gives the reviewer much -if any- credibility for reasons explained ad infinitum in this thread whereas some early birds applaud the stability of Maemo. In any case, we'll all experience soon enough "the Truth". The saga unfoils..

[zkyevolved]

No it wasn't. I hardly ever had to reboot mine and it saw heavy use.

I've had 3 different iphones (1 2.5g, another 2 3g (1 16 gig and 1 8 gig) purchased from diff. manufacturing dates and all of them were HORRIBLE. They crashed SO MUCH because I'm a hard core user :)

[Jack6428]

I do trust Michal Jerz of my-symbian quite a lot, loads of experience and loads of reviews done by him over the years and i asked him if he had crashes or stability issues with his prototype that he has now for 3 weeks or so, this was his response:

http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=368144#368144


good to know, especially since he is using a Nxx model, not a N900, which is alot newer... im sure in the final there won't be any problems at all...

[JayOnThaBeat]

No it wasn't. I hardly ever had to reboot mine and it saw heavy use.

Is "heavy use" even possible, sans multi-tasking?

[qgil]

I don't want to attack Eldar since I believe he is trying to do his best as specialized journalist. Still, last week I asked him about the version he was using, he said latest (http://twitter.com/eldarmurtazin/status/4024489742) (would have meant w38) and now it turns that was w34.

I understand he is in a situation where he can't disclose everything but for this reason it is really difficult to see what is he playing with.

So many screenshots. Is there any with Settings --> About product? (even if the game would continue: it's damn easy to fake a version there if you want to fake it).

Anyway, what counts are the impressions of reviewers and real customers with devices out of real sales box. In the meantime we can all get entertained with lectures like these. As others said, not many elements new in this "review" if your read this forum and listen Nokia World keynotes.

[twaelti]

I don't like the current state of this thread. Got a bit derailed and misses some respect. Eldar might be a bit in trouble after his early preview, but in the past I always liked his extensive and deep reviews - at least he puts some real work into it, not like most other sites with superificial "reviews".

And the linked "new" article really seems very recent - at least it does not even yet have an official english version.

Let's be gentle.

[twaelti]

In the meantime we can all get entertained with lectures like these.
Not just entertained, but getting some ideas about the remaining rough edges that make such an experienced power user like eldar uneasy? :)
Some quotes from his review:

No MMS, no matter how ridiculous it sounds
(Audio player) other disadvantages include the lever is adjustable sound on the screen, it is too small, awkward, easier to use the side buttons
(Video player) Unfortunately, there is also affected by haste, in particular, the developers have not thought buffering the stream, in the first 10 seconds of video ragged, swinging.

[Jack6428]

Not just entertained, but getting some ideas about the remaining rough edges that make such an experienced power user like eldar uneasy? :)
Some quotes from his review:

No MMS, no matter how ridiculous it sounds
(Audio player) other disadvantages include the lever is adjustable sound on the screen, it is too small, awkward, easier to use the side buttons
(Video player) Unfortunately, there is also affected by haste, in particular, the developers have not thought buffering the stream, in the first 10 seconds of video ragged, swinging.


These issues seem crucial, it will seriously make the N900 look bad. Good thing Eldar wrote those down. Now i'm never buying the N900, that's for sure.

[kopte3]

Why so sarcastic and negative? Read the bloody review, he said a lot of good stuff about it and he was open-minded, not like many guys present here that can't say anything bad at all because they'll never be a tester for Nokia again. I trust him more than i trust 100 Nokia testers. And if somebody gave him his N900, how did Eldar stole it?
Many guys here just love to act smart. How can you know better than him if you never saw device in your life? And he's holding it from May. BTW he's holding an N920 right now. I read somewhere he's drama queen. Yeah right. What a bunch of BS.
I do trust him, but on the other side i believe Nokia will start shipping phones without major bugs and constant crashes.

[zerojay]

Many guys here just love to act smart. How can you know better than him if you never saw device in your life?

There's a reason why some people are acting like they know better. Think about it a little bit.

[Jack6428]

Why so sarcastic and negative? Read the bloody review, he said a lot of good stuff about it and he was open-minded, not like many guys present here that can't say anything bad at all because they'll never be a tester for Nokia again. I trust him more than i trust 100 Nokia testers. And if somebody gave him his N900, how did Eldar stole it?
Many guys here just love to act smart. How can you know better than him if you never saw device in your life? And he's holding it from May. BTW he's holding an N920 right now. I read somewhere he's drama queen. Yeah right. What a bunch of BS.
I do trust him, but on the other side i believe Nokia will start shipping phones without major bugs and constant crashes.

Why not? Those 3 points listed above are things that don't matter at all, nothing important, so i don't really see a reason why he even mentioned them. No MMS? We can live with that and a update can fix that, right?. Problems adjusting sound? That's just him being clumsy. Streams lagging the first 10 seconds? Completely normal even on PC. That's why i replied how i replied, unnecessary stupid points. I'll be happy to read it when he puts it up in English. I read his N900 preview when it came out and he knows how to write and i enjoyed reading it, so don't get me started here. But when he says his unit has errors and is crashing i don't trust him, because it's just him having old firmware or old hardware or a faulty unit. I am absolutely confident the final version of the phone will be simply awesome, because he is the only one making a fuzz about having problems. And about him and the N920. If he has it (which i am quite sure he does), why mention it even in the first place this early? And one more thing - why so serious? xD

[allnameswereout]

I trust him more than i trust 100 Nokia testers.So if 100 Nokia testers say X, and 1 Elder says Y, you believe Elder? Typical.

Some here have hold the device. And some here have the device but are under NDA.

He has a N920? Where is the proof?

[Texrat]

This is good stuff, but I'm out of peanuts.

[nilchak]

There's a reason why some people are acting like they know better. Think about it a little bit.

All good, but till the moment they are under the damned NDA and cant really tell anything in specificity, its worth nothing.

The fact that they have a device doesn't count at all, unless you can say something about the device, ain't it :D Untill then its just "acting".

So if you are under an NDA, just keep quite and dont belittle the other reviewers who are not under the same NDA - based on review quality.
I understand the Eldar criticism based on his "stolen" device and old software/hardware - thats valid - but at least lend some credence to his review. Thats all.

[GeneralAntilles]

All good, but till the moment they are under the damned NDA and cant really tell anything in specificity, its worth nothing.

The fact that they have a device doesn't count at all, unless you can say something about the device, ain't it :D Untill then its just "acting".

So if you are under an NDA, just keep quite and dont belittle the other reviewers who are not under the same NDA - based on review quality.
I understand the Eldar criticism based on his "stolen" device and old software/hardware - thats valid - but at least lend some credence to his review. Thats all.

lol? . . .

[nilchak]

IMHO I think it's odd that all these new users seem to be coming out of the woodwork to defend the man.

We had best leave him be, his army is amassing.........

Hey, lets not take sides here. I am in the TMO camp, but am open to listen to all. I thing we can all make the final judgement call when we ourselves have a device in our hands.

[nilchak]

lol? . . .

I am glad I made you laugh - now will you reveal a few juicy tidbits - NDA be damned ? :eek:

[kopte3]

Why not? Those 3 points listed above are things that don't matter at all, nothing important, so i don't really see a reason why he even mentioned them. No MMS? We can live with that and a update can fix that, right?. Problems adjusting sound? That's just him being clumsy. Streams lagging the first 10 seconds? Completely normal even on PC. That's why i replied how i replied, unnecessary stupid points. I'll be happy to read it when he puts it up in English. I read his N900 preview when it came out and he knows how to write and i enjoyed reading it, so don't get me started here. But when he says his unit has errors and is crashing i don't trust him, because it's just him having old firmware or old hardware or a faulty unit. I am absolutely confident the final version of the phone will be simply awesome, because he is the only one making a fuzz about having problems. And about him and the N920. If he has it (which i am quite sure he does), why mention it even in the first place this early? And one more thing - why so serious? xD

Fair enough. English version will soon be available so you can read it and say your opinion. I have to say, those points are listed out of the content by someone on this forum so you got it wrong, he wasn't making a fuzz about it at all. He just pointed that out.
Sorry about the attitude, i was pissed off because reading all that crap. :rolleyes:

[zerojay]

Hey, lets not take sides here. I am in the TMO camp, but am open to listen to all. I thing we can all make the final judgement call when we ourselves have a device in our hands.

And that's the entire issue here.

A lot of people apparently use Eldar as a source to decide what they will and won't buy. Him making judgments on unfinished firmware and posting them up as a "review" makes people assume he's got a final review copy, which he does not. Some of the problems he's seen may or may not already be fixed or simply not exist anymore.

WE, the TMO community, will all make our own final judgment calls when we have the machines in our hands... but for some people that will never happen because they based their purchasing decision upon what Eldar presents as a review now. Really, this is the one and only real issue I have with him.

Do you remember the professional movie critic that decided he would download an unfinished workprint edition of a movie (Hulk, maybe Wolverine) and reviewed it even though the special effects were completely missing?

He got canned.

[NvyUs]

So if you are under an NDA, just keep quite and dont belittle the other reviewers who are not under the same NDA - based on review quality.
I understand the Eldar criticism based on his "stolen" device and old software/hardware - thats valid - but at least lend some credence to his review. Thats all.

you cant tell us not to do something if you think what we are doing is valid, that would be asking us to lie about our opinion or like trying to censor it.
btw this is only review we on about so its not like we attacking everyone who says bad of n900
it just makes no sense sorry

[kopte3]

And that's the entire issue here.

A lot of people apparently use Eldar as a source to decide what they will and won't buy.
I preorder mine after his twits about crashes.
I respect the guy, i don't worship him as a god.

[mykenyc]

What i don't understand is every phone is not super duper. Okay, it have crashes so what? Now unless it happens every 4 hours or less then thats a problem and even so my Mytouch 3g force closes like a mofo sometimes but people still hack and use it to make it better. Thats the point of community like this to provide a way for other people to solve out problems. My N95 crashed but i still loved it nonetheless. His review is just a review he's one man and have opinions i didn't read the article and probably won't but at the end of the day you can return you phone if you don't like it. Why is everyone getting so crazy over nothing. Like i said earlier I'm getting this device no matter what because its like the N95 i miss on steroids with a better browser consider me sold!

[YoDude]

...I understand the Eldar criticism based on his "stolen" device and old software/hardware - thats valid - but at least lend some credence to his review. Thats all.



I don't care how he got his device, but I am trying to lend credence to his review... but which one?

As I posted earlier in this thread, the first I heard of him and at that time, the first I heard the purported specs of the N900 was when he supposedly said something to the effect that the N900 would be a "game changer" for Nokia.

When I asked about him in the thread about his pre-announcement review someone replied that he was "the most interesting man in the world" or some-such. Later on someone else reported that Nokia stock price was moving up and others speculated that his "glowing" review was responsible for this.

...then Nokia officially announced the N900 and the specs he reported were pretty much the same. He earned respect in my book at that point.

...then all of sudden he reports of a future Samsung device that will "blow the N900 out of the water".

OK, no pics, no collaboration from other blogs at the time, plus the fact that it will come more than a year after the N900's planned release.

Now all of a sudden, his N900 crashes several times a day. :eek:

All I asked is what happened. :confused:

No disrespect. I am actually hoping that one of the members who chimed in earlier about knowing him or who considered him to be a colleague would ring him up and ask; Yo Eldar, what's up with that bro? ...and report back to this thread.

Then maybe we can end all this speculation about motive.

I mean for all we know Nokia could have a crack team of unauthorized handset trackers in black helicopters hovering over his location purposely jamming his device...

...it could happen. :p

[bugelrex]

For this particular phone, the only review issue I care about is the battery.

Software issues can be fixed at some point, if apps crash I can write my own to replace. The hardware specs are adequate enough to last at least 2 years with the current software advancements.

However the battery is the real deal breaker. This is something that cannot be changed and software optimization can only go so far.

With 3G and no wifi can the phone last from 9am to 12am with 15-20% battery left with
- instant email
- facebook status every A mins (will it share the email internet connection?)
- B hours music
- C mins surfing
- D mins video

What are A,B,C,D or perhaps put it another way, is the battery usage at least HALF as good as the E71/E72?

I would not be surprised if the first reviewer to give negative battery results will be flamed and tarred alive!

[kopte3]

As I posted earlier in this thread, the first I heard of him and at that time, the first I heard the purported specs of the N900 was when he supposedly said something to the effect that the N900 would be a "game changer" for Nokia.
..........
...then all of sudden he reports of a future Samsung device that will "blow the N900 out of the water".
...............
OK, no pics, no collaboration from other blogs at the time, plus the fact that it will come more than a year after the N900's planned release.
You know, he didn't existed before you heard of him. I think whether you heard of him or not is so irrelevant. He's well known reviewer. He didn't become famous because of his pre-released review.
Of course it's sudden because he reports about device for 2011. and he wants to describe it in a few words. Blowing out N900 out of the water says very much about how good something is, right? How many people do you know on the internet that have that kind of connections and that kind of insight in future of mobile phones?
No pics, of course, he wouldn't show us N920 pics because he doesn't want to harm companies that much. If you're going to say "and what about N900!?" - he did a preview week before it's official announcement and said he thinks he cannot harm it that way. He had a N900 from May, so he could do it much much earlier if he wanted to do as much damage as he can. About device for 2011. - other blogs don't know that stuff.

[Bratag]

Several people have already stated that with the new firmware that with wifi always on and some moderate to heavy use the battery gets between 12-13 hours. Thats pretty damn good in my opinion.

[gerbick]

I assume that was sarcasm? I hope it doesn't crash as much as he says. My iPhone almost never crashed and any phone I have I expect to operate in similar fashion.

I can't say that. My iPhone just had a whole slew of issues with the 2.2.1 to 3.0 upgrade and once again (a new phone) with the 3.0 to 3.1 upgrade. Even after restoring and treating it like a new phone, I was having probs.

After yet another new phone, it's finally acting right. It would go straight to the bootup Apple screen intermittently.

The whole "Windows crashes" part... I've been an Windows admin since the NT 3.51 days and my personal machines don't crash like that. In fact, my Win2k3 Server and Windows Vista machines both have 3 years and close to zero crashes. You have to properly admin the machines.

My N810, had one crash that ticked me off - and it was entirely my fault. I interrupted an install... oops.

This person's N900 crashing? Well, prove it. I'm not saying it might not/could not happen. I would honestly love some proof for once.

[Mandor]

... and thus it came to past that the Nokia N900 was released and people were wondering what he meant by "unstable" and "Nokia won't be able to make it work in time". That is why, my children, we are gathering here around this review as a memorial of his monumental failure. Let us remember tonight, so the future generations can never forget.

My 2 cents.

I read reviews for : 1) Photos and 2) Features.
Opinions are mine and mine only, after I tested it. (October 31st, Chicago)

I have been looking to own (not owned by a carrier or another company) a mobile phone since last year.

[Texrat]

Sorry, I can't equate fame with competence.

More peanuts please!

[bugelrex]

Several people have already stated that with the new firmware that with wifi always on and some moderate to heavy use the battery gets between 12-13 hours. Thats pretty damn good in my opinion.


wifi drain is probably much less than 3G. For me, I'll be mostly without wifi.

[bugelrex]

... and thus it came to past that the Nokia N900 was released and people were wondering what he meant by "unstable" and "Nokia won't be able to make it work in time". That is why, my children, we are gathering here around this review as a memorial of his monumental failure. Let us remember tonight, so the future generations can never forget.

My 2 cents.

I read reviews for : 1) Photos and 2) Features.
Opinions are mine and mine only, after I tested it. (October 31st, Chicago)

I have been looking to own (not owned by a carrier or another company) a mobile phone since last year.


If you read the reviews for N97 for Photos and Features only it would have seemed like the best phone on earth. In reality, Nokia had the balls to pass the piece of crap as a flagship product. (2 year old hardware specs! the worst example of touchscreen interface you'll ever see. The OK and Cancel buttons take up 20% of the screen for gods sake!)

Pre-order buyers got hosed, opinions do matter.

[dansus]

Has this been posted? Im not reading this mostly pointless thread to find out..

Michael Jerz from my-symbian has other experiences from early N900 proto after three weeks testing.

The device, even though the hardware is marked as proto (and called Nxx rather than N900) and the firmware is quite an early one, is ROCK STABLE. This is actually one of the things that amaze me THE MOST. I got the device on Sept 3rd or so, been playing with it DAILY for almost three weeks now, and it didn't crash A SINGLE TIME!

http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40267&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=90
.

[Bratag]

Yes they do - and as soon as he reviews a non prototype n900 phone not fallen off the back of a truck and running the latest firmware I will be happy to take everything he says into consideration. Until then all I have is the words of someone who wont tell us how he got the phone, and has shown in his own tweets he has no concept what the "latest" firmware is.

Sorry but thems the facts. EOL.

[zerojay]

What i don't understand is every phone is not super duper. Okay, it have crashes so what? Now unless it happens every 4 hours or less then thats a problem and even so my Mytouch 3g force closes like a mofo sometimes but people still hack and use it to make it better. Thats the point of community like this to provide a way for other people to solve out problems. My N95 crashed but i still loved it nonetheless. His review is just a review he's one man and have opinions i didn't read the article and probably won't but at the end of the day you can return you phone if you don't like it. Why is everyone getting so crazy over nothing. Like i said earlier I'm getting this device no matter what because its like the N95 i miss on steroids with a better browser consider me sold!

If you don't understand why we're complaining, read the previous posts. It should be plenty clear to you.

[YoDude]

You know, he didn't existed before you heard of him. I think whether you heard of him or not is so irrelevant. He's well known reviewer. He didn't become famous because of his pre-released review.
Of course it's sudden because he reports about device for 2011. and he wants to describe it in a few words. Blowing out N900 out of the water says very much about how good something is, right? How many people do you know on the internet that have that kind of connections and that kind of insight in future of mobile phones?
No pics, of course, he wouldn't show us N920 pics because he doesn't want to harm companies that much. If you're going to say "and what about N900!?" - he did a preview week before it's official announcement and said he thinks he cannot harm it that way. He had a N900 from May, so he could do it much much earlier if he wanted to do as much damage as he can. About device for 2011. - other blogs don't know that stuff.


Of course he existed before I heard of him... The reason I noted when I first became aware of him was to show that I had no pre conceptions. The fact that he reported the features of the N900 accurately before the official announcement gained my respect... and I said so. (BTW, a lot of the reviewers I do know can't accurately report device features after an official announcement... so that is saying something good about Eldar, dig? )

I also read with great interest and appreciation his remarks about Nokia and Samsung battling it out to be the dominant player in the future cell phone market.

However, I do not see where he reported what has changed with the N900.

In other words, either the phone always crashed and he failed to report that in his first review or something happened to the phone or his attitude since the first review.

Who knows? Maybe his dog pee'ed on the dang thing. :eek:

In any event, this discrepancy in reports remains... and so does my question. :)

[Laughing Man]

It's only worth a corporation going after an individual if that individual has sufficient wealth and assets to make the recompense worthwhile. Otherwise you spend a lot of money to make a point. That may, or may not, be best for shareholder value in the medium to long term.

True, but if somebody's writing is damaging the brand-name of your smartphone/smart-computer-phone then it might just be worth it to make a point.

[bugelrex]

True, but if somebody's writing is damaging the brand-name of your smartphone/smart-computer-phone then it might just be worth it to make a point.


You mean Nokia's reputation for treating its smartphone buyers as beta-testers? The N-Series devices certainly don't have a reputation as being rock-solid on initial releases.

[Laughing Man]

True, but that's with a finalized build and finalized firmware on release. Then all gloves are off when it comes to reviews.

[bugelrex]

True, but that's with a finalized build and finalized firmware on release. Then all gloves are off when it comes to reviews.


True... You know it would take a truly incompetent company to take a rock-solid linux kernel and turning into a crashing mess. I don't think Eldar is lying though, more likely he's got an obscure hardware problem

[Mandor]

If you read the reviews for N97 for Photos and Features only it would have seemed like the best phone on earth. In reality, Nokia had the balls to pass the piece of crap as a flagship product. (2 year old hardware specs! the worst example of touchscreen interface you'll ever see. The OK and Cancel buttons take up 20% of the screen for gods sake!)

Pre-order buyers got hosed, opinions do matter.

That is why I insist on always testing it myself before I spend the money. Reviews will only tell me if it worth my time to go and test the device.

Reviewers can be pertinent if, and only if, you have been following the writer for a long time and know for sure that he/she has taste similar to yours. In any other case you are risking big.

Will you go buy an iPhone after reading a review made by a fan ? Really ?

[jandmdickerson]

Shouldn't the title of this thread be "infamous mobile reviewer throws N900 under the bus..."?

[Laughing Man]

That is why I insist on always testing it myself before I spend the money. Reviews will only tell me if it worth my time to go and test the device.

Reviewers can be pertinent if, and only if, you have been following the writer for a long time and know for sure that he/she has taste similar to yours. In any other case you are risking big.

Will you go buy an iPhone after reading a review made by a fan ? Really ?

I agree, reviews for me are helpful in finding out about the device. But I always try to test-drive the device myself before making the final purchase. Or I buy it somewhere, where I could return it for store credit if I'm not satisfed (I think Costco has this).


True... You know it would take a truly incompetent company to take a rock-solid linux kernel and turning into a crashing mess. I don't think Eldar is lying though, more likely he's got an obscure hardware problem

I don't think it's as much the kernel that is crashing, than it is Nokia's GUI and everything on top of the kernel that's iffy. I don't think Eldar is lying either, but given that we don't fully know what firmware and what hardware he is running it on we can't really make say if what he says about the n900 will match up with say what someone experiences with a more up to date firmware and actual n900 hardware. Therefore my point that if reviewers review products before they are finalized then they should point that out in their review. It's just simple honesty.

[Ayle]

I just read the translated review. Where did he say anything overly bad about the n900?

[Texrat]

True, but if somebody's writing is damaging the brand-name of your smartphone/smart-computer-phone then it might just be worth it to make a point.

...much like the RIAA going after individuals for music theft to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars most don't have.

But then, there's this: http://www.geek.com/articles/law/riaa-pays-out-10795103-in-music-piracy-lawsuit-20080819/

/OT in a blatant attempt to defuse subject

[Texrat]

True... You know it would take a truly incompetent company to take a rock-solid linux kernel and turning into a crashing mess. I don't think Eldar is lying though, more likely he's got an obscure hardware problem

...and as a former N800 QA engineer I can assure you they happen. We encountered the occasional hardware glitch on some units that didn't show up on the vast majority, and all in preproduction and early release. But then, that only serves to underscore the points about eldar's "preview" being disingenuous; his reported troubles induce a concern disproportionate to the reality.

You know, capacitors are notorious for causing issues with electronics devices. One need only be a bit out of spec or improperly sealed and you start off with decent behavior that degrades dramatically. Not insinuating this is at issue here, just offering an example.

[Mandor]

...and as a former N800 QA engineer I can assure you they happen. We encountered the occasional hardware glitch on some units that didn't show up on the vast majority, and all in preproduction and early release. But then, that only serves to underscore the points about eldar's "preview" being disingenuous; his reported troubles induce a concern disproportionate to the reality.

You know, capacitors are notorious for causing issues with electronics devices. One need only be a bit out of spec or improperly sealed and you start off with decent behavior that degrades dramatically. Not insinuating this is at issue here, just offering an example.

That is, sir, exactly on target. Why one "malfunctioning" prototype would suddenly represents what we will get in October. If, say, you read 5 reviews and one of them got a "faulty" device, will everybody imply that 20% of the manufactured final devices will be like that ? I don't think so.

Edit : typo

[Texrat]

Thanks Mandor.

And as for firmware-- I was testing updated Diablo builds on a weekly basis. There was a noticeable steady rise toward improved functionality and stability. Yes, there were occasional regressions and new glitches but they did not represent the trend and were outliers. The same is no doubt true of Fremantle.

[gerbick]

Even though I've followed this thread, I might have missed if there are any reviews from 3rd parties other than this individual out there on more recent firmware.

Thanks in advance.

[JayOnThaBeat]

You know, he didn't existed before you heard of him.

That's also how I choose to view the world... like a story. Characters don't exist until they are introduced to the protagonist (me, in this case).



;)

[danramos]

Do you remember the professional movie critic that decided he would download an unfinished workprint edition of a movie (Hulk, maybe Wolverine) and reviewed it even though the special effects were completely missing?

He got canned.

Zerojay, you ignorant slut. :)

First, the movie he DOWNLOADED ILLEGALLY OFF THE INTERNET to review was 'Wolverine'.

Secondly, he got canned for publishing a SELF-INCRIMINATING ARTICLE where he admitted to ILLEGALLY DOWNLOADING A COPY OF THE MOVIE OFF THE INTERNET. Not, as you attempted to allude, for pointing out that the effects were missing.

ref:
http://arstechnica.com/media/news/2009/04/fox-threatens-over-wolverine-leak-fbi-raids-data-center.ars
http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/17471.cfm
http://www.getthebigpicture.net/blog/2009/4/4/fox-columnist-brags-about-wolverine-piracy.html
yawn... I'm sure you could google up more sites that clarify the point.

There were plenty of opportunities for you to site as examples of poor reviews getting people canned--but that wasn't one of them.

[vapid smile as he shuffles his papers]

(Note: ZJ, no personal assault intended, I was parodying the style of Saturday Night Live's editorial 'he said, she said' debate segments) ^.^;

[qgil]

Brothers, sisters: love, peace and prosperity.

If you notice it, everybody is trying to do their job as good as they can. The Maemo team is working on a great product. Eldar makes reviews based on what he has and no matter what his intentions are it's clear that he puts his best skills into it. All you are great smart dudes that could be just wathing TV and instead you are here squeezing your brain and skills as well.

It's not worth discussing about appreciations that will be obsoleted as soon as the N900 starts selling, no matter how positive or negative such appreciations are. Pre-order, wait, support, critize... Do as you want, what matters is this common interest of making something great with this Maemo 5.

Respect is more important than any bug or any piece of silicon, and ultimately we are all here for the fun of it.

[deadmalc]

Aren't we all missing two important points here, as far as I understand it...(which I could be completely wrong [again])

1) As far as I am aware there are no other comprehensive reviews of the n900
2) The release date is at least one or two months away

So I for one am glad for his reviews, if nothing else at least we have something to keep us entertained for the next few months.
;)

[ragnar]

+1 to qgil.

Naturally he is not reviewing the final SW, i.e. it will still improve. (I personally noticed some very nice improvements just yesterday, for instance.)

If the SW would be final, you would have it in your hands. :)

[ArnimS]

Because... stealing, is theft...

And copyright infringement is neither of those.

[BaKSo]

eldar twitte..

"After current update of fw I could check standby time (at least now). Before wasnt very impressive figures, now i believe it will be better"

is he talking about N900?

[frals]

Could be the Samsung 2011 device!



;)

[zerojay]

Secondly, he got canned for publishing a SELF-INCRIMINATING ARTICLE where he admitted to ILLEGALLY DOWNLOADING A COPY OF THE MOVIE OFF THE INTERNET. Not, as you attempted to allude, for pointing out that the effects were missing.

Hehe.. no, I wasn't alluding to him being fired for pointing out the special effects were missing. I was pointing out that his copy of the movie was missing them, that's all.

[77h]

For this particular phone, the only review issue I care about is the battery.

Software issues can be fixed at some point, if apps crash I can write my own to replace. The hardware specs are adequate enough to last at least 2 years with the current software advancements.

However the battery is the real deal breaker. This is something that cannot be changed and software optimization can only go so far.

With 3G and no wifi can the phone last from 9am to 12am with 15-20% battery left with
- instant email
- facebook status every A mins (will it share the email internet connection?)
- B hours music
- C mins surfing
- D mins video

What are A,B,C,D or perhaps put it another way, is the battery usage at least HALF as good as the E71/E72?

I would not be surprised if the first reviewer to give negative battery results will be flamed and tarred alive!
first off hello to this forum ;)

re battery life. I agree this will be important to most. As a heavy user of the N95 (joikuspot) I am used to batteries getting drained pretty quickly but thank god we can change it and carry multiple ones. Re the review. I don't really care about this one and am waiting for the phone to be released and see the overall reaction of the testers (not the techcrunch guys or OM Malik obviously)

[javispedro]

I'd like to remark that on one of the screenshots he shows he's installed two of my apps from extras-devel.

Well, the issue is that neither did fully work by the time he probably did the review - I've since gotten some useful feedback and at least one of them should work a bit better now. :)
Of course, that's the reason they were in extras-devel in the first place and not -testing, but I can imagine that deciding to install a few apps and seeing them not doing what they were supposed to do would only bias him in a negative way.

Hopefully he understood what extras-devel means and the fact I do not have a N900 and thus have to do "blind testing".

[allnameswereout]

And copyright infringement is neither of those.Psst, maybe this ***** was referring to N900 prototype...

...and as a former N800 QA engineer I can assure you they happen. We encountered the occasional hardware glitch on some units that didn't show up on the vast majority, and all in preproduction and early release. But then, that only serves to underscore the points about eldar's "preview" being disingenuous; his reported troubles induce a concern disproportionate to the reality...and we know Nokia had to sacrifice for priorities because of bugs found. Like with USB.

Also, do not neglect possibility the user (Eldar in this case) operated the device wrong.

You mean Nokia's reputation for treating its smartphone buyers as beta-testers? The N-Series devices certainly don't have a reputation as being rock-solid on initial releases.I'm not aware of that reputation but I am aware that when a product is released to masses it is entirely possible these people are going to use the device in ways internal testing did not.

That is why I insist on always testing it myself before I spend the money. Reviews will only tell me if it worth my time to go and test the device.You cannot fully test a piece of electronics in a store in such a limited amount of time, and some hardware like a HDD you cannot extensively test as customer.

If I'll want to test Nokia N900 I will have to travel 2x 1,5-2 hours for that. I rather buy Nokia N900, and if I do not like it use my EU rights to send it back.

Likewise, I bought an iPod touch partly to review iPhoneOS. Yes, I needed a new flash-based DAP too. I combined these 2 'needs' (luxaries, rather).

Even though I've followed this thread, I might have missed if there are any reviews from 3rd parties other than this individual out there on more recent firmware.

Thanks in advance.As posted earlier in this thread:

Michal Jerz from My-Symbian.com (http://my-symbian.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40267&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=90) has used a prototype since 20090903 and has not experienced a single crash.

Perhaps Eldar upgraded to newer firmware which introduced regressions. We'll never know.

[mykenyc]

If you don't understand why we're complaining, read the previous posts. It should be plenty clear to you.

its really not the fact of getting at the complainers i understand why but what I'm saying is we giving to much into this topic people will do what they want to nonetheless. I understand that people look at his reviews for guidance but there will be even more million reviews, hands on, and buyers when the device drops .
[edit]..
just read what qgil said and agree 100%, basically the same thing I'm saying.

Brothers, sisters: love, peace and prosperity.

If you notice it, everybody is trying to do their job as good as they can. The Maemo team is working on a great product. Eldar makes reviews based on what he has and no matter what his intentions are it's clear that he puts his best skills into it. All you are great smart dudes that could be just wathing TV and instead you are here squeezing your brain and skills as well.

It's not worth discussing about appreciations that will be obsoleted as soon as the N900 starts selling, no matter how positive or negative such appreciations are. Pre-order, wait, support, critize... Do as you want, what matters is this common interest of making something great with this Maemo 5.

Respect is more important than any bug or any piece of silicon, and ultimately we are all here for the fun of it.

[sjgadsby]

I'd like to remark that on one of the screenshots he shows he's installed two of my apps...

Well, at least we know he's a man of taste and culture.

[kanishou]

I'd like to remark that on one of the screenshots he shows he's installed two of my apps from extras-devel.

Well, the issue is that neither did fully work by the time he probably did the review - I've since gotten some useful feedback and at least one of them should work a bit better now. :)
Of course, that's the reason they were in extras-devel in the first place and not -testing, but I can imagine that deciding to install a few apps and seeing them not doing what they were supposed to do would only bias him in a negative way.

Hopefully he understood what extras-devel means and the fact I do not have a N900 and thus have to do "blind testing".

Yes, I was about to point that out too. It looks like he crammed the device with unstable software, who knows what consequences that has on the device's overall stability (let alone battery life). Hopefully that's just for screenshots and not what he is basing his comments on.

[javispedro]

Yes, I was about to point that out too. It looks like he crammed the device with unstable software, who knows what consequences that has on the device's overall stability (let alone battery life). .
I wouldn't go that far -- few apps will affect overall stability.
But otherwise, your point is valid. If he lets any of the apps in extras-devel unfavor his opinion about the device in any way I'd consider the review invalid -- because of people like me :rolleyes: (who use extras-devel for what I think it is: a testground for experimental apps, which may or may not have enough quality yet to be promoted to -testing).
Of course, this does not apply for apps in extras(-stable).

However, don't forget to give him the benefit of doubt. Probably, he did know what to expect from extras-devel.

[Laughing Man]

Haha that would be the equivilent of jailbreaking the iPhone, installing a bunch of unstable apps and then saying the iPhone sucks because of that.

[kopte3]

No it wouldn't.

[jandmdickerson]

No it wouldn't.

Thou dost protest too much, methinks....

Do you have anything to gain here? Is this about gaining traffic on a certain website?

hmmm.....;)

[danramos]

And copyright infringement is neither of those.

Copying for yourself is SUPPOSED to generally fall under 'fair use' provisions in our laws--it's, in fact, a right granted by the Constitution. Illegally distributing, publicly performing, and making money off of someone else's production, while illegal, no... NONE of that is STEALING and it's boggling logic to equate any of that with robbing a person of one's possession when you've simply duplicated a possession and left the original copy intact. Illegal, maybe.. but it's not 'stealing.' Let's try and illegally COPY that guy's television or microwave, over there, before we start equating them.

Hehe.. no, I wasn't alluding to him being fired for pointing out the special effects were missing. I was pointing out that his copy of the movie was missing them, that's all.

Well, shoot.. now you're nice longer fun to insult. :)

Haha that would be the equivilent of jailbreaking the iPhone, installing a bunch of unstable apps and then saying the iPhone sucks because of that.

I agree with kopte3, it is not the same. Come back later with a better example.

[qole]

Well, at least we know he's a man of taste and culture.

I thought the phrase was, "a man of wealth and taste (http://www.lyricsfreak.com/r/rolling+stones/sympathy+for+the+devil_20117881.html)"?

[Laughing Man]

No it wouldn't.

Mind elaborating why it wouldn't be?

In both instances you are installing software from unstable sources (extras-devel) or in the iPhone's case (Cydia).

And Nokia nor Apple has supported people installing applications from those sources. I think Nokia even gives you a warning about it when you try installing them.

[danramos]

Mind elaborating why it wouldn't be?

In both instances you are installing software from unstable sources (extras-devel) or in the iPhone's case (Cydia).

And Nokia nor Apple has supported people installing applications from those sources. I think Nokia even gives you a warning about it when you try installing them.

That's like asking someone to prove something false. You need to prove something is TRUE, not the other way around.

At any rate jailbreaking an iphone is something they go out of their way to prevent. Come back later with a better example.

[Laughing Man]

I did prove why something is true (see above post that you quoted). So now it's up to them to prove it false. Though you are right in that Nokia doesn't try to block it. But it seems rather stupid to install expermental software and then if your device is unstable because of it, blame the device rather than the expermental software.

[bbin]

No it wouldn't.

LOL! What an argument. How old are you? five?

Just kidding :p

[kanishou]

I think Nokia even gives you a warning about it when you try installing them.

Yes they do. Nokia asks "you do this on your own risk, we don't take any responsibility for it. Are you fine with that?", Apple says "you're a criminal if you do that!".

I find it disingenuous to claim that this is not the same, as that would be indirectly justifying Apple's no-go policy.

[javispedro]

Yes they do. Nokia asks "you do this on your own risk, we don't take any responsibility for it. Are you fine with that?", Apple says "you're a criminal if you do that!".

I find it disingenuous to claim that this is not the same, as that would be indirectly justifying Apple's no-go policy.
That's the warning given with extras(-stable) apps.

Extras-devel apps cannot even be installed without knowing what an APT repository is. That's a quite a difference. The repo is designed for hosting unstable apps; stable apps would be promoted to extras(-stable).

Thus the issue at hand.

[danramos]

I did prove why something is true (see above post that you quoted). So now it's up to them to prove it false. Though you are right in that Nokia doesn't try to block it. But it seems rather stupid to install expermental software and then if your device is unstable because of it, blame the device rather than the expermental software.

To that end, I absolutely agree with your sentiment.

LOL! What an argument. How old are you? five?

Just kidding :p

[mockingly] "How old are you? five?" myeah :D

[allnameswereout]

Yes they do. Nokia asks "you do this on your own risk, we don't take any responsibility for it. Are you fine with that?", Apple says "you're a criminal if you do that!".Any software besides the official software is unsupported and completely at your own risk whether that is on iPhoneOS or Maemo does not matter.

However, Extras is tested by this community and found stable, whereas the App Store is reviewed (but not tested in sense of QA!) by Apple and found stable, whereas Cydia is tested by community and found stable. One problem Cydia has is that with the scattered repositories you run a combination of repositories probably not well tested or taking each other into account.

Now, Extras-Devel is explicitly for development purposes. We now know that Eldar has installed software from Extras-Devel on the same device he is using to publicly judge stability of the N900 firmware. I question this behaviour. Extras-Devel is like installing an alpha/beta/rc firmware or OS. Much of the software has not been tested on the final product. Its like running Windows XP software on Windows Vista. Anything can happen.

I have seen iPhoneOS applications being reviewed by an iPhoneOS enthusiast news site, and they're usually a sneak preview. The reviewers are honest and informative in telling their experience both positive and negative wise without remarks like 'oh this sucks donkey' while also underlining they're not using the final version. Ie. "this bug was reported and confirmed" or "the bug is fixed in the final version currently pending reviewal". AFAIK Eldar does not commence such communication.

[allnameswereout]

Copying for yourself is SUPPOSED to generally fall under 'fair use' provisions in our laws--it's, in fact, a right granted by the Constitution. Illegally distributing, publicly performing, and making money off of someone else's production, while illegal, no... NONE of that is STEALING and it's boggling logic to equate any of that with robbing a person of one's possession when you've simply duplicated a possession and left the original copy intact. Illegal, maybe.. but it's not 'stealing.' Let's try and illegally COPY that guy's television or microwave, over there, before we start equating them.For example, the crimes committed in this case (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-Life_2#2003_leak) were both copyright infringement as well as cracking. This was however via Internet while we don't know how Eldar obtained the alleged N900 prototype hardware/software.

Obtaining it involved a physical deed not committed over the Internet, and given he 1) leaked confidential information 2) is afraid for Nokia to find his personal details it appears he did not receive his N900 prototype through legal circuits. Therefore, it is reasonable to suspect Eldar of a crime, most likely 'theft' indeed.

You can applaud him for releasing confidential information which you'd have received (albeit later) anyway much like you can applaud the HL2 cracker to spread source code of HL2 but I know in the latter case some people compiled the source and played the game, while it was not stable. This gave HL2 a bad name. One can also argue 'better bad publicity than none at all'; OK, might be true.

[Texrat]

Next: well-defended eldar throws eager supporters under bus.

[eldarmurtazin]

Funny to read a lot of rubbish about me and my articles. Glad to see that at least some of people could think by yourself and make conclusions.

Trying to clarify some things.

First of all, I'm not using expirience from 3hd parties apps to make conclusions about stability of devices, that's stupid and Nokia/Maemo couldnt be in charge of that codes.

Second thing which you have take to account. No one is provide review nowadays and no one except some Nokia/Maemo stuff, have units like me. Welcome in real world. The same situation with many others products (not only Nokia). And I dont care how jealous people could be, sometimes like here. I hear a lot of cryes in a style:
- he havent anything
- he have not a final things
- his things is not working properly etc

Unfortunately for someone, my connection in this industry much higher than anyone here could have and I working with all companies (vendors/operators) on the market (except a few, frankly speaking).

Next big thing. A very few of you see in review of Maemo5 (how you read it? through Google Translator? haha) the main topic. I'm not discussed unstability in any way, just mention it. I disscused limitation of platform which we faced today (no EQ, no MMS, no many others things). Thats not a good thing for power user which will come from S60 platform. And if they will buy device without knowing possible limitation they will said a lot of rude words against Maemo/Nokia etc. And I call that kind of things a very bad PR. Nowadays a lot of enthusiasts of Maemo trying to push OS to the market. Good, but not a smart move. OS is not ready for mass market, is not ready even for mass market itself.

Guys from Maemo team see that the last stable FW with moderate usage (online services, WiFi, contact lists etc) generate one crash per day (under crash i Mean reboot of device). If you will use some software for checking memory leakage, you will see a lot of interesting details about standard apps. Etc

Next things. When I write first preview (actually it was made in June), I didnt care about fw/stability and other things. Because it was a long way to market and things have to be changed dramatically. But it isnt happens nowadays. Now, device is producing with such software which we have now. With some limitations in quantities, market availability, but in any way. That's production cycle which started. And on several devices I have on the same pattern of usage the same mistakes in software part. The hardware is great and will be on market for 2-3 years. But GSM part is a little bit problematic now (3G networks), software glitches are obvious. Check bug list for Maemo5 or ask how many details it consists. You will be astonished. But I dont believe that anyone from nokia will be discussed this topic open minded and frankly.

In any case, you keen about Maemo5/RX51 - so I am. But the only huge difference between us, that I see potential of platform, not current state of development. And my expirience tell me that this device with such SW wont get a very positive feedback from mass market (for you and other fans of Maemo or previous devices, is pretty ok). But sometimes people prefer to be blind and deaf. Who cares? We will see what will happens in 6-7 weeks. So enjoy before that time you feelings. They will be different from mass market feedback.

[Texrat]

Unfortunately for someone, my connection in this industry much higher than anyone here...

ROFL... :rolleyes:

[zerojay]

...

Well, thanks for at least coming here and talking to us about it even if you aren't happy about what some of us have been saying about you and the article.

[eldarmurtazin]

Texrat
So may be you see products for 2011 from major player on this market? or hekp with development of marketing strategy for some of them. Go on... You are funny

[Texrat]

Texrat
So may be you see products for 2011 from major player on this market? or hekp with development of marketing strategy for some of them. Go on... You are funny

Go back and look at the quote I chuckled at, eldar. You got it wrong.

[eldarmurtazin]

zerojay
Actually, it was a pleasure to read a lot of things here. You all made my day :)

I'm pretty happy with such things, I hear them around 5-6 years in the same manner, nothing changed

[ragnar]

Welcome aboard, Eldar. :)

[sachin007]

Funny to read a lot of rubbish about me and my articles. Glad to see that at least some of people could think by yourself and make conclusions.

Trying to clarify some things.

First of all, I'm not using expirience from 3hd parties apps to make conclusions about stability of devices, that's stupid and Nokia/Maemo couldnt be in charge of that codes.

Second thing which you have take to account. No one is provide review nowadays and no one except some Nokia/Maemo stuff, have units like me. Welcome in real world. The same situation with many others products (not only Nokia). And I dont care how jealous people could be, sometimes like here. I hear a lot of cryes in a style:
- he havent anything
- he have not a final things
- his things is not working properly etc

Unfortunately for someone, my connection in this industry much higher than anyone here could have and I working with all companies (vendors/operators) on the market (except a few, frankly speaking).

Next big thing. A very few of you see in review of Maemo5 (how you read it? through Google Translator? haha) the main topic. I'm not discussed unstability in any way, just mention it. I disscused limitation of platform which we faced today (no EQ, no MMS, no many others things). Thats not a good thing for power user which will come from S60 platform. And if they will buy device without knowing possible limitation they will said a lot of rude words against Maemo/Nokia etc. And I call that kind of things a very bad PR. Nowadays a lot of enthusiasts of Maemo trying to push OS to the market. Good, but not a smart move. OS is not ready for mass market, is not ready even for mass market itself.

Guys from Maemo team see that the last stable FW with moderate usage (online services, WiFi, contact lists etc) generate one crash per day (under crash i Mean reboot of device). If you will use some software for checking memory leakage, you will see a lot of interesting details about standard apps. Etc

Next things. When I write first preview (actually it was made in June), I didnt care about fw/stability and other things. Because it was a long way to market and things have to be changed dramatically. But it isnt happens nowadays. Now, device is producing with such software which we have now. With some limitations in quantities, market availability, but in any way. That's production cycle which started. And on several devices I have on the same pattern of usage the same mistakes in software part. The hardware is great and will be on market for 2-3 years. But GSM part is a little bit problematic now (3G networks), software glitches are obvious. Check bug list for Maemo5 or ask how many details it consists. You will be astonished. But I dont believe that anyone from nokia will be discussed this topic open minded and frankly.

In any case, you keen about Maemo5/RX51 - so I am. But the only huge difference between us, that I see potential of platform, not current state of development. And my expirience tell me that this device with such SW wont get a very positive feedback from mass market (for you and other fans of Maemo or previous devices, is pretty ok). But sometimes people prefer to be blind and deaf. Who cares? We will see what will happens in 6-7 weeks. So enjoy before that time you feelings. They will be different from mass market feedback.

Yeah it is a good thing that you came here to post your views. But the way u gave good review about the n900 initially and later on bashed it saying that there was stability issues while other reviewers also said that it was one of the most stable device made people to think that you were seeking more attention.
Many people here are just complaining that you failed to mention the firmware of your device and how you got your n900. Without that information many of the new users who are interested in maemo will not get the full picture. For us maemo your review is really not a big deal because we know a lot about maemo but it may mis guide new to be maemo users.