[Poll] Reboots with N900?

[daxx]

dont know if this has been done, i searched and only found faulty phone polls, this one i want to be just for random reboots.

try and keep this alive please people.

[ahmadka]

Got my N900 yesterday ... no reboots so far :)

[Simoen]

Today, Finland, ~5 reboots in 6 hours... :confused:

[mikec]

you would get more response if you changed the title to indicate it was a poll, as there is a long thread on reboots already

[daxx]

true, nice one.

[bocaJ]

I voted. One caveat is that I only had 2 reboots, and both occured when I was messing with SIP and plugged into my laptop via USB. Also, there is a section for this on the N900 spreadsheet:
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0Akx7Psmg91y3dExoWFlnT0JJZV8wbEh4MHRSNjBuU mc&hl=en

[daxx]

so far the stats make it look hopefull lol.

[bbin]

3 reboots. Extras-devel apps installed.

[Laughing Man]

If you have devel or testing applications you really shouldn't be voting in this poll. Installing unstable software of course may lead to reboots.

[bachagabriel]

i received my phone today at 12:00 PM. It is now 4:00 PM and my phone has rebooted at least 10 times

[God]

its been rebooting 24/7 since 2 weeks. Wdf am I suposd to do :S

[RevdKathy]

I wonder if the more useful piece of research might be to ask what people were doing when the device rebooted. If we can establish that we might be on the way to solving it. Other useful information might be what it was connected to at the time (a particular carrier or wifi modem?).

Just knowing where you live doesn't tell us much about why some devices are rebooting while others (like mine) have seen no spontaneous reboots at all.

[daxx]

i wanted 2 try and see where the majority of faulty phones are going, people have stated reboots from strait out the box? So its more in depth then apps. could be an electrical component problem ?

[bossrulez]

i wanted 2 try and see where the majority of faulty phones are going, people have stated reboots from strait out the box? So its more in depth then apps. could be an electrical component problem ?

yeah reboots straight out of box for me :(

[NvyUs]

i've had reboots but only when playing some videos in browser

[x61]

No reboot. American N900 phones don't reboot.

[makel]

Got it monday. About 50 reboots in two days and today I send it back and now I am waiting new one.

ps. Reboots happened with and without extra installed apps.

[solpete]

Completely useless poll.....

1.) People with reboot-problems are more likely to answer
2.) People with problems are more likely to visit forums like this one

[daxx]

quit bein a *****, useless 2 u but not 4 me. as i stated i want 2 know the stats the more telling me where they are if they are having problems the better results. dnt have anythinp creative 2 say? Jog on mate :)

[bachagabriel]

I can tell you that the reboots are RANDOM

Mine rebooted at first when I was setting up email and mostly when trying to install apps. Other times were just random

[NotTheMessiah]

No reboot. American N900 phones don't reboot.

Hmmm intriguing. Maybe its something they did when they fixed them for "3" sims. Tho i wouldnt have thought they'd have to have changed the hardware at all for that.

[bocaJ]

No reboot. American N900 phones don't reboot.

Having an American phone, and looking at the poll, I say not only are you wrong, but American phones reboot with greater frequency then European ones.

[bossrulez]

No reboot. American N900 phones don't reboot.

You are wrong

I am having an American N900(bought from Nokia USA site) using AT&T sim and it is rebooting right out of the box

it rebooted me twice while I was trying to write this reply !!

[iJanne]

For what its worth, my Finnish N900 from the first public batch has never rebooted on me. Solid as a rock.

[joshua.maverick]

I know there are more people for sure.

[pyromaniac]

have it since 2 weeks .. no "unintentional" reboots yet ...

[Oddi]

Bought in Norway.

Reboots started straight of out box.

First was when adjusting the clock. No apps installed at all, besides pre-installed ones.

Happens randomly when using any app (browser, chess, calendar, contact list, etc. even in the app list screen, and telephone screen. Sometimes instantly, sometimes after a couple of minutes.

Wi-Fi on or off. 3G on or off. SIM card installed or not. No difference.

Returned phone, but probably won't be getting any replacements before start of next year because of slow shipping times, and holiday season inc, which sucks because, despite of the annoying reboots, I quite liked the phone :(

[daxx]

bump.............

[mikec]

Guys
Comments from Nokia Engineer looking into this. Try and categorize your reboot before you send it back to help track this down.

This bug contains many different reboot issues.
=================================================
One set of issues is system service crashes. These seems to be quite rare in
this bug though.

Another set is crashes when the device is heavily used. This could be memory
management related issue (e.g. between CPU, GPU and DSP, they all can change
the memory mappings).

One set seems to be related to power management (device wakeup from sleep) and
happening more often on some specific devices, but it may be more of a slight
difference in how they behave than "hardware bug"[1].

Last set seems to be related to networking and an Oops in network related
functionality. This may be something that triggers based on what kind of a
network environment one has or traffic that network has.

Most of them so far seem to be triggering randomly, but that doesn't mean that
it would be a HW issue. Things that depend on power management, memory
management, network environment, timings etc on the kernel side, may get
triggered seemingly randomly when the device has as complex HW and SW
interactions as what e.g. N900 has.


The important thing is to check what kind of reboot is in the question; sw_rst
or 32wd_to, whether former was because of a critical system service
termination, or whether they were because of some specific kernel oops, or
whether 32wd_to was just due to device freezing (without Oops being logged) and
provide the information in which kind of situations these happen and steps
leading to it.

Based on that information from all of you, we can then try to come up with
specific steps where some *specific* reboot cause can be nearly always be
triggered within reasonable time (say 15 mins). After that finding the cause
for the bug and fixing it becomes much easier.


[1] As to HW, every device from every manufacturer has "HW bugs", at least if
you consider any component in device working even slightly differently from its
specification as a bug. SW adapting to these is normal driver work.

Then there are variations between individual devices. HW in devices is not
100% identical, they just comply to certain set of tolerance limits and
functionality tests. Some components are calibrated at the manufacturing line
and these calibrations may also differ between devices. With the complex HW &
SW combinations & interactions & radio/network environments these small
variations may sometimes cause unexpected situations for the SW.

As to whether one could say that some issue is a "bug" in some specific device
HW, requires first determining the exact cause of the issue and whether SW can
handle that reasonably.

[Tetharion]

got mine last thursday, had no random reboot since then... haven't installed any testing software either

[ossipena]

just wrote here to show you my great signature.

hint: look at the text that is bolded..

[shapeshifter]

just wrote here to show you my great signature.I think it would be useful to the bug tracking people if you'd append "please keep non-technical discussions to *this* (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=392303) thread, as posts on the bugtracker not containing any useful information described in post 20 (https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6334#c20) of the tracker are needlessly cluttering the bug report", as Andre keeps repeating. :)

[ossipena]

I think it would be useful to the bug tracking people if you'd append "please keep non-technical discussions to *this* (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=392303) thread, as posts on the bugtracker not containing any useful information described in post 20 (https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6334#c20) of the tracker are needlessly cluttering the bug report", as Andre keeps repeating. :)

the conversation should be cleaned. a lot of stuff that should have written here.

[thiswayup]

had lots of reboots sat/sun/mon. reflashed wednesday seemed to sort it. now rebooting again like it's going out of fashion.

[mikec]

just bumping this thread now more people are getting their devices

[bsving]

I think it would be useful to the bug tracking people if you'd append "please keep non-technical discussions to *this* (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=392303) thread, as posts on the bugtracker not containing any useful information described in post 20 (https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6334#c20) of the tracker are needlessly cluttering the bug report", as Andre keeps repeating. :)
Yes, but - It is obvious by now that this is not an ordinary SW bug. This bug is something that can only be fixed by the innermost circle of Nokia SW/HW engineers, IF it is fixable at all. Judging by the posts from the Nokia representative, it looks like they are, at the moment, clueless of what causes it and how to fix it.

By this poll, approximately 10% of the phones are affected. Nokia should get hold of some of these and get to work, and clearly state so in that bug report. As of now that bug track is useless unless Nokia make some changes for us to try.

[daxx]

bump...............

[Alex Atkin UK]

I do not think the poll gives enough options nor is to clear enough. It should needs to state RANDOM reboots, just saying reboot doesn't even make it clear what you are asking unless you already know of the random reboot issue.

Personally, I have only had 1 random reboot.

Also the big problem is people having them with nothing extra installed. If someone only has random reboots after installing something from extras-devel then surely you don't want them voting on the poll as that's they caused the problem themselves, rather than it being an issue with the N900 as stock.

[bsving]

You are probably right. it should read random reboots and with the following requirement:

in x.term:
cat /proc/bootreason

should give the following
wd32_to


On the other hand, I think most people answering this poll, have done so because they have been searching for answers to why their N900 is rebooting all the time. In my opinion it should be representative, the "wd32_to" will simply make it 100% (instead of 95??)

[Venomrush]

Those with rebooting issues probably have apps from devel installed.

[daxx]

I do not think the poll gives enough options nor is to clear enough. It should needs to state RANDOM reboots, just saying reboot doesn't even make it clear what you are asking unless you already know of the random reboot issue.

Personally, I have only had 1 random reboot.

Also the big problem is people having them with nothing extra installed. If someone only has random reboots after installing something from extras-devel then surely you don't want them voting on the poll as that's they caused the problem themselves, rather than it being an issue with the N900 as stock.
umm the poll does say random reboots?! not just reboots like u have said it does, also if you read my first post it asks for random reboots out of box. but im sure you would of known that if you had read the thread? douche bag lol

[bsving]

Those with rebooting issues probably have apps from devel installed.

No they certainly do not. Look, those with rebooting N900s know exactly what they have, it cannot be mistaken. They reboot roughly every 10-30 minutes with heavy use and can go for hours while not being used. They reboot straight out of the box, nothing installed. They reboot even when reflashed.

[NotTheMessiah]

picked mine up yesterday and all is fine so far. fingers crossed for the next 18 months now!

[bocaJ]

Those with rebooting issues probably have apps from devel installed.

Not true - my phone rebooted just hours after I got it, and the only major thing I had done was enable an SIP account.

[miniscalope]

people who respond "no reboots" did not stress yet their device. Mine reboot when i play a video, seek in it ,close it, open an other one, seek etc... many times (but not especially fast)

[captainqtp]

I got a random reboot one time when I was hopping from program to program. I've had it one week and only one random reboot so far.

[bouvin]

My device began rebooting right out of the box (rebooted twice while I was setting the clock). No installed software; approx. 30 reboots, apparently random.

Eventually, the device became unresponsive, and can no longer boot. Sent back. Another N900 (we bought two) is performing without a hitch.

Got a replacement N900 - has been performing without a hitch for 4 hours now. Update: A day later - still smooth sailing.

/Niels

[REMFwhoopitydo]

had mine in the UK for a week. no reboots.

[bltcool]

i have the american one, my reboots only sometimes like a couple of day, but not all the time

[Laughingstok]

Currently have an uptime of over 10 days.

[m0par]

I only got as far as setting the time/date on mine.

Immediately following that, it went into a non-stop reboot cycle.

It would reboot, get as far as displaying the desktop background, the led would then turn on white for about a second, fade to off, and reboot.

Waiting for a replacement now. I wasn't too upset with having to return it, since I have hopes of getting one with fewer dead pixels in addition to actually functioning.

BTW, does anyone know if Nokia has a dead-pixel policy? Mine had at least nine. One all by its lonesome and a cluster of at least 8 near the center that was really, really obvious.

[That One Guy]

I'm not putting much stock in these early replies, since it's come to light that a 30 count unwanted reboot (10 actual reboots) renders the device as bricked.


i received my phone today at 12:00 PM. It is now 4:00 PM and my phone has rebooted at least 10 times

Got it monday. About 50 reboots in two days and today I send it back and now I am waiting new one.

ps. Reboots happened with and without extra installed apps.

My device began rebooting right out of the box (rebooted twice while I was setting the clock). No installed software; approx. 30 reboots, apparently random.

/Niels

[onestop]

I only got as far as setting the time/date on mine.

Immediately following that, it went into a non-stop reboot cycle.



I didn't even get that far. Out of the box my n900 continuously rebooted, while rebooting. I would get the first set of dancing dots, and it would stop on the 2nd dot from the left for a few seconds, then reboot. Eventually, it entered brick mode.

I tried the R&D mode trick to reset brick mode, and even though I was unable to enter R&D mode, then go back to production mode, once in production mode it was bricked for good. Contacted Nokia customer support, and they said to return it :-(

I didn't even try to flash it. Having never had the opportunity to change anything on the device, I figured the problem was not the flash.

[hm88]

Those with no reboots, how heavy are you using the N900??
Maybe its just power users that experience the "occasional reboots"

[Laughing Man]

Those with no reboots, how heavy are you using the N900??
Maybe its just power users that experience the "occasional reboots"

Define power user? It's a bit vague (does it mean multi-task alot). Or have several resource intensive apps open (e.g. gpodder downloading podcasts, pidgin, web browser, etc..?)

[hm88]

Define power user? It's a bit vague (does it mean multi-task alot). Or have several resource intensive apps open (e.g. gpodder downloading podcasts, pidgin, web browser, etc..?)

both =)

[bsving]

There is a quick-fix for this. Also, nokia has informed that this is a driver issue due to (un)expected spread in HW specs, and will be fixed.

In any case the device should not be continuosly run in "rebooting mode", as this will corrupt the filesystem.

see:
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=434335#post434335

[Suurorca]

A friend of mine is a Nokia service engineer... and I witnessed his device to reboot twice in as many hours, straight after reflash, with the device still in vanilla state.

First was while downloading mclock from app manager. Rebooted while still downloading.

The second, I believe was while writing an SMS.


...good thing mine works flawlessly :)

[mhmtntky]

my phone does not charge. i could only use it for one day. in that day i had around 10 reboots.

this phone is a crap,

i am returning it and buying another brand.

http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=35132&page=5

[TA-t3]

I just now had my first unexpected reboot.

Phone was idle. I had it too close to the computer so I heard that annoying GSM connect sound (the one a phone does routinely), so I grabbed it to move it farther away from the computer. That's when I noticed the white screen with NOKIA, and then the five small boot balls.

I had a browser, contacts, hp42 open. No excessive memory or CPU usage (it had been idle since last night). The only abnormality was that the last day it's had a screen refresh problem with the icon mode - when hitting 'more apps' and scrolling I could still see the first icons in the background.

[bsving]

Looking at the poll statistics, it occured to me that the number of rebooting devices are actually more than 20%. The poll is devided in American and European (why??) and then everything is summed. This a a rather odd way of doing it, but the actual number is 20, not 10 as it seems to be.

[Tiptronic]

had it for about a week, no reboots yet.

[sjgadsby]

Those with no reboots, how heavy are you using the N900??
Maybe its just power users that experience the "occasional reboots"

Perhaps. All I can tell you is that I have both a pre-production N900 from the summit and a production N900. The pre-production unit rebooted a total of three times while running the pre-production firmware and not once on the production firmware. The production N900 has not rebooted.

I keep Mauku open for Twitter. I browse the web, sometimes with five, six, or more browser windows open at once. I sometimes keep Google Latitude or GoWalla open to share my location. I listen to audio from local files and streaming from the Internet. I watch video clips. I check four IMAP and one POP3 account for email every five minutes, plus have MfE synchronizing email, calendar, contacts, and tasks with an Exchange 2007 server. I take and share photos. I stay logged into AIM, ICQ, Jabber (GoogleTalk and Ovi), MSN, SIP, Skype, and Y!M and have location updates enabled for them. I keep Extras-testing enabled and install available updates from it. I have installed items from Extras-devel and SDK/Tools.

I don't know what kind of user that makes me. In the past, I've been told I'm not a power user. Regardless, if you have a load set you suspect will reliably reboot N900s, I'm interested to hear it.

[ossipena]

I can't vote again. got replacement unit that doesn't reboot.

[BoeMatic]

I've been using mine since Christmas, no unexpected reboots so far. It's a European device (Germany actually)