My 770 becomes sluggish after browsing for 15-20 min [Archive] - maemo.org

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zarco

11-22-2005, 06:02 PM

Hello from Spain !
In general, I am really enchanted with my 770. (After surfing in a Treo 650, you really appreciate the size and quality of the screen).

But I am a bit disappointed because my 770 becomes sluggish after 15 minutes approx. browsing the web. The screen does not respond properly and charging the windows is very slow. I delete the cache, and get some improvements but at the end I have to reset the device.
Are you having the same problem?
Thank you for your help

seindal

11-22-2005, 06:05 PM

The browser sometimes leave processes behind which gobble up memory.

If you install an xterm you can run a "ps" and see them. The browser is called "browser" :-)

Run a "killall browser" from the xterm and your tablet will become responsive again.

JPB

11-23-2005, 06:59 AM

I have the same problem. Sometimes the browser even freezes.
It is clear why Nokia is not rolling out this device yet in big numbers.

gristle

11-23-2005, 08:50 AM

Lets hope it is fixable in software!! Dont want to have to return my 770 for a fix.

Titus

11-23-2005, 01:17 PM

I have the same problem. Sometimes the browser even freezes.

Me too! Not so often though. Closed browser, stll sluggish, opened xterm, ps showing no browser processes, TOP showed command 'events/0' which took most of the cpu time (70-99%). Has anyone else checked processes in their device when it starts to get sluggish?

dolcitalia

11-23-2005, 02:50 PM

:mad: me too, i have the same problem...

zupidupi

11-24-2005, 02:57 PM

Well, one application that most definitely clogs up the tablet is the News Reader. l´ve noticed that the reader can spawn one new entry in the ps-list every time you refresh the feeds. Drove me crazy until l installed the X terminal!

Zup

cuckoo

11-24-2005, 03:24 PM

I've only had my 770 for like a day, but so far, i'm not too impressed. It's not that fast, it's actually quite sluggish.

All of the apps have crashed on me more than once.

Configuring my ISP's IMAP system doens't work at all, it sometimes shows messages, but most of the time just an empty mailbox.

And it loses my wifi connection every 2 minutes (apple airport extreme)

when opening a lot of webpages (with only the browser open) it warns me for low memory

and i've already check, but got the latest os....

if i could, i'd give it back and ask for my cash....

Simon

11-24-2005, 03:59 PM

if i could, i'd give it back and ask for my cash....
Sell it on eBay. Given that there are a lot of people who want them and Nokia isn't shipping any you might even get more money than you paid for it :)

cuckoo

11-24-2005, 04:18 PM

Thank for the hint...

But before i quit all together, i'll try some more, but it's a machine hard to like

TripleNickle

11-24-2005, 09:07 PM

Remote User

11-24-2005, 10:04 PM

I am sure glad I cancelled my order. The 770 sounds like it still needs some work!
I just spent a couple of minutes reviewing your posts - all 79 of them. You haven't really contributed anything to ITT as far as useful information goes. Your comments amount to little more than a diary of an "Apple Whore", as you call yourself, somehone who somehow enjoys whining about the efforts of Nokia, Maemo and the rest of us in building a 770 community here, yet is too lazy to whine about it by writing more than 25 words at a time.

I don't like negativity and I don't like whiners. Many people have posted here at ITT and have given the ITT readership a lot of valuable help. I would like to suggest to you that since you don't have a 770 and have no intention of getting one any time soon that you just stop posting any more of the same old useless, irrelevant messages that you've posted here by the score. Really, when you get a 770 and you have something of value to share, then share it. Until then, do the rest of us all a big favor and STFU (stop the flavorless utterances).

TripleNickle

11-24-2005, 10:13 PM

I just spent a couple of minutes reviewing your posts - all 79 of them. You haven't really contributed anything to ITT as far as useful information goes. Your comments amount to little more than a diary of an "Apple Whore", as you call yourself, somehone who somehow enjoys whining about the efforts of Nokia, Maemo and the rest of us in building a 770 community here, yet is too lazy to whine about it by writing more than 25 words at a time.

I don't like negativity and I don't like whiners. Many people have posted here at ITT and have given the ITT readership a lot of valuable help. I would like to suggest to you that since you don't have a 770 and have no intention of getting one any time soon that you just stop posting any more of the same old useless, irrelevant messages that you've posted here by the score. Really, when you get a 770 and you have something of value to share, then share it. Until then, do the rest of us all a big favor and STFU (stop the flavorless utterances).

Thank you for your expert analysis... ;)

jaycee

11-25-2005, 03:19 AM

Thank you for your expert analysis... ;)

I've got to say that, looking at both your posts and RemoteUsers, I agree with him. He's here to explore the potential of a new product which he seems to be well placed to talk about (not an "authority" argument, merely looking at publically available facts), whereas you seem to have moved from "I want one" to "I can't be arsed to wait" through "I've cancelled my order" and now ending up with "I haven't got one, but don't they suck?".

Look at the site's name. When you got something to *add* to a discussion about the N770, do let me know. 'Til then, you're on my ignore list. For others with similar feelings, it's located on your "User CP" page, under the "Misc" options.

HAND,
jc

PS The impossibility of the request in the last paragraph is not unintentional

Titus

11-25-2005, 03:19 AM

All of the apps have crashed on me more than once.

Really, all of them? Even chess? Browser sometimes crashes, sometimes news reader. It isn't the most stable os I have seen(Linux inside, what can you expect ;) ), but all of the apps crashing, there must be something wrong with your 770.

when opening a lot of webpages (with only the browser open) it warns me for low memory

Close extra browser windows, when you don't need them. In my experience three concurrent browser windows is maximum memory can handle.

if i could, i'd give it back and ask for my cash....

Wasn't there a disclaimer on Nokia's 770 buy page something like "If you are not satisfied with your Nokia 770, 30-day cashback etc." Ask Nokia, maybe you can.

Titus

11-25-2005, 03:56 AM

cuckoo

11-25-2005, 04:29 AM

Disconnecting WLAN seems to release 'events/0' command from hogging all the cpu resources. There are more WLAN related serious problems than anything else in 770 (disconnects, wpa, sluggishness etc.), but after browsing bugzilla there might be hope soon!
Source:
https://maemo.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=192
Last line dated 2005-11-21 :
"There will be a new release available within few days. It has a working WiFi."

I hope it fixes these issues and that they release it soon to us end-users also!

Let's hope so. Today somehow the device has a better day....

I do believe it has to have a fair chance in performing, i consider the current OS as a beta (for what it's worth). I hope some of my gripes are addressed in the q1 2006 OS. We'll see.

There are a few things which isappoint me, but given time i hope somebody will write a little app or nokia will update the os..

For instance, i'd love if the device itself would more easaly switch connections. That the user can define the priority (first try WLAN then GSM) without me telling it to switch.

And what i really miss is, i haven't figured out how i can browse the 770 from my laptop with bluetooth, it would be great if i could transfer files from laptop to 770 and vise versa...

Sorry about my sour post yesterday, was having quite an off-day, i'll stick to it a while longer...

Smiley Dan

11-25-2005, 08:29 AM

Yeah, news reader is the big culprit for me. I use it a lot (in fact I didn't "get" RSS until I started using it on the 770) and often spawns more processes which aren't terminated. "kill" is your friend (what's the usage for killall btw, can't get it to work, e.g. "killall rss" doesn't find any processes to kill?).

Smiley Dan

11-25-2005, 08:37 AM

Let's hope so. Today somehow the device has a better day....Bizarrely my device "seemed" to get better as the days went by, perhaps some kinda bell curve with the components... or sun spots ;)

I don't expect the 770 to be perfect, or even near it. It's the same with my SX1 phone. I brought that when it first came out a couple of years ago (had to get it shipped from Germany) and there was the odd problem, but as an early adopter tech companies know such users can fix their own problems.

TripleNickle's comments remind me a little of my experience of PC games forums. I moderate one large one for a football manager game and also browse the Civ4 ones regularly, in all cases issues with products become almost self fulfilling prophecies - people without problems mystically start experiencing things others post about that they hadn't seen before, people start saying the game is rubbish basing their opinion on others' posts, aspects of the game even start being labelled "bugs" when they are nothing of the sort and are informed more of the user's ignorance than anything else.

Of course, the actual consumers have a right to support and the like, as they should receive the product they paid for. This will come with patches etc. But the reality is that as products become more complex they become harder to test and the economics involved suggest releasing the product can be advantageous as you instantly have a large user base which can file reports and the product can be improved.

Some might take offence at this, but they are not early adopters because they don't understand the "responsibility" (if you will) that comes with such a title.

Karel Jansens

11-25-2005, 11:25 AM

Remote User

11-25-2005, 11:45 AM

I my opinion, "early adopter" is marketingspeak for "suckers who will give good money for anything. as long as they're first". I'm not prepared to pay someone to test their beta-quality computer hardware. That's Microsoft's way of doing "business". So Nokia, call me when you've got your 770 act together...
Yeah, Apple "suckered me" in 1977 when they sold me an Apple ][ that only had 4 Kilobytes of RAM in it for the equivalent of about $10,000 of today's US$. I had to pay the equivalent of about $2,000 and throw out that memory and replace it with 16 K. Then I had to pay the equivalent of about $1,000 to buy a 'floating point' card so that it could deal with decimals and numbers outside the range of -32768 and +32768. Christ, I had to put 7 power supplies in that thing over the next few years, at $250 each! And Apple didn't even make a 100K floppy drive available for it for
almost a year! And it came with NO APPLICATION SOFTWARE. It couldn't even do color Bitmaps - I had to use my television to see its output!

Dude, I did EXACTLY what you suggest; I told them to call me when they had their act together. Earlier this year they finally did - after 28 years - and told me to buy an IPOD. I already had an RCA MP3 player that takes SD flash in any size, though, so I didn't. Boy, did they lose out by "Suckering ME"!

Smiley Dan

11-25-2005, 11:57 AM

Maybe I'm a sucker, maybe I'm not. My opinion is that these approaches to product releases are inevitable while engineering and business constraints do not keep up with the growing complexity of the products. I don't personally mind skirting around some issues; one of the reasons I got this tablet was because of the platform and the fact that I'd be able to do something about it, which I have.

This is a bit different to bugs in another tablet release by a company Karel mentioned which you couldn't do a great deal about ;)

Remote User

11-25-2005, 12:44 PM

One of the reasons I got this tablet was because of the platform and the fact that I'd be able to do something about it, which I have.
I bought a couple dozen Hitachi VisionPlates this year at about $1,800 each. They can be ordered with Minix (er, make that Midori Linux), a mobile Linux put out by a group which included Linus himself when he used to work for Paul Allen and which can be used as wireless touchscreen X terminals. They only have a 802.11b wireless connection and they do work pretty well, but it is very difficult to upgrade the firmware in them. Compared to the VisionPlate the 770 represents a revolution in price, in speed of connectivity and in ease of connectivity. By the weigh, the VisionPlate weighs almost 3 pounds whereas the 770 weighs half a pound. So, you are absolutely correct when you stress the importance of being able to easily upgrade the 770's firmware and apps. The 770 is a HUGE step forward in many, many ways, not the least of which is its upgradeability. As people figure out how to access and make use of devices as network resources instead of as peripherals they will appreciate the 770 more and more. A laser printer is much more valuable on a network than when it is attached to a PC - it's the same with any device. When the network is wireless then it's an even bigger breakthrough. The tipping point though, that makes the 770 such an innovation is that it fully implements Richard Stallman's vision that anyone who needs to depend on a software system is entitled to be able to understand it and fix it without having to get any licenses to do so and without having to further pay for the right to do so.

You're now free to innovate. It wasn't always like this. A lot of people spent a lot of time and fought a lot of battles to make possible everything that the 770 represents. It didn't just 'happen'.

gultig

11-25-2005, 03:43 PM

We could all go through what each of our respective opinions are on what early adopter or some other nebulous terminology means, or how polished a finished product should be. These are the differences between those who buy a product on the possibility of what it might become vs those who buy based on what a product is right now.

I have made my decision. I see the 770 as a work of art. The melding of all the things I might want right now in a handsome package. Think about it. Sure we can disagree on the choice of storage medium, the size of processor, the amount of ram - but here is the beauty of that argument: The fact that a large amount of people that I have read on this site are so invested in what this product is or isn't shows me that Nokia has come pretty damn close to a bullseye for a first generation product.

It seems that many others have made their decision also. Figure out what your purpose is and buy accordingly. There is no shame in waiting for the second generation.

Hopefully we (as in the actual users / outside devs) will have beta tested all of the niggles out of the system for you. :D

Titus

11-25-2005, 04:04 PM

I my opinion, "early adopter" is marketingspeak for "suckers who will give good money for anything. as long as they're first".

I don't mind doing that for a softdrink, but I'm not prepared to pay someone to test their beta-quality computer hardware. That's Microsoft's way of doing "business".

So Nokia, call me when you've got your 770 act together...

Oh, so young and so arrogant. Don't want to sound too arrogant myself, but for 350 dollars/euros this thing is really a bargain. Don't know what problems Karel originally had (he never mentions them particularly), and now when new update is getting for example "My official YAY!!!!'s" from Cuckoo ( http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=503&goto=newpost ) , who had severe problems, isn't this thread getting old? Or did I fall into the ITT forum's first troll hole?

Karel Jansens

11-25-2005, 05:30 PM

I bought a couple dozen Hitachi VisionPlates this year at about $1,800 each. They can be ordered with Minix (a mobile Linux put out by a group Linus himself when he used to work for Paul Allen) and can be used as wireless touchscreen X terminals.

Minix was a UNIX lookalike, developed by dr Tanenbaum and aimed at educational use. Linus Torvalds had nothing to do with its development, other than that he mentioned Minix as his inspirational source in the (now famous) 1992 email in which he announced his Linux OS. Are you sure you didn't mean Midori Linux, Transmeta's embedded Linux distro, on which Linus is rumoured to have contributed significantly?

zarco

11-25-2005, 06:39 PM

Remote User

11-25-2005, 08:56 PM

Minix was a UNIX lookalike, developed by dr Tanenbaum and aimed at educational use. Linus Torvalds had nothing to do with its development, other than that he mentioned Minix as his inspirational source in the (now famous) 1992 email in which he announced his Linux OS. Are you sure you didn't mean Midori Linux, Transmeta's embedded Linux distro, on which Linus is rumoured to have contributed significantly?
Yep, I misspoke. I'm replaying Final Fantasy X today, while listening to Carole King's Living Room sets, putting down the Winter carpet in my home theater and browsing the net, so, naturally, I carelessly stepped on my history there. Midori is what I meant, as you deduced. Thanks for catching that. I'll go back and correct it.

Karel Jansens

11-26-2005, 04:41 AM

Yep, I misspoke. I'm replaying Final Fantasy X today, while listening to Carole King's Living Room sets, putting down the Winter carpet in my home theater and browsing the net, so, naturally, I carelessly stepped on my history there. Midori is what I meant, as you deduced. Thanks for catching that. I'll go back and correct it.

Hey, I should thank you. How often do I get the opportunity to correct someone more knowledgeable than me? :D

One final question about those VisionPlates: did they come with RitePen HWR? And if so, how does it perform in Linux? (I once wanted to buy one of those just for the HWR, but eBay only had WinCE versions at the time, so naturally...)

Remote User

11-26-2005, 12:06 PM

Those VisionPlates: did they come with RitePen HWR? And if so, how does it perform in Linux?
Hitachi had contracted for handwriting recognition with at least 3 different companies that I'm aware of. We don't do anything with HWR at ViewTouch but we did try Xscribble just to see what it looked like; it installed and worked without any difficulty. I prefer to think of it as Hand Printing Recognition. As far as how it works in real life I can't say but it's a project that any of us can join and contribute to. Perhaps the 770 will add impetus to it. It's here...
http://www.handhelds.org/projects/xscribble.html
I have no doubt that if the need exists for a quality input method then Xscribble is a good choice to begin and to build on.

I've been fascinated with touchscreens for a long time but I also think that voice commands and voice recognition have to be used to further enrich our user input experiences. The way I'd do it is to have the remote X link established, use the 770 as a network-attached microphone, do the command and recognition processing with a specialized voice processing application cluster somewhere on the net, and just send an acknowledgment of the processed result back to the remote 770's speaker & display. The TI chips in the 770 are designed to do stuff like this, of course. We're not yet thinking of the 770 as a device for voice but that will certainly change. The 770 already exceeds most of what Captain Kirk was doing on the Enterprise with his communicator.

Reggie; is there a way to push a conversation like this to the proper forum when it gets off topic?

Karel Jansens

11-26-2005, 01:27 PM

Hitachi had contracted for handwriting recognition with at least 3 different companies that I'm aware of. We don't do anything with HWR at ViewTouch but we did try Xscribble just to see what it looked like; it installed and worked without any difficulty. I prefer to think of it as Hand Printing Recognition. As far as how it works in real life I can't say but it's a project that any of us can join and contribute to. Perhaps the 770 will add impetus to it. It's here...
http://www.handhelds.org/projects/xscribble.html
I have no doubt that if the need exists for a quality input method then Xscribble is a good choice to begin and to build on.

I've been fascinated with touchscreens for a long time but I also think that voice commands and voice recognition have to be used to further enrich our user input experiences. The way I'd do it is to have the remote X link established, use the 770 as a network-attached microphone, do the command and recognition processing with a specialized voice processing application cluster somewhere on the net, and just send an acknowledgment of the processed result back to the remote 770's speaker & display. The TI chips in the 770 are designed to do stuff like this, of course. We're not yet thinking of the 770 as a device for voice but that will certainly change. The 770 already exceeds most of what Captain Kirk was doing on the Enterprise with his communicator.

Reggie; is there a way to push a conversation like this to the proper forum when it gets off topic?

I am a huge sucker for HWR, ever since I bought my first Newton on eBay. When I moved on, I discovered that the cursive HWR engine on the Newton was available for the pc (PhatWare's PenOffice) but for Windows only. It works so well that I hardly ever use a keyboard on my Fujitsu Stylistic.

Nevertheless, for me Linux is a much more capable OS than whatever version of Windows, but as long as I cannot get decent HWR for Linux Windows has to stay.

Xscribble is a decent character recognizer, but like all Graffiti lookalikes it is not really fit for more than the occasional text entry. There is also Xstroke, a similar project (http://www.xstroke.org/) but on its mailing list someone (Arne Limburg) recently disclosed his intention to convert it to a full-blown HWR engine.

I tried voice recognition several years ago on IBM's OS/2 Warp 4 and although it worked suprisingly well, it turned out to be not as user friendly as it seemed: only in a nearly completely silent environment would it work as promised.