Topic of the Day: Should Nokia Drop Meego and roll with Android?

[wmarone]

not really have you ever heard of a little thing called ophone

Oh, the China Mobile fork of Android? One of two things will happen: It'll either diverge so much from Android it is no longer compatible, or it will change so little to stick with the Android trunk that it's effectively still under Google control.

No handset developer truly wants to create their own OS, as it's outside their scope. They also don't want to be dependent on an OS vendor who will probably compete with them, or seeks to push their brand via the OS.

MeeGo is very much neutral territory. Android is not, or it is not Android.

[gerbick]

I'm still not sold on MeeGo being "neutral" as of yet.

But GM, BMW (http://bit.ly/c8IXUi) and quite a few others think so. So I guess there's more research for me to do.

[ossipena]

I'm still not sold on MeeGo being "neutral" as of yet.

But GM, BMW (http://bit.ly/c8IXUi) and quite a few others think so. So I guess there's more research for me to do.

I bet it isn't about neutrality. Big corporations look things in different perspective than *nix fanbois.

Meego probably just suits best to their use cases.

[naabi]

I think the Android is the last option that Nokia is considering. If they fail totally in the smart phone category, who knows? But it's not gonna happen soon.

They have Navteq, they do not want to use Google's maps and navigation. They invested loads on money when purchasing Navteq and have spent more money to developer services suitable for mobile phone use. They have their own app store (sigh...), they do not want to send that money to Android Market. They are trying to pull together a content provider portfolio, like Apple has done.

My guess is that Samsung will try to push their Bada as much as possible and try to get rid of MS and/or Android. Samsung also got stuck with Symbian, but they took a different route. There's no point in using three different platforms, and the future of Samsung seems to be similar to Nokia's - independent.

Bottom line, Android is an unrealistic option to Nokia. Big corporates do not want to use Android. It will used by small players and corporates that are seriously struggling. Too much money is going to other pockets when using Android.

[attila77]

My guess is that Samsung will try to push their Bada as much as possible and try to get rid of MS and/or Android. Samsung also got stuck with Symbian, but they took a different route. There's no point in using three different platforms, and the future of Samsung seems to be similar to Nokia's - independent.

There is no single platform that can span top-to-bottom hardware and all form factors (some of which stem from software requirements, though). That's a fact. Thus, *some* platform fragmentation is inevitable. We saw already one metaplatform that tried to address this - Java, and it failed miserably, as it was plagued by fragmentation to the level of the original problem it was trying to solve. Now, with Qt, Nokia has the chance to do it right without confining itself to a particular hardware/OS niche.

[naabi]

There is no single platform that can span top-to-bottom hardware and all form factors (some of which stem from software requirements, though). That's a fact. Thus, *some* platform fragmentation is inevitable.

Bada as a platform is suitable for high-end and low-end phones. Naturally it's two different operating systems.

[attila77]

Bada is interesting in terms it is doing just the reverse MeeGo is doing, while MeeGo is trying to make a unified base that can be fitted with a Qt API (which is in turn universal across other OSes), Samsung is fitting OS-es (or, rather, kernels) INTO their API. Due to this, Nokia's approach has a bit more resource overhead, but on the other hand is easier to maintain and is more universal - as it can easily spread to new OSes (we already have - even if unofficial - Qt for webOS and Android, and a sterling but doomed iOS effort). Plus, as a bonus, it can be retrofitted with very little effort to tens, in not hundreds of millions of existing handsets. As for Bada, the 'low-end' part of the platform has not been released yet, so I can't comment just how well their unified approach works (contrary to Nokia, who have demonstrated Qt working nicely on midrange hardware of 2008).

EDIT: When I say 'not released yet' I mean the new range of low-end spectrum, not the existing, pre-Bada-is-now-cool phones. Also note that Bada is not really aiming for top-tier - the Galaxy stuff is Android, and even on the Bada pages, Bada is positioned more like the OS Samsung wants featurephone users to migrate to - very much the position of Symbian in the Nokia ecosystem. The problem with this is that I don't see the bridge between Android and Bada (the role of Qt in Symbian-MeeGo), and the popularity of Android makes it difficult for Sammy to push Bada into that segment without hurting itself at least on the short term.

[naabi]

Also note that Bada is not really aiming for top-tier - the Galaxy stuff is Android, and even on the Bada pages, Bada is positioned more like the OS Samsung wants featurephone users to migrate to - very much the position of Symbian in the Nokia ecosystem. The problem with this is that I don't see the bridge between Android and Bada (the role of Qt in Symbian-MeeGo), and the popularity of Android makes it difficult for Sammy to push Bada into that segment without hurting itself at least on the short term.

It's true that Bada has been mostly mentioned with low-end phones and cheaper smart phones. I still don't see why they couldn't push Bada to high-end also after they've got their stuff together. I'm pretty sure they would like to. It's true that e.g. Android users that have invested money in the software will have hard time moving to Bada.

Currently the profits from high-end phones are ridiculous, it's not going to be like this forever. Content and services will become more important, and at this point hanging with Google is not that appealing anymore.

[wmarone]

I'm still not sold on MeeGo being "neutral" as of yet.
If MeeGo is not neutral then arguably the Linux kernel is not neutral. Currently there are only two heavy investors in it, but they can't unilaterally decide where things go (and certainly, can't bar other companies or individuals from joining.)

But GM, BMW (http://bit.ly/c8IXUi) and quite a few others think so. So I guess there's more research for me to do.
You bet. I'm sure they're raring to strike up their own deals for in-car GPS and other services, possibly selling the slots -to- Google.

I bet it isn't about neutrality. Big corporations look things in different perspective than *nix fanbois.
Neutrality is a big thing when it comes to your use case. If it's all about creating a platform for you to sell services, then a platform like Android gives Google a leg up on that, in addition to riding your brand.

MeeGo, being controlled by the Linux Foundation, is owned by an entity with a vested interest only in your participation.

[ysss]

So if Nokia takes a sip from the MeeGo fountain, tailors it to one of their device (infuse it with proprietary hw drivers, proprietary UI and a set of proprietary base apps); how would one revert it back to 'open'?

Would it be a simple package removal/substitution?

[wmarone]

So if Nokia takes a sip from the MeeGo fountain, tailors it to one of their device (infuse it with proprietary hw drivers, proprietary UI and a set of proprietary base apps); how would one revert it back to 'open'?

Would it be a simple package removal/substitution?

Well if Nokia provides the necessary drivers like they do now for the MeeGo preview release (they can be pulled in at image build time) then it's a matter of grabbing whatever community release there is.

Anything that belongs to Nokia is Nokia's, and not part of MeeGo. It'd be more along the lines of wiping your PC clean of the vendor provided install and loading a fresh install of say, Ubuntu.

[Stskeeps]

So if Nokia takes a sip from the MeeGo fountain, tailors it to one of their device (infuse it with proprietary hw drivers, proprietary UI and a set of proprietary base apps); how would one revert it back to 'open'?

Would it be a simple package removal/substitution?

My hopes are they'd provide whatever is needed for hardware adaptation to MeeGo Core (+ closed repo like we have in N900 hw adaptation) and then that together with the differentiation (closed apps+UI theming etc) makes out the final product..

In my wet dreams they'd provide a .ks on the emmc on how to remix the OS image ;)

[ysss]

Are those sufficiently reasonable assumptions though?
That Nokia will appease the community with such gesture?

Or is there a less altruistic motivation that would drive them to do such thing, improving our chance of getting such windfall?

[wmarone]

Are those sufficiently reasonable assumptions though? That Nokia will appease the community with such gesture?
Well, they are providing the necessary bits -now- to get the graphics going, with luck the next drop will include wifi and cellular support. If they want the N900 to be a reference platform for an ARM MeeGo handset, they need to. It does them no good -not to-.

Or is there a less altruistic motivation that would drive them to do such thing, improving our chance of getting such windfall?
Handset sales? Getting more people working on the core such that they don't have to?

[Maettu]

Competition is good .. it makes things happen! (http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2010/05/competition-is-good-it-makes-things.html)

did some of you read this?

nothing happens without competition. if everyone is using google (sony ericsson, htc, samsung....) there is no more competition...except apple and microsoft...but... :-)

[ysss]

Well, they are providing the necessary bits -now- to get the graphics going, with luck the next drop will include wifi and cellular support. If they want the N900 to be a reference platform for an ARM MeeGo handset, they need to. It does them no good -not to-.

Well, the N900 will most likely already be discontinued when the first MeeGo phone is released. My question was for non 'developer' MeeGo handsets in the future and it's sustained 'openness'.

Handset sales?

I can't see it affecting sales numbers significantly. Mainstream users has other things higher in their priority.

Getting more people working on the core such that they don't have to?

This is a reasonable assumption from OSS community view.. but have we seen that happening in the NIT iterations before this? How about all those close bits in N900 that's nagging its performance?

[wmarone]

My question was for non 'developer' MeeGo handsets in the future and it's sustained 'openness'.
The only thing that makes the N900 a "developer" phone is, well, nothing. It's a not-quite-consumer-ready phone that appeals to *nix geeks. If Nokia makes the "secure mode" thing a simple switch you can turn off, then there's no issue.

I can't see it affecting sales numbers significantly. Mainstream users has other things higher in their priority.
It should be completely transparent to the mainstream user. For Nokia, however, MeeGo is a decrease in developmental expenses that directly reduces costs, at the expense of someone's time to keep the device drivers current with whatever kernel/X release is in MeeGo at the time, and that's not much.

This is a reasonable assumption from OSS community view.. but have we seen that happening in the NIT iterations before this?
I don't think so, but considering that the entire OS is a downstream assembly from numerous independent projects MeeGo is in a far better position than Maemo ever was.

I have seen more than a few people working on Hildon Desktop and Modest in the past couple months, but the lack of effort in this area can be directly attributed to Nokia's weird behavior towards the community.

How about all those close bits in N900 that's nagging its performance?
We can't do anything about closed bits. Ironically, the only closed bit I can think of that -directly- impacts performance is microB. Everything else is poorly tuned open programs (iirc) doing things at inopportune times.

[ossipena]

Neutrality is a big thing when it comes to your use case. If it's all about creating a platform for you to sell services, then a platform like Android gives Google a leg up on that, in addition to riding your brand.

any companion can blew things up badly. neutral can become something else in a second if wrong persons paths cross between 2 companies (case Porsche & Volkswagen for example)

but I am betting that MeeGo gives the most and car manufacturers can switch from arm to intel if needed and everything should stay at least almost intact in software front.

[superg05]

Competition is good .. it makes things happen! (http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2010/05/competition-is-good-it-makes-things.html)

did some of you read this?

nothing happens without competition. if everyone is using google (sony ericsson, htc, samsung....) there is no more competition...except apple and microsoft...but... :-)

if there had not been a 1ghz nexus one and such there would be no 1ghz iphone4g because apple would have only made the phone slightly better than the previous model so competition is good for everyone and all those companies you listed are in competition with each other adding there own differentiations to android but since android 2.1 its easier to upgrade custom builds to newer version build so fragmentation issues are now null

[danramos]

not really have you ever heard of a little thing called ophone

Did you say ODROID (http://www.hardkernel.com/products.php)?

[wmarone]

Did you say ODROID (http://www.hardkernel.com/products.php)?

Needs more buttons. More buttons.

Actually that wouldn't be a bad platform for MeeGo development, provided they supplied X drivers for the SGX.

[danramos]

Needs more buttons. More buttons.

Actually that wouldn't be a bad platform for MeeGo development, provided they supplied X drivers for the SGX.

Wait...did you just say "MeeGo gaming platform?" I dunno.. almost sounded like you said "MeeGo gaming platform."

[ysss]

The only thing that makes the N900 a "developer" phone is, well, nothing. It's a not-quite-consumer-ready phone that appeals to *nix geeks. If Nokia makes the "secure mode" thing a simple switch you can turn off, then there's no issue.

I meant the N900 is now the designated (developer) reference platform for MeeGo which probably won't be on sale anymore when MeeGo 1.0 devices get official release. I think that's what makes the N900 a 'developer' phone in my previous remark.

Will the switch also make it simple to replace the proprietary components? (Customization layer, etc)

It should be completely transparent to the mainstream user. For Nokia, however, MeeGo is a decrease in developmental expenses that directly reduces costs, at the expense of someone's time to keep the device drivers current with whatever kernel/X release is in MeeGo at the time, and that's not much.

Hmm not sure how this relate to 'increasing sales'. If you meant increasing margin/bottomline, then I'd say that the saving in software developing cost is miniscule compared to other costs involved here (hardware design & manufacturing, marketing costs). Especially compared to their already was ongoing maemo efforts.

I don't think so, but considering that the entire OS is a downstream assembly from numerous independent projects MeeGo is in a far better position than Maemo ever was.

I have seen more than a few people working on Hildon Desktop and Modest in the past couple months, but the lack of effort in this area can be directly attributed to Nokia's weird behavior towards the community..

It's nice to know that, but I've yet to see any significant changes in policy/stance by Nokia to go against their core 'planned obsolescence' strategy. In this case, it's safe to say that their track record and lack of motivation to do otherwise trumps a 'technical possibility'.

We can't do anything about closed bits. Ironically, the only closed bit I can think of that -directly- impacts performance is microB. Everything else is poorly tuned open programs (iirc) doing things at inopportune times.

Ok, I meant 'performance' in a more general sense. The way it affects user' perception and experience toward the N900 and how it in turns affects the N900 market performance...

[boosted_4cyl]

no android

[wmarone]

I meant the N900 is now the designated (developer) reference platform for MeeGo which probably won't be on sale anymore when MeeGo 1.0 devices get official release. I think that's what makes the N900 a 'developer' phone in my previous remark.

Will the switch also make it simple to replace the proprietary components? (Customization layer, etc)
Well, my assumption is the switch deactivates the DRM features, at which point you can stick with Nokia's stuff or move to a community build, where the proprietary stuff should be replaced.

Hmm not sure how this relate to 'increasing sales'. If you meant increasing margin/bottomline, then I'd say that the saving in software developing cost is miniscule compared to other costs involved here (hardware design & manufacturing, marketing costs). Especially compared to their already was ongoing maemo efforts.
It's all about the bottom line. By offloading much of the OS development that is rather out of scope for Nokia, they can hopefully work on making the user experience better, which they desperately need.

It's nice to know that, but I've yet to see any significant changes in policy/stance by Nokia to go against their core 'planned obsolescence' strategy.
Planned obsolescence is basically standard fare for the industry these days, so Nokia is not special here. That said, if they step up and provide proper SGX libraries whenever X gets updated and help keep the kernel current, that's more than most other vendors care to ever do.

All we can do is wait and see, however.

[smoku]

Competition is good .. it makes things happen! (http://jaaksi.blogspot.com/2010/05/competition-is-good-it-makes-things.html)

Yeah. Right.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartel

[ossipena]

Yeah. Right.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartel

did you understand the wiki article you posted?

besides everyone using android would mean far greater risk of cartel....

[smoku]

Gosh.
Do I really have to put it in layman's terms?

Not everything looking like free market and competition is one.
Simply introducing new players to the market does not necessary leads to improvements. There is no free meal. In this case you are for sure introducing ie. fragmentation. And the possible advantages might be simply gamed off by big players of the market.

Now, did you understand the wiki article I posted? ;)

[attila77]

I meant the N900 is now the designated (developer) reference platform for MeeGo which probably won't be on sale anymore when MeeGo 1.0 devices get official release.

Just nitpicking, but due to the silly naming convention, there will actually not be a single MeeGo 1.0 device ever released.

[wmarone]

Now, did you understand the wiki article I posted? ;)

If you want to look at something that at least has the appearance of being a cartel, look at US cellphone providers and how closely matched all of their service plans are.

Or are you suggesting that Google will collude with the Linux Foundation to fix prices... on what, exactly?

[cmstewart86]

If Maemo is anything to go by then nokia should adopt android for future mobile phones. There is no reason to suggest that Meego will come close to denting the penetration of apple and google. the main thing to think of is what a mobile phone is actually used for. Today it is getting info fast and easily and support for most common methods of communication ie sms mms facebook email etc. Maemo has failed on most of those points and Meego will fail because of the small audience and therefore poor app support. The n900 would/will be twice as functional in day to day use with android than with Maemo. Google is the lesser of the two evils (with the other being apple of course)

[attila77]

Don't base any assumptions on Maemo, MeeGo is a completely different ballgame. It shares the application base with Symbian (through Qt), and it also (for the first time) is at the center of Nokia's software strategy. I don't know how successful it will be, but I know hardly anything about Maemo applies to it.

[Sopwith]

As Niklas Savander said two days ago, "Android is run by Google, and that just means that potentially it's much more in their hands. We're not prepared to hand over our destiny to a third-party on that one."

Makes perfect sense to me.

IMO, Android will be the platform to beat, not join.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/08/06/nokias-vp-talks-n8-meego-milestone-product-tablets-android/

[happymonkey]

An Android only phone is as worthwhile to me as a Win 7 phone. That is, I don't want either and have no intention of ever purchasing one, other than the G1 I bought as an early Android adopter. So should Nokia drop Meego and run with Android. First I have a resounding, "No". Secondly, do I care if they do, not really. If they do this then I just take my time, and $ elsewhere, no harm, no foul. I don't care about Nokia's prolonged existence as it isn't in my best interest to. For the fact alone that they have made a few pseudo open sourced software/hardware "experiments" they are in my favor. I don't swear my allegiance to them or any other large corp.. For instance the fact that Microsoft has donated to open source projects doesn't make me a supporter of Microsoft.

Perhaps it is in Nokia's best interest to use Android but I'm not really interested in their interests. From a personal economic view I understand why payed developers might be interested in speculating on this question. How to make bread as an open source *. I say good luck to all those attempting such employment and I hope that it becomes much, much easier in the future, though there is little sign that this will be the case. I end this by saying something trite, it's awfully important to support developers, and if at all possible get rid of big corporations. Peace!

[railroadmaster]

If Maemo is anything to go by then nokia should adopt android for future mobile phones. There is no reason to suggest that Meego will come close to denting the penetration of apple and google. the main thing to think of is what a mobile phone is actually used for. Today it is getting info fast and easily and support for most common methods of communication ie sms mms facebook email etc. Maemo has failed on most of those points and Meego will fail because of the small audience and therefore poor app support. The n900 would/will be twice as functional in day to day use with android than with Maemo. Google is the lesser of the two evils (with the other being apple of course)
Exactly most people will view MeeGo as just another mobile platform that has no point of existing. I mean what is the need for MeeGo why do we need yet another Linux based platform most people will think. Hey people said that about Android so we will see how the actual market performance of MeeGo is before we make judgments. I don't want the Mobile market to end up like the desktop market where there is one os that controls the entire market. So competition is good.

[Ronaldo]

my 1st post in months, Nokia should drop symbian and use andriod.

been enjoying my rooted Desire with 2.2 (has 10.1 flash). Love all the apps and customizations you can do with andriod.

ps1 emu works great, just need a real keyboard for buttons :D

[c:drive]

Nokia will drop Meego instead of symbian.

[6sicSIX]

I'm sorry, but from reading this thread it seems that people are saying
"Hey it's another platform, it'll never have a chance because of the other major platforms dominating the market." Wft, are you the head of tesco? All snidey comments aside, how do you expect other platforms to emerge? If everyone acted like this then there would be no meamo, meego or anything!!

I just would like more options, open source options.
And people who don't abandon the platform purely because of the lack of apps/games.

This is how a platform grows!

I'm sorry for the rant.

=)

[lavo]

I hope Nokia just drop Symbian altogether and have one OS for all their phones. Splintered OS options almost killed Apple in the 90s. How annoying is it to get that email from the Ovi Store saying there are all these new apps, and only some work on some phones.

Stick it out with Meego and push QT with either C++ or Python with bindings as the future path for Nokia. This wishy washy direction they have at the moment will get them nowhere!

[attila77]

I hope Nokia just drop Symbian altogether and have one OS for all their phones. Splintered OS options almost killed Apple in the 90s. How annoying is it to get that email from the Ovi Store saying there are all these new apps, and only some work on some phones.

Stick it out with Meego and push QT with either C++ or Python with bindings as the future path for Nokia. This wishy washy direction they have at the moment will get them nowhere!

That's the point of Qt - that you can use a different OS, better fitted to the actual hardware while keeping it a single platform with regard to apps. That's already way better than what Sammy or HTC does, splitting across Android/WinMo/Bada/BREW/etc

[zhandro]

Imagined N900 with Fedora or Ubuntu as OS with additional phone function. That would be great right? :D

I prefer to stick with maemo right now because it provides my everyday needs. Flash 10 and VLC player though is missing in the puzzle.

But for the question of Meego VS Android, I'll prefer Android, because I think Meego will go the same path as maemo.

[smoku]

Imagined N900 with Fedora or Ubuntu as OS with additional phone function. That would be great right? :D

http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=58083

[vivainio]

Why don't you guys buy a HTC/Motorola/Samsung device, and then slap a Nokia sticker on it?

[Dave999]

I don't trust apps without close button top right or top left. go with meego and the close button :)

[shockgiga]

why don't they just drop meego and stick with maemo instead? the transitions on the meego sample desktop i saw on youtube sucks. except for that one video where a thumb of everything viewed is displayed. but maemo can do that too if they develop it some more.

[wmarone]

why don't they just drop meego and stick with maemo instead? the transitions on the meego sample desktop i saw on youtube sucks. except for that one video where a thumb of everything viewed is displayed. but maemo can do that too if they develop it some more.

Because doing OS development is outside Nokia's core competence. They can spend more time making eye candy if a lot of the lower level OS work is shared with others.

Also, no whining about open source projects. It's there to change if you wish.

[vitamina]

Meego is on his celebrity way...in baby diapers for now...but it will be the next revolution os...my opinion
In the next years i believe the market will explode of meego devices and maemo devices also...to late for some of us perfect for others

[railroadmaster]

Meego is on his celebrity way...in baby diapers for now...but it will be the next revolution os...my opinion
In the next years i believe the market will explode of meego devices and maemo devices also...to late for some of us perfect for others
Explain how Nokia putting out yet another Linux based platform is revolutionary?

[c:drive]

Why not all(symbian,webOS,android,iOS,BaDa,Winmo,Maemo,Mee go) in one,Yeahhhhh MultiBoot plus option on start,
Imagine Sunday-Maemo
Monday-symbian/\
Tuesday-android
wednesday-webOS
Thursday-iOS
Friday-winmo7
Saturday-Meego,,,,,,,,,,Yeahhhhhh :rolleyes:

[fatalsaint]

Explain how Nokia putting out yet another Linux based platform is revolutionary?

This would be the first widely accepted one that is actually linux* based. So "yet another" is kind of inaccurate.

*Connotation: Not just the kernel.

[railroadmaster]

This would be the first widely accepted one that is actually linux* based. So "yet another" is kind of inaccurate.

*Connotation: Not just the kernel.
Thats is even less revolutionary at least Google and Palm created there own unique platforms rather than just re-branding one that already exists.

[railroadmaster]

While adopting Android would cause Nokia to not make money from software it would be smarter than trying to push an unproven platform but Nokia would loose what makes there products unique.

[fatalsaint]

Thats is even less revolutionary at least Google and Palm created there own unique platforms rather than just re-branding one that already exists.

Throw Apple in there too.. they did it too.

Unique (different) != Good.....

[fatalsaint]

While adopting Android would cause Nokia to not make money from software it would be smarter than trying to push an unproven platform but Nokia would loose what makes there products unique.

Nokia is already not going to making much (any) on software. MeeGo is open source and free.. Nokia and Intel won't get a dime from MeeGo.. they'll get it from their hardware. What Nokia and Intel by going with MeeGo is to have at least some say in the direction of the OS.. with Android they give that power over to google.

[nightfire]

This seems about as good a place as any for a rant. :)

I have to put up with iPhone users constantly hammering on about how awesome their phone is... and how I should buy one.

I've had my chance to play with them. In my opinion, they are toys. Very nice toys, but toys none-the-less.

The n900 is my 5th or 6th smartphone now. For me, it is the first one that is essentially perfect. Pocket unix workstation with a GSM radio. Brilliant.

Now, not once have I ever picked up an iPhone and complained about it. Not once have I said "oh man... they should add a shell! They should add X11!"

Because I recognize that the device is not for me. It is created for a different market.

And yet, so many people complain about Maemo. About how it should be shinier, or more Android-like, or canned altogether.

Finally, a company builds a product for people like me, and thousands descend to complain about it. These people are why people like me can't have nice things.

The font's too small! There's no café sex finder app! I don't like physical keyboards! It's too complicated!

Damnit. :(

These people have an entire universe of smartphones tailored just for them. Yet they come here to dig at Maemo and the n900...

I'm not talking about legitimate issues like bugs and lack of communication. But drop Maemo/Meego for Android? Why doesn't the author just get a life, buy his favorite Android phone, and move on?

[superg05]

This seems about as good a place as any for a rant. :)

I have to put up with iPhone users constantly hammering on about how awesome their phone is... and how I should buy one.

I've had my chance to play with them. In my opinion, they are toys. Very nice toys, but toys none-the-less.

The n900 is my 5th or 6th smartphone now. For me, it is the first one that is essentially perfect. Pocket unix workstation with a GSM radio. Brilliant.

Now, not once have I ever picked up an iPhone and complained about it. Not once have I said "oh man... they should add a shell! They should add X11!"

Because I recognize that the device is not for me. It is created for a different market.

And yet, so many people complain about Maemo. About how it should be shinier, or more Android-like, or canned altogether.

Finally, a company builds a product for people like me, and thousands descend to complain about it. These people are why people like me can't have nice things.

The font's too small! There's no café sex finder app! I don't like physical keyboards! It's too complicated!

Damnit. :(

These people have an entire universe of smartphones tailored just for them. Yet they come here to dig at Maemo and the n900...

I'm not talking about legitimate issues like bugs and lack of communication. But drop Maemo/Meego for Android? Why doesn't the author just get a life, buy his favorite Android phone, and move on?
its not the fact its for people like you they don't like its product abandonment lack of support and Nokia dodging the issues you even mention the n900 they look at you with blank stares wondering what your talking about as if it never existed at all people who participated in the twitter ceo answers questions thing he was ask by alot of people about the n900 and in his responses on twitter he did not mention it at all its kind of funny reminds me of area 51 early days

[vivainio]

Should google drop Android and roll with MeeGo?

http://news.cnet.com/8301-30684_3-20013546-265.html

[myrjola]

Should google drop Android and roll with MeeGo?

http://news.cnet.com/8301-30684_3-20013546-265.html

Yeah, it will be quite interesting to see how this thing turns out.

Found this interesting article about the Java licensing issues between Sun (now Oracle) and Google:

"Initial Thoughts on Oracle vs Google Patent Lawsuit" Miguel de Icaza's at:

http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2010/Aug-13.html

Suddenly MeeGo seems much more sensible choice than Android for Nokia.

[fatalsaint]

Meh.. lawsuits.

Linux gets sued ('http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCO-Linux_controversies')

Microsoft, Apple, Google, gets sued ('http://www.silicon.com/technology/hardware/2010/07/12/apple-google-microsoft-sued-over-wireless-email-patents-39746085/')

.. everyone gets sued by everyone else just so some lawyers can do their form of flexing their muscles and giving them a little kiss on the biceps.

It's all crap.

[jaimex2]

The question circulating around is: should Nokia drop the MeeGo and throw in Android (http://www.zdnet.com/blog/cell-phones/should-nokia-drop-meego-and-put-google-android-on-their-hardware/4194)?

Depends, Can Nokia pull it off without doing a half bothered job and not dump it half way to chase of a newer project?

If no then definitely go with Android. Nokia put together some sweet hardware but they sure lose all momentum on the software front.

[gill_za]

Ok, so I got myself Samsung Vibrant at a good deal for existing customers (100$). The same day the phone was rooted, recovery flashed, bloatware deleted, CM5 applications ported (music, clock etc ) GPS fixed yada yada yada...

I had G1 before that and it started to die on me so I thought newer, faster Android phone will be what I'll ever need.. And now I can honestly say that despite all my previous complaining about how Maemo is being dropped, n900 abandoned, bugs and missing features on the device etc, Android just does not cut it... It is limited and it is just plain boring. Most of the similar features between Android 2.2 (what was on my G1), 2.1 and Maemo 5 are implemented far more elegantly in Maemo 5. I will use the phone and despite what I said to myself previously will seriously consider n900 successor.

As far as the OP goes, I think even though Nokia said that they dont want to be under Google's thumb, having one or two high end phones (n8 equivalent) running modified Android with Ovi store and Ovi maps ported on it will do more good than bad and bring some profits as well. I think in its current state Nokia has to keep an open "Mind" when talking about this. Having an Android device from a company that is known to make a TOP quality hardware will I think pull customers from HTC, Samsung and Motorola.