Meego - Where's Maemo multitasking? [Archive] - maemo.org

mrebanza

07-10-2010, 07:03 AM

http://meego.com/sites/all/files/users/u3/meego-handset-day1-screenshots.png

This comment was originally submitted here (http://meego.com/community/blogs/valhalla/2010/meego-handset-project-day-1-here) by denywinarto on 5 July, 2010 on the official Meego Site on a post titled "MeeGo Handset Project Day 1 is Here" were they introduced a road map for the Meego Mobile User Interface.

I'm personally a bit dissapointed,
Multitasking is the main reason i chose N900 over other phones..

Maemo 5 is definitely the best handset OS in terms of multitasking,
Even though it's lacking some basic functions you see on other phones..

And i was hoping Meego could fix the disadvantages of Maemo 5,
BUT still retain its advantages..
Because i have faith in Meego Device and i'm definitely gonna buy one someday..
But with this UI?
What makes me and other consumers choose this?
when there's a bunch of Android devices out there with similar UI?

It's still beta i know,
that's why i hope you guys change your mind..
This is supposed to be Maemo/Moblin hybrid...
Not Android/IOS Hybrid :(

This comment reflects my own options so much that I could help but re-posting it here for the community to discus. If Nokia makes a Meego device running a UI like this than they might as well just start making android devices cause this is looking like it is going to suck big time. Another wanna be iphone UI like the OG poster said. WTF?!?! Maemo 5's UI is so kick *** . . . Nokia just needs to finish tweaking it and come out with a FLEET of devices both mobile and tablet. Both high end to low end that are running it Maemo and they would murder the game.

When I use Maemo it feels like I am using the future of TOUCH SCREEN COMPUTING . . . ipad is cool with it's sexy little UI and BIG screen but the multi-tasking capabilities in Maemo are not only sexy the provide much needed possibility for much more productivity.

If Nokia doesn't turn "THEIR" Meego Mobile Devices in the direction of Maemo 6 than I hope somebody picks up the Mer Source and builds some more kick *** mobiles and tablets with it because that UI is too good to let it go to waste.

barzam

07-10-2010, 07:07 AM

I'm positively 100% sure you will be able to change the look of the UI in Meego. Just look at the options in your standard Linux desktop..

slartibartfass

07-10-2010, 07:09 AM

This is the UI from the MeeGo guys, I'm sure, if you buy a Nokia phone with MeeGo, they won't just put this on it. They will use the experience with Maemo to improve the UI.

mrebanza

07-10-2010, 07:10 AM

I'm positively 100% sure you will be able to change the look of the UI in Meego. Just look at the options in your standard Linux desktop..

This is the UI from the MeeGo guys, I'm sure, if you buy a Nokia phone with MeeGo, they won't just put this on it. They will use the experience with Maemo to improve the UI.

I REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY REALLY hope so :D

slartibartfass

07-10-2010, 07:18 AM

I mean, since MeeGo is open source, what are they actually going to sell us? Only the hardware? I don't think so.

F2thaK

07-10-2010, 07:19 AM

we can always hope and dream..

HtheB

07-10-2010, 07:21 AM

I mean, since MeeGo is open source, what are they actually going to sell us? Only the hardware? I don't think so.

If something is Open source, it doesn't mean that it's for free

barzam

07-10-2010, 07:25 AM

mrebanza

07-10-2010, 07:37 AM

Normally it means that you charge for supporting the free (as in beer) software. In Nokia's case creating a good and well-liked OS is a major selling point for their hardware so it's a different situation.

off topic a bit but . . . even tho Meego is open source . . . almost ANY DEVICE running it will have closed drives and apps running on it . . . just like the nvidia drivers in ubuntu linux . . . they are closed . . . you can use them so long as you use them with a nvidia grafics chip but you can't edit / improve them and you can't try to use them on a non nvidia chipset . . .

Same BS with Android . . . the base OS is open but hardware manufacturs still have to make the drivers for the **** to work and the phones ship with a bunch of apps that are closed AKA Gmail Youtube Google Maps . . . ect

That's why Maemo not on a Nokia Device isn't Maemo at all it is Merr.

Mer doesn't even have a basic phone dialing app . . . it is just the OS, the App Manager and a terminal. No phone No Music Player No Web Browser nada.

Although Firefox is Free and I think they is an alternative Music Player . . .

for a company to pick up Mer and start building they would need to develop thier own phone app, drivers for the gsm and sim antenna, wifi functions ect.

mrebanza

07-10-2010, 07:51 AM

Pre-Alpha MeeGo for Tablets Preview looks pretty cool!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lncfZda0iEc&feature=player_embedded

wmarone

07-10-2010, 12:21 PM

off topic a bit but . . . even tho Meego is open source . . . almost ANY DEVICE running it will have closed drives and apps running on it . . . just like the nvidia drivers in ubuntu linux . . . they are closed . . . you can use them so long as you use them with a nvidia grafics chip but you can't edit / improve them and you can't try to use them on a non nvidia chipset . . .
Which is irrelevant except with respect to specific hardware. Until companies like Nvidia or Imagination decide to go open, we can only push closed bits to the periphery.

Same BS with Android . . . the base OS is open but hardware manufacturs still have to make the drivers for the **** to work and the phones ship with a bunch of apps that are closed AKA Gmail Youtube Google Maps . . . ect
Which is unavoidable. And if you don't like the closed apps you can always remove them.

Mer doesn't even have a basic phone dialing app . . . it is just the OS, the App Manager and a terminal. No phone No Music Player No Web Browser nada.
If you hadn't noticed, Stskeeps has retired Mer and moved to working on MeeGo.

for a company to pick up Mer and start building they would need to develop thier own phone app, drivers for the gsm and sim antenna, wifi functions ect.
Or they will grab MeeGo and make it compatible with their hardware. Their closed bits will be kept outside of the core distro, hopefully in such a place that end-users can grab them and build their own images, similar to how things seem to be lining up for the N900.

Also, I'm not quite sure what people's problem with the multitasking is. Unless I missed something, it is functionally identical to Maemo's, only with a different task switcher. If people are mistaking the task switcher for how multitasking behaves then I can only presume they have no knowledge of what they are talking about.

Rauha

07-12-2010, 04:41 AM

Not sure what you mean by multitasking, but if you mean Task Switcher it's still there. You get two choices: Palmesque card system and Maemo 5 -like grid of open apps. AFAIK you can switch between these views by making a pinch gesture.

http://meego.com/sites/all/files/users/u36/overall-UI-model-1.png

Meego UI basics (http://meego.com/developers/ui-design-guidelines/handset/meego-basics)

CormacB

07-12-2010, 12:11 PM

wmarone

07-12-2010, 01:11 PM

They really should stick with the grid approach, and not require you to take some extra action to get to the grid. Android and iOS are copying the Windows NT style of alt-tabbing through a list, despite that being obsolete since Mac 10.3 introduced Expose. It would be a shame if Meego went backwards in a fit of trying to be like the cool kids.

Except that even OS X provides alt-tab support (well, cmd-tab.) Generally, end-users won't have so many applications over that the card method is unwieldy, and in the end the grid view is still available, likely configurable.

Perhaps a good idea would be for a threshold at which point it goes automatically to grid view... sounds like an enhancement request.

ndi

07-12-2010, 02:06 PM

They really should stick with the grid approach, and not require you to take some extra action to get to the grid. Android and iOS are copying the Windows NT style of alt-tabbing through a list, despite that being obsolete since Mac 10.3 introduced Expose.

List-based task switching has been deprecated for ages and is kept for backwards compatibility.

Windows NT (line of OSs) no longer uses alt-tab through lists for quite a while. W7, e.g., has a live grid of thumbnails one can click by mouse/touch.

IIRC, XP and older don't allow mouse selection (in the older versions). But even so, that's 2003, and there are power tools to fix that as well. Last time anyonw was stuck with alt+tab list was W2000.

I have no idea who told them lists are good. Wasn't us :)

buurmas

07-12-2010, 02:13 PM

As I noted in the blog post referenced in the OP, multitasking IS in the MeeGo design spec:

http://meego.com/developers/ui-design-guidelines/handset/meego-basics

Are we past the initial freak-out phase yet? :)

ndi

07-12-2010, 03:17 PM

Are we past the initial freak-out phase yet? :)

We've all seen what freaking out too late does. Thus, in the spirit of OSS, we watch the pre-alpha and pre-freak out.

Once the initial freaking out passes, it moves into freak-testing, where people discuss rules for freaking out, whether or not it should pass, and whether of not it has a freak tracker.

Once that passes, it's promoted to a full-blown freak out, so everyone can freely freak out without worrying about unstable early freaks.

q8phantom

07-23-2010, 05:16 PM

mikecomputing

07-23-2010, 05:32 PM

I think this one shows it better, I'm exciting to see MeeGo! :D

Live view of apps.

http://meego.com/sites/all/files/users/u36/switcher-2.png

Also read this http://meego.com/developers/ui-design-guidelines/handset/theming

It's fully customizable so yes you can do anything with it! Let's wait and see!

Thing is it looks like Andoid and thats BAD imho :-(

As someone here said I hope nokia will continue and improve maemo5 instead of try make a ripoff Android/IOS.

q8phantom

07-24-2010, 07:12 AM

Thing is it looks like Andoid and thats BAD imho :-(

As someone here said I hope nokia will continue and improve maemo5 instead of try make a ripoff Android/IOS.

If you see the last picture or 5th one. It looks excatly like maemo but it's portrait mode and have the shortcuts down. 3x3 if I remember like our Maemo. Maybe you could cancel the shortcuts down. Hold your phone horizantaly. that's it. Also it's not all about the look only. We have to see the perfomance and it will offer better perfomance and customization at lease equally to maemo or more anyway it's open source.

ibodnano

07-25-2010, 01:02 AM

I like the current meego ui

i also happy if nokia customize the meego ui and make it look like maemo6 ui

bayernhan

07-25-2010, 02:35 AM

I think this one shows it better, I'm exciting to see MeeGo! :D

Live view of apps.

http://meego.com/sites/all/files/users/u36/switcher-2.png

Also read this http://meego.com/developers/ui-design-guidelines/handset/theming

It's fully customizable so yes you can do anything with it! Let's wait and see!

I wish there would be an option to interact with the tasks while in multitask window that would be worth it

q8phantom

07-26-2010, 06:10 AM

That would nice, ex using currency converter then getting back to the browser.

ZShakespeare

07-26-2010, 10:21 AM

Thing is it looks like Andoid and thats BAD imho :-(

As someone here said I hope nokia will continue and improve maemo5 instead of try make a ripoff Android/IOS.

Clearly you've never used Android. The only thing close to that it has is that it brings up a list of icons of recently used apps when you hold down the home key.

It's closer to WebOS.

wheelybird

07-26-2010, 10:49 AM

Regarding the talk of Nokia applying their own UI to Meego. Perhaps I'm missing the point, but surely Meego is all about the UI? The aim is to have a UI that crosses devices, meaning that you have applications that use the same UI whether on a phone, a netbook, in your car or in your toaster.
The actual Linux distro behind the UI is meant to be interchangable; debian-based, red-hat based or whatever. So if Nokia changed the UI then that would be entirely defeating the purpose of Meego.
We would end up with a similar situation to Android/Symbian, where there are incompatibilities between different phones running the same notional OS because of the wild differences in the UI.

tissot

07-26-2010, 11:26 AM

Well look wise netbook, tablet and handset ux's look already very different.
As far as Nokia goes in phones i think Nokia surely wants different UI and will most probally use harmattan there.

Helmuth

07-26-2010, 11:38 AM

Live view of apps.

http://meego.com/sites/all/files/users/u36/switcher-2.png

I'm fine with this task view so long as the next time you start the task switcher you got your last setting.

If you prefer the table view and have selected the last time the table you should see the next time the table.
If you prefer the card view and have selected the last time the card view you should see the next time the card view.

If you have every time to go to the task switcher and make a pinch gestue to get your table view it will get annoying very fast.

jnwi

07-26-2010, 11:48 AM

Regarding the talk of Nokia applying their own UI to Meego. Perhaps I'm missing the point, but surely Meego is all about the UI? The aim is to have a UI that crosses devices, meaning that you have applications that use the same UI whether on a phone, a netbook, in your car or in your toaster.

MeeGo is all about the UI *framework*. You don't want the exact same UI on all those devices, and in theory Qt's standard widgets should automatically give you the ideal experience on each device.

If you have every time to go to the task switcher and make a pinch gestue to get your table view it will get annoying very fast.

This can't be emphasized enough.

SAABoy

07-26-2010, 12:39 PM

If you have every time to go to the task switcher and make a pinch gestue to get your table view it will get annoying very fast.

heaven forbid we have change the view every time... nokia cant be THAT cruel...

Helmuth

07-27-2010, 07:46 AM

heaven forbid we have change the view every time... nokia cant be THAT cruel...

Ouh, have you a source for this?

Kangal

07-27-2010, 10:48 AM

Man I got thinking the other day. How cool would it be if Nokia bought WebOS and used its patent-portfolio and rich software to really make MeeGo outstanding but Open. And got thinking that all N-series would run on Symbian_4 and that Nokia would start a new line the P-series (where the Perfection is the motto). And advertise and release it before Xmas '10.

Then I got thinking, that would be sweet ... but how much better it would be is Google took the same approach MeeGo is taking (desktop linux slimmed down and tweeked for mobile use with vast cross-platform quality and native access) but with their own additions like Google Maps, Goggles, Flash 10 etc. Then it would be three steps a better platform, and one that has the giant corporate backing to gain massive support.

ahh!

mikecomputing

07-27-2010, 11:21 AM

Clearly you've never used Android. The only thing close to that it has is that it brings up a list of icons of recently used apps when you hold down the home key.

It's closer to WebOS.

I did have an andorid., HTC Magic, but sold it and bought my N900 so yes I know about that OS.

Also tried write som app in Google:s "java" (yes I know there has happen alot since 1.5) and it was not my favorite development enviroment or language for sure. Meego and Maemo is better on this, but what i meant was the some of the Meego UI. When I looked at some screenshoits it looked to mush like android imho.

Also the icons looks like some "ten year old kid" has done them. So Ii the feature to make meego/nokia smarthphones for the then year old kids or what :-O

So to the Meego/nokia engiiners: Dont try to make an android clone to just to think "android people will come back and use our phones instead if we just make a copy/paste" cause if they go that way they will probadly loose all other customers instead.

I bought my N900 for this reasons:

1. Nokia knows hardware better than HTC/Google (Many has whined about N900 is bad phone but my HTC Magic was even more bad on that point)

2. More open platform than Android

3. Google to much "worddominate" of cause there is good stuff done by Google but still to mush Google gives me some kind of a warning...

I hope Nokia will do better smartphones/embeddedcomputers in the future and N900 was a bit in "right direction" even if its buggy as phone, but if they start to make a android clone I will not buy nextphone for sure...

I hope I am wrong on Meego but atm. I am a little affraid it is a go backward instead of forward. I mean N900 and Maemo has some fails but alot in that Maemo OS is better than todays other Mobile OS like Iphone, Andoid and Symbian :-) So keep going in "Maemoforward" direction in Meego.

ZShakespeare

07-27-2010, 07:03 PM

That has nothing to do with the plain fact that MeeGo's multitasking is absolutely nothing like Android's multitasking, aside from the ability to have processes run in the background.

Helmuth

07-30-2010, 06:26 AM

I got no answer here for my question as several weeks before at the meego forum.

So I'm gone the rigorous way and filled a bug against this to get a clear answer: task switcher - stacked view is always the default view (https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4300)

Please vote at this Bug report if you want to get updates about the solution without creating noise and post only if you have to contribute anything helpful.

q8phantom

08-02-2010, 10:19 AM

Hope they fix it! I don't think it's a hard thing to do!

joey12

08-02-2010, 10:38 AM

I think that's why maemo is such a great os, much better than android or ios, I think meego shouldn't fall away from thae maemo tree...

Helmuth

08-26-2010, 07:29 AM

I'm gone the rigorous way and filled a bug against this

So, small update. We have made a small success: Link (https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4300#c5)

We're working on the implementation at the moment. Correctly working version
should be in master branch in git no later than end of next week (3.9.).

Note: The Version and hence the Target is set explicit to 1.1. So, don't expect maemo5 style task switching at the N9 meego-harmattan device. To ensure to get this feature wait for the successor of the N9 or a clear statement by Nokia that N9 Meego 1.0 will be updated to Meego 1.1 with full support.

mrebanza

09-05-2010, 02:19 AM

So, small update. We have made a small success: Link (https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4300#c5)

Note: The Version and hence the Target is set explicit to 1.1. So, don't expect maemo5 style task switching at the N9 meego-harmattan device. To ensure to get this feature wait for the successor of the N9 or a clear statement by Nokia that N9 Meego 1.0 will be updated to Meego 1.1 with full support.

DAMN so thier you have it NO MULTITASKING in MEEGO 1.0 . . . fingers crossed for 1.1 . . . :confused:

Stskeeps

09-05-2010, 02:21 AM

DAMN so thier you have it NO MULTITASKING in MEEGO 1.0 . . . fingers crossed for 1.1 . . . :confused:

MeeGo 1.0 came out already (6 months ago?). Next one is 1.1 in october.

HellFlyer

09-05-2010, 03:20 AM

So, small update. We have made a small success: Link (https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4300#c5)

Note: The Version and hence the Target is set explicit to 1.1. So, don't expect maemo5 style task switching at the N9 meego-harmattan device. To ensure to get this feature wait for the successor of the N9 or a clear statement by Nokia that N9 Meego 1.0 will be updated to Meego 1.1 with full support.

If Nokia keeps his policy 1 OS for each device i wont buy their phones again. MeeGo 1.2 will be in 2011? and then what? new phone again?

attila77

09-05-2010, 04:25 AM

Note: The Version and hence the Target is set explicit to 1.1. So, don't expect maemo5 style task switching at the N9 meego-harmattan device. To ensure to get this feature wait for the successor of the N9 or a clear statement by Nokia that N9 Meego 1.0 will be updated to Meego 1.1 with full support.

The N900 successor was never said to be running Meego 1.0 - it's was an early release for developers who want(ed) to get their feet wet with MeeGo (might end up in stuff like the WeTab from what I hear, though). What you talk about is said not be running vanilla 1.1 either, remember, it's a 'provisionally named MeeGo-Harmattan' which used to be called Maemo 6 (naturally, they share a lot of technology, but don't jump into conclusions by looking at MeeGo roadmaps as they are not directly applicable - yet).

Helmuth

09-05-2010, 08:53 AM

The N900 successor was never said to be running Meego 1.0 - it's was an early release for developers who want(ed) to get their feet wet with MeeGo (might end up in stuff like the WeTab from what I hear, though). What you talk about is said not be running vanilla 1.1 either, remember, it's a 'provisionally named MeeGo-Harmattan' which used to be called Maemo 6 (naturally, they share a lot of technology, but don't jump into conclusions by looking at MeeGo roadmaps as they are not directly applicable - yet).

Oh, yes. You're right. I guess I'm a little bit confused with this naming thing. :confused:
I only wanted to avoid wrond expectations and I can remember a post by Quim Gil early this year at the Harmattan renaming thread that he called the migration step Meego 1.0. But perhaps I'm wrong. :)

So, the first Meego device will run Maemo 6. So this Meego related issue has nothing to do with the first Meego device (probably N9). But my solution at the Bug report fixed the issue for the successor of the next device. :)

We will see how the first Meego device works. I expect at the moment Maemo 5 style multitasking. But we will see it soon.
In the end it gets anyway multitasking. No one has to worry about it and no matter how it looks like. It's not a first generation iPhone or Windows Phone 7 device. It's the next maemo/meego step. :)

And when it won't work like we want it. We were able at maemo5 to compile our own task switcher. And I guess we are able at maemo6 ("Meego 1.0") to do the same thing again. :)