3.2005.51-13 now available

[aflegg]

Hi,

As discussed on #maemo, there's a new firmware available for download from Nokia:

http://europe.nokia.com/nokia/0,,79636,00.html

Nothing new on maemo.org yet, and still no changelog as far as I can tell :-(

This update includes small feature enhancements and corrections which provide improved performance.

Cheers,

Andrew

[Hybride]

Great news, thx

[konfoo]

I just flashed this. Device boots up, shows kernel version, then turns off. Some update, that.

[jrac]

Just flashed it myself. Worked fine right out of the gate. Adds a good bit of snappiness to everything. One complaint - my Cingular MediaWorks settings were not included this time, only 'Cingular Internet' which did not work. Manually set up the connection and I am good to go.

[konfoo]

Well I reflashed the old image and ... same problem. Seems something along the way bricked my device. Has anyone else had this problem?

*edit* after a couple re-re-re-flashes, the device is fine. :confused:

Update seems to be a little snappier in operation.

[bigboote]

Mine flashed OK. There is an upgraded flasher tool too, and if you didn't install it that might have been the problem.

While on the OS upgrade subject: now that I've lost all the apps I'd installed, it occurs to ask whether there is any way for Nokia to install the upgrade without nuking your apps?

I think this time I'll try making a shell script that I can manually insert all the installs and tweaks I make and then just run that after the next OS install. Linux people: is there a better way?

[bigboote]

BTW: If anyone finds the change log, please post it here!

[andymulhearn]

IMAP is much improved. Too soon to say it's completely resolved the problems but i.can connect and download which is a huge improvement :)

[konfoo]

Since libraries and config scripts may change doing a filesystem diff would be a bad idea in this case.

Your best bet is like you say to write a simple shell script to dpkg install your list of apps, and then copy your other settings and files to where needed.

[Titus]

Did anyone else notice this but it seems to me, that memory handling is a lot better. Some web sites, where previous firmware version reported memory low problems are now browsable. 770 still alerts "Memory low" when pushing it too far, but most importantly it doesn't go to extremely sluggish mode, when encountering a low memory situation, it just reports "Not enough memory".
BTW, that reminds me : Nokia, please notice: 770 is excellent device but the successor of 770 should have a bit or byte more memory.

[mk500]

BTW, that reminds me : Nokia, please notice: 770 is excellent device but the successor of 770 should have a bit or byte more memory.

Everyone seems to think the problem is with the hardware (e.g. needs more RAM). In fact, it's just a software issue, and Nokia developers will eventually fix it.

64MB is plenty of RAM for a device like this. I have a similar PDA running linux that also has 64MB RAM. I recently opened 7 applications simultaneously and browsed for several hours without problems (Opera, Netfront, Excel compat. app, Word compat. app, PDF viewer, GAIM, and Console). I haven't had an "out of memory" error on that device in years. I'm not saying more RAM isn't always nice, but you can churn through 128MB RAM with buggy software pretty fast as well. Throwing more RAM at it just makes the device more expensive, and doesn't really fix the problem.

The Nokia software is just still "beta" level, at best. I'm not blaming Nokia for this...early release was their strategy. As it matures, it will get faster, and the memory errors should be a thing of the past. Hopefully Opera will also step up to the plate and fix the memory footprint and other issues with their application, or alternately it will be replaced with a better browser.

[Hedgecore]

Exactly mk500. Gigs of memory on a desktop only became reality when hardware prices went down drastically and Microsoft got sloppy. I still think it'd be an excellent exercise to limit programmers to 64kb of memory space to do things that are unheard of these days. The art of memory management seems to be a thing of the past.

I'm sitting on a P4 3Ghz with 1GB of RAM and it still spends it's sweet time thinking about opening some apps. Horrid.

[Titus]

Everyone seems to think the problem is with the hardware (e.g. needs more RAM). In fact, it's just a software issue, and Nokia developers will eventually fix it.

64MB is plenty of RAM for a device like this. I have a similar PDA running linux that also has 64MB RAM. I recently opened 7 applications simultaneously and browsed for several hours without problems (Opera, Netfront, Excel compat. app, Word compat. app, PDF viewer, GAIM, and Console). I haven't had an "out of memory" error on that device in years.

I hope you are right, but this "test website" that I am using is very graphics heavy and a bit extreme case. Could you do a little testing for me with your other PDA?

Please open website http://www.dpreview.com and from reviews (left menu) choose Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II review, and choose "27 Samples" from listbox. Open one of the sample picture clicking link "Original". Can you now open another browser and open another sample picture simultaneously with it? 770 can now handle one sample picture (with previous firmware it couldn't, without extreme sluggishness).

[Mike Cane]

64MB is plenty of RAM for a device like this.

Oh stop. Do you really want to be remembered like this, along with Bill "640K Should Be Enough For Anybody" Gates?

Sure, the Mem Mgr is wonky, but if it had more RAM to begin with, I'd think we'd all be seeing that Low Memory dialog a lot less.

[unuselessj]

I reflashed without any problems other than it taking a bunch of retries to pair with my phone. The only changes I have noticed so far is that the memory program in the control panel works and the e-mail client seems a little quicker. Memory management seems to be about the same to me.

[konfoo]

I don't think the issue is as much with RAM and the OS/software, but rather the *content*. The 770 is clearly marketed as an internet browsing device. As such the requirement for a decent amount of RAM to handle website content without chugging is a must. Squeezing the apps is helpful, but largely irrelevant in this context. More is better.

[e12pilot]

Sure, the Mem Mgr is wonky, but if it had more RAM to begin with, I'd think we'd all be seeing that Low Memory dialog a lot less.

Thats not the point he is trying to make. While the cheap way is to simply throw more ram at the problem, I would rather have a well engineered application managing itself properly. End result nets you a much leaner application that gives you less problems down the road.

My (uneducated) guess is that Nokia has recognized that many of the applications they are using on the 770 are not *that* memory concious, nor have they been designed that way. Lets face it, orphaning 4-10mb on a desktop these days is not considered a problem, while doing the same on the 770 causes quite a few problems. I have a feeling they are going through code right now trying to streamline everything as much as possible, and I for one applaud them for doing it. It is something that not many companies do these days, and it is the *right* way to do it IMHO.

Now where is my freakin 256mb upgrade Nokia! :D

[Titus]

Oh stop. Do you really want to be remembered like this, along with Bill "640K Should Be Enough For Anybody" Gates?


Mike, I totally agree you with the memory issue, but Time's Person of the Year probably never said it:
http://www.wired.com/news/politics/0,1283,1484,00.html

But one of his (also known as Good Samaritan) quotes might be appropriate for this issue:
"I've said some stupid things and some wrong things, but not that. No one involved in computers would ever say that a certain amount of memory is enough for all time."

[Mike Cane]

Just because he never said it doesn't mean he never thought it.

(Yes, I know people are NOW saying he never said it. But strange how back in the *1980s* everyone was certain he had. And I still suspect that a search through circa early 1980s InfoWorlds will uncover the truth!)

As for my crankiness over RAM, I'm sure you engineer types are correct in your assertions that In Theory Everything Should Work Well. In Practice, It Is Not, however. I look forward to the day when it does -- either by better software or more RAM.

[Titus]

Just because he never said it doesn't mean he never thought it.
(Yes, I know people are NOW saying he never said it. But strange how back in the *1980s* everyone was certain he had. And I still suspect that a search through circa early 1980s InfoWorlds will uncover the truth!)


Off topic, but wasn't this a Intel's hardware issue:8086 CPU could only address 1 MB of memory and of that 384 KB was for BIOS by IBM's specs. So Microsoft,then a little company, couldn't argue with the big guy IBM. Or is it revisionist history?

[Mike Cane]

I think it came about during the Expanded/Extended Memory debates.

Anyway, we can await someone to dig through those InfoWorlds for the truth. (Wish I had kept mine.... *sigh*)

Back to Topic...

[eye.surgeon]

Just because he never said it doesn't mean he never thought it.


Your powers of divining the inner thoughts of BG are impressive, but even more interesting is this new release, so if anyone has any further experience with it, this would be a good time to get on topic :)

[myet01]

Could you start another thread concerning the memory debate and lets just use this one strictly for comments related to the software update?

Tony

[kessdaman]

I did the update and it ran very well. A lot of the memory issues seemed to go away. I even imported bookmarks much faster than under the last firmware.

It will only get better. Keep'em coming.

[andymulhearn]

Well I've spent most of this evening browsing around, checking e-mail and all sorts and I've had no problems with slowdowns, browser crashes or out of memory errors. Did I mention that my IMAP problem has gone away as well?

Some more specific comments:


Task switching is quicker, either using the icons or the double arrows (>>), though the arrows are still more usable.
I've had three browser windows open, on national rail looking up train details, the IMDb looking up Elizabeth and this thread. No signs of poor response and no out of memory errors.
At no point did the browser disappear with any of the pages I accessed.
With all of the browser windows open, the e-mail app was a little slow to redraw when switched to, but nothing too painful.
There is still a problem with the rendering of text only e-mails which seems to take and age to complete, so much so that I kill the opening of the message - it seems to get stuck.
No problems with video - the Ice Age 2 trailer, opened and ran first time.
The install worked pefectly first time, using the newly downloaded windows flash app. I did notice that this binary is somewhat larger - by about 2 meg - than the previous two which were identically sized.
Backup restored my settings fine, though an option to "just do the whole of /home/user/ would be more than welcome .
Did I mention that IMAP now works?


I thought the previous release was a significant improvement but IMHO this one is an even bigger step forward. Nokia and the developers working on the software, thanks guys, deserve a lot of kudos for continuing to work to improve the 770 :D

[eye.surgeon]

I just installed the new software and tested it for 5 minutes. Initial impressions:

installation had no problems
noticebly faster app loads
noticably less memory warnings (for example, I loaded 2 large web pages, ESPN and FoxNews) while playing streaming radio and had no problems at all, where before just the ESPN page alone would give me low memory errors.)
noticably faster switching between apps

Overall, a definite improvement. If this keeps up, I'll be happy!

[funkapus]

How long is it generally taking people to flash the device?

I ran the Windows wizard and it hung on "10% Completed" for something like 20 minutes. I'm trying again now and am seeing similar behavior.

[funkapus]

Never mind, I tried it twice more and finally got it to work. Strange.

[eye.surgeon]

It took mine about 2 minutes to flash.

[gnuite]

Holy cow! The dash character (-) is now available on the virtual keyboard without needing to shift! Ha ha, take that, you worthless equals sign!

Three cheers for the new image!

(although MANaOS still doesn't work for me)

[myet01]

Here is what I see now that I have updated:

1 - When turning on the 770 (booting up) it seems the progress bar gets about 1/8 of the way then resets (the screen blinks) and starts at zero again. It then gets to about a 1/3 of the way and stops (but the 770 looks like it is continuing to boot up) then a few seconds later the home screen appears.
2 - On a couple of occasions I have had 770 reboot immediately after the initial booting process completes and getting to the home page.
3 - The control panel memory seems to work much better now.
4 - It does seem to handle memory conditions better as I too have had no "out of memory" alerts. ESPN now works!

Has anyone else noticed the same booting issues as I annotated in 1 & 2 above?

Tony

[cAPSLOCK]

This is a much improved OS in general... much more responsive.

Did it break nethack for any of you other roguelike-geeks out there?

I cant get it to run anymore. It seems to just shut down the 770. :(

cAPS

[bhima]

Gack. nethack does the same thing to my 770. I just reflashed, and then installed and tried to run it, and it rebooted.

Help! Browser performance means nothing if I don't have nethack! :)

[anson]

The dash is a reflection of what region/locale you set (or at least it was). If you set the keyboard to UK English, you get the -, but not if you chose US English.

[NokNok770]

I really wish they have the _ symbol on the main keyboard. That gets used a lot. I just update mine to 3.2005.53-13. The first time I tried to flash it, it locked up at 10%...I had to perform the update again which went through. My 770 seems a little more peppy but I'm experiencing more problems. Playing a radio station caused it to reboot. I can't duplicate again though. And my browser closes for no reason on certain web sites. On the other hand...my email seem to be improved and everything seem slightly faster including dragging an image around in the image viewer. It isn't as choppy. Else seems normal.

[Simon]

I upgraded this morning. Still no New Zealand cities in the clock.

[cAPSLOCK]

Help! Browser performance means nothing if I don't have nethack! :)

Well... I am glad I am not the only one with the problem... umm... and the non working Nethack ;)

I will forward the bug on to the developer.

cAPS

[IceTlv]

Just installed the new update...
Going to Inbox, after 2 secs 770 reboot.
Tried 10 times already.
Anyone any idea ?

[Nickster]

People here have said that there's a new Windows flasher - does the old Linux one still work?

[ziggamon]

People here have said that there's a new Windows flasher - does the old Linux one still work?

Yes.
It worked fine for me

[Hedgecore]

I can't get the 770 into USB host mode. I hold the Home button, power on, the device boots and nothing. Help!

*** Edit: Problem solved. The kitten disconnected the USB cable from behind the computer. Someone want to update the Wiki with that? ;)

[duffy]

I flashed last night with no issues. This morning when I powered up the machine kept locking up and eventually rebooting. Something about surfing and streaming radio was causing issues. I reflashed and everything is OK again. If you keep crashing you may want to try a reflash.

I have the '-' key on the num pad and I'm using the US keyboard.

[anson]

If you view your keyboard settings (bottom left -> Tools -> Settings -> 1st language) the default is English (UK). If you change that to English (USA) the dash will change to a plus sign. This setting seems to be independent of the locale setting which I have set to US.

[mrp]

after upgrade is it possible to listen to netradio with cover closed or is this a hardware issue?

[choover]

i dont think you can
wouldnt it cover the speaker and sound like poo?

[duffy]

By design the tablet turns off when the cover is installed. It prevents the tablet from powering on accidentally when it's in standby. Like choover said it would sound like poo...poo is never good. ;)

[Robette]

My mp3s play fine with the cover closed. I thought my shoutcast was still playing as well. I can't confirm right now, can anyone else help here?

The speakers sound like poo no matter what.

[andymulhearn]

I'm pretty sure, well close to certain actually, that when you put the cover on, the radios are both turned off.

[Robette]

hmm maybe I was thinking sleep mode. Anyone want to settle this for us?

[Biomech]

I had to flash several times before I could get the browser to work. It would say it was starting but it would never launch.

Also, I had several music videos that I had converted to full screen Nokia 770 format and they are no longer full screen. Can someone else confirm that change?

Overall, the 770 seems much more stable. I am finally able to run email, browser, and streaming audio sessions all at once.

[henry]

Wifi gets disconnected when the cover is on. So internet radio/shoutcast will stop. Mp3s located on the device or MMC cards seem to continue playing even with cover on.

[NokNok770]

Well...I'm reporting another problem I had after the update. My newsreader would not open up even though it said it was loading. It just did nothing after that...and I experience that with the audio player also.

Someone mentioned that the mp3 plays now even the cover on. Mine always played mp3 that was on the memory card. It just doesn't play streaming audio when the cover is on which is understandable because it goes into standy mode...this disable the display and wifi to save battery...programs should still run in the background.

[skynetos]

the RSS feeder still sometime leaves behind a process and an icon in the dock.

I really hope that gets taken care of! as it takes a reboot to get rid of the stuck icon. Anyone else notice this?

[LiquidIce]

Does anyone know if there are command line switches to allow the Windows Software Update Wizard to set the 770 into R&D mode? Can a frontend be made for flasher.dll that allows you to easily set the bit on the 700 for R&D mode?

I snooped through the DLL, but i did not see any functions that might allow this...
_Boot@4 0x100013e0 0x000013e0 1 (0x1) flasher.dll
_DetectDevice@8 0x10001000 0x00001000 2 (0x2) flasher.dll
_FlashBootFiles@16 0x100010b0 0x000010b0 3 (0x3) flasher.dll
_FlashInitFilesystem@8 0x10001280 0x00001280 4 (0x4) flasher.dll
_FlashKernel@8 0x100011d0 0x000011d0 5 (0x5) flasher.dll
_FlashOperatingSystem@8 0x10001060 0x00001060 6 (0x6) flasher.dll
_FlashRootFilesystem@8 0x10001330 0x00001330 7 (0x7) flasher.dll
_GetLastErrorCode@0 0x10001450 0x00001450 8 (0x8) flasher.dll
_GetLastErrorMessage@8 0x10001460 0x00001460 9 (0x9) flasher.dll

[Simon]

With the new upgradeI still have problems with the email deciding to stop working. I think maybe something to do with the scheduler which never seemed to work right for me anyway. The only way to get it to work again is to do a restore from a backup.

I don't think it is anything to do with the upgrade but I am getting better at the hwr. Figuring out the dash at the end of the line where you enter text means you can start entering back at the beginning was a bit of a revelation for me. Obvious really. I wish it was more tuneable though. The line (for descending letters) I find is too far down if you are writing big which seems to help. And I wish there was an indication on screen showing where the limit is for if you will get a space or not. Maybe a line after the last char typed. If to the left it adds to the prodeeding word and to the right you get a space. As a long time Palm user I often find myself doing Grafitti by mistake! The faster I go the less well it works but that is because my printing gets too messy.

Simon

[Joohan]

I had no problems with my e-mail client before I upgraded. Now I often need to restart the device in order to get the e-mail client to start. It tries to start for a while and dies. Sad.

//Johan

[NokNok770]

My nokia have totally rebooted several times now since I upgraded to 3.2005.51-13. Other times the applications web browser and newsreader would not launch. I have to shut down and power it back up to get it working. I hope they resolve this and put out another update soon. Cause its getting annoying.

[Mike Cane]

The Wizard cannot see the compressed folder the 51 update is in. Am I supposed to UnZip the folder or what? How can I get the Wizard to see. The Wiz is looking for a .bin file, but can't see the compressed folder the bin file is in!

[elwood]

Am I supposed to UnZip the folder or what?

Yep.

I had a few problems with the update myself, it seems as if the update messed up my connection settings. After I updated and reinstalled the backuped files and settings I could first connect to the net through my router just fine like before, but a bit later I couldn't connect at all. I had to setup a new connection and it worked again.

[Mike Cane]

Thanks! Updated smoothly.

[phatman81]

I also updated the software. have had no problems at all. In fact, the browser is much quicker than before and makes surfing much better.
Q: what do you guys use to back-up so that you do not have to re-install stuff like gaim, abi word, etc. ?

[thoughtfix]

the RSS feeder still sometime leaves behind a process and an icon in the dock.

I really hope that gets taken care of! as it takes a reboot to get rid of the stuck icon. Anyone else notice this?

Yes - This is a recurring issue on my 770 as well.

[NokNok770]

When I said that if you update 3.2005.51-13 and don't do a restore...it works much better...well I was wrong. My web browser will not open. It would load up and close it back right after the page is about to display. No matter what I do...reboot. Still does it. It was doing so well yesterday, didn't lockup or reboot once for no reason.

[Mike Cane]

I've had Opera go south on me as well with some sites since updating to Week 51. That only happened maybe once or twice with Week 49. Weird. Reboot.

[RogerS]

I'm pretty sure, well close to certain actually, that when you put the cover on, the radios are both turned off.I don't think this is right.

I believe that only the display is turned off when you put the cover on. I think that connections are broken then, but that WiFi and Bluetooth are still on and still draining battery power. Offline mode, of course, turns them off.

So we really do need someone who REALLY KNOWS to chime in.

[andymulhearn]

I don't think this is right.

I believe that only the display is turned off when you put the cover on. I think that connections are broken then, but that WiFi and Bluetooth are still on and still draining battery power. Offline mode, of course, turns them off.

So we really do need someone who REALLY KNOWS to chime in.

Agreed, on both counts. My experience of wireless and bluetooth is that with the cover on, they definitely drop the connection.

I was only assuming that this is because the radios are turned off.

[Hedgecore]

The past few days while at work, I've left the unit in standby in offline mode - - I still have four battery bars by the end of the day compared to 2-3 when I used to leave it in online mode.

[TGKnIght]

The new image is pretty good... everything runs faster due to the improved memory handling... sometimes my browser shuts itself down, but it's better than before where it would freeze or reboot for the same page.

p.s. it's funny while i type this i find myself tapping in vim commands sometimes

[myet01]

I agree, much improved! As stated, the only issues I have had is that the browser tends to shut down periodically?

Tony

[Frisc0Dave]

I think it is necesary to restart PC after installing update wizard before attempting update. When I tried update before a system restart I got to 10/100% completion and then froze. After PC restart, I was able to update without problems.

[Supergeek]

I think it is necesary to restart PC after installing update wizard before attempting update. When I tried update before a system restart I got to 10/100% completion and then froze. After PC restart, I was able to update without problems.
My tablet exhibited the same behavior as Frisc0Dave's. On my first attempt, it stayed at 10%. After a reboot, it worked fine.

[Loose Press]

Just flashed it myself. Worked fine right out of the gate. Adds a good bit of snappiness to everything. One complaint - my Cingular MediaWorks settings were not included this time, only 'Cingular Internet' which did not work. Manually set up the connection and I am good to go.

What are the manual settings for the connection and how do you set them? I got out of one jam by flashing the Dec 20 image but I've lost my MediaWorks.

Thanks.

[Loose Press]

What are the manual settings for the connection and how do you set them? I got out of one jam by flashing the Dec 20 image but I've lost my MediaWorks.

Thanks.

I found them by digging up DaveC's Nov 2005 post; search for "Settings for Cingular GPRS internet access via your Cell". Thanks, DaveC!

[kakos]

Agreed, on both counts. My experience of wireless and bluetooth is that with the cover on, they definitely drop the connection.

I was only assuming that this is because the radios are turned off.

There is a little option in the Connectivity control panel that says "Disconnect when cover on device". It is, by default, checked. You can uncheck it and the Nokia 770 will maintain connections even when you put the lid on.