Nokia is done.
 

http://geekongadgets.com/2014/09/10/...osoft-windows/

It's so sad to think that Nokia, the veritable grandfather of mobiles will be simply no more. A part of me is hoping Microsoft does things in a way which allows Nokia to be reborn independently someday, but Microsoft isn't sloppy like that.

Just makes you wonder how different the market would be if Eflop hadn't sent the burning platform memo, if Nokia had kept to their plan, and Microsoft wasn't.. well, Microsoft.

Oh well, it was a blast while it lasted!

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Nokia isn't done. It's the handsets unit sold to Microsoft that's done.

Microsoft got Lumia brand, so let them have it. I'm enjoying my Nokia Z Launcher on my Nexus 5, made by Nokia. The company that's still alive.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

I'm actually feeling happy that junksoft finally going to let Nokia go, and I hope to see the real Nokia come back after 2016, whatever platform the real Nokia choose will be better than those windows junk anyway.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

The Nokia moniker on Windows Phone devices will be discontinued, but are those the products we're really going to miss seeing the Nokia name on? Not trying to direct hate at Microsoft/Windows Phone, but after the switch Nokia's products changed. The really great stuff came before 2011-2012, in my opinion. Their hardware has stayed top notch (especially in the imaging department), and I really wish we lived in a universe where the current Lumia line ran Meego instead of Windows, but of course that isn't the case.

The way I see it, a decade or so from now Nokia as a mobile devices company will be remembered for products like the 3310, 6820, N-Gage, N95, 808 etc. People will remember when Nokia made Lumias, but they aren't the phones that made Nokia a household name worldwide.

I also see this as a good thing. Nokia remains an independent company, it was the devices division they sold. Microsoft using the name is confusing. The Nokia Lumia 830 and other new handsets are products of Microsoft, not Nokia. Call them Lumia phones, not Nokia phones.

What sticks out to me in this article is that MS plans to depreciate the "Phone" part of "Windows Phone." That sounds like a great way to confuse customers. "It runs Windows," is that what they'll say about their mobile products? But it doesn't run Windows, not in a desktop sense, and that's what people think of when they hear "Windows." I don't understand the thought process at MS.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Finally there would be no nokia branding in crappy devices.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

The things that finally bug me the most since I am currently still affected by it are:

-Pureview camera tech under the MS license is going to end in the deepfreezer or cryo because they obviously figure people don't need a superior camera on a smartphone or the current camera's are good enough (see the celebs be so pleased with their grainy iPhone selfies ;) )

Nokia could have so easily swapped their unappreciated smartphone manufacturer coat for one of a innovating camera manufacturer that revolutionizes the way we take pictures and.. become the poorer man's Leica for street photography.

-Nokia failing to secure Symbian support till 2016 in the whole MSFT deal. (and being excluded from maps "for life" updates is a lowly practice)

This is certainly not the way to ever win me or the people I consult over for a future "update to the MSFT smartphone platform. Nokia nor Microsoft have cared about about the loyal Nokia customer base enough. Launching a goodbye teaser 808 PV then cut its support!

Great to see the maps of Nokia the company coming to Samdroid.
http://mobilenews4world.wordpress.co...et-nokia-maps/

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Where is Lumiaman?

I thought he would be the one to start this kind of threat...

It is kind of sad to see the Nokia name be wiped away from mobile phones, but for me at least it is a relief. No matter basically where you look nowadays, you can only see the wasted opportunities that Nokia (its leadership?) managed to screw. Even the latest Apple launch managed to bring back stuff. Weren't Nokia among the first ones to really talk about wireless paying methods with phones out loud years and years ago? The famous wending machine example... Wonder where those plans were forgotten...

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Forget about Lumiaman, where is the guy that said Bada was going to kill MeeGo, BBX, Windows Phone and eventually Android.

Was his name badarox?

I haven't seen him in ages.

...i miss you

Re: Nokia is done.
 

If what we heard about Nokia only selling devices division to Microsoft was correct, why is Nokia.com (US version. I am not sure about other regional sites) redirected to Microsoft's owned page?

It looks like, Microsoft did purchase the Nokia brand for ever. So anyone waiting for Nokia to reborn, it is not going to happen.

Nokia has been killed by Microsoft. :mad:

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Microsoft is licking it's chops with a smile and belching out trash. Now, it's even going after Minecraft...

http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2014/09/...ype=blogs&_r=0

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Nokia disagrees :)
https://blogs.nsn.com/mobile-network...ry-much-alive/

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Nokia missed the boat and got stranded on Symbian with nobody seemingly realising that Meego was there as an outstanding lifeboat. Much as I loved it the N9 was too late and could never win the app war that seams to prevail in the press (One which Windows Phone is still struggling with).
A great shame, however the 808 camera live on, in a form, in the Lumia 1020. I have one and the build quality is up there with the N9 and I even like the latest version WP8.1
Even Jolla realised that they had to offer Android support to get the app count up and be considered as a credible smart phone.

Nokia should have moved onto a new platform after the N95 IMHO, Symbian never felt right on a touch screen, they traded on customer loyalty just that bit too long.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

The opposite. Nokia is finally out of all this **** (cutting back for years, Windows Phone, Microsoft free of it all) and back to engineering house with hefty profits and a big bank, with no worries in the world at the moment and still remain relatively largish company with 35 000 working on the new Nokia.

This has been discussed hundreds of times here, so I wont bother to go too deeply, but Microsoft can't say what Nokia can manufacturer and what it can't. Nokia is a openly traded company. Only thing they are hindered is that they can't use Nokia brand on "mobile devices" before 2016.
Granted I do think it's irrelevant as I don't think Nokia will return to making phones ever. Consumer devices, that are mobile? That I see almost likely. It does seem like Nokia is making HERE as a consumer brand, with the reshuffling going on there.

Though I suspect whatever consumer side stuff it will be, it wont be something to get excited by typical talk maemo forum member. I doubt they want to be anywhere near anything related to maemo, meego etc.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

and a front panel of a phone also leaked showing new Microsoft branding on its front.

http://www.gsmarena.com/microsoftbra...-news-9618.php

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Wasn't it the opposite? The previous man in charge wanted to head more into consumer and Nokia's current CEO not?

Re: Nokia is done.
 

You are actually right. I had it other way around in my head.
Of course it's all rumors and it could just as well be that the old HERE boss wasn't up for whatever there's next for the HERE brand. But yes, you are right.

I do still have hard time believing Nokia's patent portfolio would not be used more extensively than just licensing. We don't know example what happened behind the curtains with China approving MS Nokia buy after it holding approval for a while. Will Nokia be allowed to use its patent portfolio, like Qualcomm was in Nokia's heydays? Will Nokia research get the best returns as a licensing factory? Would guy like Skillman want to be doing something else than just part of the current HERE brand?

Granted, who knows. Couldn't fault them for settling what they got now, as they seem to be doing just fine finally. If they decide to go purely licensing route, rather than lowering their unit costs using their patent portfolio to cross license, they got their patent portfolio still not used to full potential when it comes licensing.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Please do look at the article P@t linked to ;)

Nokia.com still directs to the mobile phone page because Nokia is still recognized as a phone brand. Visit www.company.nokia.com for their current website. I think I read Microsoft will manage the Nokia.com domain for a year after the acquisition.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Unfortunately this article is in Finnish, but it shed some absolutely terrifying info about the Microsoft decision by Nokia.

http://www.itviikko.fi/talous/2014/10/07/nain-microsoft-veti-maton-nokian-alta/201413821/7


It truly terrifies to think, that such a big company can be run by idiots who didn't see these point before hand about Microsoft and Windows Phone OS. All these points were crystal clear to every user of that shitload that is called Microsoft Phone and Windows for Phones.

Well, even if this stuff makes me so ANGRY, I guess as a Finn I just have to torture my self and read this book.




Quotes from the book:

"Yhden kirjassa esitetyn arvion mukaan Windows Phone 7 oli jopa vuoden Nokian kehittämää Meego-käyttöjärjestelmää jäljessä."

in English

"According to a estimate given in the book, Windows Phone 7 was even one year behind Nokias inhouse Meego-operating system"




"Meegolle oli kehitetty esimerkiksi täyttä fyysistä näppäimistöä käyttävä laite, mutta Windows Phonelle tällaista laitetta ei pysty toteuttamaan vieläkään"

in English

"For Meego they had developed full physical keyboard support, but Windows Phone can't manage that even today"




A direct quote from an interview (of engineer?) in the book: "-- We started to wonder [after they had received indepth info of the Windows Phone OS] whether anyone had actually studied Windows phone hands-on. And we came to conclude that no one had"

What in the gods name???!?!?!



Also there is a mention that the only after they had already announced the co-operation the Top Level management found out that Windows OS could not be used in the cheap phones. Before hand they had understood that it could be used on approximetely 100€ level phones.



This article just ruined my day... There are also other unbelievable stuff there. Thanks again Elop for being such a *****.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Silly question: I am one of those old OVI users, my main mail is now on Yahoo, but it SSO with nokia.com (through nokiamail.com).
Does anybody know what is going to happen here? Will I be borged in M$ anytime soon?
Thanks.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Even if it’s clear that Nokia has made big mistakes by the past, it’s also clear for me that Elop is a disgusting amoeba.

If I were Finn, there is some probability that I would be in jail, for murder.

http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...&postcount=392

PS: don't read this book, you will not learn anything constructive that you do not already know.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

He only cares about money anyways. It's just how it is most of the time, ruthless business.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

You can't blame elop for this **** show. Blame the millions who did nothing to stop him :D it's not like elop just went to nokia HQ one day and told them I want to be your CEO give me all the power. He was selected, vetted, selected, elected, approved , approved again and again over the time...especially the biggest shareholders supported his strategy. A CEO cant do anything without "approvol" from majority of shareholders.

But if it feels better to do it so what the hell..let's blame him :D

However, it would have been intressting to live in a parallel universe where nokia continued with Symbian and maemo...my guess unfortunatly android would rain on Nokia parade until they left or was bought...still this road would been more fun...for us at least. Go Down swinging.

Let's face it. Nokia couldn't handle the transition and new competition from android and iOS. Anyone actually think maemo could survive android and iOS? And with that I mean keep nokia relevant with above 5% of world market of smartphone ?

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Let's rename Burning Man to Burning Elop.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _


Edit: or is that the game Where you guess a Word by selecting letters:confused:

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Y'know...in context of the multiverse...
technically there is a "shunt" we (our current temporal community) missed the off-ramp to.
One of the universes right beside ours where everything is pretty much the same except some small differences.
Sigh...wish I had gone left instead of right....
Just about positive that in one of them Nokia actually saw the intelligence of the N.I.T. series nxx0 ...continued down the same path (instead of that one minute decision to stop devel. in our bubbleverse) ...creating more and more powerful devices aimed at user openness, choice and control...I think it would have competed (rather IS competing in an alternate (if not multiple alternate) universe) very well against M$/ Apple/ Google. Hm...still...we aren't very far away from that type of possible temporal intersection again...however...the likelihood Nokia will "steer" us all there is diminishing with the passage of time (though is still possible) to be replaced with other players in the game who may accomplish the same effect.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

From the 100 interviews done for the book it was also said that nobody believed, and still believe that it was some kind of MS inside job. Elop was just extremely terrible at his job. Author of the book comes to conclusion that there was no possibility Elop itself had it all for MS.

That said, big questions are raised about involvement of consultant that changed Board of Directors mind 2 weeks before Elop was chosen. Before this consultants speech about "how Elop had opened his eyes of the situation", they were going to choose Vanjoki. This consultant did also happen to work for Microsoft at the time, alongside Nokia.


There's pages after pages of interesting stuff just from random text quotes picked from the book.
- How passionate those old employees were/are and explaining Nokia's situation and past teary eyed.
- Stuff about meltemi and how it was late to the game by the time it was supposed to be announced. Mostly because Android had already captured the price range they were going.
- How livid Nokia's hardware side was about choosing Windows Phone
- How Nokia started erode its old working organisation with the introduction of US style big corporate matrix organisation back in Kallasvuo's CEO days.
- Desperation started seeking inside Nokia and its board of directors shortly after Lumia 800 had gone to sale. *I guess after developing the phone they saw what they were in for

Reading some of the stuff about Windows Phone development from MS side is unbelievable. That's just about how Windows Phones development has looked from the outside.


I doubt I will get the book either. :) Enough is enough.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

That gives me a great idea.
I'm gonna start a new (off-topic) thread about this alternate universe where Nokia didn't go down the path of Microsuck.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

I think Dave's got it right...Elop is simply the tool.
Don't blame the tool...that is way too convenient.
Blame those that use the tool improperly.

@ Kangal
It is an interesting postulation eh?
Funny thing is that technically in some alts. Nokia never got off the ground with the NIT or even existed as a corp.
In others it ends up becoming the dominating corp on the planet superceding all the others.
In still more the concept of intelligently aimed openness and choice herald a thoughtful golden age in society and saw the beginning of the collapse of the institutions of greed, disparity, corruption, etc.
In yet others the NIT heralds the dominance of a dark age of control...
Fact is ...theoretically ...what ever can be conceived ...has already happened...is happening ...will happen. It's simply the nature of "the odds".

yeah man...
More and more accepted...mutiverse theory ...it's "overlaps" ...it's "distancing"...from one to another....from what is believably possible..in a nearby univese...to unlikely or impossible in a universe with great separation 'tween "here" and "there".. is way-cool.
I'm all for your multiverse thread.
+1 to that
Got my vote.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Nokia really had it all with meego and qt - says a n9 owner.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Why not? I've had an iPhone and various Android devices, I don't think either iOS or Android are anything special.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

I can agree to that. But look around you. that didnt stop their instant success a fast growth on the expence of mostly Nokia? The world is Bigger than you ;)

It wouldn't be pretty to see Nokia go down with meego as their main os while disabled Symbian. Just think of a compony of Nokia (mobile) shrink to 5 perfekt of market.. I would say they would need to got rid of approx 80-90 percent of their people do stay plus result...or waste their savings in no time.

Was maemo or meego ever over 1 % of world market?

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Maemo competing against ios and android ...yes.
WITH Nokia...no.
They aren't interested at this juncture...
and if they had their mitts on maemo again ...what more would they do to/ with it?
(shudder)
No...I think it much better that maemo goes it alone...
There is more chance of surviving and thriving than with Nokia.
Don't get me wrong...Nokia did exceptional by maemo up until those last few years....Perhaps there are other Entities that would do a better job...than Nokia did in their last few years with their grip on maemo
As far as market relevance goes...yes...in the past maemo-meego really occupied a miniscule percentage of the market.
But the old rules are gone.
More and more people want control over their devices.
Of course some will always wish devices that they don't have to think about...ergo the smart phone.
But the ignorantly content applecart has been upset by snowden and others. The rules have/ are changed/ changing.
maemo-meego has opportunity to be very relevant.
More and more.
We still have people joining TMO...why?
Heck...lately on ebay I have closely watched the prices for n800's and n810's....and they have been going up.

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nokia-N-Serie...item462596707c

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nokia-N-Serie...item2a450ce928

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nokia-N-Serie...item35ddceeb25

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nokia-N-Serie...item58b6512f1e

http://www.ebay.ca/itm/Nokia-N-Serie...item3f3aea5f72
They went in the last 2 months normally from $25-$50 plus shipping (which unto itself is remarkable frankly...)...up to $65-$125-$200-and even above $300 (definitely people trying to take advantage...mind there are still some sane prices available still...) and that is for a 2007-2008 device...why?

A desire for an "understandable" device...
User dissatisfaction with marketplace standards....
User control ...
are the best answers I can come up with.
Many have spoken of maemo's "golden years" being behind us.
The same for the n8x0's.
Yes...the prices rising to such heights ..is..well...quite mad ..but I think it indicative of a resurgence in what I was speaking long ago on. It may be the end of Nokia. But it is hardly the end of the n770 selling at prices in excess of $70 and then shipping...nor the n8x0 selling for what it is currently....perhaps an n900 in decent shape will command in comparison an even madder price than what I am seing for the n8x0's currently. Perhaps the price is relevant to the desire for bigger keypads and slightly larger screens and a simpler more manageable operating system....time will tell. Perhaps I am wrong completely and it is all a "blip" soon to be forgotten...but I don't think so.
Weirdly interesting times hm?

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Just think if they could release the source :D jolla could Abandon sail and bring back maemo. Yeah, Im sure IT Will happen any day. Yup, any day now. Im sure. When Will the remaining of Nokia release something phoneish? They are not dead..they are waiting, sleeping, waiting for the end of 2015.
http://m.gadgets.ndtv.com/mobiles/ne...istings-569244

Lets say i has nothing to do With here maps ;)

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Frankly I think Nokia coming back to the table has caught onto a few current key industry success lessons.
One of the big ones being...Don't try to do it all yourself.
Build wicked... truly great devices... like they used to...
BUT leave the platform to others.
Work in tandem WITH the platform developers instead.
Maemo-Nemo-Android-etc...

It's been a model for success for other manufacturers so far.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Imo Nokia's problem was their hardware not their software, for example we had to wait until the end of 2010 to get a separate GPU (N8), with Android and iOS that was compulsary from the start. Nokia also used slow processors and tiny amounts of ram. If you put Valentino Rossi on a moped and me on a Repsol Honda I bet I'd be faster than him but that doesn't make me a better rider.

By migrating to Windows Phone 7 Nokia compounded their problems rather than fixed them.

You also don't have to be a business genius to foresee how carriers and retailers are likely to react to the burning platforms press release closely followed by Elop publicly announcing Symbian EOL.

Re: Nokia is done.
 

So let's say: instead of the Burning platform memo. Elop announced a Nokia N10 with Meego...

Re: Nokia is done.
 

we have to see the whole picture , Elop is a Trojan horse period . but he worked for ?. USA , why Nokia would accept for the first time a foreign CEO with a lunatic idea?
as several people cited above, Elop needed the support of the board. my logic leads me to speculate and questioning what if this is all a plan? but not of Elop or Microsoft, if not, America.
what if a plan to DOMINATE all operating systems and therefore make their plans for world espionage. With a software manufacturer outside your borders as Nokia would be very difficult . I think a plan took underwater , including the three parts Nokia, Microsoft and the government of the United States of America
They offered a lot of money ( as indeed they did ) to buy Nokia and gradually remove unwanted uninfected operating systems (MeeGo Symbian)
and launch a new system ( WP7 ) with this super program (PRISM ) inside. Nokia was fighting a losing war against Android and took the easy door and sold his phone company from the first day of the deal with Microsoft , there are facts that were better deals than those offered by Microsoft, any intelligent person would sell his company to the highest bidder , why Nokia did not do that ?.
there are many facts that without Snowden this would be another case of Microsoft 's ineptitude destroying another company , but no. America is in control of everything and Nokia stood in his plans.
and remember that Microsoft is the number one provider of information to the NSA and thats a FACT.
nothing is random , just like they did with the twin towers with non-existent weapons of mass destruction of saddam hussein with Syria chemical weapons, and Iraq Opium fields and oil etc etc etc the list is long

Re: Nokia is done.
 

Re: Nokia is done.
 

I think what panukooo is trying to get at is a truly insidious and fabulous tactic by the USA.
essentially this is the slideshow progression of danger and devastation by putting elop in charge of anything.

I am Elop ...

Fear me!

http://s26.postimg.org/dtqc54bkp/14_...2_29_55_PM.png

No ...
I am Elop...Fear Me...

http://s26.postimg.org/5mtagff6h/14_...2_35_42_PM.png

No...
I am Elop..
Obey Me..

http://s26.postimg.org/ss8qzjqmx/14_...2_34_21_PM.png

No...
It is I...
I am the Elop! ...

http://s26.postimg.org/xbfxny26x/14_...2_38_05_PM.png

of course culminating in the successful conspiratorial terrorist sabotage and master plan...

http://s26.postimg.org/3xp95h5sp/14_...2_39_26_PM.png

Re: Nokia is done.