What to get to replace my N900?
 

The USB port on my N900 has finally died (totally broken,not just loose or comming off the PCB). My N900 is also wearing out in other ways (including cellular modem giving "no sim" error more and more) and its just not viable for me here in Brisbane, Australia to get all the problems fixed. Plus with 3G on my carrier going away sooner rather than later I would rather have something with 4G for future proofing.

Its time to replace it and I want advice on what I should replace it with.
The Pinephone isn't shipping for who knows how long (they say "January 2021" but with all that's going on in the world, I don't trust shipping estimates that far out) plus they say its for people who are developers/early adopters and not just people who want something for everyday use.

The Librem5 isn't shipping right now either (no sign of an ETA when I would get one if I ordered now) and the Fairphone is EU only right now.

The Droid 4 doesn't seem like its easy to obtain (here in Australia at least) plus I can't find any info on if it will even support the frequencies I need for my choice of carrier.

Buying a used N900 is an option but its not future proof (no 4G, lack of modern browser and so on) and its hard to find used N900s in Australia.

Can anyone suggest what might be a viable replacement that's actually available in Australia?

Note that for all sorts of reasons I don't want to go into here, buying something on eBay is not an option for me (Amazon and other marketplaces are fine, just not eBay)

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

The Droid 4 only supports a single LTE Band, 13.
Thats around 750MHz.

You can find bands in use in Australia here.
13 is not among them.
(Don't use the site to check for device compatibility directly, the supported bands are stored wrong for most devices)

Here in Germany LTE also does not work and the 3G antenna of my Droid 4 is a bit worse than the one of my N9, N900 and Nokia 808.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Like you, my device is showing it's age. It's not been my daily for a few years but is used for alarms and keeping a copy of some IT manuals available locally within arm's reach. The keyboard could do with a replacement, backspace key has worn off, keys need cleaning/ transparent letters have yellowed. I had an SD card give up a few months ago. Very early 64gb card, split into 2x 1gb swaps with rest as data. Read works fine, write doesn't. Phone reboots, laptop says it has written file but it disappears on removal. Replaced it with a 128gb configured the same.

I looked at Planetcom, Gemini and Cosmo, but not sure on specs. The FxTec 1 X looks more like it spec wise but it's in a crowdfunding project. Still haven't found that true N900 replacement. Last few years I've had a OnePlus 3T, also now showing age and battery wear. Might get a 9 next year. For now my Pi4 4Gb is having to support my interests.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

You may still be able to get the manjaro edition if you drop them a email or directly. Also they are supposed to be working on a keybaord/battery combo for it too!

No promise, and it also seem you may not want a phone that need more work then the n900.

I currently have one and it can mostly work dpending on the OS you want to run. But my n900 is still my daily. But I might be forced to change starting jan 2021 :(.

Probably the fx Pro1/x is the best alternative if you want something that seemly mostly works. And rumored to be heading to main soon/eventually too

You haven't shared what your needs are and also what OS you want to run.

x

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I am hoping someone who knows how to would make a 3D replacement backcover for N900 with room for 4G connection dongle stuff.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I would say the Pro1x from IGG is a very good N900 replacement with keyboard, multiple OSes and soon multiboot, mainline progressing significantly (hence hope for Maemo Leste) and chroot/LXC like EasyDebian. However shipping time is important for you now that your main phone died, so that won't really work. Christmas perks are all sold, and I am afraid it won't be easy to find one on the forum since there were only 10. If you like it, it could be worse buying a cheap phone in the mean time until the Pro1x is shipped next year.

I can see myself still using a Pro1 in years unless they make a Pro2, which is something that very much reminds me of my N900 too.

You can find videos from Netman, Mosen and I (Netman and Kib nicknames on YT). They're not professional videos, but we all have been using ours for one year and different uses (Android. Sailfish, Sailfish + Debian). Also we're TMO people, so for you it may give a better idea of what to expect than reviews made by Android pros who don't care much about keyboards or alternate OSes, and haven't use the phone for long.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

In terms of OS it seems that all the phones running Linux are not available to me, unsuitable for my needs (i.e. not supporting 4G on Vodafone here in Australia) or not usable enough for a daily driver (e.g. Leste) so it looks like I might need to go Android.

The fxtec pro1 seems to be another device that isn't shipping until some future date so that's no good. (and the pro-1x is only available through crowdfunding and also not shipping yet so that's even less helpful)

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I'm very happy with my pinephone. If you don't depend on MMS, it's perfectly suitable for everyday use. Calls, SMS, and power management are all working reasonably well on the latest distro releases.

They expect to ship the next wave out in January, which is only a few weeks. There isn't any reason to expect they'd miss it other than pandemic-related logistics problems, which could affect any overseas shipping.

If you do pick one up, spend a few extra bucks to grab the UART cable. It's turned out to be much more useful than I had expected.

EDIT: In case it's not clear, Pine64 has been reliably shipping Pinephones for months. They've been shipping various "community edition" phones since May, in batches every 2-3 months. Since a board revision after the first UBPorts edition, the only difference has been the preinstalled OS and branded back cover.

The next batch is the Plasma Mobile edition, with KDE branding and shipping with Manjaro-ARM Plasma Mobile in January.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Yeah like peflex mentioned. Called sms 4g working firefox good browser. Still lots mising but for sure usable. Last I test over 17hrs battery life on manjaro. But your still have yet to share your must have daily feature/apps.

x

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Chromium also works well (at least on Arch), especially if you force it to use wayland.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I need GPS/navigation (not the turn-by-turn directions, just the "show me where I am and let me follow along so I figure out where to walk to or when the bus is approaching the stop I need to get off at")

I need public transport journey planning (but any phone I buy should come with a web browser good enough that I can use the online journey planner and not need the official app or the Fahrplan thing I was using on the N900)

I need calls and SMS (but not MMS).

I need a decent web browser (so I can e.g. access my web email on the go, google for stuff, look up the address and phone number of business, look up the prices of stuff online etc)

I need calculator (so I can do basic calculations when I need to) and camera/photos (both as a reminder if I am looking at something and want to remember that thing and as a way to take a quick photo of something and then email it or otherwise share it)

I need notes (so I can make notes of things I want to remember)

I need time/date (since my phone is how I check what time and day it is)

I need 4G on 2100/1800/850.

I need decent battery life

I need a phone that isn't full of unremovable bloatware.

I need a phone (Android, Linux or otherwise) that is in compliance with the GPL and all the other software licenses they need to comply with (I refuse to give my money to anyone who is knowingly profiting off copyright violations by not releasing the GPL'd kernel source or releasing incomplete or incorrect source)

I need a phone that's usable as a daily driver and not something where you need to do lower level things or poke around in the bowels of the OS just to do the normal stuff.

The nice-to-have-but-not-essential features:
Physical keyboard (gotten used to the one on my N900)

Some decent free (100% free, no microtransactions or other crap) games available to play on the device when e.g. I am on a bus or otherwise out and about and have time I want to kill.

Something that has decent privacy protections (i.e. not loaded down with spyware and crapware in the way most phones)

Something that will continue to get support going forward (OS updates etc)

Something that is hackable in the way the N900 is hackable (i.e. not full of binary blobs getting in the way)

Something that doesn't cost a thousand dollars or more and that isn't going to take 6 months or something before I can get one here in Brisbane, Australia.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

@jonwil if you are willing to forgo the physical keyboard then just about any Sony X-and-derivatives-lineup device with SFOS would tick all the boxes.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Thanks for this detailed list :) it's excellent!

- GPS/navigation (I have yet to get it working, but have only tried once.)

- public transport journey planning (will need to rely on the browser for now most likely, I hven’t seen any transportation apps .. but have not looked)

- ✓ calls & SMS (but not MMS).

- ✓ decent web browser (firefox and now chrome if you like that)

- ✓ calculator

- ✓ notes (lots of different note apps already)

- ✓ time/date (time and date on the lock screen, but alarms are not great yet under some OS)

- ✓ 4G on 2100/1800/850. (works good on tmobile us)

- ✓ decent battery life (will depend on the kernal and OS, but I seen ppl post about 2 1/2 days on one charge)

- ✓ bloatware. (most you can delete anything you want)

- ✓ compliance with the GPL (OS dependant)

- daily driver (too subjective to comment on)


The nice-to-have-but-not-essential features:

- ✓ Physical keyboard (fx pro1 {used maybe], one of the gemini phones)

- ✓ free games (too subjective to comment on, also I don’t really play games. But many emulators already)

- ✓ privacy protections

- future OS support (if it open source then there is a chance of future updates, but never a guarantee of course)

- ✓ hackable (mostly depending on OS)

- ✓ doesn't cost a thousand dollars or taking 6 to receive (the sony phone are a good suggestion, but there seems to be some other Chinese brands that are getting some support for other OS on them)


So if I was you (you didn’t give top budget price) I would grab either a sony phone drop sailfish on it which will also get you an official android layer to use those apps you need, a used fx pro1 must exist, A gemini (too big for me), or a Chinese brand.

You have many options

A lot of your needs will depend on which OS/distro you want to use. In my opion your realistic choices are sailfish, android, ubports, on the Pinephone manjaro or mobian for basic phone needs.

So have you put together a list of potential devices and OSs yet?

Edit:
Looks like they have a few PinePhone Manjaro left for dec delivery

x

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

In that case, you're screwed.

I don't think any device on the market fulfills that requirement. Maybe the Librem5. However, I suspect its modem firmware is a bust, since it's allowed by the FCC in the US. I'd assume it's either completely proprietary or violates GPL. ;-P

The Pinephone is a no-go, as it uses Allwinner A64. The modem firmware is also an absolute nightmare.

EDIT: I think all the relevant stuff for the A64 has been reverse-engineered by community, but the upstream vendor for the SoC itself vioates GPL. Pine64 chose the A64 becuse it's cheap and has good mainline kernel support, thus Allwinner's evils are largely irrelevant.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

There are no options checking all the items in your list, you'll have to sacrifice some of them if you want the device now. The requirements that are most difficult to fulfill are hackability, full openness (even the Pinephone doesn't fully comply, as detailed by Preflex) and waiting/shipping time.

The Pinephone is a very nice device with a lot of hackability and OSes will improve, but so far they still need users to be quite flexible as to what they can do and to which level they are prepared to skew their usecase to adapt to current limitations. It's cheap and will ship every few weeks, reliably.

The Pro1 is on the way to mainline and its form factor means there's a niche community behind it to port OSes and support it on the long term, pretty much like the N900. It's hackable with open bootloader and one dev is close to achieving multiboot on it. It's significantly more powerful than the Pinephone and smaller in height and width, just a bit thicker. Its keyboard and performance make it a good device to run desktop Linux in chroot or LXC. Progress is being done towards mainlining on this SOC so Leste and pmOS may happen in the future, but that will require some patience; until then current feature complete Linux OSes include Sailfish and Ubuntu (not sure GPS works on Ubuntu though). It's the closest to the N900 and has some repairability, but ships in 3 to 4 months, so you'd need another phone in the mean time. And yes, the Pro1x is a crowdfunding device, but I'd still recommend it over the Pro1 from the store because lead time for the latter is not really known. The company has a good track record and they have already produced the same phone (Pro1) in the past, so the main risk is delays (a real risk since they do "first come first serve" and there are 1000 buyers in queue), but not cancellation. But waiting until March may be unacceptable in your situation. If you can find a used Pro1, that might work, but I'm afraid most of them would be on eBay so that's a no go. Now may be a good time to check for used ones on the forum though, since some users may sell their Pro1 (still powerful enough) soon to upgrade to the Pro1x. I'm currently uploading a Ubuntu Touch vs SailfishOS video for this device, should be available later today. [Edit] Here: https://youtu.be/rgxrJj37xOs.

Xperia X and variants running Sailfish, but this will again come with some trade-offs regarding your list. They can ship whenever you can find a used or reconditionned Xperia; there may still be some new units in online stores too.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

There goes that infamous "need" again.

You do not need such a phone. You want such a phone. There is a difference.

The world would be a much better place if people (in general, all of them, not just you) stopped passing their "wants" as their "needs".

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I suppose in this instance it's explained that it's mandatory and the reasons for that, so if "want" or "need" is used correctly is just semantics, although I do see where your coming from.
More important for decussion is if that's a possible option, which as pointed out I don't believe so to get approval, this was talked about for Neo.

An option that hasn't been pitched is to make do with a cheap "dumb" phone or if must android device in the short term? At least until devices tick more of your boxes.
I am hopeful Pine with keyboard will be the right option for me in future.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

What I mean by GPL is that the manufacturer of the phone is following copyright law and releasing all the source code that they are required to release. If the license for a piece of software they are using (including things like the modem firmware) doesn't require them to publish the source code, that's fine.

Its when a company is required by the license to publish source code (say GPL for the Linux kernel) but doesn't public that required source code (or that publishes source code that doesn't match the binaries they are shipping) that I get annoyed.

I am saying that I refuse to buy a phone from a company who profits off \copyright violations by shipping binaries (Linux kernel and otherwise) and not releasing the source code that the license for those binaries requires them to release. I would be saying exactly the same thing if a manufacturer was including a copy of the latest Star Wars film on a device without permission from Disney and profiting off copyright violations that way.

Its one of my principles that I wont support companies who profit off copyright violation (among other reasons why I have a list of companies I refuse to do business with)

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Reading this thread (well it could be any Os related thread here) and then reading this: How many linux users are needed to change a lightbulp. https://www.gnu.org/fun/jokes/users-lightbulb.html

Have to say that linux users learn a lot before the lightbulp gets changed.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Pinephone and Librem5 both seem to be compatible with your ethical standards. If you want to get a Pinephone next month, you should order soon, as their small batches tend to sell out long before they ship.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Just get an iPhone mate. Even a used SE 2020 for like 300$ will be up to date for the next 6 years or so.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Didn't you read? He "needs" a GPL phone. That very much rules out an iPhone.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

A read a bunch of stuff and I figured out that the SE 2020 ticks all the other things plus more except the GPL.

“I need a phone that's usable as a daily driver and not something where you need to do lower level things or poke around in the bowels of the OS just to do the normal stuff.”

“Future updates”


Stuff like that and relatively low price, you can’t get with customs roms and other enthusiast phones.

The perfect phone doesn’t exist. Sometimes you have to check what comes closer to your needs and go that way :)

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

No idea about GPL and hackabiliity, but HMD's Nokias have the least bloat and the longest OS support among Android phones

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

No they don’t.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Alright, "and usually enjoy more upgrades to newer Android versions (unless limited by h/w compatibility)"

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Basically every company has longer and faster support than Nokia. 1+, Samsung, Google, heck even Xiaomi cheapos!

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Hm, not really. Google does for the Pixel range but those others you mention are pretty much dead ends.

But this is anyway moot because android is not the answer. Too bad really the HMD Nokias are not bootable to alternate OS'es.

What to get to replace my N900?
 

Too bad Nokia’s are not Nokia anymore actually.
I just can’t stand mediocre software, features, support and this generic Chinese design from 2016.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I haven't heard the best things about HMD devices maybe they were unlucky but earpiece issues occurred after a while on original and a replacement device. Search results seem to hint a few devices have this. Not sure if this has been solved.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Just came here to comment that if your N900's USB port broke off, it is not that hard to solder another port to replace it. I managed to fix my N900 this way some time ago.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

A lot of the time it can take the pads with it, or have pad issues during replacement.
There are some good guides on this forum worth a look but not everyone feels competent to do it.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

There are other things going wrong with the device as well that make it not worth the effort to get the USB port fixed.

Are there any devices running SaillfishOS that might work for my needs?
Or is SFOS not that good?

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

While the SailfishOS UI (Silica/Lipstick) and Maemo 5's Hildon desktop are very different, I think SailfishOS is the closest you can get to Maemo 5 at the moment. There's a package manager, a terminal with full access to / and no limitation like Harmattan had, an official repository, and each developers on Openrepos have their own repository that you can add either manually from CLI or using an application. Multitasking is also similar to Maemo 5's. You can see it in action in the video I posted in a previous message here.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Maybe I was fortunate then, but the footprint on the N900's PCB was compatible with a random noname microUSB port that I had lying around. So I just had to take the time to take it apart, solder it in place, then put it together and magically, it works now!

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Are there any SailfishOS devices out there that I can buy right now and have full feature support?

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

There were more then a few already mentioned no. I'm starting to feel like this is becoming ground hogs day ... :P

x

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Depends on what you mean by "full feature support".

If you mean that you are looking for a device that supports all the features of Sailfish OS, then look into Sailfish X.

If you mean that you want to get all the features that you see on mainstream platforms like Android or iOS, with the same level of detail, then the answer is no.

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

Funny how this simple question "What to replace my N900 nowadays?" still has no simple answer since... ages.
Unbelievable, very special finally.

I personally tried a Pine Phone end 2020. I tried a bit all the Os's present by multiboot.
I finally had the feeling I'd have to reboot every time I needed another task: photos possible here, phonecalls there... And that I'd have to sacrifice the rest of the life (tweak-script-compile) to be able to get some kind of everyday usable phone.
Sure I am not as talented as most of you guys in those kind of things, though.
Well, I finally sold it and came back to my N900. One more case :rolleyes:

Yesterday, since not having followed this phone replacement question since long, I was hot and would have ordered a Pro1-X with closed eyes.
Digging back more in Pro1(-X) question, I found possible huge waiting time, possible beta-version syndrome, possible lacks (or overflow) in support/replacement...

Pressure is getting higher though.
Birthdays, Sport activities for kids, classes management, are organized only through Whatsapp and people are mad when you don't answer. They don't even imagine one can live without it. Often, they don't realize you are not there, and you just miss things.
Picture/video sending. If you miss a cat or a sunrise, no big deal. But at work, for showing tech things and so on, becomes problematic not to receive/send anything.
If you want to show a vid of something to a client, it becomes a bit ridiculous with a N900 where it takes ages to load on a tiny black display...
We love it, still, this N900. They just don't understand the truth :D
Not easy.

So, really, without these Google/Apple data pumps, really no way today?
Even without keyboard?
And formulated like this: "A modern device to be by my own, with no notifications every second and where I can put a simcard"?

It was long, sorry. If you read, thank you. I just needed this therapy!

Re: What to get to replace my N900?
 

I gave up for a moment. Bought Moto g8, installed LineageOs, and using telegram and signal. But not having whatsapp is a big deal for a family guy like me. I put my money on Fx X and it was promised on march but was delayed. I just hope Leste gets ready for N900. Would change so much.