N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Guys,

My fancy android phone screen smashed and rather than replacing the screen im toying with picking up a second hand n900 instead as it is still the best mobile device I ever owned and I miss my slide out keyboard... however Im looking for a reality check before I do

How is a second hand phone battery gonna be? You guys still making it through a day?
How is the web browser at this stage, can I browse casually on the sofa one handed without frustration
I remember the Sat Nav app/GPS signal being pretty poor. Could I use for my daily commute and detour without fear its not gonna still get me there

Anything else that could say my decision?

This is probably a tired question this many years on but thought Id get an up to date opinion from anyone still haunting this forum

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I love my N900 irrationally. But the Web browsing--including via third party browsers--is excruciatingly slow after using a more recent phone. I know some will argue it's not that bad. I wonder what they're smoking.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

You'll want to check that its cell network hardware is still supported by your carrier in your area. For me, I'd have to switch carriers to use the N900 as daily driver again.

GPS works, but should work better if you get the AGPS fix to work properly. I haven't spent enough time on it to sort it out, but I think others have. Power search these forums for some info on that issue. And Modrana is still under development on N900! Using it in the car was always a pleasure, since it perfectly fit the "easel" formed by opening the dashboard compartment that occupies the space in my vehicle that would contain the optional Navigation screen.

Last time I used the N900 for a week (before AT&T pulled the plug on 2G GSM) battery life was ok for a full day. YMMV. And who knows how the previous user(s) took care of yours . . .

The web browser no longer works or works poorly with many websites these days. Again, YMMV depending on just what websites you use. I never found the N900 to be all that well suited to one-handed operation -- just IMHO. [For me, the N9 was kinda the pinnacle of one-hand usage, just big enough to read, not so big as to risk dropping (in the toilet, perhaps, not that I'd do that) when scrolling with a thumb and gripping it with your palm] The best thing I've found to do on the sofa (with the N900, that is) is to use both Pierogi for IR control of my AV equipment and XBMCRemote for my Kodi (fka XBMC) over my wifi. That IR emitter is perhaps the 2nd most awesome thing about the N900 after the keyboard.

Other members will probably have other interesting observations and ideas for you with using your N900 in 2017. There have been a few threads about this subject in the past you might look through, but stuff changes in the smartphone and online world right out from under us whether we like it or not.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Cheers Guys,

As I feared then its probably best to leave it in the past and not spoil the memories

Ill just have to hope some company with insane profits decides to take a risk and offer something similar but with todays specs in the not too distant future...but Ive been holding out for that since the day I retired my old one.

When I think of some of the old phones I had and the flexibility they offered you realise how much the 'smart' phone has killed the smart phone.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

For fast web browsing i think Opera Mini Java is the best choice

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Hi,

I'm still using my n900 as a main daily phone. I think if you are interested in using so (i.e. as a daily main phone) you may want to think through want you would like to use it for.
Let me tell how I'm using it:

- My laptop sits at home for my wife and children so I use my n900 as a real pocket computer I can make call and send SMS with.
- The original battery died after 6 years (random reboots) so I bought another one (produced by Nokia) with 1430 mAh capacity. It is nearly a year old now but if I do not touch my phone (wifi on, email is syncing) it makes through even 2 days. Or more; I can't stand to touch it :)
- GPS is working fine for me; sometimes it takes some minutes to get a valid signal, but most of the times it takes only a minute (yes, I know that for today's devices it takes seconds...) or less. I use Sygic (I know it is outdated but for my country and needs it is enough; if I want up to date tiles (fo example for hiking) I use modrana.).
- For web browsing I use opera-mobile 12.1beta1-16. For most cases it is fine. For me... Slowliness is relative for me; I can't understand why is it so necesseary to make huge websites... Anyway, if I want to just read something I use links2. Even midori is available through chroot-ed kali linux.

- I use it for programming/learning programming. I have rebuilt vim with python support and I installed neovim on my kali.
- I have chroot-ed kali linux with i3 window manager; I use Maemo and Kali 50%-50%.
- I like it because I do not have to worry about anything - I can do what I want with my device and I can make my device to do what I want and when I want it...

So it fits my needs. But I do not really care about browser speed if it is enough for me. I do not use any social app (FB, Twitter, etc.).
It would be awesome to have more apps (for banking fo example) but I can live without these because I can adjust these through web browser (opera-mobile). It is a communitiy maintained device so I would recommend treat it that way.

jm

EDIT:// I forgot to mention that on my kali I have rawtherapee so I can edit my photos taken with blessn900 in dng format. It's speed is not bad - even editing curves takes 1-3 seconds to take effect (it depends on image size). I use it overclocked to 1100 MHz though...

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

My N900 is still my daily phone ~7 years later, I can't see me using anything other than Maemo in the near future.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I too use my N900 daily.

I haven't found a suitable replacement yet
(Hardware Keyboard, Linux & Phone, small)

As a Phone it is perfectly usable.
SMS, phone, mail, chat everything works.
In my experience GPS on the N900 works way better than on the N9,
but also a fix takes way longer than with A-GPS on a modern phone.

Internet Browsing is difficult on some sites.
I am happily browsing all my daily news site (Javascript disabled)
And the only site I miss is gog.com, which brings my N900 to its knees and does not work without JS.

I love the ability to run Linux tools, to use ssh to check on our company server and to run java software.
Jbidwatcher for example is great. Nothing better as an ebay snipping platform than my always on pocket device.
Also there are so many file formats other phones cannot handle, the N900 opens nearly everything (with chroot).
On the other hand, I miss some android apps and would enjoy a modern game from time to time. Some of these can be replaced by websites.

My original battery is replaced by a Polarcell one which lasts 3 days without use and about 6 hours of heavy use (And I use it often, so I carry a spare)

What does the N900 lack:
Ram, modern websites and many applications which run under chroot want more than 256MB. Also compiling big software on the N900 itsself is impossible. This is the main reason I am looking for a replacement.
CPU is supprisingly ok
The camera was very good when it was released, but today it has low resolution and can't take videos in acceptable resolutions. Therefore I carry a 808 Pureview with me for these tasks.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Likewise here.

I made a foolish diversion to Sailfish just to try it out and unwittingly remained stuck for two years but I came crawling back. Coming back to Maemo from Sailfish feels like taking off a straitjacket. I can only imagine how it would feel had I spent those two years with something even more restrictive.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Can you share with us your Kali image chroot if its possible??

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I use the one from here.

I made some tweaks to be able to use blue arrow keys (like easy debian) and installed/removed many things (see attached file (rename it to txt...) - st for example for terminal, i3 window manager instead of xfce or lxde; keybindings to be able to type hungarian characters, neovim for document processing, etc.). Some other configs are connected to my phone's content, so if you would like to use it you may want to modify some things/config.

I would happily share it but I do not know where to upload it; sadly I do not have any place (mediafire or dropbox or anything like that) to upload the image... If anyone know a place where no registration is required then I shall share it...

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

If you are so kind you can try http://www.filedropper.com (no need registration, only upload the file and share the link)

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Hmm... ok, it says "Sign up free" then I should use amazon pay... Am I missing something or I cannot just click and upload...

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Try https://wetransfer.com/

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Thanks; will try from my laptop as soon as I got home...
Hahaha - from n900 I tried with:
- opera - browser is too old.
- Microb and chromium - cannot load the website.
From under kali:
- midori - browser is too old.
- links2 - does not work as it lacks java support...

That is at least 5 working browsers that cannot achive a task as simple as uploading a file... Now that means something...

But even on my working laptop it says "Cannot load some parts of the website" - tried with Explorer and Chrome (not alowed to use any other...).

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

It requires JS from wetransfer.com and wetransfer.net, but it does allow you to upload 2GB without registration, which is why I linked it.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Really? I see "Sign up" all over but I have just uploaded a file without signing up.
(Note: I had no idea about that site's existence until 5 minutes ago.)

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Yeah, thanks; I know... It is not about JS but this task connected to the thread title: even with 5 browsers installed I still cannot upload a simple file :)
Besides the compressed image is over 2 GB.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Really :)

There is a space where it says "Missing plugin" - maybe it is flash, I don't know...
From my working laptop I'm not allowed to reach the website and from my n900 I cannot do the upload :)
So please be patient, in the evening I shall do it at home...

EDIT:// Had some network issue, will try again in the afternoon...
EDIT2:// Ok, I think the Universe does not want me to upload it... Now there is a power-cut at home so upload canceled... Trying, trying...

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

OK, here it is.

Some side notes before you go…:

- it is larger than 5 GB so I recommend copying it to a reformatted SD card – I created a ext3 partition on mine. The bigger the partition the more programs you are able to install…

- maybe you should untar it as root.

- there are some scripts that are meant to run kali in terminal or with i3. My kali image is on /media/mmc1p3 so maybe you should modify these scripts according to your kali image location. (There is a “bootkali” script – this remained from earlier; unnecessary, but I kept it)

- I have "sudo" and kernel-power installed; some of the scripts are using these. kaliwm sets CPU max to 1100 MHz so be careful! My n900 can handle this but maybe yours not... If you wish to reset to 600 MHz after quitting i3, just add the following line to the end of kali-i3 script: sudo kernel-config limits 250 600.

- if you wish to run a kali application from under Maemo then run: kalli the-program-that-you-want-to-run in osso-xterm.

- for terminal usage you should run the script named “kali” as root.

- for i3 you should run “kaliwm” but before doing that
- maybe you should install wmctrl on Maemo,
- modify some things in chrooted kali:
• for example the ~/.i3/config file – near the end of the file there is a line that randomly adds wallpapers at startup from my MyDocs folder so you should modify this line according to your needs.
• Btw. I recommend reading through this config file because it has many tweaks – keybindings (~/.xbindkeysrc has some tweaks too!) for example or status bar infos, etc. So getting familiar with these can spare you some headache (:

- if you do not like i3 just wipe it out and install xfce or lxde or openbox/fluxbox or anything you want…

- since I do not want to use this image as a dual boot but with chroot, I removed the modules folder completelyto get some space (I backed up this folder so in the future I can just copy it back…).

- there is a remapped keyboard config: /usr/share/X11/xkb/symbols/nokia_vndr/rx-51. This way I can type Hungarian characters easily with Shift+Up/Down/Left/Right arrow. Btw. “^” sign is Shift+Down arrow (twice) – it can be handy when using terminal…

- Basics…:
o I wanted to keep things as simple as possible so there are no fancy things installed that is why I chose i3 window manager. There are still several things that can be removed - and I removed those since I packed this image - but I thought maybe someone will need these.
o This image has st (simple terminal installed) as terminal emulator. If you are not familiar with it I recommend reading this. It uses Source Code Pro font with solarized theme and transparent background. If you would like to use something else then go to ~/st directory, make the needed changes in config.h then run command: make clean install.
o Midnight Commander has solarized theme too; just define something else in mc.ini if you wish to use something else.
o Using tor: sadly midori doesn’t have to option to set/use socks proxy and tsocks midori command doesn’t work either (at least for me…) so if you want to stay lightweight you should use links2: after running tor (or tor&) just type torlinks2 or if you want a “gui” then torxlinks2 – this will run links2 with the appropriate socks proxy settings (at least it is working for me but you can test it if you visit check.torproject.org). Alternatively you can install iceweasel but it is painfully slow…
o there is neovim installed too – not the up to date one; I didn’t try to update it from github but you can try. Sadly I couldn’t compile it from source because of the dependencies – libjemalloc always fails and I cannot figure out why… So this neovim and the libs it is depending on are from debian repo… But it is working as it should. I configured it to my needs – I use python so all configs are made according to this fact (pydiction, flake8, vulture, etc.). Config is: ~/.config/nvim/init.
o for video there is mplayer, for audio there is cmus.
o if you want to manage volume then type alsamixer – if you don’t hear anything search for HP DAC and set it other than 0 (:

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I still use my N900 as an everyday though my wife now uses a a Oneplus 1 LineageOS/ with fDroid repos(no Google).
If I need web browsing I take along my Nexus 7 also running LineageOS.
I dislike the non GNU-ness of any Android distro and would love a way to have an updated Maemo5/Debian-like GNU-Linux OS on it instead.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Thanks a lot for this work!

Im wish prove it.

PD: Maybe your post will be useful too in the kali thread.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

[OT]

I was thinking of buying a phone that is compatible with LineageOS.
How would you compare LineageOS with Maemo.
I looooove Maemo, and hate Android with Google, do you think LineageOS (with some open source repos) could be a viable option?
I would like to have an updated Maemo5/Debian-like GNU-Linux OS too, but sadly I think we are stuck with what we have now.

[/OT]

Sorry for the off topic.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I use my N900 as a daily driver and will continue to do so until one of 3 things happens:
1.It fails and cant be fixed/repaired
2.Something happens in the network that prevents it from being used (carrier stops supporting the needed frequencies)
or 3.I am able to replace it with something better (no way I would downgrade from an N900 to a Galaxy S7 or an iPhone 7 though)

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

I run CM13, effectively LineageOS, with noGAPPs. Look it is Android in it's manner, but yes, you are free of leaking info left right and centre. That is a huge plus, if you want modern browsing and access to Android apps, such as those for local public transport (the n900 had Fahrplan, but it was not updated to newer iterations and so.... it makes a huge difference having that access for me). So yes, it is viable but still Androidish.

N900 style linux phone? Guess Sailfish is the closest, now that Ubuntu Touch is dormant, and UT anyway was frustrating due to it's security model.

HA

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Apples vs oranges. A Linux geek used to Deban grabs a N900 and is at home once they add all of the repos, it actually came with a console app installed, even the Linux Zaurus didnt come with that installed.
Grab a supported Android phone or tablet, USB unlock bootloader in fastboot, flash a new recovery firmware like Team Win, then download and sideload the Lineage image. Once you have LineageOS dl and sideload the root enabler addon and the f-Droid .apk for FOSS software repo, dont get the Google play addon or what is the point of this all. Get the .apks you feel needed for closed software from a friend with an insecure google play phone and an apk repacker app or use an apk downloader solution and you have a usable tool, friendly and hackable but still too nanny as say WindowsXP but with better security and a very useful permissions blocker. It still is not Linux as we know it, SSH is not as useful and it seems like every useful feature requires an easter egg level of effort and forum surfing to learn the little trick. That said it is amazingly more secure and more useful than dealing with a google-play standard android device which requires a known root exploit to hack yourself root access.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

N900 viable as a daily phone driver? No.

As a geek device that would make any Linux tinkerer beyond happy? Yes.

Personally, I am not a fan of the N900 any longer for communication of any kind. But man, it's hands down the best pocket Linux device ever released.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Wrong. I switched back to the N900 after two and a half years with Jolla and it feels like a HUGE upgrade.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Who is wrong?

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Well it's situational.
Used mine as primary for a very, very long time.
But the time has come for me too, I needed apps for my work and pretty much for my daily life that Maemo cannot provide anymore.
I'm using an LG Leon since last week, which is a 2 years old low-low-lowend Android phone, bought it for like 30 €, and its better in every single way possible, except the keyboard which I miss very much.

N900 is still ok if you don't need any mainstream apps, internet, advanced gps and transportation tools, social crap, and standby time.
As a phone, as an e-mail client, or Skype device, PMP, all of these are still working.

It's still very nice as a Linux toy, but as a smartphone, nowadays it's suffocated by it's hw and the lack of support.
Honestly, since I've got my LG, N900 is on my desk, and I have no task for it. :\

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Do you mean it has a lot of standby time, or only little?

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

My N900 was very weak in the terms of battery life. Even with a new, genuine 1430 (I think, I can't check now, my swap is on my SD :D ) mAh battery, I needed a mobile power bank or a charger in the middle of the day if I wanted to use it's capabilites. Default CPU speeds or OCd to 500-1000 MHz doesn't really matter.

LG Leon (1900 mAh) doesn't need any power for at least one day, two days are possible with intermediate use.
And I mean this with constantly online mobile data (LTE), 2-4 hours of music playing, and some Messenger usage, checking bus schedules with GPS and so on.. it's a whole new dimension.. N900 just old.
As a phone, and phone only, it's ok, as a smartphone, well.. questionable these days
:(

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Not who, what.
This claim:

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

We have different opinions. Last I checked, opinions are unarguable. You have yours. I have mine. We differ. Get over thinking that it's wrong because it counters yours.

I offered my opinion. I stand by it. Will continue to do so, especially now.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

Exactly. I did not object to your opinion. I objected to its presentation. It looked like a statement of an objective fact, which it obviously isn't. I just copied the same style.

Opinions differ and so do use cases. There is no objectiive answer to many questions, including the one that is the subject of this thread.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

In this case, the use cases are very specific and spelled out by the OP (see below).

My opinions were based on that, not any other conjecture nor input from anybody else; including you.

Battery life was horrible to begin with. I never got a full day out of the N900. Even the Wikipedia page acknowledges this. But then again, I was one of the few people that actually used the phone to communicate - you know, make calls, send texts and when the community added it, also send MMS messages since that was not part of the original specs delivered to the users.

The GPS lock was also horrible. I took my N900 to Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and never got a lock while in that city for three days. That was honestly the biggest reason I returned our three purchased devices. In fact, it was second only to the fact that the other two phones exhibited faulty USB ports and I had already shaved down the prongs on the cables.

And the web browser... today? Might as well use something else than the stock browser. I couldn't surf heavy JS sites on the N900 then. It's probably worse now.

Those are all of my opinions based on the use cases put forth by the OP. There were no other ones I took into mind when responding. Your input on my statement as a "fact" - that's only your interpretation and not my intent.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

From the bowels of the sub forums ...
I megaphone that ...
"You are BOTH wrong! ... the deified N8x0 rules with an iron fist and trumps even Laser Sword!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QoFRNfIk60

:D

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

FWIW I use my N900 for communication all the time, calls, texts, MMS are probably the most used things after the media player and the GPS.

All these work perfectly well for me, most returning users will feel at home returning to Maemo UI.

I still get several days from my N900's Polarcell with fairly average usage, so I can only assume something was chewing your battery life.

An issue with the N900 from a user perspective is you have to be careful how you use it and what you install on it. Going to Extras and installing everything will no doubt cause slowness. I found out very quickly that less is more when it comes to "apps".

Yes, browsing is clunky but I am getting good results from QML Browser at the moment. Opera has always been operational for most.

Also yes some devices have issues with the USB port, but again we are talking about a returning user.
The device isn't for everyone but for many here, myself included, there isn't anything else suitable, I would say if your considering returning then your highly likely to put up with it's quirks over the other offerings.

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

As a daily driver, it has failed me repeatedly by losing messages - a known issue when multiple messages come in. Recently, too, I've lost all the data in MyDocs.

I do, however, use it as a daily driver when in a particular country, as I don't like switching SIM cards. But then I know that I won't be making many calls and any SMS are not critical.

A most recent use was in a prank. I used the megaphone app to pick up my voice, and connected the N900 to a bluetooth speaker that in a colleague's office behind a wall. Helloooooo...

Re: N900 viable daily phone or is nostalgia clouding my memory?
 

It is my daily driver since 2011 when I bought it. Most sites I need work just fine in microb. On mine, Opera is memory hog.
And yes, it is a communication's device for me.
I do have an SGS4 for WhatsApp purposes (simply because my dad gave me the phone), but that's where its use ends. Everything else happens on N900, including all my email use.
IRC ... N900. Skype ... N900. Lync at work ... N900 (i tried Lync app for Android on SGS4, and found it unreliable compared to Pidgin's implementation)
Anyway yes, ymmv - we all need different things in life, and that's why it's so good to have variety.
Life would be dull if everyone owned a BMW/Merc/whatever brand :-)
Each to his own!
I'll stick to my N900 until it becomes inoperable