Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

Nokia appears to have a history of breaking stuff without having a clear goal with Maemo.

OS 2005 -> OS 2006: switched from ARM to ARMEL, all applications had to be recompiled, no finger-friendly UI

OS 2006 -> OS 2007: (N800) switched from OMAP1 to OMAP2, this was necessary and not too tragic, since OMAP2 could execute OMAP1 code, many apps had to be recompiled because of API breakage though. mix of finger-UI and stylus-UI with poor autodetection

OS 2007 -> OS 2008: again much had to be recompiled once again. no more finger/stylus-autodetection. mix of finger-UI with stylus-UI

OS 2008 -> Diablo: smooth transition, wow!

(so far, API breakage was OK because maemo was not mainstream. the next step enters mainstream market, though)

Diablo -> Elephanta: dropped. time is running out. Nokia faces tough competition. No point in concentrating on the NIT devices any more.

Diablo -> Fremantle: OMAP2 -> OMAP3, API breakage, HIG (human interface guidelines) breakage. finger-UI. Many apps have to be redesigned for the new UI guidelines.

Fremantle -> Harmattan: toolkit switch from Gtk to Qt, switching from C to C++ as the default language. Many apps will have to be rewritten! Possibly switching CPU architecture from ARM to x86. Total breakage, total disaster. Once downloaded or paid apps from the "app store" will no longer work.

Nokia seems to be struggling real hard with iPhone and Android competition. The N900 could be a year too late for catching up. I'm still a fan of the NITs and am looking forward to the N900, but slowly I begin to lose faith in maemo, and the latest news don't help rebuilding faith.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

I stand corrected. That (porting a non-trivial chunk of kdelibs to S60) is really impressive then :-)

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

While I don't necessarily disagree re: S60, a vastly improved version of the S90 UI (aka Hildon) lives on in Maemo. Ok, as we just found out its days are numbered but it's there right now if you want it.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

That's ok, ABI breaks happen sometimes and this one had several benefits & was pretty much a necessary move since upstream compilers, distributions etc were moving to EABI. Most other ARM platforms had to go through the same transition.

Both Chinook (aka Maemo 4.0) and Diablo (Maemo 4.1) are "OS2008". As the version numbering suggests there shouldn't be any major API or ABI breaks.

In most ways that matter we could consider Harmattan a new platform. Sure, many of the low and middle level components remain, but it's been hinted that we would access them via "Qt Mobility" wrappers for cross-platform compatibility reasons so for all intents and purposes they are different. Besides, those components also there in (for example) ALP or Openmoko and we don't go around calling them Maemo.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

Maybe, but when you learn your way around the UI, the novelty factor wears off, the effects become annoying and you turn them off (provided somebody didn't decide she knows better and doesn't let you turn them off).

Well, it doesn't matter if it looks slick but it doesn't do its job well. Claws looks like sh*t[*] on the tablet, but it actually works.
[*]for me it's actually ui nirvana, but for those looking for effects, animations, big icons and whatever it probably looks like sh*t.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

That depends a lot of what your application is doing. In easiest
case, you can refactor UI with Qt designer in couple of days
and leave the actual application logic un touched.

In worst case if your application is about 100% UI then thing is
different. There is no magic mixing C and C++ together.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

We have started announcing changes on Harmattan even before releasing Fremantle final precisely to have enough time to discuss and make the right steps. Nobody is asking current Maemo application developers to switch to Qt, they better concentrate on Fremantle in the way that pleases them better.

Also nobody is asking these app developers to go and maintain the toolkit in Harmattan. The announcement was done in front of an audience of platform developers including plenty of GNOME contributors and the GTK+ and Hildon developers.

Technically there shouldn't be many problems having the Fremantle Hildon/GTK+ libraries coexisting with the Harmattan application framework based on Qt, thanks to keeping the same middleware. Getting these Fremantle Hildon apps 'as is' in Harmattan shouldn't be a big deal.

The Harmattan API and UI will bring more things and having GTK+ apps taking all the new thing is surely a more complicated task. But this is one of the things the community and the developers interested can decide: prioritize the alignment with GNOME or with Maemo, or find ways to satisfy both.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

Well done is the operative term here, and you're clearly not getting my point. But continue on with your bias against composited UIs. It's of little matter to me.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

A UI is as it says an interface to interact with the software.
Having special effects doesn't necessarily mean just cheap thrills. If its done with tought and good design, it actually enhances the user experience - not in the "Wow that is cool sliding effect", but in reducing the amount of time it takes for an average user to interact usefully to do a task.

Or it increases the choices in how you can accomplish something.

Please don't equate UI effects to only graphical gee-whiz effects. Its really more than that.

Claws having multiple panes unlike many other apps is itself an UI effect so to speak. Similarly a sliding window to reveal additional info is also a effective UI design. Just because it slides gracefully doesn't mean its of no use.

Re: Quim keynote on Maemo's switch to Qt as the main toolkit
 

[.....]

Well, that's contradictory: if it slides gracefully it will take more time to show the information than just popping it up instantly.
The special effect, while nice, will increase the time, not reduce it.
Edit: and having the information already visible in the first place will further reduce time.