Yep, and you and others still refuse to understand how Indiegogo crowdfunding works. It is not a purchase of any sort of product. Jolla were explicit, and specifically stated on their Indigogo campaign page(s) under the Availability & Delivery section:

Disclaimer: Delivery of rewards/perks are subject to best efforts and not guaranteed.

1. So what?
2. So what?
3. So what?
4. So what?
5. Yep, these people who purchased from the webshop have a legitimate case for a refund - but that's nothing to do with Indiegogo.

if that is True, then my support is not a guarantee either so we are even

5. So then you agree that its a scam for the webshopers or fraud or trick or ... until jolla do a refund to this purchasers from the shop. So then its a fraud...its not like you can wait to ship like 2 weeks or more.

doesn't really matter since we are all their supports, Webshopers or IIGs. I don't like when customers are used!

Refund all or ship all plz!

So indiegogo should be treated like a gambling site, no under 18s and appropriate warnings before you start.

There was a time I would go through indiegogo and think ' that's cool, what a great idea!', now I just think 'not gonna happen, waste of money'
So maybe jolla has saved me money!

As for the secret surprise, I'm guessing $100 off the Indian phone.

Note: "However, you can be sure you will not end up empty handed."
I guess it will be unmatched/unlike Jolla mittens.
Think it would be a nice idea to give tablet to the most eager ones and refund to those who given up Jolla tablet, making more people happy.
Hope I am in next batch for tablets myself (joined campaign the first day).
Almost any outcome is better than it looked like one month ago.

Surprise!

We've used our Chinese sourcing experience and we're pround to announce Jolla "Antti"-gravity hoverboards*



*non-exploding batteries extra**
** batteries not available

Coming "Soon TM"

10 euros? Are you sure you did not misspell 10 percent?

This is yet another demonstration of the deep misunderstanding some people have. How many times does this have to be repeated? The tablet and the phone run the same OS! Sure there are two different builds for two different CPU architectures but that is no big job for an automated build (Jolla does use those, right?). The only extra effort is testing on different screen sizes but since there are only two and they want to support OEM devices, they will have to run those anyway.

So that. You are right, they are not legally obliged to deliver the IGG tablets. But you should also know that there is more to running a business than the bare minimum you are legally obliged. In business, it matters more what people think you are worth than what you are actually worth. Reputation is more valuable than machines, factories, the state of your bank account or the portfolio of your products.

So you are right, Jolla is not legally obliged to deliver the damn tablets or compensate the backers. But can they afford not to?

Morally and ethically...
they can't afford not to deliver or compensate the backers.

Realistically ..
Fiscally ...
Can they afford to?

I think there wasn't enough fine print here.
Who (in their right sane mind) would have expectations of delivery of ANYTHING ...
or feel they are owed ANYTHING....
If it isn't spelled out that they WILL be owed something for ...
and remember this....
DONATING...
People expecting a return on a donation...
whether it be a product or a refund..
should be realistic.

It's either A, B, C, or D

If it is A-
Crowdfunding...
That is a murky legally obligated nightmare of fuzziness...only cleared up with distinct language of obligation.
(This pretty rudimentarily put...but...it is the gist...)
ie- Stage 1 - "IF ...we get enough money ..those investing will be 1st on the short list when we get to stage 2...production..." ,
"We have enough funds..now we are aiming to make it to stage 2..production...now we are obliged to follow through with producing product for those who donated to make this possible...or ...refund..." ...etc

If it is B-
Pre-ordering ...
there is (hopefully spelled out in official legalese...if there isn't anything stated officially as to the security of your investment ...fool, you... for investing..still....there may be the option for legal recourse ...) inherent corporate liability to produce or refund. Failure on the project / corp end to produce either product or refund MAY be considered fraud.

If it is C-
Sales ...there is an (obvious) inherent corporate liability to produce or refund.
If the corp reneg's on it's obligations to it's customers in this regard it is outright fraud.

If it is D-
Donation....
with no guaranteed statement of refund or product in the event of internal fiscal upheaval...then caveat emptor. (It IS after all a donation expectations should be realistic)
You have donated funds to a sinkhole.

The obligations of a project / company to it's investors is pretty straightforward.
Soooo
the real question is...
which realm does the Jolla tablet issue fall under?
A, B, C, or D?

That will dictate the strength of a case for the investors..to either:

-pursue legal action (a class action lawsuit would make the most sense rather than every individual fighting for recompense on their own)...to force the obligation of reception of the goods they paid for or compensation..

-pursue the reception of their goods they have put money into for...

-pursue the reception of compensatory refunds (minus what work was done to try to achieve project completion...parts, wages, all those costs....) .

-or abandon attempts at pursuit of any kind if the obligations of the project / corp are not clearly spelled out ...and / or if it was clearly stated monies put to said project were classed as "Donation" with no inherent obligation to the donator...

Where is the fine print?
Where is the legalese?
Is there any at all?
Is there any official project / corp. statement on file / or public record stating their obligations at any point in the past which they must be accountable for?
If any one knows ...
post it or link it...
It would go a long way to understanding the investors rights here.

Murky-Murky-Murky.

Well, every time Jolla post another blog post without giving me tablet or refund I'm buying another apple product during 2016.

Hope they give me a tablet soon

Midsummer Night's Dream?