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	Texrat	2008-05-23 , 12:11
	Posts: 11,700 \| Thanked: 10,045 times \| Joined on Jun 2006 @ North Texas, USA	#181

Originally Posted by krisse

I mentioned garage because a previous comment in the thread said something along the lines of "we've already got maemo.org and garage", and I was purely trying to say they're not aimed at end users.

I'm not sure what you mean by "back to blurring the lines", this is the only time I've mentioned garage as far as I can recall. Maybe you mean someone else?

By "back" I don't mean that you were doing it more than once but that it had been done more than once and, well, there you were.

Not trying to whip up the dead horse, though. I just think you were making an assumption about end users that may not be true. When I pull maemo.org up, I see Downloads very boldly displayed, and see NumptyPhysics highlighted. That's a good signal SOMEthing for end users is going on.

And it's been said before, but your post seemed to me to be ignoring this fundamental fact and I was surprised that you of all people had not latched onto it: above all else, many of the gripes against maemo point to educational opportunities. So... is there a place on Internet Tablet School to inform your customers what's available at maemo?

Finally, the solution to shortcomings at maemo is NOT fragmentation, but illumination. I think we have that rolling now, but it was NOT part of the original proposal, which did indeed support fragmentation.

/hopefully done

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dont	2008-05-23 , 12:34
Posts: 334 \| Thanked: 55 times \| Joined on Aug 2007 @ Eastern Ontario, Canada	#182

I should like some clarification about off-Maemo repositories please.

Q1. I understand that these are considered 'persona no grata' as far as Maemo and ITT is concerned. Is that correct?

Q2. If I develop a new application that I hope will eventually make it into Maemo Extras but that right now is still under development then am I allowed to create my own repository and tell folks about it on ITT?

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	Bundyo	2008-05-23 , 12:39
	Posts: 4,708 \| Thanked: 4,649 times \| Joined on Oct 2007 @ Bulgaria	#183

You can create your own, but why bother? Just use extras-devel - it exists for a reason.

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BoxOfSnoo	2008-05-23 , 15:38
Posts: 259 \| Thanked: 72 times \| Joined on Dec 2007 @ Halifax, NS	#184

Hopefully that reason isn't supposed to be to fail when updating the package list...

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	Benson	2008-05-23 , 15:54
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Repos are like cats in boxes that way. The purpose of extras is to be Bloody Furious.

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pa28pilot	2008-05-23 , 16:23
Posts: 28 \| Thanked: 7 times \| Joined on Mar 2007 @ Eastern U.S.A.	#186

I find it {shocking | disheartening} that people related to communities that claim to value "freedom" as a fundamental tenet can be so utterly committed to constraining the editorial options of what is arguably a social mechanism and discussion forum.

Then again, it would not be the first time that I've seen people so intent on finding technical mechanisms for a (human or social) task that the initial intention became diluted or obscured.

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	Jaffa	2008-05-23 , 16:31
	Posts: 2,535 \| Thanked: 6,681 times \| Joined on Mar 2008 @ UK	#187

Originally Posted by pa28pilot

I find it {shocking | disheartening} that people related to communities that claim to value "freedom" as a fundamental tenet can be so utterly committed to constraining the editorial options of what is arguably a social mechanism and discussion forum.

<sigh/>

Haven't we moved on already?

Then again, it would not be the first time that I've seen people so intent on finding technical mechanisms for a (human or social) task that the initial intention became diluted or obscured.

OK, now you've lost me. It appeared in the first part of your message you were annoyed at the negative reaction to Reggie's original announcement. But our negativity was on the exact same topic you raise here: it appeared to us that ITSSS was a technical solution to end-user problems, rather than address (what we saw as) the underlying causes. Our point was (and is) that another download catalogue won't solve any of the problems and that the effort would be better placed elsewhere.

Hopefully, we'll see the fruits of some of that effort soon.

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	Benson	2008-05-23 , 16:44
	Posts: 4,930 \| Thanked: 2,272 times \| Joined on Oct 2007	#188

Originally Posted by pa28pilot

I find it {shocking | disheartening} that people related to communities that claim to value "freedom" as a fundamental tenet can be so utterly committed to constraining the editorial options of what is arguably a social mechanism and discussion forum.

Then again, it would not be the first time that I've seen people so intent on finding technical mechanisms for a (human or social) task that the initial intention became diluted or obscured.

I am not, in fact, a FS advocate. I'm OSS, thanks very much.
(Commence flamewar in 3... 2... 1...; but this really is relevant. FS people have a different view of the world, which I (biasedly) consider warped.)

Honestly, I'd say that this is not the first time that I've seen people so intent on finding human or social substitutes for a technical task that the initial intention became diluted or obscured. I see the goal here as related to production of good software in general, and of a system where apps install with minimal input or configuration in particular. Fragmentation hurts that, even when people's efforts to make everything newb-friendly are what leads to it.

People focusing on the human issues leads to thinking in terms of shiny instead of efficient; of "user friendly" instead of "minimal input or configuration"; that's half the problem here, IMO.

But most importantly, I've seen no one "committed to constraining the editorial options" of anyone. We've said we thought it (as implemented) was a bad idea; that's not at all the same as claiming we have a right to stop it, or as making an effort to stop it.

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	Bundyo	2008-05-23 , 16:53
	Posts: 4,708 \| Thanked: 4,649 times \| Joined on Oct 2007 @ Bulgaria	#189

Originally Posted by pa28pilot

I find it {shocking | disheartening} that people related to communities that claim to value "freedom" as a fundamental tenet can be so utterly committed to constraining the editorial options of what is arguably a social mechanism and discussion forum.

There is a very big difference between freedom and chaos.

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	Texrat	2008-05-23 , 17:49
	Posts: 11,700 \| Thanked: 10,045 times \| Joined on Jun 2006 @ North Texas, USA	#190

Originally Posted by pa28pilot

I find it {shocking | disheartening} that people related to communities that claim to value "freedom" as a fundamental tenet can be so utterly committed to constraining the editorial options of what is arguably a social mechanism and discussion forum.

I find it disheartening that the point was totally missed.

Maybe you read a different thread, and accidentally responded here?

Not the first time someone in a forum got it all wrong!

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