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fms is offline fms
2008-03-08 , 06:21
Posts: 1,418 | Thanked: 1,541 times | Joined on Feb 2008
#91
Originally Posted by fanoush View Post
So for such playback you must sent only one rectangle = whole video frame (and then you are limited by bandwidth).
No, you just transfer the envelope, i.e. the smallest rectangle that contains all the changed ones. In other words, if your game uses 640x480 window, you only transfer that window.

Also the overhead of starting and stopping the transfer may be bigger than sending one bigger rectangle.
From what I have seen in other ARM-based architectures, it is as simple as writing into a few DMA controller registers (starting and ending addresses + stride). To make it more complicated, Epson must have really screwed things up.

And BTW, OMAP is system on chip, it is not clear every part (DSP, MPU, IVA, 3d accelerator - each being separate CPU with own caches, private SRAM, even private MMU units ...) can directly access any other part.
No, no, it usually does not get this disjoint in a SoC. If you have got a 3D engine and a video buffer in your chip, there is 99% probability that the 3D engine will render into that buffer. Adding another 600kB video buffer to the chip is prohibitively expensive.

Yes and such step causes delay and you must stop drawing until frame is transferred.
You don't need to stop drawing, just need to know where your current DMA pointer is and not overwrite that spot.

Anyway, as for complexity, feel free to study omapfb, rfbi, dispc and blizzard drivers (and lcd_mipid.c but that one does not add any complexity) in linux sources (in drivers/video/omap/), each handling different part of hardware puzzle.
Thanks, now I know where to look.

I don't understand it completely but seeing code of those drivers in kernel is good (or bad) enough for me to feel pity for anyone who must touch that code and may be tasked to throw 3d acceleration to the mix :-)
I have seen worse code.
 
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tabletrat is offline tabletrat
2008-03-08 , 14:34
Posts: 481 | Thanked: 65 times | Joined on Aug 2007 @ Westcountry, UK
#92
Originally Posted by sarahn View Post
I couldn't deal with only being able to run a single app at a time, palm wasn't even quite that bad.
It was though. When you get a application change event you have to dump your state to memory and a new application gets a try. I don't know if that has changed with the newer (than 2 years ago) palms, but that is how it was last time I tried.
 
gylman is offline gylman
2008-03-08 , 16:08
Posts: 5 | Thanked: 1 time | Joined on Feb 2008
#93
As someone who has used an ipaq 4700 for several years, and is accustomed to getting full VGA resolution from a 4 inch screen, I find it very hard to get excited about the iPhone/iTouch. Regardless of how slick the software MAY EVENTUALLY be, at half-VGA and 3.5 inches, it doesn't surpass today what my iPaq did 3 years ago.

I got the N800 because it had a good screen, and I'm happy with it as an internet browser. In all other ways it is sadly inferior to my iPaq, primarily because of the limited horsepower and lack of mainstream apps.

Now, if apple comes up with an "iTouchMax", with a 4.3 inch screen and true VGA or better.... all bets are off.
 
sherifnix is offline sherifnix
2008-03-09 , 00:22
Posts: 344 | Thanked: 26 times | Joined on Jan 2007
#94
Originally Posted by gylman View Post
As someone who has used an ipaq 4700 for several years, and is accustomed to getting full VGA resolution from a 4 inch screen, I find it very hard to get excited about the iPhone/iTouch. Regardless of how slick the software MAY EVENTUALLY be, at half-VGA and 3.5 inches, it doesn't surpass today what my iPaq did 3 years ago.

I got the N800 because it had a good screen, and I'm happy with it as an internet browser. In all other ways it is sadly inferior to my iPaq, primarily because of the limited horsepower and lack of mainstream apps.

Now, if apple comes up with an "iTouchMax", with a 4.3 inch screen and true VGA or better.... all bets are off.
I still think interface design and scaling alleviates most of your complaint. Windows Mobile and Maemo both waste an incredible amount of screen real estate on screen and have no scaling. You'll find that everything looks great and fits on the iTouch screen just fine. Even websites are easier to navigate on the 480x320 screen than the 800x480 of the N800. Mostly due to the slick input and resizing.
 
theflew is offline theflew
2008-03-09 , 00:51
Posts: 237 | Thanked: 167 times | Joined on Feb 2007 @ Powell, OH
#95
Originally Posted by sherifnix View Post
I still think interface design and scaling alleviates most of your complaint. Windows Mobile and Maemo both waste an incredible amount of screen real estate on screen and have no scaling. You'll find that everything looks great and fits on the iTouch screen just fine. Even websites are easier to navigate on the 480x320 screen than the 800x480 of the N800. Mostly due to the slick input and resizing.
I think the point most 770, N8X0 owners have been trying to make on the tablets is you don't have to resize that much. I see the iPhone/iTouch commercials and they are zooming in/out all over the place. On my N810 I just use full screen mode and use the page as intended without and magnification. The resizing for the iPhone/iTouch was necessary for the size screen Apple decided to use. As your screen gets larger zooming in/out isn't necessary. Multi touch is ok but not the second coming of Christ.

I guess we'll see in June the apps that come out.
 
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sondjata is offline sondjata
2008-03-09 , 01:31
Posts: 1,076 | Thanked: 176 times | Joined on Mar 2007
#96
Below you will find a quote by a person who has no clue.

Originally Posted by witznitz View Post

the nokia n800 has had 3 os's in just over 1 year. i got my money worth i hope you did too.

plus they added fm chip and going from 320cpu to 400.

lets see apple do that. suckers

one more note nokia sells tons of them outside the usa.
How about one OS that works right? hmmmm? How about an OS that doesn't corrupt your drives (sd drived is this case)? Or an OS that doesn have runaway processes that eat up the CPU and kill the battery? Or wait maybe a mail client that can deal with IMAP properly or....

and If you bought an iPhone you got about 4 updates so far in a year. Ummm yeah....

If you don't like Apple and /or Apple products say so and move along.
 
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brontide is offline brontide
2008-03-09 , 01:37
Posts: 868 | Thanked: 474 times | Joined on Oct 2007 @ Capital District, NY, USA
#97
I tried discussing the problems of the SDK on macrumors, but the RDF was far too strong there.

1) It's incompatible with the GPLv3 due to the fact that an end user can't load software on the device without paying Apple first. So developers will have to be very careful on what they port to the OSX touch platform.

2) It's one more unnecessary lock-in. There is no reason Apple needs to prohibit tinkering and installation outside of the iTMS since most people will use iTMS anyways.

3) No persistence, no undocumented API's, no accessories... Apple still keeps all the goodies to themselves.

4) Apple as the gatekeeper... I don't think I need to say why this is a problem.

5) $100/year just to load custom code onto a tethered iPhone. $300/year for in house apps.

And of course, this is on top of the fact that you are paying through the nose for the Apple way of life. You pay hundreds of dollars for the device and then you get the honor of paying every month for a locked in cell provider or pay for basic updates. Now you get to pay for every application that you install as well.
Last edited by brontide; 2008-03-09 at 01:59.
 
GeraldKo is offline GeraldKo
2008-03-09 , 02:03
Posts: 1,950 | Thanked: 1,174 times | Joined on Jan 2008 @ Seattle, USA
#98
I'm gladly sticking with my N800. It does a lot more than the iPhone or iTouch.

*But*, I *do* wish the touch-screen were as smooth as Apple's. I am *not* talking about "pinching" or tapping to get a column, or the other cute tricks (though I like them); what I'm talking about is the same stuff we do on the N-Series: scrolling and tapping.

What I would most like as an improvement in the N-Series (and I don't know if this is a hardware of software issue), is for the scrolling to be smooth and fast and *consistent* and for the Tablet to know if I'm trying to Scroll or trying to Select or trying to Tap. On the NIT, frequently I try scrolling with my finger and I end up accidentally clicking a link instead. The iPhone and iTouch are much better at distinguishing what I'm trying to do.
 
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brontide is offline brontide
2008-03-09 , 02:09
Posts: 868 | Thanked: 474 times | Joined on Oct 2007 @ Capital District, NY, USA
#99
GeraldKo,

Try scrolling with two finger, much less likely to be misinterpreted as a tap.
 
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brontide is offline brontide
2008-03-09 , 02:59
Posts: 868 | Thanked: 474 times | Joined on Oct 2007 @ Capital District, NY, USA
#100
I had an interesting discussion with an iPhone user about how long they intend to keep their device before upgrading they don't intend on keeping their device longer than 2 years! So, based on how long people intend on keeping their iPhones and how much they spent on them here is just a simple break down of how much they are spending.

$400 iphone, upgraded after 2 years = $880 or $36.66/month before taxes and fees.
$400 iphone, upgraded after 3 years = $1120 or $31.11/month before taxes and fees.

$500 iphone, upgraded after 3 years = $1220 or $33.80/month before taxes and fees.

So I can pay off my $350 n810 in 11.2 months by NOT getting an iPhone. The n800 at $230 can be paid off in 7.5 months. Hell after 3 years I can upgrade the nokia and STILL come out ahead.
 
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