Final reminder! There's less than half-a-day to vote in the Referendum!
The voting closes today at 23:59:59 UTC

http://maemo.org/vote/vote.php?election_id=44

The referendum vote has been calculated, and the resolution is "Yes"

See the results on the voting page: http://maemo.org/vote/results.php?election_id=44

okayyy... having created MC e.V. for the most part, it somewhat saddens me that 9 people voted no (and 3 "abstained").
I really would like to hear the reasons and arguments of the nay-sayers. Since I don't expect everyone to carry out their disapproval here, my first action as new councilor: I put up this webpad where you can post anonymously.

I was one such vote. I did so because I've seen what trying to integrate Council into a legal body can do from my experience with HiFo. I still believe that nothing good can come from mingling a legal entity with a non-legal entity. Council has a non-authenticated membership which can hold no legal liability, and integrating them legally is frankly a bad idea.

Had the vote gone "no" Council would still exist, and would make it's rumblings known to the e.V. in the same way it did to Nokia, with about the same legal power. The difference being that the e.V. would at least publicly respond to such things and may even try to address and fix things brought up by Council from the community.

Since I'm not part of the e.V., nor an EU citizen, all I can do is wish you well at this point. I never again wish to be involved in a legal establishment with elements that have no legal liability for their poor choices.

Hm, then it wasn't made clear enough, I guess.
The referendum is to fix exactly the concern you raised. It is explained in "Part 2 - Council role & MC eV Bylaws" of the announcement:

I've seen that, but I'm still not seeing where Council can take on responsibility for things they demand done. There are plenty of things that are legal to do that can still have consequences. For example: Forcing a decision on renewing trademarks. Either path is legal, but consequences each way are different, and land on the e.V., not Council.

Sorry, but my opinion is unchanged. Mingling legal entities and non-legal entities in a legal frame work is, IMHO, a bad decision. The resolution has passed, so anything I say has little relevance on the process. I'm simply stating why I chose the option I did.

It's OK to disagree. I'm slightly indifferent because I'm not the one in the cross hairs this time. I wish you all well and hope I'm wrong this time. If not, the community may simply have to re-learn this painful lesson again.

Woody, we discussed it in the other thread and we agree on the concern.
But, in MC e.V., Council is not a legal entity, it's a committee. And their domain/responsibility/competence now is clearly defined as Representation of the community, Counseling of the Board and to execute all elections.
So from my view, they aren't able to force other things (like TM renewal) since they're not entitled to.

If you still think there's a flaw, please tell me via email.

I voted no.

in short my view is the council adds UN-nessary compilations and is no longer needed, we are just keeping it for historical reasons

if you want to influence the legal body (MCeV), you should join it.

for those who wish to stay anonymous but still have control:
legal responsibility and anonymity do not go together its either one or the other. giving control without responsibility is plain stupid.
but feel free to clearly voice your reasoning - most people here seem reasonable, and will take your view into due consideration.

but in saying that strictly, and clearly defining what the council can do should keep the situation manageable, its just not my preferred solution.

That's funny, I voted "yes" for exactly the same reason. Maybe I missunderstood something. Now you got me worried.

I agree with almost everything you said chainsawbike ...
except that 1st bit...
Determining the relevancy of the council ...
well ...
from the varied reasons people have given for yea and nay to it...
and all of them voicing the conviction of the validity of their stances ...
quoting or calling upon varied regulation, law, etc.
and all of them having very sound arguments for yea and nay...
and after reading everything pertaining to those backed quotes...
In small part ...I do agree with your view ..council is kept for historical reasons.
Myself...I see nothing wrong in that.
Having a visible past and seeing the progression from it and where one is in the present..means one can navigate more easily ..get ones bearings and see the direction for the future more easily..
Erasing the past ..means there is no anchor, no rudder, nothing behind you to mark where you have been and to keep your direction true ahead of you..
It may seem a poor metaphor...
But here in North America we see it everyday...
the goal [excepting some places] is to tear down the old buildings and landmarks and build the new directly on top...
This wasn't always the norm..but as the philo. took hold and gained ...to the point that ...now we have a society here in N.A. who's intent is simply to build the next thing...From my view it is a meaningless growth ...like a cancer...a tower of Babel of epic proportions...

I'm all in favour of keeping our History and building with it.
Not razing it to the ground and building on the ashes.
Hell come to think of it..
Our whole site is historical ..hehe..
and all our devices and our os's and pretty much all our software...
Android, Iphone, WP, and all the rest ...they have the latest...they have their sites, and their forums too.
But they don't have a lovely old home like ours. And I adore our home. Who burns out a closet, a room or an entire floor of their home when it isn't useful anymore?

What the council may accomplish ...I see that as a wide open vista of possibility ...
So I differ slightly on that topic...
otherwise ...
I agree with the fact people should join the MCeV.
and
I agree ...
anonymous responsibility?
Forget it...
When we have unaccountable [in every possible meaning of the term..] boards, councils, or groups of anonymous shadowy members making important decisions...
Just give me the heads up when that becomes acceptable...
so I can get a head-start on work in my studio for timely carving out the funerary monument ...the tombstone... for this place and all of us.