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	Jordi	2015-08-14 , 12:30
	Posts: 400 \| Thanked: 708 times \| Joined on Jun 2011 @ Geneva - CH	#141

Originally Posted by juiceme

Yay!

See what just dropped in my mailbox

I received the same one one week ago: works without a hitch!

I suspect it's the same battery as the Jolla one, the electrical characteristics are the same and the ribs on the plastic parts are identical as well.

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tathhu	2015-08-14 , 16:03
Posts: 5 \| Thanked: 0 times \| Joined on Apr 2015	#142

What's the capacity% on those? I'd like to buy one but if it's closer to 90 than 100 i'll skip. :P Got now a official Jolla battery with 84,xx% capacity.

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ThomasAH	2015-08-15 , 10:04
Posts: 176 \| Thanked: 468 times \| Joined on Jan 2010 @ NL	#143

For the people who own the Polarcell battery: I just noticed this news over at TJC. Someone ran some (prelimenary) tests which suggest that charging the battery with the Jolla phone will overcharge it:

In the worst case, Jolla might charge it until the safety circuit on the battery refuses more, leaving Polarcell slightly overcharged, maybe to about 103% - but to be sure on this, Jolla battery curve needed, that or confirmation that the kernel chart is actually the original battery curve, values not fixed by any other chips/sensors on the phone

... and from another comment:

Until we know more, the best way to avoid negative effect on the battery lifespan is to not charge Polarcell batteries over 97% (checked by value on the lock screen on the phone). Safety circuit preventing dangerous overcharge should work, but even slight overcharge will reduce the lifespan of battery by few months.

I don't know if this is true (since I don't have a Polarcell battery myself), but I'd say it's something to be careful with none the less. Can anyone owning a Polarcell confirm this happens?

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Last edited by ThomasAH; 2015-08-15 at 10:11.

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	javispedro	2015-08-16 , 21:47
	Posts: 2,355 \| Thanked: 5,249 times \| Joined on Jan 2009 @ Barcelona	#144

Originally Posted by ThomasAH

Can anyone owning a Polarcell confirm this happens?

I'm about to confirm this. For some reason it has "increased" the design voltage from 4.35v to 4.41v and it's still increasing.

Note however the Jolla already indicates 100% at 4.35v.

Will update with the complete log once it stops charging.

At 4.36v already and it's still charging, but now has reduced the design voltage to 4.37v, so I believe it will stop soon.

Code:

[BAT] 95( 95, 95.0, 93.9( 93.9)  0.0)v4290(4239)(-218,-212)t253,c -191210,    0(18910)r231,L4142,s10
[ 1539.060185] [BAT]## SOC= 95( 95, 95),4294(4290),A=-195,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1539.061528] [BAT] Internal R 176 mOhm, I1:-99540uA I2:-218022uA V1:4274034uV V2:4294914uV
[ 1641.038394] [BAT]vddmax  = 4410 mV
[ 1841.835952] [BAT]## SOC= 95( 95, 95),4303(4299),A=-212,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1870.376865] [BAT] 96( 96, 96.0, 95.0( 95.0)  0.0)v4300(4252)(-208,-208)t253,c -210150,    0(18910)r231,L4142,s10
[ 1870.379825] [BAT]## SOC= 96( 96, 96),4304(4300),A=-207,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2175.053501] [BAT]## SOC= 96( 96, 96),4312(4309),A=-198,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2211.763436] [BAT] 97( 97, 97.0, 95.9( 95.9)  0.0)v4310(4264)(-201,-198)t253,c -229337,    0(18910)r230,L4142,s10
[ 2211.766366] [BAT]## SOC= 97( 97, 97),4314(4310),A=-200,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2518.871783] [BAT]## SOC= 97( 97, 97),4324(4317),A=-228,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2553.122813] [BAT] 98( 98, 98.0, 96.9( 96.6)  0.0)v4313(4278)(-153,-201)t253,c -248032,    0(18910)r230,L4142,s10
[ 2553.125804] [BAT]## SOC= 98( 98, 98),4317(4313),A=-197,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2862.682801] [BAT]## SOC= 98( 98, 98),4329(4329),A=-197,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2904.522783] [BAT] 99( 99, 99.0, 97.4( 97.4)  0.0)v4330(4285)(-193,-193)t253,c -266726,    0(18910)r230,L4142,s10
[ 2904.525743] [BAT]## SOC= 99( 99, 99),4334(4330),A=-192,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3085.243460] [BAT]100(100, 99.5, 97.8( 97.8)  0.0)v4335(4290)(-193,-188)t253,c -276156,    0(18910)r230,L4142,s10
[ 3085.246360] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4339(4335),A=-178,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3387.859392] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4347(4342),A=-190,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3691.050144] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4353(4350),A=-139,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3994.259300] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4353(4359),A=-180,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 4297.446878] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4374(4367),A=-158,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4390(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 4600.616938] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4360(4361),A=-119,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 4793.101235] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Unknown (Real)
[ 4793.101266] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Unknown (AP)
[ 4793.105691] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4355(4361),A=-107,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F00,R08,W0B
[ 4793.109262] [BAT]## STATUS: Unknown -> Charging (Real)
[ 4793.109262] [BAT]## STATUS: Unknown -> Charging (AP)
[ 4793.113931] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4370(4361),A=-040,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W0B

End of charging! The maximum batter voltage was 4.37v, so a bit of overcharging indeed.

Code:

[ 4920.996367] eoc_worker: End of Charging
[ 4920.996672] [BAT]eoc_worker, EOC_WAKE_LOCK = 0, End of Charging
[ 4920.996764] [BAT]pm8921_bms_charging_end, eoc_reached
[ 4921.026246] [BAT]## cc_soc 100.7 -> 100.0 (EOC)
[ 4921.026338] [BAT]## CC_ADJUST ## ocv=4142->4344( 202) soc=84.9->101.7 (-356838/16.8=21240) cps=18918->18918 valid=0 t253 (EOC Bypass)
[ 4921.495894] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (Real)
[ 4921.495924] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (AP)
[ 4921.498641] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4370(4345),A=-001,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,1,F01,R08,W39
[ 4923.966365] [BAT]pm_chg_override_hot = 0
[ 4923.966427] [BAT]pm_chg_override_cold = 0
[ 5096.297328] [BAT]## STATUS: Full -> Charging (Real)
[ 5096.297359] [BAT]## STATUS: Full -> Charging (AP)
[ 5096.299678] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (Real)
[ 5096.299678] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (AP)
[ 5096.301479] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4341(4336),A=-001,T=253,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,1,F01,R08,W0

Now trying with the standard battery.

Last edited by javispedro; 2015-08-16 at 22:35.

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	javispedro	2015-08-17 , 00:00
	Posts: 2,355 \| Thanked: 5,249 times \| Joined on Jan 2009 @ Barcelona	#145

Full log with the Jolla battery (from 86% until end of charge).

Code:

[   89.414314] [BAT]## STATUS: Discharging -> Charging (Real)
[   89.414375] [BAT]## STATUS: Discharging -> Charging (AP)
[   89.417121] [BAT]## SOC= 85( 86, 86),4074(4089),A=0249,T=311,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W3B
[   89.423470] [BAT]## SOC= 85( 86, 86),4187(4089),A=-243,T=310,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W3B
[   89.428200] [BAT] Internal R 285 mOhm, I1:165628uA I2:-188094uA V1:4077594uV V2:4178460uV
[  109.989287] [BAT]## SOC= 86( 86, 86),4193(4216),A=-225,T=309,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R01,W1B
[  377.235495] [BAT] 87( 87, 87.0, 90.4( 90.3)  0.0)v4250(4199)(-235,-236)t308,c  -10823,    0(18910)r218,L4157,s10
[  377.238486] [BAT]## SOC= 87( 87, 87),4254(4250),A=-242,T=308,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[  668.396245] [BAT] 88( 88, 88.0, 91.6( 91.6)  0.0)v4261(4213)(-222,-222)t307,c  -29353,    0(18910)r218,L4157,s10
[  668.399206] [BAT]## SOC= 88( 88, 88),4295(4261),A=-227,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[  969.596215] [BAT] 89( 89, 89.0, 92.5( 92.5)  0.0)v4272(4223)(-223,-223)t306,c  -48130,    0(18910)r218,L4157,s10
[  969.599175] [BAT]## SOC= 89( 89, 89),4281(4272),A=-317,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1275.562276] [BAT]## SOC= 89( 89, 89),4283(4280),A=-204,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1280.876880] [BAT] 90( 90, 90.0, 93.4( 93.4)  0.0)v4277(4233)(-204,-204)t306,c  -67071,    0(18910)r218,L4157,s10
[ 1280.879810] [BAT]## SOC= 90( 90, 90),4283(4277),A=-206,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4350(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1540.059117] [BAT]vddmax  = 4420 mV
[ 1581.018281] [BAT]## SOC= 90( 90, 90),4291(4289),A=-168,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1602.156874] [BAT] 91( 91, 91.0, 94.6( 94.4)  0.0)v4297(4246)(-237,-218)t306,c  -86175,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 1602.159804] [BAT]## SOC= 91( 91, 91),4293(4297),A=-237,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1902.503769] [BAT]## SOC= 91( 91, 91),4296(4300),A=-207,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 1933.476819] [BAT] 92( 92, 92.0, 95.3( 95.3)  0.0)v4300(4255)(-211,-208)t306,c -105362,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 1933.479780] [BAT]## SOC= 92( 92, 92),4303(4300),A=-207,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2555.019563] [BAT]## SOC= 93( 93, 93),4322(4315),A=-180,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2596.116923] [BAT] 94( 94, 94.0, 96.6( 96.6)  0.0)v4316(4273)(-201,-199)t306,c -142669,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 2596.119883] [BAT]## SOC= 94( 94, 94),4349(4316),A=-203,T=304,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2902.797222] [BAT]## SOC= 94( 94, 94),4328(4329),A=-174,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 2947.557698] [BAT] 95( 95, 95.0, 97.5( 97.5)  0.0)v4327(4284)(-197,-197)t306,c -161774,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 2947.560628] [BAT]## SOC= 95( 95, 95),4331(4327),A=-188,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3252.030153] [BAT]## SOC= 95( 95, 95),4338(4334),A=-189,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3298.958217] [BAT] 96( 96, 96.0, 98.4( 98.3)  0.0)v4337(4296)(-190,-192)t305,c -180632,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 3298.961147] [BAT]## SOC= 96( 96, 96),4341(4337),A=-190,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3600.428353] [BAT]## SOC= 96( 96, 96),4330(4345),A=-200,T=306,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3670.478223] [BAT] 97( 97, 97.0, 99.1( 99.0)  0.0)v4336(4305)(-143,-187)t305,c -199737,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 3670.481153] [BAT]## SOC= 97( 97, 97),4348(4336),A=-143,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3951.598229] [BAT]## CV Mode enter, soc=97.7, ibat=-186
[ 3974.278986] [BAT]## SOC= 97( 97, 97),4350(4355),A=-180,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 3991.758217] [BAT]## CV Mode leave, soc=97.7, ibat=-186, cc_soc=97.8->97.7
[ 4092.157606] [BAT]## CV Mode enter, soc=97.9, ibat=-180
[ 4277.479810] [BAT]## SOC= 97( 97, 97),4364(4360),A=-167,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4420(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R00,W1B
[ 4493.758949] [BAT] 98( 98, 99.0,100.6(100.6) 98.0)v4365(4327)(-175,-175)t305,c -240816,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 4493.761879] [BAT]## SOC= 98( 98, 98),4389(4365),A=-191,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4410(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 4794.012024] [BAT]## SOC= 98( 98, 98),4367(4360),A=-138,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 4865.238943] [BAT] 99( 99, 99.8,100.9(100.9) 99.0)v4360(4330)(-139,-139)t305,c -256395,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 4865.241903] [BAT]## SOC= 99( 99, 99),4365(4360),A=-137,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 5167.053623] [BAT]## SOC= 99( 99, 99),4366(4361),A=-121,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 5618.239584] [BAT]100(100,100.1,101.6(101.6)100.0)v4362(4339)(-105,-105)t305,c -281485,    0(18910)r216,L4157,s10
[ 5618.242514] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4366(4362),A=-105,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,0,F07,R08,W1B
[ 5628.279535] [BAT]## CV Mode leave, soc=97.9, ibat=-180, cc_soc=100.1->100.0
[ 5760.059544] eoc_worker: End of Charging
[ 5760.059849] [BAT]eoc_worker, EOC_WAKE_LOCK = 0, End of Charging
[ 5760.059941] [BAT]pm8921_bms_charging_end, eoc_reached
[ 5760.088905] [BAT]## cc_soc 100.1 -> 100.0 (EOC)
[ 5760.088996] [BAT]## CC_ADJUST ## ocv=4157->4342( 185) soc=86.5->101.8 (-285503/15.3=18660) cps=18918->18892 valid=1 t306 (EOC)
[ 5760.558369] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (Real)
[ 5760.558430] [BAT]## STATUS: Charging -> Full (AP)
[ 5760.561268] [BAT]## SOC=100(100,100),4366(4342),A=0000,T=305,On=1,0,(1),USB 500(500),vd=4370(0,0),ib=1000,1,F01,R08,W39
[ 5763.029054] [BAT]pm_chg_override_hot = 0
[ 5763.029115] [BAT]pm_chg_override_cold = 0

Something is really fishy here. Notice the lack of "CV Mode" messages while using the Polarcell. Despite that the actual charging current seems to be the same during the charging period. The battery voltage at end of charge is also 4.37v, not that different from when using the Polarcell. And the maximum voltage at one point is 4.38, even greater than on Polarcell. So not sure if it's overcharging the Polarcell, overcharging the Jolla battery now that I've let it overcharge the Polarcell, doing nothing, or if this is completely normal

So cannot confirm anything. Maybe someone can make use of the data.

The benefit of replaceable batteries is that it's not a problem if I ruin one

Last edited by javispedro; 2015-08-17 at 00:07.

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	peterleinchen	2015-08-18 , 15:07
	Posts: 4,117 \| Thanked: 8,901 times \| Joined on Aug 2010 @ Ruhrgebiet, Germany	#146

The Jolla has a user replacable battery?
Pretty un-helpful after not being able to deliver more than a handful of those ...

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ThomasAH	2015-08-18 , 17:53
Posts: 176 \| Thanked: 468 times \| Joined on Jan 2010 @ NL	#147

According to a new comment, the observation of the battery overcharging might simply have been a misinterpretation/misobservation:

By later comment by @Giacomo Di Giacomo, this has nothing to do with actual overcharge, as the charging is stopped based on different factor (current)

and (part of) his comment:

All lithium batteries have the same voltages, plus or minus maybe one tenth of a volt. The battery real voltage ranges from about 3.6 V to about 4.4 V. Do not panic for one tenth of a volt of declared nominal voltage. That will only serve to declare a higher energy storage value.

So perhaps there was nothing to be worried about after all... Sorry for the (possible) false alarm guys

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zenecho	2015-08-24 , 12:16
Posts: 71 \| Thanked: 621 times \| Joined on Sep 2010 @ UK	#148

Originally Posted by zenecho

Ive got a "genuine" HTC battery about £16 from ebay arrived today

3.8VDC
2000mAh - jolla battery 2100mAh
7.60Wh - jolla battery 7.98Wh
Max charging voltage 4.35V

perfect fit
seems to charge ok

Some (NON-Scientific) feedback two weeks in:

What can I say? It all works without any problems. Did not want to totally flatten battery, so that side not tested. I swapped it out for original battery, no problems. Charging no problems. Usage no problems.

Does in fact seem to be a "genuine" HTC battery, keeps a great charge. As far as I'm concerned its a proper alternative replacement battery

Which one am I using now? not sure would have to look...

VERY VERY Happy <g>

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hhbbap	2015-08-25 , 21:38
Posts: 72 \| Thanked: 194 times \| Joined on Apr 2011 @ Norway	#149

Mad prices on ebay for HTC Desire 310 batteries:
£90.68 Polarcell from Germany
£71.14 from Ireland

But more moderate:
Genuine HTC Desire 310 2000mAh Battery - 35H00221-00M - BA S960
£17.95

Ordered myself one from akku-land.de, using the original link.
With this result:
"many thanks for your order. Enclosed you will find our order confirmation.
Unfortunately, we must inform you that the goods you require are currently not available.
Please let us know if you are still interested in a shipment in week number 44 . "

Last edited by hhbbap; 2015-09-16 at 20:21. Reason: new information

Quote & Reply |

	explit	2015-09-08 , 22:54
	Posts: 592 \| Thanked: 1,603 times \| Joined on Apr 2010 @ Berlin / Germany	#150

Originally Posted by hhbbap

Mad prices on ebay for HTC Desire 310 batteries:
£90.68 Polarcell from Germany
£71.14 from Ireland

But more moderate:
Genuine HTC Desire 310 2000mAh Battery - 35H00221-00M - BA S960
£17.95

Ordered myself one from akku-land.de, using the original link.

PolarCell costs 12,90 EUR on
eBay.de from wansee-electronic