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Posts: 2,516 | Thanked: 6,205 times | Joined on Feb 2013 @ From my Gabriola Island hermitage, near the Edge of the World
#31
aw ...man...it isn't about shutting up.
THAT is the very LAST thing I want anyone to do at Talk here.
Others may say such things, but as long as no one is instilling hate around here or spreading fake info, I would never tell someone to shut up.
If anything, your argument was great!
it provided lots of humor to work with.
and I can personally be just as determined .
I call it the "mud puddle conundrum"
When one is young and VERY frustrated, and slips and falls on one's butt in a mud puddle, whether alone or with folks watching on,
there are times when one doesn't really want to get up out of the mud puddle....right away anyway.
Little changes when we leave childhood,
the mud puddles of life are still there, and every now and then everyone ends up on their butt in one.
You just were keen on sitting in your mud puddle for a little while there...
that is all.
Many get stubborn and are determined to sit until their butt prunes up.
I get into a "mud puddle conundrum" every now and then, not often, but I spend time there on my arse.

I am considering utilizing one of the various "meta comm options" myself ..
So it amalgamates all the comms I do use into one place so I am not closing one and opening another ...etc...
Or having multiple platforms running chewing resources and battery , just so I don't miss some important communique.

Definitely you with even more juggling than I,
should be considering it for the time saving, resource and battery saving.

Of course it may take a brief learning curve to figure out one of said optional platforms, and as a has already been mentioned by another here, that they tried one of them years ago and it didn't seem ready for primetime then.
So trying out a few and seeing how well they integrate all the disparate services I or you use, is the main thing.
One of the options may handle some of the disparate comms poorly, yet the interface and service excellent.
Another may have a poor gui yet excellent handling of comms

A bit of exploration and a slight learning curve,
for myself if it saves battery and resources, and saves me 10-30 min extra out of my day from bouncing from one to another service ,
then it is worth the brief learning curve and exploration time.

30 min a day saved works out to 7 and 1/2 days per year extra time I recoup to spend doing something else completely different...
like duet yodeling with my dog,
more conversation time my cat is always complaining about,
the list goes on for me.


y'know, if anything, like me and gerbick , you too pichlo may be suffering from the embarrassing itch of "techno angst"

I just realized that,
the 3 of us most assuredly are upset with the general state of tech and how it wastes our time and increasingly demands more, instead of liberating us all the way it is supposed to , the way it has always been promised us all.
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PIMP MY N8X0
Idiot's Guide and a video walkthrough.
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=94294
THE LOST GRONMAYER CATALOGS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ight=gronmayer
N8X0 VIDEO ENCODING THE EASY WAY
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ght=mediacoder
242gb ON N800
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90634
THE PAIN-FREE MAEMO DEVELOPMENT LIVE DISTRO-ISO FOR THE NOOB TO THE PRO
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=95567
AFFORDABLE MASS PRODUCTION FOR MAEMO PARTS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=93325

Last edited by endsormeans; 2018-11-10 at 10:57.
 

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#32
Originally Posted by pichlo View Post
I do not know what more commitment you may possibly want.
Same level of commitment to protesting perhaps?

Or what your question really is. If you are asking, "which of the hundreds chat solutions is The One", then my answer would have to be, "none of them". I did not see your question as so narrow, though. I had you for more than that.
It was that narrow. Your "commitment" to "none of them" is about as non-committal as ever. So be it. Let's play this game.

You like IRC. Folks that have no history with it see it as limited. It's not as convenient, prevalent as other applications that do mostly the same thing - offer away to communicate.

Your fight is with something new. Why? Because your beloved choice from over a decade ago still works? If that's the case, I'd still be using ICQ or AIM. Or worse, I'd still be using groups on Usenet still. Both "still work" but are not currently seen as choices by the majority.

Your complaint is against the march of time.

"Protesting for protest's sake?" Is it how you see it because you are genuinely happy with the current situation or because you have just accepted it as the norm and have not opened your eyes yet to see how bad it is?
Not going to pull punches here. You are constantly bitching and moaning yet offer nothing to the narrative other than a contrarian, anachronistic, myopic and egocentric view that shows how deeply entrenched you are to the argument as opposed to the solution. Any solution.

So yes. You doth protest too much.

I am happy with change. How I used a computer today is vastly different than when I used one a decade ago. Or the decade before that. Or the decade before that.
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#33
Sorry guys, I just want to say the last few words and then I will really shut up as promised. I just feel compelled to clear up a few things.

First, endso, thank you. I also thought I had a point. And I thought you were being a bit unfair to me for accusing me of not asking ("not once" were your exact words), when I clearly did in my post #11. In hindsight, maybe not that clearly. But I got my answer in post #12 which I acknowledged in post #17. As far as I was concerned, that was it. Sorry I allowed gerbick to provoke me. You are right, my following posts did not bring anything new to the discussion. I thought gerbick did not quite get my point and was asking for a clarification but it turns out he was just looking for a fight and I stupidly walked into it.

Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
Your complaint is against the march of time.
[...]
So yes. You doth protest too much.
That cut me deep. There was I, thinking all this time that I was being constructive by calling for unity. Oh well. It looks like this thread could not be named more appropriately.

/pichlo out.
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#34
you are absolutely right pichlo.
I recant those words.
They were unnecessarily harsh and wrong.
my profound apologies.
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Rosa sum ergo spam sum....
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Memory is a crazy woman that hoards rags and throws away food.~ Austin O'Malley

Owner of :
1-n770 (in retirement), 3-n800's , 3-n810's (still in daily use), 5-n900's ((3 are flawless, 1 has loose usb ( considering it for parts), 1 has no telephony (perfect for permanent set-up as mini-pc with one of my monitors))
1/2 - neo900 pre- "purchased" in 2013. Awaiting refund process.
3-nexus 5's : 1 with Lineage oreo 8.1 (intend stable "pie" when ready) , 1 with ̶Ubuntu Touch, 1 with Maru OS (intend maemo leste when ready)


PIMP MY N8X0
Idiot's Guide and a video walkthrough.
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=94294
THE LOST GRONMAYER CATALOGS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ight=gronmayer
N8X0 VIDEO ENCODING THE EASY WAY
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ght=mediacoder
242gb ON N800
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90634
THE PAIN-FREE MAEMO DEVELOPMENT LIVE DISTRO-ISO FOR THE NOOB TO THE PRO
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=95567
AFFORDABLE MASS PRODUCTION FOR MAEMO PARTS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=93325

Last edited by endsormeans; 2018-11-10 at 21:42.
 

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#35
Originally Posted by pichlo View Post
I thought gerbick did not quite get my point and was asking for a clarification but it turns out he was just looking for a fight and I stupidly walked into it.
I asked a simple question, requested the same level of commitment to the answer as the protest and I receive a retreat instead?

Sorry, but I refuse to be the villain here. To protest ad infinitum against something new in a thread about a new way of communicating about Maemo just really made zero sense to me.

Still doesn't. I've yet to sign up for the Discord for Maemo despite being a Discord user. But given how counter discussion is handled - you cannot have a dissenting opinion unless you fear being vilified - then perhaps my time around everything Maemo, MeeGo, ITT, Internet Tablets and honestly, this forum is over.

That cut me deep. There was I, thinking all this time that I was being constructive by calling for unity. Oh well. It looks like this thread could not be named more appropriately.

/pichlo out.
I remember when Pidgin was on my 770/N810 and I felt like it was the greatest thing ever. I could talk to MSN, Skype, AIM, ICQ, so forth. Those days are over. Folks have tried to reinvent the wheel to just communicate.

I can apologize for cutting deep. But I will not apologize for asking for clarification and then pointing out how that clarification never came. Matrix is not the answer. Vague "unity" isn't either.

Apparently we differ but we do agree in one area. I'm out as well.
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#36
The pair of you!
Argh.
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Lurker since 2007,
Member since 2013,
Certifiable since 1972

Rosa sum ergo spam sum....
I am pink, therefore I am spam

Memory is a crazy woman that hoards rags and throws away food.~ Austin O'Malley

Owner of :
1-n770 (in retirement), 3-n800's , 3-n810's (still in daily use), 5-n900's ((3 are flawless, 1 has loose usb ( considering it for parts), 1 has no telephony (perfect for permanent set-up as mini-pc with one of my monitors))
1/2 - neo900 pre- "purchased" in 2013. Awaiting refund process.
3-nexus 5's : 1 with Lineage oreo 8.1 (intend stable "pie" when ready) , 1 with ̶Ubuntu Touch, 1 with Maru OS (intend maemo leste when ready)


PIMP MY N8X0
Idiot's Guide and a video walkthrough.
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=94294
THE LOST GRONMAYER CATALOGS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ight=gronmayer
N8X0 VIDEO ENCODING THE EASY WAY
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...ght=mediacoder
242gb ON N800
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90634
THE PAIN-FREE MAEMO DEVELOPMENT LIVE DISTRO-ISO FOR THE NOOB TO THE PRO
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=95567
AFFORDABLE MASS PRODUCTION FOR MAEMO PARTS
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=93325
 

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#37
Originally Posted by endsormeans View Post
Actually there are FOSS alternatives to Discord ...if that is the ultimate desire...
Security and privacy.
(and personally I am ALL for that ...so that option should be explored and migration to said best alt is a sane option.)

-Matrix.org
-Retroshare
-Riot.im
and
-Tox

I haven't checked any of them out, but all are free open sauce alts to Discord.
Sadly,
I have tried all of these and they all fall very short.

* Avoiding the pitfalls of centralized server (SPOF)
would be a first requirement.

This would put Retroshare Top of the list
but they have no iPhone or Android port.
This dooms it from even competing.
Nice idea, stillborn.


* I have tried all the versions of TOX:
although it has bugs and whatnot it would be nice,
except it has not yet developed viable group chat.
I am still seeking a method to create a group-cloud
to host long conversations.
It should be very possible to share
(as a p2p 'living document') a group discussion
but I am not there yet. (They are considering this)
The new NGC concept sounds like the right direction,
but not implemented yet.
< A specific use-case for a ethics-charity organization>
I like TOX a lot but it still fails group functionality.
- The other problem with Tox is that ordinary users might not
be found posting their Tox ID to connect.


* Matrix sounds nice but the homeserver design is a SPOF
Plus the fact that it seems to have evolved into yet another
hyper-complicated slogan-salad rah-rah contest.
the deal-killer is:
"...email addresses or phone numbers should be used publicly to identify Matrix users..."

* Riot is a glossy Matrix client.

All that said,
for some conventional organized comms venue,
some kind of Matrix looks okay for joe six-pack dialogues
but it looks like you need a server
along with all the conventional rubbish that means.
Like bending your knee to CA authorities
and all the DNS drama. PITA gravel sandwiches...
And not to forget there will eventually be
some kind of fealty checks on whether ->you<- are permissible.


One nice (current) summary about this sort of thing:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...FOU/edit#gid=0


I have used Citadel for a long time.
It is functional for chats and discussions,
but it is a very old-school solution.
Think 1980's old-school.
It is free and a server can be setup without a domain name
and all that associated rubbish.
Users need no client - they can use a web interface
or even ordinary XMPP / email clients.
{users can also run federated servers if they wish,
it is an interesting option citadel provided long before Matrix etc}

They have dropped that feature recently

cheers
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Last edited by theonelaw; 2018-11-11 at 17:39.
 

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#38
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
I am happy with change. How I used a computer today is vastly different than when I used one a decade ago. Or the decade before that. Or the decade before that.
hmm good for you then.
But can you honestly say you are more productive with the way you use it now?
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