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Redfizh	2013-12-10 , 13:22
Posts: 10 \| Thanked: 16 times \| Joined on Mar 2013	#201

Originally Posted by dirkvl

. I have an extra launchpad if you don't want to wait two months on china

No thanks. Maybe just for a single test but I'm not working for DIY-project although it sound's awesome. I'm just making model (that works) just in paper so I could pass it on... If I wouldn't have my family and chicken-farm, I've had this project as my main goal. This is why cheap and simple plan is good. It make's selling this easier.

Seem's that I have to re-wire everything. I downloaded this Kicad and use it instead ExpressPCB. Kicad allows me to make my own components. 3D-Model is in ice until I'm sure about electronics. I just have some body made and unfinished button of 9x7mm size. I've counted that in 13 keys wide and 4 rows high keyboard (with small space between buttons) could fit to Jolla's scales so that It would still have some space to hold on. Also second and third rows have directional buttons at the left side. I got inspiration from E90 and N97. It has directional button where N97 but space around is given for key's that it doesn't bother Qwerty-writing at all like ESC or FN. 3D-model doesn't even have style of grip so let's forget this for a while.

So just to make sure:
- Rows and Columns doesn't have anything else but diodes at row's side of the component allowing current only from rows to columns.
- Reset doesn't lead anywhere cause keyboard will lose it's power when closed. When power is turned on, chip will automatically reset.
- SCL, SDA, INT, GND are wired directly to the phone. Manual say's SCL and SDA don't need pull-ups, but then again it say's it otherwise at the part where each pin is introduced.
-VCC is connected to...3.3v? 5v and regulator?
-LED's will be not used. Those leds are not meant to be as keyboard lights right? i2C could power stronger light-system outside TCA8424

Correct everything I said

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rainisto	2013-12-10 , 13:34
Posts: 1,067 \| Thanked: 2,383 times \| Joined on Jan 2012 @ Finland	#202

Originally Posted by cvp

i see DC=5V, it is for a charger like wireless or solar.
But what happend if i connect a 3,8V Accu? it will be not charge the internal accu, i know that, but will be give extra power if the internal accu is empty?? ♠

Sorry nope 3.8V Accu wont do anything since everything under the treshold limit.

5V pin is connected to charger circuit. The DC charger circuitry inside the phone will draw at maximum 1000mA at 5V. The charging is automatically stopped once phone's battery is full. Please note that charging effectively stops if the VIN voltage drops below 4,3V.

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Oblomow	2013-12-10 , 14:00
Posts: 72 \| Thanked: 184 times \| Joined on Apr 2011 @ Germany	#203

Originally Posted by rainisto

Sorry nope 3.8V Accu wont do anything since everything under the treshold limit.

5V pin is connected to charger circuit. The DC charger circuitry inside the phone will draw at maximum 1000mA at 5V. The charging is automatically stopped once phone's battery is full. Please note that charging effectively stops if the VIN voltage drops below 4,3V.

Do I understand correctly, this means a second battery Otherhalf needs an additional voltage regulator and would look to the phone like a charger, so battery level is not available (at least not straight forward)? And that there has to be an own power_in at the Otherhalf, but it could charge also the main battery through it? Or do you maybe know the max. current available on the 3.3V-line?

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juiceme	2013-12-10 , 14:01
Community Council \| Posts: 4,920 \| Thanked: 12,867 times \| Joined on May 2012 @ Southerrn Finland	#204

I just thought of couple of scenarios;

In addition to the i2c pins, there's the IRQ pin which was said to be wired in GPIO in the device. Now, as normally it is meant to serve as input line from the peripheral to the device, I assume it can also be programmed to act as output.

So, if normally IRQ is pulled up and the peripheral asserts it to zero when it has somethiing to say, could not the master device also assert it to zero to reset the peripheral? (it's no brainer to wire it so in the peripheral end...)

Additionally, if have a device that does not create events itself and has no need for signalling the master device I assume that this line could be used as extra data line to potentially double the downlink bandwidth, for example that a display-like peripheral could be refreshed faster...

And one thing still, is the Vout pin software controllable, meaning can I power-on/power-off the peripheral easily?

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Redfizh	2013-12-11 , 17:43
Posts: 10 \| Thanked: 16 times \| Joined on Mar 2013	#205

Just destroyed E90. It has 125 x 40 mm keyboard in 5 rows without shortcuts. I've tried to see key-matrix but it was insanely high-tech-space-age. Instead of buttons it had small strips of metal hopping on circuit.
E90's mat fit's perfectly and leaves some space for grip and allow's even to reveal camera... at least that's how I figured it out: You lower your keyboard just to take a photo.

I loved that keyboard

Now I'm wiring it for third time with directional keys at the spot where E90 has them. Instead of a huge enter-key, I'll set enter to the middle of the directional keys. I squeeze 5 rows in to 4.

Are you Dirkvl still using N900 -mat. I recommend this one.

Diode in each key (in combinations) that causes ghosting solve's the problem. Are you still sure about pull-up-resistors since manual says both: doesn't need and does. Or doesn't need them somewhere else than SDA and SCL.

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dirkvl	2013-12-11 , 17:51
Posts: 1,104 \| Thanked: 5,652 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Holland	#206

Originally Posted by Redfizh

Just destroyed E90. It has 125 x 40 mm keyboard in 5 rows without shortcuts. I've tried to see key-matrix but it was insanely high-tech-space-age. Instead of buttons it had small strips of metal hopping on circuit.
E90's mat fit's perfectly and leaves some space for grip and allow's even to reveal camera... at least that's how I figured it out: You lower your keyboard just to take a photo.

I loved that keyboard

Now I'm wiring it for third time with directional keys at the spot where E90 has them. Instead of a huge enter-key, I'll set enter to the middle of the directional keys. I squeeze 5 rows in to 4.

Are you Dirkvl still using N900 -mat. I recommend this one.

This thread is for design to keep it tidy.

Originally Posted by Oblomow

Do I understand correctly, this means a second battery Otherhalf needs an additional voltage regulator and would look to the phone like a charger, so battery level is not available (at least not straight forward)? And that there has to be an own power_in at the Otherhalf, but it could charge also the main battery through it? Or do you maybe know the max. current available on the 3.3V-line?

Excellent discussion and info for this thread!

Originally Posted by Redfizh

Diode in each key (in combinations) that causes ghosting solve's the problem. Are you still sure about pull-up-resistors since manual says both: doesn't need and does. Or doesn't need them somewhere else than SDA and SCL.

Advice: don't go for the 'one million diodes' solution against ghosting, this makes the design and build very complex! AFAIK all the pull-ups etc are internal!

rainisto	2013-12-12 , 15:06
Posts: 1,067 \| Thanked: 2,383 times \| Joined on Jan 2012 @ Finland	#207

Originally Posted by Oblomow

Do I understand correctly, this means a second battery Otherhalf needs an additional voltage regulator and would look to the phone like a charger, so battery level is not available (at least not straight forward)? And that there has to be an own power_in at the Otherhalf, but it could charge also the main battery through it? Or do you maybe know the max. current available on the 3.3V-line?

Yes your assumption sounds right (if on seperate battery, then you need to use i2c for batterylevels). Buf of course you could just design double sized battery which replaces the main battery and not worry about that.

Current limitation from that pin is maximum 300mA but 150mA is recommended max current drawn from this pin to avoid any thermal issues.

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minimos	2013-12-12 , 18:11
Posts: 646 \| Thanked: 1,124 times \| Joined on Jul 2010 @ Espoo, Finland	#208

Question probably for rainisto: looking at the back of the device, on the bottom left part the device frame has a black sticker. Is it protecting something? Is so, what?

rainisto	2013-12-12 , 20:29
Posts: 1,067 \| Thanked: 2,383 times \| Joined on Jan 2012 @ Finland	#209

Originally Posted by minimos

Question probably for rainisto: looking at the back of the device, on the bottom left part the device frame has a black sticker. Is it protecting something? Is so, what?

Most likely yes, but I have no idea what