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Is there a section to talk about Java ME? Apps, etc. (3)
to General by Kalatti - 23 hrs, 43 mins ago - more...
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penguinbait |
2007-10-20
, 04:49
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Posts: 3,096 |
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Joined on Jan 2006
@ Michigan, USA
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#11
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Originally Posted by jzencovich
Not until 4 is out of beta, and if I dont buy a n810, which is looking like no, I either wait for the next device, or I bail, jump platform. I wish I knew when the next device was coming out, I wont be waiting another year, my n800 works good, but it has a couple scratches in the screen, the battery cover latch is broke, and my stand is broken. (Nokia refuses to sell me a battery cover or stand) I have gotten plenty of use out of it, but I am ready for a new device.
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2007-10-20
, 04:58
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Posts: 223 |
Thanked: 38 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ home
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#12
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What's the fun in waiting for a stable release? 
Beta 3 is plenty good 
I'm not looking too keenly on the 810 either. I would need to have it at a pretty discounted price.
If you do end up jumping platform:
1) You will be sorely missed
2) Let me know where you're going
I think it's nice that Nokia's heading towards mainstream, but I don't think it should be at the expense of hackers (think iPhone).
Beta 3 is plenty good I'm not looking too keenly on the 810 either. I would need to have it at a pretty discounted price.
If you do end up jumping platform:
1) You will be sorely missed
2) Let me know where you're going
I think it's nice that Nokia's heading towards mainstream, but I don't think it should be at the expense of hackers (think iPhone).
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2007-10-20
, 07:16
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Posts: 3,105 |
Thanked: 11,088 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#13
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Everybody has opinions and these are mine:
The need of smaller size and hardware keyboard has been quite general, and not only coming from "mainstream" users. Should we dig in the ITt archives? Now when you provide both there is *no physical room* for the same memory card configuration than the N800.
I don't get this idea of geeks and hackers requiring more Gb than mainstream users. I don't have market data but for what we see the trends are it looks like it's precisely the mainstream market what is pushing cards and devices with more capacity.
And again, what is wrong with hackers vs mainstream anyway? As far as I know developers want they hacks and apps to be used and enjoyed for as many users as possible. Nokia might have some weaknesses compared to other champions of open source but has a clear strength which is precisely to develop and promote products that become successful in the real-real-real mainstream (i.e. your neighbour, your cousin and such).
What's wrong with 10Gb for a mobile device anyway in 2007/08? It's not that you can't leave home with that. Now the N95 is being superpromoted with a 8Gb upgrade.
But then there is another trend, which is to consider devices not as isolated machines but as part of a computing ecosystem in our home/office/Internet where i.e. memory capacities poll together. Has anybody thought of these 10Gb in conjunction with the improved connectivity of Chinook, bringing Samba and letting you access transparently the sharable folders in your laptop or local network? The more syncing software and network capacities progress the less critical is the local memory in your mobile device.
But yet another trend is the increase of capacity of these local memories, even in smaller cards. Is the current 8Gb limit a hardcoded limit or can it grow as innovation and market evolve?
And well, a thought written out loud: if excellent maemo hackers like penguinbait think of spending more than 99€ for an N810 is just because they want. (hint, hint)
The need of smaller size and hardware keyboard has been quite general, and not only coming from "mainstream" users. Should we dig in the ITt archives? Now when you provide both there is *no physical room* for the same memory card configuration than the N800.
I don't get this idea of geeks and hackers requiring more Gb than mainstream users. I don't have market data but for what we see the trends are it looks like it's precisely the mainstream market what is pushing cards and devices with more capacity.
And again, what is wrong with hackers vs mainstream anyway? As far as I know developers want they hacks and apps to be used and enjoyed for as many users as possible. Nokia might have some weaknesses compared to other champions of open source but has a clear strength which is precisely to develop and promote products that become successful in the real-real-real mainstream (i.e. your neighbour, your cousin and such).
What's wrong with 10Gb for a mobile device anyway in 2007/08? It's not that you can't leave home with that. Now the N95 is being superpromoted with a 8Gb upgrade.
But then there is another trend, which is to consider devices not as isolated machines but as part of a computing ecosystem in our home/office/Internet where i.e. memory capacities poll together. Has anybody thought of these 10Gb in conjunction with the improved connectivity of Chinook, bringing Samba and letting you access transparently the sharable folders in your laptop or local network? The more syncing software and network capacities progress the less critical is the local memory in your mobile device.
But yet another trend is the increase of capacity of these local memories, even in smaller cards. Is the current 8Gb limit a hardcoded limit or can it grow as innovation and market evolve?
And well, a thought written out loud: if excellent maemo hackers like penguinbait think of spending more than 99€ for an N810 is just because they want. (hint, hint)
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2007-10-20
, 07:57
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Posts: 117 |
Thanked: 22 times |
Joined on Apr 2007
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#14
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It's a miniSD slot. Compatible to microSD through adapter.
Maybe somewhere out there is an adapter for full SD in miniSD slots.(they have the same interface) Then you only have to manipulate the close machanism of the n810.
That, what you got is a SD card sticking out of the n810.
Maybe somewhere out there is an adapter for full SD in miniSD slots.(they have the same interface) Then you only have to manipulate the close machanism of the n810.
That, what you got is a SD card sticking out of the n810.
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2007-10-20
, 08:13
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Posts: 5,478 |
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Joined on Jan 2006
@ St. Petersburg, FL
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#15
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Originally Posted by qgil
Which is fine, but I, for one, would be very willing to have a little more thickness for the extra capacity (and functionality) provided by dual-SDHC slots.
The need of smaller size and hardware keyboard has been quite general, and not only coming from "mainstream" users. Should we dig in the ITt archives? Now when you provide both there is *no physical room* for the same memory card configuration than the N800.
Originally Posted by qgil
Movies, music, pictures, and even text, they all add up. If we look at the IT lineup as being potential replacements for iPods (not that they are or are being marketed as such, but the "mainstream" makes their purchasing decisions on devices in this category in an either/or fashion—Archos 605wifi or Nokia N810), lots of storage is incredibly important. My current music library is more than 100GB, I realize that this isn't a realistic storage capacity for a device like the N800/N810 right now, but the 32GB (and 64GB, soon enough) from the N800 is a heckuvalot better than 10GB.
I don't get this idea of geeks and hackers requiring more Gb than mainstream users. I don't have market data but for what we see the trends are it looks like it's precisely the mainstream market what is pushing cards and devices with more capacity.
Originally Posted by qgil
The N95 is a cellphone, despite it's other features, it is only a cellphone. I don't expect my cellphone to be able to carry a lot of media (in fact, too keep cost and size down, I'd prefer that it didn't—that's what my N800 is for
[...]
What's wrong with 10Gb for a mobile device anyway in 2007/08? It's not that you can't leave home with that. Now the N95 is being superpromoted with a 8Gb upgrade.
). The N800/N810 are not cellphones, so the same storage standards don't apply. The IT platform stands to compete rather nicely with the PMP market, especially for people who want as much functionality out of their mobile devices as possible without sacrificing too much in focus on one feature, so the storage is important.
Originally Posted by qgil
UPnP and Samba are great features when you're at home (who doesn't dig watching a movie in bed on their N800? If only we had a good on-demand on-the-fly media transcoding/streaming service for Mac), but I'm out and about fairly often without easy access to my home machine and its media collection. Because of this, having the ability to take a large amount of movies and music (especially to kill that time between classes on campus) is a very important feature. A feature that the N810, unfortunately, lacks.
But then there is another trend, which is to consider devices not as isolated machines but as part of a computing ecosystem in our home/office/Internet where i.e. memory capacities poll together. Has anybody thought of these 10Gb in conjunction with the improved connectivity of Chinook, bringing Samba and letting you access transparently the sharable folders in your laptop or local network? The more syncing software and network capacities progress the less critical is the local memory in your mobile device.
Originally Posted by qgil
Yes, the capacity of MiniSD will grow with time, but the capacity of SD will, too and SD will always be larger and cheaper than MiniSD. We have 16GB SDHC cards available now (and two slots to fill with the N800), while MiniSD is still barely available in 8GB.
But yet another trend is the increase of capacity of these local memories, even in smaller cards. Is the current 8Gb limit a hardcoded limit or can it grow as innovation and market evolve?
Originally Posted by qgil
Which is a great and wonderful thing. It means more application and OS development, and better and cheaper hardware. I just hope Nokia doesn't lose sight of the needs and desires of their early-adopters.
And again, what is wrong with hackers vs mainstream anyway? As far as I know developers want they hacks and apps to be used and enjoyed for as many users as possible. Nokia might have some weaknesses compared to other champions of open source but has a clear strength which is precisely to develop and promote products that become successful in the real-real-real mainstream (i.e. your neighbour, your cousin and such).
If, for one, would rather have more memory capacity than a built-in keyboard if it comes down to a choice between the two. Hopefully Nokia keeps that in mind when moving forward with future IT devices.
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2007-10-20
, 17:14
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Posts: 271 |
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Joined on Mar 2007
@ Finland
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#16
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I think that its really bad move from Nokia that we old N800 users cant use our ´old´ memorycards with new N810. It would be so much easyer upgrage to N810 from N800 if we could just plug old cards to new device. Also it would be good if there was two memorycard slots at device.. I have 4GB + 8GB cards at N800 and there is never too much space for files.
Maybe N900 has harddisc for user data..
Last edited by Mika73; 2007-10-20 at 19:47.
Maybe N900 has harddisc for user data..
Last edited by Mika73; 2007-10-20 at 19:47.
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2007-10-20
, 17:34
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Posts: 3,096 |
Thanked: 1,525 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ Michigan, USA
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#17
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Originally Posted by kotzkind
It's a miniSD slot. Compatible to microSD through adapter.
Maybe somewhere out there is an adapter for full SD in miniSD slots.(they have the same interface) Then you only have to manipulate the close machanism of the n810.
That, what you got is a SD card sticking out of the n810.
It makes me wonder if that wasn't the plan all along to use mini-SD after all thats what was packaged with my n800, with an adapter to be SD. I guess that could have given a clue, but perhaps that could have stated in a direction so we could have purchased the minisd cards to begin with.
Can they roadmap this things, or are they just throwing darts at a wall. If they have a roadmap they should be showing at least some specs for the next device in line.
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2007-10-20
, 17:53
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Posts: 223 |
Thanked: 38 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ home
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#18
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I'm thinking it might be possible to just stick an SD card into a miniSD slot, but it would be ugly and I would be incredibly paranoid of breaking the card (since half of it would be sticking out). Actually, would the card even mount? You'd have to manually mount it via shell since there would be no way of closing the door...
I'm all for a roadmap. I think a dev wrote about some short and long term goals of the platform, but nothing Nokia-Official.
Harddisk? How about SSD?
I'm all for a roadmap. I think a dev wrote about some short and long term goals of the platform, but nothing Nokia-Official.
Harddisk? How about SSD?
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2007-10-20
, 19:47
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Posts: 245 |
Thanked: 25 times |
Joined on Apr 2007
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#19
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Originally Posted by qgil
I personally remember voicing my thoughts on this device vs. the zaurus 5500 and 5600's. My biggest two gripes for the N800 were
Everybody has opinions and these are mine:
The need of smaller size and hardware keyboard has been quite general, and not only coming from "mainstream" users. Should we dig in the ITt archives? Now when you provide both there is *no physical room* for the same memory card configuration than the N800.
1. No hardware keyboard
2. No transreflective screen
This addresses the first point, which was most important to me. While I don't see myself jumping onto this upgrade in the next few months, for budget reasons, I'll probably upgrade in a year or so. Given falling memory prices and increasing capacity, I could justify a new card if needed. Can always ebay old cards.
Originally Posted by qgil
I think geeks are a little more likely to carry around more music and movies, because they can convert them more easily. Really, it's still a little more complex than "Insert DVD, sync to (Ipod/Tablet/Archos/etc)". The process is getting easier all the time, but it still has bugs/workarounds.
I don't get this idea of geeks and hackers requiring more Gb than mainstream users. I don't have market data but for what we see the trends are it looks like it's precisely the mainstream market what is pushing cards and devices with more capacity.
Originally Posted by qgil
And as memory cards increase in size, there will be upgrades to support them, just like the N800. Have we forgotten already that there was no SDHC support at first? As far as I can see, there are no 16GB Mini-SD SDHC cards currently, but the spec would allow it.
What's wrong with 10Gb for a mobile device anyway in 2007/08? It's not that you can't leave home with that. Now the N95 is being superpromoted with a 8Gb upgrade.
Originally Posted by qgil
So you mean "The Network Is The Computer"! John Gage of Sun Microsystems said that in 1982 - and it's taken us 25 years, but yes, I'd have to agree, we're almost there. In fact the biggest stumbling block for most users is archaic policies, DHCP, and NAT from their ISPs.
But then there is another trend, which is to consider devices not as isolated machines but as part of a computing ecosystem in our home/office/Internet where i.e. memory capacities poll together. Has anybody thought of these 10Gb in conjunction with the improved connectivity of Chinook, bringing Samba and letting you access transparently the sharable folders in your laptop or local network? The more syncing software and network capacities progress the less critical is the local memory in your mobile device.
Overall, I'd have to agree that the N810 is looking like a great device, and while 2 slots are nice for keeping "permanent" data on one card, and swapping out the other for tunes and movies, the new configuration should be manageable.
I do wonder if the internal memory can host a swapfile though? That would be very nice, since that's one use of my internal slot, and one that means a reboot to change out the card on those rare occasions I remove it.
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2007-10-20
, 19:57
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Posts: 3,790 |
Thanked: 5,718 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Vienna, Austria
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#20
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Originally Posted by Mika73
I dont think Nokia expects N800-users to switch to an N810. They've stated repeatedly that they do not see the N810 as the "next generation" but as a variation of the N800. There's nothing the N810 can do that that N800 can't (GPS+keyboard can be connected via bluetooth), so if you own an N800 (and invested in add-ons like SD-cards), there's no reason to get an N810 - at least from Nokias point of view.
I think that its really bad move from Nokia that we old N800 users cant use our ´old´ memorycards with new N810. It would be so much easyer upgrage to N810 from N800 if we could just plug old cards to new device.