View Full Version : Of SIMs and Tablets . . .
Over at GigaOM, I see Om Malik repeating the belief that the Nokia Internet Tablets need to be phones (http://gigaom.com/2007/10/17/cloud-computers/). Same thing at stuff.tv (http://stuff.tv/news/nokia-unveils-n810-internet-tablet/default.aspx).
Me, I buy the Nokia party line that you use your phone for some things and your NIT for others and they should complement each other. No reason to make the tablet do phone things.
As for that, I look forward to the day I keep cam calls going for hours, used more as visual IMing than visual phone calling.
And I look forward to the day ubiquitous WiFi enables me to access the internet without thinking about how to jack into it.
And if telecoms in the U.S. offered reasonably-priced data plans, maybe I'd be there already.
That makes me wonder what it would take to get a SIM card put into a future Internet Tablet. Answering that is easy -- the second a mobile-phone company wants one. Which seems completely unlikely.
But honestly, I don't really want my NIT to be a cellphone too.
On the other hand, I think it would be great if I could get a cellphone voice-and-data plan that enabled me to add a SIM-enabled NIT as a second device that just accessed the data plan. Sure, sure, you can BlueTooth to your phone now and that's easy, and enabling the NIT as a phone too would be trivial, but really why tether them or cross them? I'm happy to leave my phone as the phone and be able to take a call while I'm surfing. And what I really want to do is access the web from the car or the train and lots of other places where WiFi doesn't compare to cell-phone networks.
This isn't Nokia holding us back. That I understand. But it's nice after all to think about the day when sticking a SIM into a NIT is an option that makes sense.Read the full article. (http://www.internettablettalk.com/2007/11/05/of-sims-and-tablets-2/)
Much of what you discuss was to be addressed by the WiMax version to come out next year. I don't know if Xohm will use a SIM card or equivalent, but it is was supposed to be open so you can VoIP and video call to your heart's delight.
I must agree with RogerS. To me, the NIT and the mobile phone have two separate functions. A major reason for this is the size requirements. Whilst for the NIT I want as large a screen as practical, for the mobile phone I want as small a form factor as practical. These two requirements go in opposite directions. I do not want the two tools to be combined.
Exactly. And I already own a phone. And I've been replacing it regularly, which I intend to continue to do, and at the same time I intend to hold on to the NIT.
Yeah, good point. I believe that most consumers (at least in the US; can't speak for elsewhere) view their phones as somewhat disposable, in that they assume they are going to upgrade every two years or so. I like the idea of holding onto my IT for a few years longer.
That's ^ my feeling too: the 2 devices have different lifecycles, at least in the US. Makes sense from one perspective to integrate phone capability into tablets, but equal sense on the other hand to keep them separate.
Maybe there just need to be more variants...
When I got started with my 770 in December '05 I had an EDGE-capable phone. This summer I upgraded to a (cheap, second-hand) 3G-capable one. Maybe next year or later to a 3G+ unit or whatever comes after ?
Also, I still have and will keep my 770 but I'm also waiting for a N800 off eBay. With my phone I will be able to connect either using BT, without needing to swap SIMs.
I for one am quite happy that this Nokia is not a phone :-)
Edit: also, 3G and above are greedy battery suckers. My phone lasts less when connected than the 770 tethered to it. It's good to be able to manage both battery lives independently, and to still have a working tablet when the phone is dead...
Exactly. And I already own a phone. And I've been replacing it regularly, which I intend to continue to do, and at the same time I intend to hold on to the NIT.I also want the maximum flexibility of a cell phone that is small, and a NIT that has a large display, etc. Although any good 3G cell phone is more expensive than the N800. Unfortunately, in the US, 3G wireless data is a difficult market for anybody other than the carriers (even Nokia), so Nokia desperately would like to do an end around. While WiFi will become ubiquitous, open APs will not. Where this leads no one knows, except that VoIP is part of the answer, which the 3G carriers will fight, and so it's hard to know where this will end up. Whatever alternative appears, Nokia will probably jump on it with the IT.
pixelseventy2
2007-11-05, 16:43
Yeah, good point. I believe that most consumers (at least in the US; can't speak for elsewhere) view their phones as somewhat disposable, in that they assume they are going to upgrade every two years or so. I like the idea of holding onto my IT for a few years longer.
In the UK I tend to find that people either keep their phones until they die completely (and these people wouldn't be buying an IT in the first place) or change them annually. Most UK contracts are 12 months, although 18 months is starting to appear more often.
Personally, I don't like to keep a phone more than 6 months, but then I'm just awkward (and work in the mobile phone industry). Currently I'm using a Motorola Q9, Sony Ericsson W950i or a Nokia N95, depending on my current mood :) I think an HSDPA version of the 6500 classic could settle me down, maybe even for 12 months
I have a slightly different perspective -- I've had a cell phone since Voicestream was a carrier in the US (late '90s?). And, get this, I still have the same phone.
Funnily enough, it makes and takes phone calls just fine.
I've thought about upgrading to a camera phone, or something I can SMS with (I can receive 'em but sending I've never figured out). Except a) I don't like being tied to a contract (although I could get around that with an ebay buy), and b) I don't want a monthly bill.
I went pre-paid a couple of years back. I just don't talk that much to warrant the monthly fee, and I emphatically do not relish the idea of an expensive monthly dataplan fee. (Anything over $20 a month I'm going to consider expensive.)
On the other hand, a one-time purchase of a useful IT is reasonable. If it were married with a phone, though, I'd much more hesitant about purchasing, for fears of functionality being impeded if I didn't also spring for a monthly phone and/or data plan.
I have a slightly different perspective -- I've had a cell phone since Voicestream was a carrier in the US (late '90s?). And, get this, I still have the same phone.
Funnily enough, it makes and takes phone calls just fine.
So you're the guy! ;)
I've thought about upgrading to a camera phone, or something I can SMS with (I can receive 'em but sending I've never figured out). Except a) I don't like being tied to a contract (although I could get around that with an ebay buy), and b) I don't want a monthly bill.
I went pre-paid a couple of years back. I just don't talk that much to warrant the monthly fee, and I emphatically do not relish the idea of an expensive monthly dataplan fee. (Anything over $20 a month I'm going to consider expensive.)
On the other hand, a one-time purchase of a useful IT is reasonable. If it were married with a phone, though, I'd much more hesitant about purchasing, for fears of functionality being impeded if I didn't also spring for a monthly phone and/or data plan.
But seriously, I think you've done a good job highlighting why so many of us don't want to have our internet tablets be an all-in-one convergence device. As long as we have bluetooth, we can tether our tablets to whatever data plan gets rolled out and incorporated in our cellular service (if that's what we desire). And with Linux, we don't have to worry about platform lockout; we can do pretty much what we will with our hardware.
In the UK I tend to find that people either keep their phones until they die completely (and these people wouldn't be buying an IT in the first place) or change them annually. Most UK contracts are 12 months, although 18 months is starting to appear more often.
It's worse than this :)
A year or two ago a guy from my mobile company phoned me and offered me a brand new phone for nothing. All I had to do was keep on contract with them. I'm one of those people who stay with the same phone until it dies, largely because phones are usually crap at other functions (like web browsing), so are essentially all the same in my eyes, but also for environmental reasons (why create waste?).
When I said thanks but no thanks, the guy on the other end of the line got increasingly irate with me. But I stood my ground. In the end he slammed the phone down without even saying goodbye. I think he must have been on commission or something -- for giving away phones.
It was a bizarre phone call but perhaps illustrative of the modern world in which we live :(
So you're the guy! ;)
Girl, but yes. :) I like T-Mobile in general...
But seriously, I think you've done a good job highlighting why so many of us don't want to have our internet tablets be an all-in-one convergence device. As long as we have bluetooth, we can tether our tablets to whatever data plan gets rolled out and incorporated in our cellular service (if that's what we desire). And with Linux, we don't have to worry about platform lockout; we can do pretty much what we will with our hardware.
Exactly. At the moment I'm hanging around my house and other open wifi hotspots a GREAT deal more than I'm "on the road." An open platform lets me do what I want as-is, without having to get into the mess that is regional cellular data plans.
-Jennifer
Yeah, good point. I believe that most consumers (at least in the US; can't speak for elsewhere) view their phones as somewhat disposable, in that they assume they are going to upgrade every two years or so. I like the idea of holding onto my IT for a few years longer.
While here I am, about to trade my month or two old N800 in for a N810.... :confused: I've kept my phone longer much longer than that (for over a year now, wow!)
I'd love to have a phone like the IT. The sad fact is that for me, there is not a phone that can do what my IT can do, or even close, so for now and the foreseable future, it is the IT all the way. I've tried UMPCs that can squeeze into your pocket and smartphones, but the IT fits my personal needs best.
(Here's a real nightmare scenario: if Sprint comes out with a WiMAX IT like I hear is planned, I might end up getting *another* Internet Tablet. How's that for different product lifecycles? ;))
Hedgecore
2007-11-07, 01:25
I need to ask this question... If it were *any* other company that made the 770, n800, or n810, would the cell issue be such a hotly contested one?
If Kraft made the n810, would we complain there was no cheese? If CocaCola made the n810, would we complain it tasted like metal when we licked it? (I licked my 770. You didn't? Weirdo.) If it were made by Ford, would we complain about it not having any trunk space?
I'd love to see Nokia start screwing with all of these so called gadget afficionados that judge products by what they *think* they should be and not what they *are*.
That's like giving a Volkswagen Jetta a poor review because it doesn't have a v12 Ferrari engine in it. It was never supposed to, thanks for playing.
I need to ask this question... If it were *any* other company that made the 770, n800, or n810, would the cell issue be such a hotly contested one?
Excellent point :)
I need to ask this question... If it were *any* other company that made the 770, n800, or n810, would the cell issue be such a hotly contested one?
I largely agree with you. The IT should be judged on its merits as a handheld computer. A small part of this though depends on it being an always connected device. There are some handheld computers that have the advantage of HSDPA chips, but the vast majority do not.
I need to ask this question... If it were *any* other company that made the 770, n800, or n810, would the cell issue be such a hotly contested one?I don't know if it would be *as* hotly contested, but yes, it would still come up and probably often, because...
I largely agree with you. The IT should be judged on its merits as a handheld computer. A small part of this though depends on it being an always connected device. There are some handheld computers that have the advantage of HSDPA chips, but the vast majority do not.When I think of handheld computer, I think of Nokia's IT series, the OQO computers, and Sony's UX series. The IT is the only one of the three without cellular internet... I think "does it have integrated WWAN?" is a perfectly reasonable thing to look at when considering a handheld computer.
That goes more than one way, though. I own a UX, and it's WWAN is useless. I switched from T-Mobile to Sprint, so I can't use a sim card any more, and so that module just wastes space in a device that doesn't have a lot of room to spare like that. Even when I did have T-Mobile, the fastest the UX can go is EDGE. I tether my UX even though it has an integrated SIM when I use it; for the most part, though, the N800 has taken on the role in my life I used to use the UX for.
It really is an amazing device.
pixelseventy2
2007-11-08, 14:04
When I think of handheld computer, I think of Nokia's IT series, the OQO computers, and Sony's UX series. The IT is the only one of the three without cellular internet... I think "does it have integrated WWAN?" is a perfectly reasonable thing to look at when considering a handheld computer.
I don't know about the UX, but I didn't think the OQO had cellular. From the specs:
http://www.oqo.com/intl/products/modele2/specifications.html
wireless & networking
* Wireless LAN: Atheros tri-mode 802.11a/b/g with diversity
* Bluetooth technology: Integrated Bluetooth 2.0 with EDR
* Ethernet protocol: VGA/Ethernet adapter (included)
It has EVDO with Verizon or Sprint -- none at all is also an option, which I guess is why it isn't on the spec sheet.
You can't change your mind and switch from Verizon to Sprint or vice-versa with the OQO, either. It's hardware specific.
Yes, 3G cellular is a bit of a closed, carrier specific, mess in the US (for Nokia as well as users). It would be good if the IT can rely on WiMax in 2008 for the always on connectivity. This may be why development of IT is somewhat slow, because Nokia specifically does NOT want to put carrier specific 3G in the IT and is waiting for WiMax buildout.
You can't change your mind and switch from Verizon to Sprint or vice-versa with the OQO, either. It's hardware specific.
Ouch. The best argument I've seen for keeping the cellular functionality out of the tablet.
greatgazoo
2007-11-09, 00:05
I can really see the arguments on both sides, but what is really missing (especially in the US) is ubiquitous wireless. Finding hotspots in New your is a excersise in frustration. My need for a cell phone is very limited. To pay for a voice plan and a data plan is just a waste of money for me.
I guess my real wish is that nokia could have sold an IT starter kit that came the tablet and a little cellular block that I could keep in my pocket (with an unlimited data plan) so that even if i didn't need a phone i could still use this device as intended.
Then they could also sell it without the block for people who really need to have a phone as well.
Just my .02.
vBulletin® v3.8.8, Copyright ©2000-2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.