View Full Version : [Canola] Canola2 Beta6 Feedback Thread
brontide
2008-03-13, 20:30
you bastard, I saw the thrad and immediatly checked canola's site.
EDIT: INSTALLED!
Yep, just refreshed my programlist but download is pretty slow (would take probably 1 hour to download instead of a few seconds which it takes normally). Will try it a bit later (or tomorrow morning). Is youtube in the main setup or do i have to download an addon ?
I really can't wait to try out, keep it going.
MiBi
Is youtube in the main setup or do i have to download an addon ?
You'll have to install it as a separate add-on. They can't include it with the main installation due to legal issues, and it hasn't been released yet. Maybe a few days.
Edit: I see no blue theme! >_<
New Update Released!
March 13th, 2008
Hello everyone,
We know everyone is expecting youtube and last.fm but we are not adding them to the default package, but instead they will be here on the website in the "add-ons" section. Why there's nothing there right now? Well, we did a lot of changes in the architecture to support third party plugins (youtube can be considered one) so we need at least to make sure things are ok before releasing this plugins.
We need your help : use canola2 beta6 as much as possible, and if tomorrow (friday) everything looks good we will upload the youtube packages for you.
Anyways, we are also going to release tomorrow the blue theme, the simple red and black theme and as requested by users the backgrounds and some more goodies.
Thanks, and we are waiting for your feedback!
The Canola Team
Beta 6
New view for current podcast downloads; shows information about the download.
Newly organized podcast menu with new submenus such as "Today's episodes", "New episodes" (Episodes that have been downloaded and have not yet been played).
Podcast also give a visual clue to whether an episode has been played or not.
Podcast better ensures state when exiting Canola during download.
Fixed problems with showing wrong download progress for some podcast episodes while scrolling the list.
Minor changes to the default themes.
Green theme has been renamed to Marbles.
Add system for configurable fonts.
Internal changes to accommodate the writing of plugins.
Options have been added to photos slideshow: Loop.
Now currently remembers the podcast position when using the standard OMS player backend.
Added "browse by folder" to music.
Fix video position restore bug.
Speed up parsing of feeds.
Fixed bugs when updating media library.
Remembers the last position when exiting a video.
Playback audio side of podcast of the Quicktime format (.mov).
Added autostart plugins support.
Enter all internet models now blocks the screen a lot less (Settings, Podcast, Internet Radio and Photocast).
Fix image rotate bug in python-evas.
Updated player screen.
Added scrollbar in the mini-cover selection and the list of musics in cover selection.
Quicker podcast list scrolling.
Handling of feeds requiring username and password (add username:passwork@ after http://, ex.http://username:password@www.manager-t...).
Fix some media file scanning issues.
KennethChristiansen
2008-03-13, 20:46
It is time for a beer! :-)
Hope so see some of you at the Bossa Conference, where all the developers will be going the next week!
WTF.. thank you... but I can't see videos, why?
DistantFire
2008-03-13, 21:01
Just updated to beta6 and even before I saw the release notes, I noticed and really appreciate the updates to the Podcast section. VERY nice to have the "Today's Episodes" option. Thanks! I'll be using this a lot over the next 24 hours and will give any feedback I can find worth sending!
DF
@Netss (boring questions) did you checked the video folder on the media library section on the settings ?
We tested pretty much, and the scanner is much more reliable now, so investigate a little bit more there, if there's a bug we will fix it today, and release a update for critical bugs asap.
Marcelo
My videos appear but the screen is blank
What version are you using on each device? let's try to reproduce here, if we can do that.. we will fix. Did it worked on beta5? or is it the first version you are using?
Do you have mplayer installed? Do the videos play on the default media player?
Br
my version is canola beta6, and uninstall with canola cleaning on OS2008 in my n800
Yes i have mplayer instaled
In beta5 can play videos, but after installation of beta6 the default media player can not
But I can reproduce in mplayer
I can only hear audio but no video content ahahaha... XD
Hi Netss,
If you have mplayer then mplayer is playing, the default media player is NEVER touched by canola, or canola cleanup. So something must also be wrong if your device.
I know itá again the boring question, but did you try rebooting?
We did your "sequence" here several times, all videos play fine on mplayer and default media player as planned :/
If you can help us reproduce, we can do it.
If you are able can you upload this video? I can send you a ftp account for you, and I will personally test it.
Marcelo
Zeez : let's do the following.. can you run canola from xterm with -vv and then try to play the video and send to us ?
If everything else fails, we need really to find the a possible bug to fix it.
Marcelo
* Finger navigation no longer works reliably. It kind of works in the small photo thumbnails view, but not anywhere else.
* Metadata extracted from MP3s appears to be truncated (makes "Decemberist" out of "Decemberists" etc) and it looks like some albums just do not get scanned at all.
* Would it be possible to query Gracenote/CDDB/etc and automatically download album art?
sachin007
2008-03-13, 21:57
Hello handful,
Thank you for the latest release. The problem which i had with the last release .... no songs is now rectified. However the ugly metacrawler is back and it is eating my cpu with no real reason. I tried to play a video file and the it was a slide show. this particluar file when played alone in mplayer is fine but when played in canola it struggles.
Any suggestions?
KennethChristiansen
2008-03-13, 22:01
* Finger navigation no longer works reliably. It kind of works in the small photo thumbnails view, but not anywhere else.
Can you be a bit more specific, I do not understand what exactly is not working
Thanks
* Metadata extracted from MP3s appears to be truncated (makes "Decemberist" out of "Decemberists" etc) and it looks like some albums just do not get scanned at all.
This "eating chars" issue is already fixed and we're just uploading it ATM.
Best Regards, Etrunko
* Finger navigation no longer works reliably. It kind of works in the small photo thumbnails view, but not anywhere else.
We didn't change anything.. where specifically you are having problems? lists are the same as in the beta5, I didn't request any changes to that : /
* Metadata extracted from MP3s appears to be truncated (makes "Decemberist" out of "Decemberists" etc) and it looks like some albums just do not get scanned at all.
We now this last character bug, gustavo is already fixing, it passed our tests, but we will provide a fix along with other bugs asap. The "looks like some albums" part we need your help, if you send your files to me we can work it out to see what's happening.
* Would it be possible to query Gracenote/CDDB/etc and automatically download album art?
No, we already explained that "inside" canola cannot be download album art. it's illegall, there's a third party application for that (Canola-tuning). Sorry for the trouble, but unlike the other media players we are a small company, and we do need to comply with the legal issues :/
Please, send me a private message with the albums you are having problems ( do you see them in the default media player correctly? what formats they are? do you know the id3 tag version? )
Thanks in advance..
@Sachin:
Hello handful,
Thank you for the latest release. The problem which i had with the last release .... no songs is now rectified. However the ugly metacrawler is back and it is eating my cpu with no real reason. I tried to play a video file and the it was a slide show. this particluar file when played alone in mplayer is fine but when played in canola it struggles.
Any suggestions?
So metacrawler is eating your cpu? :/ We don't know what it must be, but was you said, if something was using at least half of CPU then you probably would get a "slide show" instead of a video : / Did you try killing it to see if it helps?
Marcelo
I don't know why XD
See the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aee5RHvRMVY
Only hear audio but not video content
http://www.megaupload.com/pt/?d=58GJN451
It happens with any video, but this video this converted with MediaConverter2
The fix "eating-last-character" bug is already fixed and the packages were uploaded to the extras repository.
Can you be a bit more specific, I do not understand what exactly is not working
Specifically, when I touch the screen with my finger, intending to slide things, Canola interprets this as a click and activates whatever item I have touched. Same happens when I try sliding things with a stylus.
KennethChristiansen
2008-03-13, 22:18
Specifically, when I touch the screen with my finger, intending to slide things, Canola interprets this as a click and activates whatever item I have touched. Same happens when I try sliding things with a stylus.
As far as I know we made no changes to how Canola interprefs clicks and drags
We didn't change anything.. where specifically you are having problems? lists are the same as in the beta5, I didn't requested any changes to that : /
Still, apparently something has changed. See my explanation above.
We now this last character bug, gustavo is already fixing, it passed our tests, but we will provide a fix along with other bugs asap. The "looks like some albums" part we need your help, if you send your files to me we can work it out to see what's happening.
Thanks for fixing the truncation bug! As to the missing some albums, I have got two Decemberists albums, but only one of them gets shown in the list. It may be somehow related to the truncation bug: I will update and retest.
No, we already explained that "inside" canola cannot be download album art. it's illegall, there's a third party application for that (Canola-tuning). Sorry for the trouble, but unlike the other media players we are a small company, and we do need to comply with the legal issues :/
Understood. Too bad :( I thought there was a special clause in the US copyright law specifically covering this kind of stuff.
Please, send me a private message with the albums you are having problems ( do you see them in the default media player correctly? what formats they are? do you know the id3 tag version? )
They are plain MP3s with ID3v2 tags, as far as I can tell. Let me update Canola and see if it fixes things first.
Thanks Guys, update is working well for me, like the folder view option in audio and video options as its nice to be able to traverse AV how we have stored with filenames in addition to the standard tagging options. (For those occasions when you throw media on device that is not tagged perfectly or it's not fully supported media etc)
KennethChristiansen
2008-03-13, 22:30
I don't know why XD
See the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aee5RHvRMVY
Only hear audio but not video content
http://www.megaupload.com/pt/?d=58GJN451
It happens with any video, but this video this converted with MediaConverter2
It seems that you have a high resolution video that might play fine with mplayer, but in Canola we are using Windowed mode and it seems that all the frames are dropped because of this. Are you sure it worked earlier?
Yann Benigot
2008-03-13, 22:33
I have sound, but no image while playing a video. I use the screen-rotation enabled kernel, that may explains the problem. I tried running with -vv, but there are too many lines of ouput (xterm forget the firsts lines of ouput) and if I try to add &>canola.log or >canola.log to the command, the shell doesn't care about.
Update looks great, but I'm still looking for that blue theme. :)
rccadden : it's already being "debian" packaged :) also a simple theme that has no transparency, and speed up some things :)
Br
Guys : can you try the video with a smaller / lower resolution video?
It seems that some of you have videos (that will indeed play in mplayer default) but whenplaying outside of mplayer (even being mplayer) we cannot use mplayer fullspeed, then you probably not going to get image in too high resolution videos.
Also the rotated kernel can BE a real issue, because the video didn't play when rotated AT all.
We will do some test... but if this is the case then there will be no way but flashing again : /
Marcelo
brontide
2008-03-13, 23:05
handful
I've still got media that breaks the scanner. I will have time in an hour or so to zip it up and send you a link. No embedded covers came through, and still having issues with some meta-albums that work fine in iTunes with the compilation bit set, but in canola shows each track as an album.
podcast interface is much improved, but you need to have a queueing system rather than downloading everthing at once as it kills performance of everything.
Hi brontide :
yeah, please send to us them. About the covers, did you run canola-tuning right? and remember : embedded covers only in mp3 files (using canola-tuning).
For the each track as an album : itunes has it "way" and we will not support "specific" players way. But on the settings there's a "multiple album entries" see if that works for you. It fix (combines) the albums into ones.
podcast : is queuing right now. If you push more than 3, it becomes a timer, and it waits for the others to finish. If it didn't work, then we have a bug :/
I will be waiting for your media, you can also test straight with LSM (garage project of the scanner) on all your media there, then with the debug you can tell us what broke the device easily.
Br
Marcelo
brontide
2008-03-13, 23:15
if you can post LSM terminal instructions I would be happy to debug some.
as I have found with microb tuning any more than two downloads will probably swamp the device.
genome4hire
2008-03-13, 23:20
Bugs I've noticed already:
At least one of my podcasts has messed up names for the episodes.
See this feed: http://www.democracynow.org/podcast.xml
Today's episode (Thursday) shows up second on the list, that is, behind wednesday.
The name of the episode is listed as a bunch of gibberish characters (most I can't type, the rest include OUM<}wN, etc.
Also, when viewing "today's episodes", canola locks up for about 45 seconds, the wheel even stops spinning. I ssh'd in, and saw that a python process was using about 90% of the CPU. It's fine that it has to go out and fetch updates, but at the least, it shouldn't stop the interface from spinning the wheel.
Morpheuz, has said about that in the beta5 feedback thread. you can do it by dbus or compiling the terminal commands. I will see if we can manage to compile the small terminal app for it.
Br
Marcelo
Hi brontide :
yeah, please send to us them. About the covers, did you run canola-tuning right? and remember : embedded covers only in mp3 files (using canola-tuning).
Marcelo
So it doesn't actually download anything right? Cause I found the other media players do and they end up getting the wrong album cover usually.
Hi fellow Canola lovers! :),
I am looking forward to trying this new version on my N810/OS2008.
I uninstalled the previous version I had. After that I ran Canola cleanup (maybe this was a mistake, but it's done now :( ).
Then I tried to install this latest version but it shows "not installable" and indicates that python2.5 (=2.5.1-1osso3) is missing. However, I do have python2.5-dev (=2.5.1-1osso3) for ipython and also have
python2.5-runtime (c1.0-2).
Sooo, what do I do now? Do I need to still get python2.5? Where? Will it conflict with my other python2.5 installs?
Thanks!
Bugs I've noticed already:
At least one of my podcasts has messed up names for the episodes.
See this feed: http://www.democracynow.org/podcast.xml
Today's episode (Thursday) shows up second on the list, that is, behind wednesday.
The name of the episode is listed as a bunch of gibberish characters (most I can't type, the rest include OUM<}wN, etc.
Also, when viewing "today's episodes", canola locks up for about 45 seconds, the wheel even stops spinning. I ssh'd in, and saw that a python process was using about 90% of the CPU. It's fine that it has to go out and fetch updates, but at the least, it shouldn't stop the interface from spinning the wheel.
The thing is, if the wheel is stopping spinning, than something REALLY wrong is happening and it's eating the whole Cpu. probably as you said, is the parsing of all your feeds to create the "todays" episode list. Maybe one has a more "problematic" format that eats the cpu. can you send me the other podcast you listen to?
Democracy loading time took 16 seconds here (agains the 40-50 it took last builds)
The today's episode also took 45 seconds here with only this democracy. I think we do have a bug that is trigged somewhere in this feed. I will pass to Kenneth, to see what we can do. also like you said, it's strange that the wed. episode showed up, even being with the time from yesterday.
Well, this will enter our testing list. Thanks sorry for the trouble :/
Marcelo
Hi fellow Canola lovers! ,
I am looking forward to trying this new version on my N810/OS2008.
I uninstalled the previous version I had. After that I ran Canola cleanup (maybe this was a mistake, but it's done now ).
Then I tried to install this latest version but it shows "not installable" and indicates that python2.5 (=2.5.1-1osso3) is missing. However, I do have python2.5-dev (=2.5.1-1osso3) for ipython and also have
python2.5-runtime (c1.0-2).
Sooo, what do I do now? Do I need to still get python2.5? Where? Will it conflict with my other python2.5 installs?
Thanks!
Hi we have noticed that some users have "devel" repositories that uses higher version than us for some libs, this can break straight the canola dependencies.
But, if you have iPython installed, you probably handling well with command line right? can you try to remove manually the other pythons packages, and reboot, and then trying installing canola2 first then iPython?
Also, disable any "not official" repositories just to make sure.
Marcelo
Hi Marcelo,
thanks for the instant suggestion. I unintalled ipython and media box using the application manager and disabled many repositories. Then rebooted as you suggested. I was able to install Canola2 beta6 successfully! Thanks!
Now I will try to reinstall ipython. I think ipython uses dev version of python so that readline is supported. But I have not been able to get readline to work yet. I will have to find the right forum for that question.
Vjktm : you know that we (indt) maintain the port for python and the bindings right? So you can send to me an email, I can forward you to the python team inside here. Or, you can try finding them in IRC / #maemo , just ask for "indt python guys" that somebody will help you out!
Marcelo
brontide
2008-03-14, 00:24
Another quirk...
Folder view, great idea... but please sort the directories alphabetically. On large folders I have to scrub around since it's just thrown out there ( probably by directory order ).
Brontide : yeah, we are trying to do this, but I think this is like this now, because is they way they are "provided" by the system, so for maximum speed they are showing like this. we will improve and add the sort in next releases.
Br
marcelo
Vjktm : you know that we (indt) maintain the port for python and the bindings right? So you can send to me an email, I can forward you to the python team inside here. Or, you can try finding them in IRC / #maemo , just ask for "indt python guys" that somebody will help you out!
Marcelo
Marcelo,
I did not know that. Thanks.
I used the Canola cleanup tool to uninstall Canola then installed beta6. I have 2 movies on my memory card, both played under beta5. Now one plays but Canola does not see the other one.
Other than that things are good, so far. Images are working fine for me.
So I tried updating canola2 but an error window appears warning me that "The software contains packages from a different source and may damage the system". And when I attempted to install from xterm I got a list of the dependencies needed for canola2 to install with the report that they are "unmet".
I used the Canola cleanup tool to uninstall Canola then installed beta6. I have 2 movies on my memory card, both played under beta5. Now one plays but Canola does not see the other one.
Other than that things are good, so far. Images are working fine for me.
Did you enable Canola to search your memory card to find videos?
Hi Wizink : as I said earlier,
you probably have some of the following :
+ devel (developers) repositories that have newer versions of components that are not official
+ old version of evas based demos
+ broken installation due to some corrupted package etc.
So my guide :
go to the application installer, install canola-cleanup, run it (it will delete and remove everything from canola)
Reboot the device (just for safety)
Then go to application installer and disable all non-official repositories.
If you can, leave only the nokias and the maemo extras and maemo repository.
Install canola, then enable your repositories again.
It has worked for the people with similar problem
hope this helps,
Marcelo
Thanks and I will try it! I appreciate your quick response and you dedication to solve the communities' endless flood of questions!
...and unfournately that did not work and the same error message pops up and even my application manager crashes! Installing from root is to no avail as well. :(
wizink, then you must be in the worst category : the ones with broken installations :)
I don't know how much of the fault is ours, but if canola cleanup didn't helped you
(it actually tries to remove everything canola depends, and them do the apt-get update to fix installation problems)
Can you send me the error? just to see if we have an idea?
Also : what repositories did you have on the device? What device / firmware are you using?
Br
marcelo
wizink, then you must be in the worst category : the ones with broken installations :)
Lucky me!:( So from the top. 2.2007.50-2 running on the N810. If this helps at all, I had canola2 beta5, I believe, installed before I uninstalled it. I noticed that although I had upgraded to the newest version before beta6 was released the same identical message popped up when I tried updating canola-tuning.
As far as what I see in xterm, here you are!
The following packages have unmet dependencies:
canola2: Depends: efl-core (>= 0.9.1.042-maemo2) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-efl-core (>= 0.9.1.042-maemo2) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: lightmediascanner0-plugins (>= 0.1.9) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-lightmediascanner (>= 0.1.1-maemo7) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-dispatcher but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-dbus-ecore (>= 0.71-1osso9) but it is not installable or
python2.5-edbus (>= 0.1.1-maemo2) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: hildon-imf-ecore (>= 0.1.1) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-terra (>= 0.1.4) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: atabake (>= 0.1.3) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: python2.5-downloadmanager (>= 0.2.3) but it is not going to be installed
Depends: canolad (>= 0.1.3-maemo2) but it is not going to be installed
libgnomeprint2.2: Depends: libart-2.0 (>= 2.0.0) but it is not installable
Well, canola tuning should clean this up :/ but seems that your problems is a little worst : / libgnomeprint2.2 we don't need it at all :) hehehe
Well, so did you managed to install canola clean up after all ? if not :/
I don't know if we can help more :/ and as I use to say we have 2 options
1) to suggest you to flash the device ( this is bad I know )
2) see if you can arrange a fix ip or something on the device, and we will be able to ssh to it, and fix it remotely for you.
Also, take a look at some OLDER threads about removing canola? they tell you how to manually delete all those dependencies, and then you just run apt-get update
to see if helps.
marcelo
I have uninstalled Canola2b6 and installed again the version that has name truncation fixed. This time, it has found all the albums, so that problem must have been related to name truncation. Thanks for fixing it!
As to problems with finger-scrolling, I have found that finger-scrolling works when I slide my finger at the extreme left or the extreme right of the screen. Touching an actual item always appears to open it. Is it possible to widen left/right edges and maybe mark them as scroll areas? One way to mark these areas would be to denote them with "film perforation", as if the user were scrolling through a roll of film.
FMS : this has been widely discussed before.
What I suggest you is to try to keep pressure. touching / softly moving the finger will always be a click (as the first touch is generating a UP event) that represents the click.
So try experimenting with a little more pressure.
click / select only happens if we get a click up event, click up only comes if you touch and then un touch the screen completely (remember this is not a capacitive screen, you need to really press it to detect a click and keep pressing to generate the other events)
Film perforation idea : no ways : / sorry, it's just out of our vision for it ;/
I'm sad that you are having this problems, we will keep studying (not messing the released source) trying to improve this click rate success (for all cases)
Br
Marcelo
Wes Doobner
2008-03-14, 01:49
My upgrade works great. Just updated from the application manager.
Now for the new themes, youtube and last.fm...
Thanks you guys!
@Wes :) nice to hear :) Wish all successful updates wrote here also :) to see the balance :)
BR
Marcelo
Vjktm : you know that we (indt) maintain the port for python and the bindings right? So you can send to me an email, I can forward you to the python team inside here. Or, you can try finding them in IRC / #maemo , just ask for "indt python guys" that somebody will help you out!
Marcelo
Marcelo,
I have searched for an hour now and still cannot find ipython :confused: I forgot where I got it. All my repositories are enabled and it does not show up. Please help, where do I get IPython?
Thanks.
Well, canola tuning should clean this up :/ but seems that your problems is a little worst : / libgnomeprint2.2 we don't need it at all :) hehehe
Well, so did you managed to install canola clean up after all ? if not :/
I don't know if we can help more :/ and as I use to say we have 2 options
1) to suggest you to flash the device ( this is bad I know )
2) see if you can arrange a fix ip or something on the device, and we will be able to ssh to it, and fix it remotely for you.
I did manage to install canola-cleanup, yes, but like I said, the same errors appear. I have to admit, though, I am not too keen on option #1 and I will spare you your time and skip option #2. (any option #3?:))
As much as I love canola, perhaps I will forshake it and not install it and save me the trouble...wait, no I think it is worth it!;)
I think I even had to flash before to make the transition from canola to canola2!
Hi Wizink : just making clear that, as you can see a lot of users install with no problems, so it's also some "behaviors" that can cause this :) if you have ipython, you problably using some other repositories not "recommend" for end users, thus you know you're putting your installation in danger also :)
We cannot predict all the problems, that OTHER non official packages in repositories across the globe can cause : / unfortunately also the application manager is not dealing correctly with this : / So you can more or less see, that you do, you pay a price :)
What we make sure to work : on flashed or brand new devices, and in our personal / already with previous version installed devices, and official repositories only. the problems other repositories can generate is beyong our reach : /
anyways, thanks for the persistence and we would do what we can to reduce even more this cases, but there's a limit : /
Marcelo
Sorry Wizink (about the ipython thing) I just confused posts, but still the message :)
For VJKTM : http://www.gronmayer.com/it/index.php search for ipython, it's in the debian repository ( :( )
im getting a download failed message after about 70 percent
Once again, I appreciate your help and I thank you and the other developers for creating canola2. Even if I have to reflash, I believe it is worth the effort. Canola2 is too much of an asset to these internet tablets to not have. :)
@Mooler : this can be caused by several issues not related to canola or it's package, so the best way to receive help is providing us here in the forum the result of the log.
*just saying "it's failing at X" doesn't help at all.
First thing that could have happened: your internet connection failed in the middle of the download. / the maemo repository went down for a couple of seconds, and so on.
Can you please copy and paste your log from the application installer here?
Br
Marcelo
@Wizink : thanks, I just want to make sure you know that we tried everything we could :) we really try to help everyone here as much as possible :)
Marcelo
sorry Marcelo. the problem has corrected itself. Ill be sure to be more informative and descriptive next time. BTW Nice update. Cant wait for youtube
What I suggest you is to try to keep pressure. touching / softly moving the finger will always be a click (as the first touch is generating a UP event) that represents the click. So try experimenting with a little more pressure.
I experimented with this for a while. It is difficult to get working and nearly impossible to get working every time. In other words, when you stick your finger to slide things, you never know if it is going to work or not, pretty much as if you were pressing a button without jitter removal.
Film perforation idea : no ways : / sorry, it's just out of our vision for it ;/
At least make the empty bands at screen edges wider, even if you are not willing to denote them with any graphical elements...
I'm sad that you are having this problems, we will keep studying (not messing the released source) trying to improve this click rate success (for all cases)
You may want to change the way you register a click and introduce a "jitter protection" of a sort. For example, you may want to register a click only if there is no movement 500ms past the UP event.
PS: BTW, I have never been able to invoke Nokia's on-screen finger keyboard. I am always getting a stylus keyboard, even when touching screen with a finger. This may somehow be related to Canola problem described above.
Hi mooler :) no problem, hope we are able to delivery asap, we have bossa conference coming ( www.bossaconference.org ) so maybe we will be delayed a little but, we are here right now doing some tweaks on it :) maybe MAYBE tomorrow it's good to launch, if not, only next friday more or less.
Marcelo
Great news! I finally managed to get canola2 installed!
I ran apt-get update and xterm listed the dependencies that were broken or needed to be dealt with. Then I ran apt-get -f to remove the litte buggers, which it did. And finally I ran apt-get install canola2 which worked! HOORAY! :)
I had forgotten I had disabled the non-nokia repositories which in turn allowed me to complete the steps above.:)
Now I do not need to reflash!
I experimented with this for a while. It is difficult to get working and nearly impossible to get working every time. In other words, when you stick your finger to slide things, you never know if it is going to work or not, pretty much as if you were pressing a button without jitter removal.
(please, don't take this in a rude way, actually I'm really calm, and trying to explain our side also ok? )
Well, you need to understand my position :) we are trying to follow an idea, and this must have no arrows / select area. Of course we are not good still, and the screen doesn't help, but there's several users that have no problem with that, others that have a small problems (small error rates) and others like you that have more problems.
But I will not change Canola's main design principles based on the smaller number of users. Unfortunately not. We tried (doing the taskbar) but just do not work for us.
There's other ways, and I think pycage has done the way people expect and also Kagu : you need to touch a play area to do stuff, so scrolling is always safe. So I can only point you towards them, because we will not implement those ideas any time. Actually I think it will be easier to maemo to have a capacitive / precise screen faster than this :)))
You may want to change the way you register a click and introduce a "jitter protection" of a sort. For example, you may want to register a click only if there is no movement 500ms past the UP event.
Well, :) you're not the first one to come with "numbers" and believe me: we have tested so much so much combinations, and also there's threshold for movements, click, everything. The thing is : I really think even when you are moving your finger : you are not generating events, or your screen has some problem of some sort (interrupted events - but I don't believe that)
Your last quote actually tells me something :
PS: BTW, I have never been able to invoke Nokia's on-screen finger keyboard. I am always getting a stylus keyboard, even when touching screen with a finger. This may somehow be related to Canola problem described above.
This means 2 things : one ) you have a problematic screen, failures in the pressure part because , the thumb only comes when you press with a finger (several touch points) and with some pressure. If you don't get it, by pressing with your thumb I suggest you to try other device and see if the same happens. two ) you have a personal way of touching that makes the simple click happens to fast, and with concentrated pressure, thus "being" registered just like a stylus.
But in the end, as you said that with the stylus also failed, I really think that can also be the problem on the screen : / (not removing the blame from us, I know we are far from being good on this, but you just seems to have more problems than the average)
Can you find another device with a friend to test this? and pass your device to your friend to see if the same thing happens with them ?
Marcelo
@wizink : now I'm happy :) thanks for letting us know that :)
brontide
2008-03-14, 03:24
Not to throw gasoline on the fire..... but ;-)
I've noticed the problems scrolling too. I will attempt to scroll and about 50% of the time it works. The other 50% is split activating the item under my finger when I start the scroll or when I end it.
Short of the small links in the browser I can operate most of os2008 with a finger including small menu items most of the time.
Marcelo --
I have been eagerly awaiting beta6, and installed it this afternoon shortly after it became available.
I had asked (during beta5) for 'bookmarking' a video when exiting, so that play will resume at that point when the same video is selected again. This works now, excellently. :) There is one gap, I think, in the logic... but it's minor, at best. I was watching video this evening as my battery level fell low enough to cause the tablet to shut down. When canola2 got the signal to exit prior to shutdown, it didn't leave the bookmark on the video it was playing.
I'll admit this is quite minor, and I can live without it, so long as the 'bookmark' works the rest of the time. ...but, if you happen to be in that area of the code, it would be nice to have it always leave the bookmark if it hasn't completed playing the video.
I'm now eagerly looking forward to your youtube plugin... :)
I've noticed the problems scrolling too. I will attempt to scroll and about 50% of the time it works. The other 50% is split activating the item under my finger when I start the scroll or when I end it. Short of the small links in the browser I can operate most of os2008 with a finger including small menu items most of the time.
Pretty much the same here, either with a finger or with the stylus. MicroB browser scrolling works.
For the My Music -> Albums, is there anyway to group the albums with same name and show all songs under that album cause mine shows every on the same album as a different entry so i have like a list of the same albums one after another.
Works just fine. Waiting last.fm plugin :>
Brontide : yeah, please keep the information coming, if it turns to be a major problem, then we have a situation : / but again, it's not near perfect, or very good, but we now that it works if you press slightly harder, and keep it while scrolling. For me it's like 15% error (of course I'm part of the project so I don't count) and actually I miss because I think I'm on the iphone screen.
The browser scrolling is different, it doesn't do the kinetic thing, that's the major issue for us, when moving, we want to let you "accellerate" by touching again, and this touchs is as fast as a click, and of course there's more details and variables... As we said, we are trying to improve, but afaik, I really think this kind of low sensitivity screen is not the best thing for what we are trying to do : /
as I said, let's see if we can improve in the next version, but I can't promise anything.. at least I'm safe to say that for those with high rate of error, they have options in the platform.
Also, it's quite strange to hear from you that you have the same problem with the stylus,... because the stylus causes so much more pressure, it's not easy to miss wit that... Guys, do you have a good camera? gold you place the camera near (with macro) and try to record your usage? I want to understand better the usage pattern of each one if possible (like which part of your finger is touching, how do you move the finger across the screen, when you lift it up etc) this would be of great help to identify good strategies to solve the problem.
We just want to avoid hacks in the beginnig.
@cLin : please : go to settings, media library -> multiple album entries. click there and see if you repeated albums appears, if so, you will be able to "combine" them into one album.
BR
Marcelo
@briand : this case is a little bit more complicated, because I think the sinal is not sent to canola on time of saving the bookmark to a file : / Then I think this could be one of the more complicated cases (like saving in time intervals) but this can add some overhead.
I will take not of this issue, and if possible we will investigate later..
thanks for the feedback!
Guys facing the Scrolling problem : I forgot to ask, is there a place where it happens less then the others? where does it happen the most?
a) the regular list (textual)
b) the grid view (album cover)
c) the album view (proportional grid)
?
Thanks again...
Marcelo Eduardo
@handful
Thank's for this wonderfull app and your patience with end-users. Installed Beta6 1 and 2 without any problem (may i say as usual, at least for me :) ). I always use the update function (no uninstall / reinstall, why do it when not necessary...) and now i am waiting (as everyone i suppose) for the plugins.
@fms
Have the same problem bringing the thumb-keyboard up. In Canola it works because Canola seems to handle it. But everywhere else i fail. I press hard enough to change the color of the underlying tft (gives darker spot around the press area like tft behave when you touch them...is this bad for the tft ???) Are there any settings that could avoid me from bringing up the thumb-keyboard ? (In settings i have "activated" the thumb-keyboard...)
@handful
sorry for the "off-topic" part :D Thanks again to the team...
MiBi
mudhoney
2008-03-14, 08:42
Personally, the scrolling took some getting used to, but after a short while it became pretty easy to use without too many unintended selections. I'd say I prefer it a lot over using up space scrollbar or other section like that.
Hi,
First, I would like to thank you for this great app.
Then the complain ;) : I use to copy some pictures on my device, a kind of "best of" of friends, holidays, parties and relatives. To save space, I usually edit those pictures and make them 800x480. Problem is while doing so, the creation time is then different from the capture time, and then I get those images in the wrong order. I use to name the files using YYMMDDn.jpg so that they are in the right order in the file browser. Is their any way to have Canola switched to "file name" order and not "creation date" one?
Hi and Thanks Canola Team & Marcelo ;)
I updated without a problem everything looks very good !
I now have a slight problem with a video but I'll try and be more precise soon ...
I still can't get my (few) m4a files to show tag infos and so album cover but that's no big deal
Thanks again
TTgowings
2008-03-14, 10:17
The new improvements look great, though I am still having issues with videocasts, Canola doesn't recognize the feed. The main website is Revision3 (http://revision3.com/) and I watch several different videocasts on that site.
Also of note my xvid encoded videos seems to have a slight audio to video sync issues, not sure if that is a Mplayer issue or a Canola issue. I'm currently running ver. 1.0rc1-maemo.25.n8x0.
I can adjust the sync issue within Mplayer settings but I have to readjust for every video at the start of each.
So it may be an issue within Mplayer or a codec issue, not sure, and maybe the videocast issue may be a plug-in ? or was ver. 6 supposed to supporrt videocasts out of the box and I may have a troublesome feed for Canola to recognize?
Hi guys, let's see if I can answer some comments:
Ttgowing: we still do not support videocast, we want to, and will be easy once we are done with podcasts
The sync issue was old, I haven't faced this problem for a while : / see if you can udpate mplayer ?
@fredoll : we are trying to find out the m4a problems, but I think we don't have access to the lib that does the parsing :/ but we will keep trying
BR
Marcelo
Thanks for the great update Marcelo and the team.
I have slight problem with Podcasts. My favorite podcast at http://www.radio538.nl/clublife/podcast.xml is not recognized by Canola anymore. "URL is no feed: application/xml"
Can anyone else test if it works?
Br,Jaykie
Yes :) some people here not (they come to work hidden at late night) :)
Just installed this new beta successfully. Everything works fine - podcasts and scrolling too
Thinking of trying out the Internet Radio feature now -- do you guys have any recommendations that work in Canola? I'm into 80s/90s music, ambient, trance, lounge, thanks :)
@jaykie : what can be happening is that the server is sending a wrong mime type. I will forward to Kenne (he's behind the podcast development) to see if he already tested with that. If not we will add the feed to our testing list!
Marcelo
Ghook : try the shoutcast.com :) I think there's plenty to choose from :)
Marcelo
Wow answer in 3 mins. It's tru that you never sleep ;)
Thanks Marcelo!
sachin007
2008-03-14, 11:47
Does the internet radio feature work? i have tried many bollywood shoutcast stations and it says no feed available for this url?
Here is an example:
http://www.aakasavani.com:8500/
@jaykie : on release dates we are a little bit more "alert" to be able to help you guys in the best way possible.
I think people realized, that we have been so criticized by the other people in the community of developers for not being open source app, so we try to excel in other sections, I think our relationship with you (the real users, our "costumers") is pretty good, and we keep the answers quite fast, we implement the changes requested (when they fit the concept) and I personally try to answer each question in the best way possible. (of course I'm human and I do get pissed when people don't do a search before posting - but who cares :P )
I would like to really pass forward our "way" of working, not if we are or not opensource app. So we do believe in user centered design, but we also believe that sometimes you need someone to take decision on some controversial subject (even if it's not a goode decision).
I really like the way things are going here in the community, you guys send us a lot of feedback, and we try to give you good updates as fast as we can (I know sometimes it seems to take too much time).
So, in the end, my speed is a way to show respect and thank you, and also I try to protect the team. Protect in the sense of : they have so much stuff to do, that I can take care of the problem heres so we can speed up canola development even more :) Team work always (of course they are also here : Morpheuz, Chenca, Ulisses, Barbieri, Kenneth, Etrunko, Caio) :)
Owo, sorry for the long post :)
Guys facing the Scrolling problem : I forgot to ask, is there a place where it happens less then the others? where does it happen the most?
a) the regular list (textual)
b) the grid view (album cover)
c) the album view (proportional grid)
For myself I always found a) text lists to cause me the most problems with false clicks which was/is irritating. I found in my case that I was being far to light with screen pressure and was using the side of my finger being concerned about scratching/smudging the clean screen.
When I firmly press with the full face of finger/thumb ("Finger print" method) or use stylus, Scrolling vs Clicking in Canola works most effectively.
The problem with the finger/thumb method currently is screen SMUDGING, Looking forward to self cleaning screens on our NIT's in near future :rolleyes:
@sachin : try getting the .pls file ; / sorry for that but we cannot parse the whole page looking for it :/
http://www.aakasavani.com:8500/listen.pls
try this one!
BR
marcelo
KennethChristiansen
2008-03-14, 12:53
Does the internet radio feature work? i have tried many bollywood shoutcast stations and it says no feed available for this url?
Here is an example:
http://www.aakasavani.com:8500/
try adding /listen.pls
brontide
2008-03-14, 13:05
If I wanted to improve m4a tag support, what library should I be working on/with or is this a closed portion of the app?
Also, it's quite strange to hear from you that you have the same problem with the stylus,... because the stylus causes so much more pressure, it's not easy to miss wit that...
Here is an important note: I have a BoxWave ClearTouch screen protector on. May it somehow interfere with Canola's interpretation of the touch events?
a) the regular list (textual)
b) the grid view (album cover)
c) the album view (proportional grid)
I have just tested it in different modes, using stylus for reliability, and here are the results:
1. Textual list:
Left edge always works. The list itself (i.e. items) works sometimes but rarely, the right edge (where scrollbar appears) never works.
2. Album covers (small):
Scrolling works.
3. Album covers (large):
Scrolling does not work, but clicking on left/right screen edges scrolls covers.
important: scrolling through a list of songs that shows to the right of the album cover works in this mode.
4. Photos (small):
Scrolling works.
5. Photos (large):
Scrolling does not work (opens current photo), but clicing on left/right screen edges scrolls covers.
munky261
2008-03-14, 13:41
when im trying to update canola everytime i get a failed to download error. any ideas?
refresh the applications list in the Application Manager? it might still be trying to find beta5 because it's looking at an out-of-date list ...
munky261
2008-03-14, 13:50
ive refreshed the list more than once , ittl start downloading , can see a sliver of the progress bar jumping back and forth a bit then ittl get a little bit downloaded , then go fast up to about halfway or so then i get the error message.
andrunko
2008-03-14, 13:53
If I wanted to improve m4a tag support, what library should I be working on/with or is this a closed portion of the app?
Hey,
The m4a/mp4/... support is built using libmp4v2. If you have any problem with it you can try improving this library. Any problem please let me know
BR
brontide
2008-03-14, 14:03
there might be an easy fis to the scrolling issue, I'm working on another one of my famous tweaks that will not only help canola, but all apps.
brontide
2008-03-14, 14:05
what version of libmp4v2
thanks
what version of libmp4v2
thanks
Probably the one that's in Extras
libmp4v2-0 (v. 2.0.0+cvs20040908+mp4v2+bmp-0ubuntu6maemo1)
@fms
I think for the large photo / album covers the problem is not that scrolling does not work but that it's meant to scroll only when touching the next / previous entry on the left / right side of the screen (no bug but feature)...Handful will correct me if i am wrong...
The screen protector is probably reducing sensivity, which could bring problems in canola-scrolling (my guess).
MiBi
andersbk
2008-03-14, 16:09
New Update Released!
New view for current podcast downloads; shows information about the download.
Newly organized podcast menu with new submenus such as "Today's episodes", "New episodes" (Episodes that have been downloaded and have not yet been played).
Podcast also give a visual clue to whether an episode has been played or not.
Nice progress. I have a couple of podcast related comments.
1) The "visual clue" for whether an episode has been played (the "green dot") only works if you don't delete the podcast file. If I listen to a podcast, then then delete it when I'm done, the "green dot" comes back.
2) Many podcast xml files contain some text information, like feed content, etc. It would be nice if Canola parsed this information and presented it to the user. For the developers, I'm talking about the <description>, or <itunes:subtitle> tag for an individual <item>. This would be helpful for many podcasts that have nondescript titles.
-anders
munky261
2008-03-14, 20:04
I uninstalled canola 2 and tried to download it and reinstall and i still get a "failed to download" error message after the progress bar hangs for a while. why cant i get canola to download???
@munky : did you check your connection ? if says failure to download is probably one of the following things (based on other users with the same problem)
a. you are trying to install behind a connection that is not stable / has firewalls or proxies etc
b. the maemo official repository could be down, then causing your problem.
To know if a is your case, try installing other application (not python based) and see what happens.
Also, if you had this failed to install, and you did the unninstall only trhought the application manager, I would suggest you to first, install canola-cleanup, run it. Reboot the device and then install beta6. It has worked for the people here in the forum in the cases where problems appeared.
So, it looks that this problems is REALLY not related to canola itself, and everything you need help, please post your application manager's LOG text here so we will be able to help you out.
Br
Marcelo
Big post answering the ones I haven't yet :
@fms
1. Textual list:
Left edge always works. The list itself (i.e. items) works sometimes but rarely, the right edge (where scrollbar appears) never works
- this is strange, because EVERY thing is the same code :) theres no difference between position on any part of the screen since beta2.
2. Album covers (small):
Scrolling works.
3. Album covers (large):
Scrolling does not work, but clicking on left/right screen edges scrolls covers.
- There no scrolling here. Tearing would not let us do it the right way with so big photos. It looked terrible, it was removed. Actually was only drag to next.
important: scrolling through a list of songs that shows to the right of the album cover works in this mode.
- Ok, this is also the same list. But it already shows something strange, because you are in the middle of the screen, where you said in the 1st one that works rarely.
4. Photos (small):
Scrolling works.
5. Photos (large):
Scrolling does not work (opens current photo), but clicing on left/right screen edges scrolls covers.
- Yes, the same behavior as the Big photos. So you got the pattern. If it big, tearing kills it, we do click to next.
My final comments : I really don know if your screen protections do make it worse, but I was really worried to the fact that you cannot screen on the left edge ( of a simple song list ), the whole screen should behave the same, unless you are in the podcast screen that has the right side widget for downloads.
---------------------
@Brontide :
there might be an easy fis to the scrolling issue, I'm working on another one of my famous tweaks that will not only help canola, but all apps.
You're more than welcome dude :) I would be quite happy if this solves people's problem without changing the design.
@Andersbk :
Nice progress. I have a couple of podcast related comments.
1) The "visual clue" for whether an episode has been played (the "green dot") only works if you don't delete the podcast file. If I listen to a podcast, then then delete it when I'm done, the "green dot" comes back.
- Yeah, I only spotted it a couple of minutes before releasing :/ I think we were just to tired of looking that we didn't notice. sorry, easy fix coming on next update.
2) Many podcast xml files contain some text information, like feed content, etc. It would be nice if Canola parsed this information and presented it to the user. For the developers, I'm talking about the <description>, or <itunes:subtitle> tag for an individual <item>. This would be helpful for many podcasts that have nondescript titles.
- We already have that on the database, and we have the list screen with preview description added, to help exactly choose the right episode. It is just not "tested" enough but is in the backlog for next update. But I already saw it working :)
Marcelo Eduardo
- this is strange, because EVERY thing is the same code :) theres no difference between position on any part of the screen since beta2.
Weird, but maybe it is some kind of a timing issue related to redrawing list items? Lists with small items seem to scroll just fine, as well as scrolling a list of big items by its [inactive] left edge. But every time I try scrolling by touching and dragging a large list item, things get out of hand.
- There no scrolling here. Tearing would not let us do it the right way with so big photos. It looked terrible, it was removed. Actually was only drag to next.
Yea, I have figured that much, but listed those two cases for completeness.
- Ok, this is also the same list. But it already shows something strange, because you are in the middle of the screen, where you said in the 1st one that works rarely.
It is the same list all right, but it is much smaller and has smaller items. That may make a difference somehow.
Hehehehe!
I found why scrolling does not work in the large textual list! Handful, at the bottom of the screen you have a strip of background which looks exactly the same as the list background but it is insensitive to the stylus. If one starts scrolling by touching with his stylus in that part of the screen (and it is pretty easy, it is a wide strip), then the scrolling does not happen and a click is registered instead wherever the stylus stops.
The "BACK" button sits in the left corner of the faulty strip. I guess you intended to put more icons at the bottom, so you made that area insensitive. Please, make it sensitive again! :)
@fms : yeah.. I think you hit the spot there, it's uite possible that you found one problematic thing. We will take a deep look on this!
(that's why I was asking about the video using it, to see from where to where people scrolls etc..)
But thanks so much for this nice feedback...
yeah, there's the design of a contextual toolbar for that area.
@fms : yeah.. I think you hit the spot there, it's uite possible that you found one problematic thing. We will take a deep look on this! ... yeah, there's the design of a contextual toolbar for that area.
You probably want to make that area suitable for scrolling initiation, as long as the user does not directly tap a conceptual toolbar button. Same goes for the right edge of the screen, where you have the scroll position indicator. Otherwise, things get mighty confusing, with seemingly innocent areas of the screen acting funny.
yeah, sure, but it was fun, that it can the cause of the profile, users that start scrolling from there get the error, while users that always start from inside the list not.
I kind of have the felling that I experimented that yesterday in the opposite (much harder way) to touch the taskswitch and then enter the touching scroll area. We will for sure investigate this
thanks again Fms
Installed the update. Encountered no specific issues. Scrolling works as in previous betas. My issues with multiple album displays are gone. Everything seems to work great! So I guess what I am saying is: Bring on the YouTube and LastFM plugins! :-)
GeneralAntilles
2008-03-14, 22:42
Just a quick sidenote, I'm incredibly impressed by the amount of work the INdT guys put into not only their excellent software, but also the insanely responsive, competent and patient triage support they do for the (occasionally ungrateful :() community here.
Major, major kudos!
Hi general!!!
Thanks thanks thanks dude! We try to treat people with maximum respect and patient :) even when it's not our fault :) because in the end, we love to work on such platform that gives you the ability to do things like we are doing :)
I think I will not be able to keep this rhythm, as my responsibilities are increasing (I have something like 12 projects going on now ) and It's quite hard to convince my wife that I'm not chatting with ladies when I'm answering here :)
Anyways, I get your kudos with MAJOR MAJOR pleasure, in behalf of each team member!
ALSO : we just uploaded the new themes :))) there's 2 simple themes... that speed up some screens :))
BR
Not sure if this bug has been mentioned already:
If there are non-ascii (utf8) characters in the music title, the title is garbled. IIRC this worked correctly in the older version of Canola and it does work correctly with the Nokia-Mediaplayer.
nstalled the update. Encountered no specific issues. Scrolling works as in previous betas. My issues with multiple album displays are gone. Everything seems to work great! So I guess what I am saying is: Bring on the YouTube and LastFM plugins! :-)
Nif : don't worry, this is priority zero now . We have bossa conference now, time to discuss the future, but we will do some work :)
Marcelo
e-motion
2008-03-14, 23:15
Just wanted to second General's thanks to your team : great work and great app. Updated without issue either. :)
Yeah :) I think we are not on a good path to the final releases for the planned features :)) finally !! I can't wait to start working on new things :) (lie, I'm already doing that) :)
Comments:
1. I got the same "unable to install" msg even after running the clean-up script. Had to manually install via xterm.
2. After running the album cover app, a few albums always default to the same (wrong) cover. I have to manually select the correct one.
3. It would be nice if the Album view also showed the album cover on the left.
4. The Artist view could also show a thumbnail of the first album. Also, when you tap into an Artist, the album art should appear next to album.
5. Seems odd that the 2nd row of the Album Covers view starts at the end of the 1st row. Seems like it should be up-down then left-right (hope that makes sense)
6. No problems for me with scrolling. Seems same as v5.
7. Be nice you could manually add album art or perhaps it should--as a last resort--use first jpg in the same folder as songs.
8. If you tap Now Playing icon in upper right, hitting the return icon in bottom left should take you to previous screen.
9. I must not be using the Podcast feature right. Shouldn't it always remember the last position where I left off? After I exit, play a different song, etc. Doesn't seem to work that way.
All that said, I have to say I LOVE the app! I was very close to getting a Touch and this totally scratched that itch. Good work.
javier_h224
2008-03-15, 01:00
canola beta 6 doesnt works on my n770 os2007he
Burnin TODI
2008-03-15, 01:07
I installed and all seems to work great...just giving you the balance that some download/installs are working. Will play with it for a while and see if there are any bugs/issues.
Thanks for the hard work, I wanted a good podcast player, and i think canola is the best answer so far
@Javier : can you provide more info? Saying "don't work" is not going to help us helping you :) so please send more info about the log.
Where do you get the error ? Installation (send the log file) - did you get the error after installing ? Did you install one version over the beta5?
We will try to help you
Marcelo
@spice3d
Comments:
1. I got the same "unable to install" msg even after running the clean-up script. Had to manually install via xterm.
> Some users still have this, maybe due to some "odd" repositories that breaks the dependency chain. We cannot fix this, and users that adds more repositories without knowing if they are going to "influence" the official ones, will need to deal with the consequences :) For our testing we use 4 cases (clean install, clean install with beta5, used (some repositories + canola5)) then we install several times. If it fails, we fix before release it :/
2. After running the album cover app, a few albums always default to the same (wrong) cover. I have to manually select the correct one.
> this is the search result. We cannot of any means guarantee the accuracy of this :) blame amazon :) but that why we did the manual selection.
3. It would be nice if the Album view also showed the album cover on the left.
> Yeah, this is a request we have since beta1. I think we will do it in the near future.
4. The Artist view could also show a thumbnail of the first album. Also, when you tap into an Artist, the album art should appear next to album.
> yeah, this was planned also, but no time do it currently.
5. Seems odd that the 2nd row of the Album Covers view starts at the end of the 1st row. Seems like it should be up-down then left-right (hope that makes sense)
> This has been discussed (I think related to quiver) we have some reasons to that, and we knew people would be "pissed" unfortunately for now is staying like this. Maybe we can add the "sort" but only if we manage to get a clean solution that work for all our cases.
6. No problems for me with scrolling. Seems same as v5.
> nice to hear.
7. Be nice you could manually add album art or perhaps it should--as a last resort--use first jpg in the same folder as songs.
> this is the last missing feature: pick from file. The problem we are facing is : are you guys going to be satisfied if the browse folders component doesn show thumbnails?
(today it does : search for embedded, search for jpg and then download from internet)
8. If you tap Now Playing icon in upper right, hitting the return icon in bottom left should take you to previous screen.
> We are not a web browser. ;) (when everthing is implemented on switcher it will other history)
9. I must not be using the Podcast feature right. Shouldn't it always remember the last position where I left off? After I exit, play a different song, etc. Doesn't seem to work that way.
> Yeah, it was supposed to be doing that. Kenneth has it working on his machine but for some reason his patch didn made into the final build. So it confirmed for the next release. It seems that is working only for video. But it will be there.
All that said, I have to say I LOVE the app! I was very close to getting a Touch and this totally scratched that itch. Good work.
> WoW, this is the best payment we can get :) (of course I also do like the constructive feedback)
So, thanks for using canola, thanks for your precious time writing back to us, and let see how much can we improve for beta7 :) lot of work to do. And We are not "satisfied" we really know that we have a lot of ground to improve on.
Best Regards from Sunny (too much) Recife!
Next week, we will be "off" on ( www.bossaconference.org ) talking to our buddies : Rasterman, J5, Zack Rusin, Marcel all things that in the end we use in canola (of course they are not here because of canola) we just want to learn even more how to improve Evas, Dbus, 3D graphics, Bluetooth (a2dp with great performance is already on our labs) and so on :)
See you in a couple of days (kidding, I will be checking here everyday as almost always )
Marcelo
instigator
2008-03-15, 03:27
A2DP you say? Now you're talking :)
Loving Canola. Thanks for your hard work.
@rider :
Well, it was not supposed to happen (damn!) but can you please send us some of the files? my email is handful AT gmail
With the files will be easy to spot a possible bug.
Marcelo
OppositeOfIgnorance
2008-03-15, 03:39
black theme is very fast and very sleek. i like it very much. i like the browsebyfolder feature too. the touch response is also much better. excellent job, mr. eduardo and crew.
i'll be looking forward to your youtube plugin release
I truly enjoy using Canola and it has just gotten better with each iteration.
One thing that would make my enjoyment of Canola even better is if there was an easier way to retain podcast settings across installations. I had to run Canola Cleanup because v6 had a broken installation the first try. Of course this meant that all of the podcast URLs that I had entered were lost.
I wish there was a way to back-up the podcast/photocast feed settings so that I wouldn't have to re-enter them each time there is an update to Canola.
Thanks,
Slip
A2DP you say? Now you're talking
Loving Canola. Thanks for your hard work.
Reply With Quote
> Yeah we wanted to do that, but the enconding decoding thing was using too much cpu, so we decided to optimize it. We had a 70% opmization on it made by other team members here in INDT (we have a team that works with BlueZ for a couple years) and seems that people are very happy with the optimizations. I think it will be on the next firmware already this new version, then a2dp will be possible without bringing the UI down on heavy task like scrolling.
@slip :
There's is, we have been talking here since beta4 to beta5 : you can use the default backup system :) just go there, backup the thing and restore after the install. we are using the default maemo backup, not a custom tool.
@Oppositte : Yeah, really glad that you like it. I started requesting Miguel to do the Woo box theme, but he proposed to do a more simple theme, and I just dig it and let him finish. I'm also quite satisfied with the results, because it DOES improve the feedback to the user :)
BR
GeraldKo
2008-03-15, 04:00
PAUSE still often doesn't work.
I've had this problem in betas 3, 5, and 6 (those are all I've tried). I've had it both before and after a clean install of everything (including flashing OS2008).
If this matters, my movies are coded as avi's.
It happens once the movie is far along (say, 1 hour). I can recreate the problem by fast-forwarding to late in the movie and then pausing.
Also, I think there should be a Stop button (which returns you to the beginning of the movie), especially now that you have that nice resume feature.
@slip :
There's is, we have been talking here since beta4 to beta5 : you can use the default backup system :) just go there, backup the thing and restore after the install. we are using the default maemo backup, not a custom tool.
Thanks for telling me. I think I skipped the beta4-to-5 transition (it was already so good, I probably didn't feel I needed to upgrade!).
(I answered my own question below, but will include it here in case it is useful to others)
When I do the backup/restore, which heading will the Canola settings be stored under? (e.g. Settings, Bookmarks, Media Files...)
-It is stored under "Settings"
See this thread for more details: http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16712
munky261
2008-03-15, 04:23
im still having no luck getting it to download :( is there any alternate repository i can try or anything.... i have no media player at the moment.... grrrrr lol
if it's too sunny for ya down there please send some up to where i live LOL
edit: installed fine on my N800 , what could be screwed up on my 810 that its not working?
hi GeraldKo,
PAUSE still often doesn't work.
I've had this problem in betas 3, 5, and 6 (those are all I've tried). I've had it both before and after a clean install of everything (including flashing OS2008).
If this matters, my movies are coded as avi's.
It happens once the movie is far along (say, 1 hour). I can recreate the problem by fast-forwarding to late in the movie and then pausing.
Also, I think there should be a Stop button (which returns you to the beginning of the movie), especially now that you have that nice resume feature.
Hi geraldKo. We are actually tring to reproduce, but without a video that does that it hard. Can you please tell us how are the whole settings of your enconding? Then we can try to imitate.
About the stop button: The developers in the team always complain about that, but I stand firm in my decision :) no pause. this was useful when we needed to stop the K7 tape to do not damage it, or stop a cd from spinning. Now with simple bookmarks to file, there no need for stop. Developers often see the stop as a way to "release" resources, but I don think it will be needed :)
I will of course just make sure things works as expected, like if you pause and hit backward, it will work just like a stop (beginning of movie) in paused (ready to play) state.
MUNKY : please munky send your LOG messages for us! it the only way we can help you. There no alternative repository and we will not create because this will generate a lot of problems later with dependencies / people forgeting to remove the alternative etc.
Waiting for your log. (application manager menu -> tools -> LOG )
Best Regards,
munky261
2008-03-15, 05:15
FINALLY!!! i got it to work , very strange though , i went in and tried to install it in xterm , and it wouldnt install , so i ran "apt-get install -f" it removed gnumeric and libgoffice and then it installed fine. how the hell are canola and gnumeric related i wonder that causes the problem. cause normally when i install gnumeric , it says unable to install but installs broken , but i can still use it. but if i run canola cleanup it fixes gnumeric. seems really weird to me. oh , and i checked the logs before i gotit to install from terminal , and there was nothing at all in the logs , completely blank.
javier_h224
2008-03-15, 05:16
hi marcelo it works right now. I need to re-install the OS 2007he
Hi all!
I've seen this pass through here already a few times, but here it goes again. (I bought my N800 a few days ago, so I'm new and might be doing stuff wrong, please be gentle ;-) )
I installed beta5 and popped in a 4GB with 6 or 7 albums internally. I only see one album, and even that one I see partially in Canola. Kagu and the internal player see and play all my albums. Some albums are mp3, some are ogg. I don't think there are major differences between the ways the songs are tagged or encoded. Installing beta6 sadly didn't fix anything :(
How does Canola look for music? Are there known issues with certain bitrates, charactersets in the tags or anything?
Hi Wzzrd : there's a need for a small file for the scanner to support the ogg files.
Also, beta5 had the problem of a bug breaking when starting scanning, that's why you need to use beta6. We started yesterday recompiling the ogg support (it's a simple thing but needs to be tested a lot now).
So, I need to ask you one question : did it at least find your mp3s? or not all of it?
Also : can you please try just a small reboot, to make sure the new scanner is doing it's job?
Well, we needed to rewrite the scanner from beta3 to beta4-5 then a lot of problem happened, but now we are coming back on shape. The scanner is LMS, and it's completely open source on garage.
I apologize for this inconvenience, and if canola doesn't find all your music after we update the ogg support, than we would like to receive some files from you to debug and improve it. We have a huge media library for test, but a lot of people have "nice" mp3s with "odd" tags that can cause odd issues :) so we are fixing one by one as we get those.
I don't think you doing something wrong : ogg support is not compiled for the LMS (our scanner) so ogg are not getting added to the database, and we are improving backwards the scanner :/
So, I will wait for your feedback, if possible you can already send mp3s to my email ( handful AT gmail ) and we will gladly pass one by one in our test cases and fix any bugs on the scanner.
About known issues, for beta6 we had none.
BR
hey marcelo ,
i'm still not seeing all my mp3 files in the canola list. i mailes you a couple of the files last week and the same issuezis still there in beta6. i even tried a cleanup, reboot, reinstall and rescan. stillsame files missing.
built in media player sees them all.
all files in one folder, all mp3 with standard tagging from itunes.
any thoughts on this yet?
@stoo : the problem can be just one file (that kills the scanning when it hits it) then all files "after" it will be out :/
We received several files, and spot some bugs, but as you a probably showing us, there is a lot to do. We are trying to have a good library for that, but there are so many cases (all libs) that we really need the files : /
If you haven't before.. can you send us? Because the files sent we made sure it was working!
: /
FIXED!
i went into itunes and converted all my id3 tags to version 2.2 and now canola fins all my files. before, they were a mix with some id3 version 2.4
hope that helps with the bug fixing :)
Oberon85
2008-03-15, 14:40
Thank you for your time and excellent hard work. This is one of the best programs I have seen on the n810, and as a former programmer, my hat is off to all of you working on this (and many other) project. B6 installed fine, everything appears to be working, and can't wait for youtube!
Again, thank you, and thanks to your team!
Oberon85
GeraldKo
2008-03-15, 17:05
Hi geraldKo. We are actually tring to reproduce, but without a video that does that it hard. Can you please tell us how are the whole settings of your enconding? Then we can try to imitate.
"The Pause Problem" happens on all my long movies. I've encoded them all using N800 Video Convert ver. 0.8.4.0. Settings:
Resolution: 400 x 240
Autocrop: Fit Width
Frame Rate: 24
Aspect: 15/9
Bitrate: 512
Audio bitrate: 96
No resample
2-pass encoding
When I look at the File Information in mplayer, it says:
Video Codec: DX50
Video Bitrate: 400 kbps (even though I thought I encoded at 512)
Res: 400 x 240
Audio Codec: mad
Audio bitrate: 32 kpbs (even tho I thought N800 VC said 96 when I encoded)
Audio Samples: 48000 Hz, 2 ch.
I would try Pause on mplayer, but as far as I can see, it doesn't offer the option. But as I've said, Pause is actually Stutter Forward on Canola, at least when far along in a movie. You have to play the movie for a while at regular speed before you get the stutter problem (which probably makes it tedious to test!). But once you get it on a movie, it keeps happening whenever you Pause. Apart from that, Canola works great as a video player. (So for that matter does mplayer, except for lack of controls and a not-nearly-so-nice UI.)
As for the Stop function, Pause-Rewind is a good-enough replacement. (Though I fail to see what's wrong with including Stop.) (It reminds me of Apple refusing to really use right-clicking or refusing to implement an expand-to-full-screen button for its windows.) However, there's a minor issue with Pause-Rewind currently. When you hit Rewind, it doesn't go back to the beginning until you hit Play, which is counter-intuitive. Then, if you hit Pause and then Rewind and then close the movie, when you open it again, it starts in the middle where you had paused, whereas that's precisely the circumstance for which I would like Stop. Since once it starts up again I can immediately hit Pause then Rewind, this is really trivial.
All this bug feedback inherently focuses on the problems (which are tiny). So let me just say: Great program, I really like it! Thanks!
Congrats on the new release, I tried the new Black theme and it works GREAT! It made Canola faster and more responsive. The scrolling works good and everything seems to work fine. Since I configured b5 to NOT use any folders, it looks like it kept my old database whick I populated "manually" and everything works good. That might be a tip for some of the users if they are "scared" of loosing their music database. Back it up, and if for some reason the scanner does not index your music correctly just restore your old DB.
I'll later try the updated scanner to see if it now indexes all of my songs correctly.
Once again GREAT JOB guys!
Well, stoo :) it shows that the problem was in the version :) but we really wanted to fix it. Strange thing because I did passed your files forward, and the guys said it was working.
Well, so I have the files, I will again take a look
Marcelo
GErald : Don't worry :) I'm not trying to justify an error :) we will improve, and as I said, if I want to not add stop, I do need to make sure you have all the features in a natural way.
Sorry for the mistake not being fixed still.. but with your enconding info will be easier now!
Thanks so much for the info, and let's do the work :)))))
i have another slightly odd bug. when selecting some movies, it starts loading the file, then plays the first second of that movie, and then skips to the start of the next movie inn the list.
if i then skip back, it goes back to the movie i selected and plays fine.
movies are mpeg4 with .mp4 extention, using built in mediaplayer for play back. all worked fine in beta5.
sjgadsby
2008-03-15, 20:41
I still can't get my (few) m4a files to show tag infos and so album cover but that's no big deal
But beta 6 is finding and playing your .m4a files? Did you encode the files yourself? Neither beta 5 nor 6 have found my .m4a files, and I'm trying to determine what I did to make them screwy.
Marcelo,
beta6 is looking great. I love the blue theme, and the additions to the podcast section is great. I love 'today's podcasts' and 'new podcasts'. Just great.
I still have two albums where the tags are reading the composer field as the genre.
thanks,
hal
A really tiny request:
Could you replace the yellow selection color in the Graphite theme with somewhat more subdued blue or white?
for the record, i like the yellow selection colour in the grey theme. and my favoured theme just now is the flat red one.
looking forward to theme editor on phptoshop.
DISTORTION ISSUE: Every so often my songs play distorted. Sounds like an overdriven preamp. I mostly use WMAs. Usually closing and reopening Canola clears the issue. Can't reproduce, but I'll try to pay more attention to what causes it. I know you can't do anything based on this sketch info, but I thought I'd mention.
OppositeOfIgnorance
2008-03-16, 01:09
hows the youtube plugin going?
Another problem observed:
When playing an MP3 album and starting on another song, Canola will sometimes start playing a completely different song from a different album. After a few seconds, Canola switches to the proper song.
I have both "Loop" and "Shuffle" switches enabled.
Album art order comment: Shouldn't the Album Art be in Artist order? If you go into a store to get a CD, can you imagine the confusion if the CD's were in alphabetical order by album name? Well that is kinda how I feel about the current sorting order in Album cover view. At least a sorting option please. Thanks!
jabastien
2008-03-16, 02:28
THANK YOU Canola Team for another great release.
I now realize that Canola will not play mp3 with "%" in the song title, but it plays well in mplayer.
Let me know if you need the mp3 file.
See Picture below:
jthousand
2008-03-16, 03:47
These podcasts gives me an error when i try to subscribe:
rss.allaboutsymbian.com/media/podcastfeed.xml
spidermancrawlspace.podOmatic.com/rss2.xml
thecellphonejunkie.libsyn.com/rss
blogs.s60.com/voiceofs60/podcast-mp3.xml
outerwise, keep up the great work
I just bought my N800 and loaded up Canola. I am trying to figure out how to bookmark an audio file. Any ideas?
Thanks,
J
@ joeF , while we do want to add bookmark, it's not implemented yet. We are first finishing the crucial bits (scanner for example)
@jabastien : we will try with the %. But if it plays on mplayer, you can change the default player to mplayer. But be aware that : mplayer playing audio (AFAIK) will use more battery than the regular one. and more cpu if I am also not mistaken.
@spice3D we have a lot more of request / and actual wishes to implement, but it's not that we don't think it's logical. We first implement the widget to list albums alphabetically. Then we will start the sortings, that is like Album arts by Artist and so on. It's just impossible to do everything in such small time frame :) be patience my friend that we will improve as time goes...
@fms : odd. We will try to "reproduce" it but if we fail, I will need more info from you.
@opposite: It's going well, everything is implemented, now it's entering code reviweing, because it's going to be released as open source example for third party plugins :)
@spice3D : your having problems with your wmas? did it work perfectly on the default media player? Because one thing you need to know (we, canola) don't play files. We send messages through DBUS to the default media player engine asking them to play. So if something is going wrong is probably there not in our software.
@rms : please understand me that is hard for us to do stuff based on "one person's " taste :) I know you are probably not digging it, but as we are going to release it probably as the example to make themes, you can change just that thing to any thing you want and with the service get the new theme ready.
@sj and others with m4a problems : well, the only way we can help is by getting the files from you. As I told you we don't make the support for this files, it comes from a pre-installed library. So, if we are not seeing them, it's because it's breaking before the scanner reach them ... probably. With previous send files this seems to be happening, we are able to scan and show, but the person who sent not.. probably something is really wrong with a file before the songs.. that the scanner just dies.
@stoo : can you give more info on the enconding? how did you converted it? so we can try reproducing a video here searching for the same problem to be able to fix it.
BR
thanks for the massive amount of feedback!
Video podcast, one question.
I did a search and found nothing (o.k. my search skills in forum-engines sock but anyway). Can Canola play video podcasts ? I was able to add them but it seems that nothing happens or do i have to wait minutes when i want the list to be displayed ?
Example: http://www.tagesschau.de/export/video-podcast/tagesschau
(in german)
Thanks
MiBi
i'm usin handbrake to encode video.
creating .mp4 files with mpeg4 video and aac audio. 400x240 resolution at 512mb/s and 25frm/s.
also some files encoded from mpeg2 (eyettv recordingon mac) encoded using quicktime to mpeg4 with mp3audio to .mp4 file, same res/frm rate etc as before.
hope that helps.
iamthewalrus
2008-03-16, 12:04
I have trouble installing. I have:
- a n800 with os2008 with no previous installation of Canola after the last reflash.
- I followed instructions on http://www.openbossa.indt.org.br/canola/install_second.html
- Application manager gives "Downloading canola2 failed" error.
<edit>
Using apt-get from the commandline the install worked. I guess application-manager is a how shall I say.. not such a great application. ;)
</edit>
hi I am the walrus :
It seems that there's a combination of other repositories that can make the application manager a little bit crazy.
The command line apt usage always fix the problems, and that's why we wrote canola-cleanup for those interested in fixing such problems but don't know how to become root or use ssh.
Thanks for the files.
Marcelo
fidorulz
2008-03-16, 12:37
I dont know if this was already brought up but when your playback is set to random and you select a song by going threw the album covers it will only play the song selected and wont randomly choose another one once the first is finished(as would happen if you selected a song via the song option)
Also an equalizer option would be interesting as well.
PS-Seems the link for Canola-tuning is down on Openbossa
Url is http://openbossa.indt.org.br/canola/install_files/canola-_0.2.2_armel.deb
fidorulz :
thanks for the error report, is a typo : / : http://openbossa.indt.org.br/canola/install_files/canola-tuning_0.2.2_armel.deb
is the correct URL.
UPDATE: fido, it is correct on the "using canola" section. where you find that typo?
Actually, the behavior you said is indeed wrong. We will analyze it and fix as soon as possible. : /
Equalize has been widely asked :) we will see what we can do :) At least graphically is quite easy and fun to do :)
Marcelo
Video podcast, one question.
I did a search and found nothing (o.k. my search skills in forum-engines sock but anyway). Can Canola play video podcasts ? I was able to add them but it seems that nothing happens or do i have to wait minutes when i want the list to be displayed ?
Example: http://www.tagesschau.de/export/video-podcast/tagesschau
(in german)
Thanks
MiBi
Not yet MiBi: the real real truth is that we can do it :) if we remove podcast "file extensions" limitations you can play videos. But we are trying to focus on audio casts now because they are "easier" to work with (as the video streaming on the platform suffers more in some areas) and once it's good enough ( I think next release) we will release the new "icon" for video podcast :) that is actually a new frontend for the same application but gathering only videos.
We did thinking of both :)
i'm usin handbrake to encode video.
creating .mp4 files with mpeg4 video and aac audio. 400x240 resolution at 512mb/s and 25frm/s.
also some files encoded from mpeg2 (eyettv recordingon mac) encoded using quicktime to mpeg4 with mp3audio to .mp4 file, same res/frm rate etc as before.
hope that helps.
Yeah! Valuable information as always ! thanks for that :) It will take a while to test it properly (the conference) but we will do our best now that we have the data!
Marcelo
@handful
Thank's for the info...so i just have to wait and see when video podcast pops up :)
Have fun at your conference and no stress ;)
MiBi
iamthewalrus
2008-03-16, 13:41
I hadn't used Canola for a few months before trying it out again. Below are my impressions and suggestions. Some of the things are nitpicking ..It is just what came to my mind. ..I do like Canola :).
- How about use the startup screen of Canola to a list /thumbnail etc. of the most recent music/video/etc selected? It is unused screen estate now.
- When going to Settings -> Choose theme, which all require a single tap, I expected a single tap on a theme would set the theme. Instead I need to click on a tiny 'ok' button. It would be better IMO to make a tap on the theme thumbnail make the theme change.
- Why not use the entire height of the sides of screen to rotate through the main sections? It would be a Fitt's law type improvement because you have to be less precise when tapping
-I went to My Music -> All Songs and I see 'no items found' in the background. How about a button 'No items found. search for media now?' in such a case.
- When there is no disk space left Canola won't start up. Maybe that is by design, it might be better if there is a pop-up saying no disk space left.
- I went to Settings -> Media Library and clicked on 'Refresh All'. I was expecting a confirmation here.
- The icon in the upper-right looks like an icon. Clicking on it doesn't do anything.
- When playing an mp3 file I wanted to switch to the list of tracks in that album so click the 'back' button in the bottom left. It took me a while to realize that to return to the playing file I had to click the icon in the top-right that now had changed from a non functional icon in a 'forward' button. But it looks different from the 'back' button. Not a mirrored version of the 'back' button.
- It took some time to realize that I need to hold press an item in a scrollable list for a while before scrolling. Dragging immediately won't start the scrolling.
- I find the buttons in the bottom left and right a bit small.
I hadn't used Canola for a few months before trying it out again. Below are my impressions and suggestions. Some of the things are nitpicking ..It is just what came to my mind. ..I do like Canola .
Don't worry :) I always assume if you took your time at least you have sympathy for the software or at least the hard work on it :)
A couple of observations:
- How about use the startup screen of Canola to a list /thumbnail etc. of the most recent music/video/etc selected? It is unused screen estate now.
#Unh, sorry I didn understand it correctly, What do you call the startup screen? the one with loading message? Or the one with the 4 icons :
Even not having sure : In the next releases you will see things growing (at least 2 more icons on home) and the home will get pretty crowded :) we think about the future a little bit before, because if we just use white space, it can be trick to expand things needed in the future.
- When going to Settings -> Choose theme, which all require a single tap, I expected a single tap on a theme would set the theme. Instead I need to click on a tiny 'ok' button. It would be better IMO to make a tap on the theme thumbnail make the theme change.
#well this is a little bit trick, because we have a small rule of the following: if it going to make an action that changes something, that maybe you could possiblily not have the intention to do we do 2-state to avoid problems. On themes, it could be done, but We always take care of how many people complain(thats why I thank you for this feedback) to be able to understand how much something is pissing a lot of users. :) Most of the time we need to be a little "solid" when it a personal "felling".
- Why not use the entire height of the sides of screen to rotate through the main sections? It would be a Fitt's law type improvement because you have to be less precise when tapping
#you right about this one, it can be done. With of course safety marging for the upper button.
-I went to internet radio -> my feeds and I see 'no items found' in the background. How about a button 'No items found. search for media now?' in such a case.
#the problem is not the media, but the no items found :) We do have several ideas to help users add content, but if you cannot do it inside canola, we prefer to do not interfere so much. This would need us to do a website with several links to Internet radios etc. I think this can be done, but it would be really low priority now.
- When there is no disk space left Canola won't start up. Maybe that is by design, it might be better if there is a pop-up saying no disk space left.
#it not by design, we are improving error messages as we go. Apart from this one theres one "crash" known that is when you have HUGE pictures. But sometimes, canola is killed by the platform before we receive the information that theres no memory left :) We want and will do the possible to improve all of this. (I faced this on my table) needed to resort to xterm to see what was the problem. this was not good at all from the users pespective.
- I went to Settings -> Media Library and clicked on 'Refresh All'. I was expecting a confirmation here.
#yeah, like the previous answer there a lot to be improved in confirmations, consistency in some buttons, error messages, little things that I can assure you: they bother me more than anyone else :) It again just matter of time x priority :) People demand so much you know :)
- The icon in the upper-right looks like an icon. Clicking on it doesn't do anything.
#I have talked about it couple of times. the "real" thing is not implemented. Take a look in my blog, "crazy days" post :) There a explanation of Canola ui there.
- When playing an mp3 file I wanted to switch to the list of tracks in that album so click the 'back' button in the bottom left. It took me a while to realize that to return to the playing file I had to click the icon in the top-right that now had changed from a non functional icon in a 'forward' button. But it looks different from the 'back' button. Not a mirrored version of the 'back' button.
#not at all : that button is actually a shortcut for "now playing" screen from ANY screen on the system. This allows you to return with one touch. Otherwise you would need to go at least to home menu, audio my music to jump to the playing file.
again : the feature is not working, thus it does look really "strange"
- It took some time to realize that I need to hold press an item in a scrollable list for a while before scrolling. Scrolling immediately won't start the scrolling.
Actually is not that you need to hold. It does scrolls immediately, but to avoid items "dancing" (but even with that they still because fingers touches generates a lot of noise) we placed a limit of 5 pixels up and down. If you cross this, the list compensates (I don like this.. I think it should scroll without ) and do the scrolling. Test with the stylus. This is "crucial" to improve the ability of touching and holding, and more. Also it will be used on next release main feature: playlist on the move :)
- I find the buttons in the bottom left and right a bit small.
#we did so much experiments about this :) and they actually have a larger area than they look. The problem is improved with the "border" of the screen, too high on n800, better on n810. Anyhow it complicated to have bigger higher buttons on a widescreen oriented UI, because you loose the most important thing: the content itself. So we said : Content is more important. Options you use couple of times, Back you use more, but theres the hardware fall back, there also the opportunity to adapt a little bit to it, (letting the finger half on the physical border half on the screen).
Thanks for the really detailed feedback. You gave us some nice insights.
sjgadsby
2008-03-16, 15:28
m4a problems : ...if we are not seeing them, it's because it's breaking before the scanner reach them ... probably. With previous send files this seems to be happening, we are able to scan and show, but the person who sent not.. probably something is really wrong with a file before the songs.. that the scanner just dies.
Thank you for trying the files I sent. It's good to know they're working for you. Now I just need to determine what's wrong on my N800 that prevents them from being found.
I've tried creating a new directory on my internal card and placing only one .m4a file at a time into it while Canola was set to scan that location and nothing else. None of the files were found, not even the ones I sent to you.
When I have some time, I'll have to try reflashing and then installing only Canola. If that woks, I'll then be able to add applications one at a time until Canola breaks again.
Hei, please don't reflash, it's probably a bug on the scanner as I said, maybe in your environment is breaking, but we need to find out.
Thanks for the info again!
please understand me that is hard for us to do stuff based on "one person's " taste :) I know you are probably not digging it, but as we are going to release it probably as the example to make themes, you can change just that thing to any thing you want and with the service get the new theme ready.
There is a simple argument against using green, yellow, or red for any normal selection elements in any of the themes: These three colors are generally treated by humans as having a certain meaning, with green meaning "go" or "ok", yellow meaning "wait" or "warning", and red meaning "stop" or "failure". For example, all air traffic control software is required to use these three colors only in the above situations.
So, when somebody sees a small UI element in one of these three colors, the first reaction is that the system is trying to tell something. In order to avoid this effect, just use any other color (blue, white, brown, even magenta).
Hi,
First, I would like to thank you for this great app.
Then the complain ;) : I use to copy some pictures on my device, a kind of "best of" of friends, holidays, parties and relatives. To save space, I usually edit those pictures and make them 800x480. Problem is while doing so, the creation time is then different from the capture time, and then I get those images in the wrong order. I use to name the files using YYMMDDn.jpg so that they are in the right order in the file browser. Is their any way to have Canola switched to "file name" order and not "creation date" one?
Yes, this is VERY important for photos. Default sort mode for photos should be filename, date(s) sorting optional.
Anyway I really like the current Canola photo album interface, zoom works nice and the semi-transparent controlbars in the full view mode are excellent! Would like to get similar controls on other apps (besides of Canola) as well.
For example: wide semi-transparent scrollbars which appear when touching (and holding/scrolling) the right edge of screen would be nice on MicroB.
Has anyone else been having trouble displaying Flickr photocasts since upgrading? Viewing Flickr albums just shows the spinning wheel for me (Picasa feeds seems fine). I tried re-adding the feeds into the Photocasts 'Add URL:', but all I get is 'No feed available for this URL'.
@Thustle : this is odd :/ we will try to investigate, because flickr apperently did not change it's feeds : / can you try in the browser? with canola tuniing installed?
@fms : this is arguable :) I agree that we can have some colors meaning something but I don't think the selection is small element and when you touch it it "brighten" up one very defined and understandable area. If this was for indicators of something then I totally agree with you (so much that we use that on the cancel button, and we are thinking of add also to the delete button in the grey part, that we wanted to keep neutral)
But don't worry there will be lots of variations of each themes quite soon :)
@myrjola : yeah, this was one of the only complaints about the photo view. We want to allow some changes for the users, but just give us sometime :) I already can fully agree that this is need (by the amount of requests) and once we finish the bugs on photo and thumbnails this options can come in :)
Br, BossaConference starting!!!
Thanks,
Marcelo
@Thustle : this is odd :/ we will try to investigate, because flickr apperently did not change it's feeds : / can you try in the browser? with canola tuniing installed?
Thanks for the suggestion. I installed Canola tuning and it managed to put the feed into Canola OK, but still nothing appears (other than the spinning icon). I tried another random Flickr album and the same thing happens. This definitely worked prior to Beta6. Is there anything else I can try?
Thanks.
I agree that we can have some colors meaning something but I don't think the selection is small element and when you touch it it "brighten" up one very defined and understandable area.
The effect will occur with any outstanding UI element, not just an indicator, because your eyes continue treating objects of these colors as indicators. In other words, a yellow background is unlikely to trigger a response but a yellow selection bar on a neutral background will.
Well, as you could see from the comment just after yours, this can be said as personal.
I'm the lead interaction designer in the project, and we actualy do make some users tests in all components, nobody on the tests ever talked about it. If this was really at least near a issue, one of the more than 24 people tested would have said something. (really different personas used as template for the tester finding process)
But again, we can talk as much as you want on the subject, because I'm really glad to hear a comment outside of the " common " problem and more into my area of joy/work :)
I think you also have my email, if you want to directly contact me at any time :)
*if you like I can also send you the design sheet of the grey theme, so you can customize it for you :)
BR
MArcelo
Well, as you could see from the comment just after yours, this can be said as personal.
As weird as it sounds, the fact that you haven't seen it reported may not mean a thing. I have had some really serious bugs (not something as minor as a slightly uncomfortable UI color) reported months after the software release.
if you like I can also send you the design sheet of the grey theme, so you can customize it for you :)
It's all right, don't bother: the yellow selection color is just a minor annoyance. It may be the reason why nobody reported it so far.
Better fix the playback problem though: I have verified yesterday that Canola will sometimes start playing a wrong song for a few seconds, then straighten up and go to the next song in the album I am listening to. It is currently set to shuffle and loop. Will report more details if/when I figure them out.
Well fms, as I'm talking to you we can go offline and go really academic if you want :) I have experts on that subject on the team, also phycologist and more :) and it's not about the bugs, but I really on my use testing. BUT I do understand what you say because I am the most disruptive with rules of them all :) but I really believe this doesn't apply to this case :) there's cases and cases, and the "learning factor" is also important, because even i f the doubt comes up, he soons realize that there was no mistake and this becomes a non-issue :)
Also, we could do a black theme with RED details every where (like somebodies favorite football team) that it wouldn't mean error / problem to the user who wanted to install it. I can assure you that. People have different perceptions and of course even with some " standarts" (yellow attention) they do adapt to changes when needed if the context shows no or small possibility of problem.
About the song problem: yes, this is the kind of problem. We know how to fix it, but we will need to write OUR media engine. It just a pain to rely on a third party application communication to it via dbus to have things working. A pain, believe me. If we had one person available I would place him doing the player right now. To make sure we can control this issues ( I have some really boring bugs bogging me : the play pause changing when changing songs, the track button appearing in the beginning and locking podcst playback, the time it takes to start up the media engine and much more )
Believe me I really "picky" to the errors also, and the dev guys get really pissed when I manage to find and ask like crazy to get them fixed.
@Thustle : this is odd :/ we will try to investigate, because flickr apperently did not change it's feeds : / can you try in the browser? with canola tuniing installed?just to confirm that i have tried my flickr photo feed and have same problem. i also tried re-adding the feed via the browser and canola stopped me saying feed was already included? (worked fine pre beta 6)
andersbk
2008-03-17, 15:28
Beta 6
Speed up parsing of feeds.
Enter all internet models now blocks the screen a lot less (Settings, Podcast, Internet Radio and Photocast).
A "bug"? and an observation...
1.) I have a podcast feed that never updates. It's the only feed that I've encountered (so far) with this issue. I have about 10 feeds that I track. The following feed works fine in iTunes, but not in canola.
http://podcast.dr.dk/p4/rssfeed/sproghjoernet.xml
2) Settings->Internet media->Podcasts->Edit
User should be able to edit the feed URL here. Canola only allows editing of feed "title". Maybe you're already working on this.
Thanks,
-anders.
e-motion
2008-03-17, 16:55
Handful, any chance of getting the pause initiated from the nokia headset button in the next beta ?
@andersbk : yeah, we will add it quite soon. Honestly not working on this, but for sure it's on the list.
@emotion : There's a small thing to do to implement it, it's just a matter of what's on front. If we don't have any complicated bug possibile yes.
Marcelo
Apologies if anyone else has posted this but I don't think so. Beta6 generally is great. I really appreciate the larger albumart and fonts on the "now playing" screen. however I have found that occasionally beta6 does not display the buttons at bottom-left and bottom-right, usually the hardware back key works to drop me out of the app. Also on several occasions beta6 displays nothing apart from the settings menu. I assume thta this means the daemon (canolad?) has crashed.
Holding my breath for the last.fm plugin, and really hoping for video podcast support really soon.
Thanks
Gaz
OppositeOfIgnorance
2008-03-18, 22:54
the youtube plugin was cancelled, wasnt it?
jabastien
2008-03-19, 14:11
The return button does not show, even when I want to exit from canola using the Red & Black themes. I do not not know if it was the intention of the designer to use the hardware key.
Thank you Canola
See Picures:
jabastien, gazza_d seems to have the same problems with the buttons sometimes not showing up in the bottom left. It hasn't happened to me, though.
the youtube plugin was cancelled, wasnt it?
Ugh, just be patient. I suspect that the Canola guys are busy with Bossa at the moment. It should be released soon (Bossa ends some time today).
I encountered a strange behavior : when playing in shuffle mode from the "All songs" playlist, sometimes playback stops at the end of a song, I only have to press "next" to get it to play but it's a pain ...
I must add that I have a mix of mp3, ogg and m4a and that I never saw this behaviour in beta5
Thanks for the great work
Fred
Jabastien, Navi - Looking at the screenshots, that is the problem I am experiencing intermittantly. However I'm using the standard Gray theme, and not one of the new ones.
@jabastien
The return button shows here..
jabastien
2008-03-19, 15:14
The original and the new blue themes work well ALL the times. I use the Black theme during the day for better visibility while driving. Again only the Red and Black have this anomaly.
I'merafraid thatchedthe missing back button happens in all themes with beta6. never had a problem before. attached is a screenshot
HI guys,
About the missing buttons, we are going to investigate it here. quite strange bug actually but probably is not about a specific theme (as shown by gazza) but something that really goes wrong in the plugin.
Can some of you run in xterm, and when you realize that the button is gone copy the log and send to us?
Marcelo
I can toggle the upper and lower toolbar with Q, W, E & R on my N810,
where Q enables the two lower buttons. If you happen to have an
N810 or an onscreen keyboard of some sort, you could try that.
unmm, interesting... it appears that maybe we forgot some keyboard test bindings :/
We will check
I can toggle the upper and lower toolbar with Q, W, E & R on my N810,
where Q enables the two lower buttons. If you happen to have an
N810 or an onscreen keyboard of some sort, you could try that.I tested on my N810 and keyboard keys Q,W & E, R do indeed currently toggle Canola2 Lower & Upper toolbars on/off :)
munky261
2008-03-19, 22:31
One minor thing , would it be possible to have the first letters of all words in the menus capitalized Album Covers instead of Album covers.... its just an anal retentive thing of mine lol i just think it would look alot better
Tha bad thing about this is that it eats up the battery : I've left it all night long in this "non playing" state (but with radios switch off) and the next morning the battery was dead ...
If it is of any interest, I use the last available version of mplayer and it looks like it chokes at the end of ogg songs
I encountered a strange behavior : when playing in shuffle mode from the "All songs" playlist, sometimes playback stops at the end of a song, I only have to press "next" to get it to play but it's a pain ...
I must add that I have a mix of mp3, ogg and m4a and that I never saw this behaviour in beta5
Thanks for the great work
Fred
When I skip through a large playlist with » I can't go
back with « after several clicks and the current song
won't play. I have to manually start it and the press «
to go back.
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