Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I'd read lots of threads on here about the video chat feature on the N800/N810, and of course there's the usual complaints about the current version only working with other tablets, but even so... it's amazing. It's made me really appreciate the tablets even more.

I'd never actually used the video chat feature, I knew it was there but it was somehow one of those "I know what it does but I won't bother using it" features. However, I eventually decided to give it a go with some friends in another country whom I hadn't seen in a very long time. They had a tablet as well, and they had a Google account, so it was very easy to set up, they just entered their usual Gmail username and password on the account wizard.

I know webcams on PCs have been around for a long long time, but the camera on the tablets (especially the N800's twistable one) is a bit different because it's totally portable, and we were able to give each other guided tours of our houses. It was absolutely lovely, it was actually using technology for a purpose rather than for its own sake. This sounds corny but video chat really is the next best thing to being there in person.

I know there's a heck of a lot of room for improvement on the tablet video chat software (PC compatibility, Skype compatibility etc) but if you haven't yet had a go on the video chat then it is definitely worth trying it out if you can.

Nokia ought to make this a central selling point when advertising the tablet, because video chat can be a pretty amazing and emotional experience. It has all the hallmarks of a "killer app", if only it could be made compatible with a wider range of devices and services.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Hey, glad you had a nice long distance video chat. Pretty nice indeed. You might not hear much hype over it since there are so many variables to deal with. Besides what you did it also works over a SIP phone connection if the PBX supports it. Mine does and it works very well NIT-NIT and between NIT and a video capable pc such as running x-lite. So for me it is pretty special when I get a phone call and I see their video which prompts me to pop out mine. I no longer ask 'what are you wearing', I say 'show me'.. :)

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Yes it puzzles me why Nokia has not made available improved/better software for the camera nor did they improve the camera hardware on N810. :confused: What a miss opportunity....sad.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I have used videophone-capable mobile phones (I have to for work) but at the moment the calls are so expensive that it's never been for very long, just to test whether it works really, and I certainly wouldn't use them internationally. You could do videophone through wi-fi too on modern smartphones, but again it's one of those features that I know about but haven't gotten round to trying.

Another thing though is that phones tend to be trickier to set up, SIP settings are a pain. If video calling is going to be mainstream it shouldn't be any more difficult than just entering a username and password, which is all that you need to do on tablet-to-tablet video calls.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I'm willing to put up with 5 minutes of tricky setup one time to make SIP calls that cost me nothing or nearly nothing whether video or not. It was as simple as server name, user name, password. done.

Video calling has been around for a long time and the problem isn't the setup.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

You're absolutely right that free and cheap calls are a very powerful incentive, but it would be even more powerful if those calls could be accessed by just entering a username and password.

Skype works like this on the tablets, it never demands any technical settings whatsoever, so why can't all VOIP services be like Skype?


Well, video and VOIP haven't been on cheaper mainstream phone models bought by ordinary people. It's possible that it wasn't a problem before but it will increasingly become a problem, because even lower end phones are starting to get some kind of video call capability.

It also won't help matters that some phone network operators will do their best to put as many obstacles in the way of VOIP as possible.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

While you are willing to put in those 5 minutes, not everyone is. And for a app to become popular and mainstream, it has to appeal and be simple for the average joe - who wouldnt care about putting in those 5 minutes.

Heck, even me with my technical background am not willing to put in 5 minutes and setup SIP when Skype allows me to do the same at an equally cheap price by just putting in a username and password across multiple devices and get all my contacts in every device. That is called simple.

And do you wonder why Skype is so popular across the globe.

And as much as being a open source fan myself, I am not religious (enough) to care about proprietary protocols etc if the same app can just do what I want easily.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I am sure that it must have been done already(???), but what about video chat tied in with a game like scrabble, bridge or, I suppose, poker. Social games that folks like to play while chatting with their friends - the game not really being the point of the interaction.

So, do you folks think this would work on the Tablets? Four people playing scrabble together and being able to see and talk to each other at the same time?

Granny is in a home but can still join the family after dinner at night for a game of bridge.

Same thing with kids games.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I can't believe that so many are not willing to enter a few bits of data to get something so desirable to work. fair enough, that is why there is skype and other service specific (and proprietary) systems out there. Meanwhile I'll spend the minute to enter the bits and enjoy using my phone service the way I want to. There must be hundreds of skype devices out there and I'll bet some can do video. don't need a NIT for that.

:rolleyes:

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Here, here! Video chat is THE reason why I bought additional N800s (after the drop in price). For example: my mother lives far away and appreciates to be able to talk and see her grand children. I tried to set up skype on her windows PC a year ago, only to find out that windows PC are so unstable that Skype stopped working after a month. She is not able to set it up or repair it herself. Now I sent her a N800, and it simply works...

IcelandDreams, if you believe everyone can set up SIP, you are mistaken. Not only can it be very tricky to make it work on some routers, there are plenty of people absolutely unable to set up much simpler things. Older people, for example, but also people with little interest in technical devices. Don't forget that there are millions of people unable to set up a VCR clock.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

gee I thought Skype was so easy. perhaps easy but not always stable on Winders.
Not unable, unwilling. And I'll bet that I'm twice the average age around here. My VCR has the wrong time not because I'm too stupid but unwilling to set the time on 10 devices after every power failure and time change, it just isn't important. But I DO want to make video chat work on the NIT so I took the time. Turned out to be simple enough and it works. WTF are forums like this about if with all the help someone isn't willing to try just because it takes a little thought and direction.

There are plenty of locked down devices that do only specific tasks via specific providers. Those devices are easier because they only do specific tasks and can be made dead simple. There is a huge market for that kind of thing but I'm in a different market and willing to find the device that works the way I want it to even if I need a little direction or knowledge.

What was this about? Oh yeah, video chat. Very nice indeed.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Glad this thread came up, as this was one of those "yea yea OS 2008 great lots of new features yada yada... oh, and we fixed video chat..." that received so little hype for such a killer feature! I was sitting around last weekend and suddenly thought "Hey, I bet I could get this working and it'd be kind of neat", and I'm with you guys, I had it setup on my NIT and running in about 20 minutes. When I'd first got my tablet my Dad specifically also got one so he could do video calls with it, and that was back in the 2007 days when you had to do tablet to tablet.

As far as SIP VS GoogleTalk/Jabber/etc... it depends what you're after, who you are, etc. Personally I found setting up SIP much easier and faster... have you ever tried to setup a new googletalk account on the tablet itself?? That takes a while and is not exactly the easiest process in the world; now if you have an existing google talk account it's a completely different story.

I setup Asterisk on one of my linux boxes and had everything up and running in about 10 minutes; once you've got it setup, adding SIP accounts that are capable of video is as easy as copy and paste a few lines of script. Setting up on the NIT and any other phone/softphone is as easy as "enter username, enter password, enter address of switch/domain". Nothing complicated, the only difference is that you have to have somebody with a server setup that way to make it that easy. In my case I had the server up, and I had my parents both setup their PCs and NIT in about 2 minutes.

In terms of exterior SIP providers, it shouldn't be any different, the main problem is that most of the free ones out there haven't put the effort in to set things up and keep them up to the latest software capabilities. Video has been around for quite a while in the way the NITs do it (h263), but most SIP providers haven't bothered to implement/keep the code up to date because they haven't seen any demand for it. (Saw a few forum posts from various providers all stating this); will that change? maybe... will you get better responses from a small service charge SIP provider? Probably...

Oh and on the camera changes from N800 to N810, keep in mind there really isn't any reason to improve the camera hardware... the existing one in the N810 is more than capable of functioning for the one purpose it was intended: video chat. Low lighting it's not fantastic, but overall it's quite decent and given that it's only designed to run at a low resolution and needs to be very small/low power it works very well.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

When I got my N810 one of the first things I did was to setup my girlfriend with my old N800 to do video calls with her. Over here in the US we don't have video calling over mobile like they have had in Europe and Asia for 3 years so its quite a revolutionary experience. We love it and use it all the time.

What came as a big surprise to me was that Video calling over 3G provides a close to identical experience to video calling over wifi.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

For those of us willing to take the 20 minutes to set this up but unwilling to dig around looking for a tutorial that will get it running on our N800, could you point us in the right direction as far as how you got your setup working?

Thanks
Mark

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

excellent! Different strokes for different folks. I should have clarified that I too have setup my own Asterisk server which is my primary phone system for business and home use. I simply had enough of the incumbent providers and their practices regarding the SOHO user. For individual users they are fine but don't provide what I need by a long shot.

So with my own PBX I have phone numbers for my local area and a few remote locations that need to call me, they call a local number no matter where I physically am without any roaming or long distance charges. I then add extensions for my family and friends near and far. With a video capable phone, NIT, or softphone they can do video chat over SIP, even my aging mother can handle it and loves talking to the grandkids. All of this costs me no more than one cell phone number. But I did have to learn a few things and maintain it. For the huge savings and increased functionality I'm willing to put up with the initial headaches. The headaches are only one time but I use it long term.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

This message came in while posting so I didn't see the question. Many variables so we can start with what services do you currently use that work on the N8? I use SIP but most of the commercial providers don't support video. The other posters might be using something more suitable for you.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Many Variables ?

Wow now you scare me more than the "2 minutes it takes" scare I had before.

Se this is where the simple vs complex issue become muddled. For you - an experience and savvy computer user setting up a PBX on your machine is easy, so setting up the N800 is super-easy for you.

Now don't think this forum users - think a N800 user - your parents, my parents, an average joe's grand parent and rethink all the steps again with them in mind

a) Its easy - just setup a PBX server on PC
b) on N800 install a SIP client - from a, b, c choices which each do three different things
c) setup the ports to allow these services on router (assuming they are doing over Wif, or what use for a NIT)
d) on NIT setup username posrts, password or whatever else you need.

See, at much before this point, my poor parents would have said - why don't you just use a regular phone and call us like a good son. We dont need video.

And I wouldn't be too off to say most average users are like this.
You have to take yourself off from your savvy computing self and put yourself into a a coomon user shoes when you think about why some apps are so popular because of its simplicity and why some arent.

This thread was about Video and how simple it is on the NIT with the built-in google chat client.
And thats where the SIP clients have to take their apps too - to get broad usage I believe.

IcelandDreams - I don't mean to not accept your point that it isnt too hard if we are willing to put in some time,
but if you think from another's standpoint, for some people its not a simple thing either notwithstanding those 20 mins of complex jargon and cryptic commands and different options.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

You can start a video call between 2 3G phones. That works.:rolleyes:

You can start a google talk video call between 2 tablets connected via wifi. That works... and is free.:D

You can start a google talk video between 2 tablets connected via bluetooth and 3G phones:eek:. I do that with my mother when I need to call her from places far away from wifi...

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Not unwilling, unable. This has nothing to do with being stupid or intelligent, this has to do with knowing the conventions that computers use.

Different people, different knowledge. One world.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

The thing that struck me was just how easy the video chat is to set up on the N800 and N810: just enter your Gmail id and password.

I'd gotten the impression from other posts on here that it took all kinds of herculean efforts to get the tablet video chat working, but that's totally untrue, it's a very simple process.


Yeah, having dealt with a lot of newbies you notice this phenomenon called "computer blindness". Intelligent, imaginative people who excel in other areas of life often have severe problems using computers, because they don't understand even basic concepts like switching between tasks.

I know a non-techie who was amazed when I showed them that a computer can do several things at once, they'd been dilligently closing windows before opening new ones. This person I'm talking about has a PhD so they're not stupid, they just have no experience with computing.


This is why I'm so sceptical about wimax's chances outside America, here in Europe we're already on 3.5G and much of Asia is even further ahead. For most internet purposes, 3G is a perfectly adequate substitute for broadband, and 3.5G is even better.

3.5G can provide speeds of many megabits, and more and more network operators here have flat rate internet charges, so there's really no reason to use an alternative such as Wimax under those circumstances.

Things are different in America though, US phone networks aren't as developed or open or as cheap to use, which is why Wimax stands a chance of doing really well over there.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I guest if one's expectations are low then you are right. I am glad innovators don't have your outlook, "there really isn't any reason to improve.."

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Couldn't be simpler than that.

A phenomenon that I observed whilst traveling through Africa a few months ago, (Senegal, Zimbabwe and South Africa) was that mobile operators had skipped over Edge in most cases and gone straight to 3g/HSDPA from no data services or basic GPRS and also were doing a roaring business selling data cards and USB modems with HSDPA capability circumventing DSL and fiber solutions that are probably more difficult to setup and maintain in Africa.
I did a GoogleTalk video call with my GF back in the US over the shared HSDPA link and it worked perfectly.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

And additionally goofy in Canada. Similar to the one toll road we have up here only corporate or wealthy users dare make even limited use of xG. And what you get for your megabucks is mostly crap.

that's why I said it the other way, people are smart enough but get blinded by it all even if the basics aren't as scary as they seem. Driving comparisons might be parallel parking, backing up with the rear view, manual transmission, basic courtesy. Driving isn't difficult either if you take the time up front to learn it. But most choose to never learn the scary stuff like driving a stick shift.

You don't have to go through everything I did. I *choose* to do it that way so that I'm in complete control and can have every feature I want without extra cost.

So let's assume for the moment that you have an account at a SIP provider that supports video calls. These are the steps:
using the built in account tool that came with the NIT: Account Settings, New, Service (SIP), username @ servername, password. done.

Since you are the client talking to a server configured properly (we hope) you don't need any firewall tricks or fancy settings. I've never had to do that. My NIT phone works from almost any WiFI I've been to. The local retail store filters down to html so from there no WiFI other than web will work (one reason to not shop there...). But from nearly everywhere else with WiFI my N8 has worked and the real test is a working inbound call. The N8 is pretty good at seamlessly going online at configured APs (it gets easier over time as you add SSIDs) and the SIP client registers within a few seconds.

Dedicated provider's software lock down the server name so you only need a name/password. You give up flexibility for ease of initial setup. Generic SIP requires the server name in addition, still easy. I'll admit it can get tricky with some providers but not always.

However I'll assume that you don't have a video capable SIP provider, the other posters have provided details to googletalk and services which should be very easy. Or 'Just Easy Enough'(TM)...

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Sorry to ramble...
But I coincidently received an inbound call with video just moments after posting. My girl friend picked up a WiFI signal at the grocery store and decided to call me. She would be long distance via a cell but the call was free between the NITs and the video was good.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

"...I'd gotten the impression from other posts on here that it took all kinds of herculean efforts to get the tablet video chat working, but that's totally untrue, it's a very simple process..."

The key was know the "special handshake" that took me a lot of effort...I am kind of slow it seems...:D

You have to find and then click on chat, oh so very easy once you know that, say I could of had a V8 too...

Anyways, if anyone...here is a link

http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...ght=googletalk

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I just wanted to throw in my $.02 worth.

It isn't the 5 minutes that throw people off, it is the uncertain payback from the 5 minutes (and like one person already pointed out, will you have to re-invest that time later to set it up again? That uncertainty is also a huge stumbling block).

And for the record, it took me wayyyyyy more than 5 minutes. I've been trying on and off to get video chat working between an N800 and an N810 for months. (I bought them to investigate VoIP and video calling). I couldn't get it to work until today.

Most successful video calls seem to go through google talk, but I didn't want to use google talk. I've been trying to get gizmo (4 and 5) to work with sip accounts (and some grandcentral thrown in). But it never worked for me. Voice worked just fine, video never made it over the network.

My wife is going out of town for the better part of a week and since she has stated how she will miss us and wants to video call, I stooped to setting up a second googletalk account. Using that, I was able to make video calls at last. Googletalk to Googletalk. (ambivalent Google cheer here. They are a public company now that by law needs to put shareholder value first.)

That doesn't seem to be what most people are thinking of (considering that many savvy people are using asterix) but that was what I was reduced to. At least it works now, but I spent way more than 5 minutes on this, and I can tell you for certain that my mom would not.

I am happy that we now have a way to videochat, but I am still nonplussed that I couldn't get it to work any other way. (tips and pointers on how to get it to work otherwise are still appreciated, though I won't be able to test them for a few weeks.)

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I would suggest, unless you WNT the adventure of setting up SIP and all that, just get a Gizmo account (now that you already have a google account, so that is done).

A Gizmo account is free - and then both you and your wife can video chat over gizmo.

In fact you can setup a new Gizmo account straight from the Nokia itself. And Gizmo to Gizmo calls are free.
If 2 people already have the same platform (Nokia N810 or N800), then a Google chat or a Gizmo chat for Video is the simplest solutions, without having to go the SIP server way.

Quite frankly I dont know why you didn't investigate the first option - setting up a google account to activate the Google chat software on both ends - that is the simplest solutions. Next up is Gizmo.

I also keep Skype installed as a standby in case Gizmo happens to have a bad day (of course I have to give up my video in that case).

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I admit to only ever using googletalk for video chat so perhaps that is why I have had so few issues. It would be REALLY nice if Skype video chat worked so I could chat with my 100's of friends who use that app instead of trying to invite them to gizmo.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Slightly off topic, but for anyone who's interested in the whole "run your own Asterisk server" approach... the easiest way to go about it is to grab a copy of AsteriskNOW (liveCD and installable). Basically it's Asterisk designed to be user friendly... you can get a full switch up and running from nothing in about 15-20 minutes depending on the speed of the machine you're installing on. It comes with a web-based GUI to manage extensions, dialplan options,etc.

If you want to use it just for video chat between friends/etc you don't even need to worry about sip providers and things, just add a few extensions that use SIP as the protocol, and make sure that the H263 codec is enabled for them. I haven't used the gui in a while, but if the option for this isn't in the GUI it's extremely easy to add to the config file:
http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk+video

It's by no means intended to be easy for complete new comers to technology as the thread initially talks about, but if you want to try something new and neat you don't need a lot of Linux experience or anything to get it going!

Oh, one last tip... I don't know if the gui has the option, but for me I found it was important to enable NAT support since I'm behind a NAT router:
http://www.voip-info.org/wiki-Asterisk+sip+nat
(it's as easy as adding nat=yes to your extension definitions).

Thanks,
-Rob

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Based on this post


I went and put gizmo on my home pc and my n810. Besides the video from the 810 being horrible when viewed on either platform (as always) the video on the 810 (from the PC) constantly crapped out even at 128x96 pixels. Are there some tuning factors I need to do?

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Please correct me if I am mistaken, but most of the discussion here seems to be about NIT-to-NIT video calls. Is there a good, simple method for NIT-to-PC video calls yet?

From what I understand:
-Skype on NIT doesn't have video
-GoogleTalk video only works NIT-to-NIT
-Gizmo is a possible NIT-to-PC option, but hardly any no one I know uses Gizmo.
-and None of the mega-IM services (AIM, Yahoo, MSN) are supported either.

Am I wrong?

I keep hoping that the RTCOMM beta will add simple videochat to those mega-IM services, but that seems unlikely at this moment.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I don't know about Gizmo specific but what are your bandwidth capabilities at the location? I assume you did this with both endpoints on the same LAN. That means you were both going out to the the net and back. Your internet upstream speed is likely the bottle neck. I don't know/think that Gizmo will "reinvite" connections that it finds can go peer to peer so that the video doesn't have to leave the LAN and come back. I did a similar test (SIP) that forced both ends to travel out and back. The quality was good but close to saturating the upstream. With the NITs on different LANs the quality was very good unless WiFI signal was weak. I find the cameras to be optimized for video calls and work rather well.

First I'd check several bandwidth test sites to determine a realistic upstream speed. Many other factors but I'd start there.

jolouis, it must have been a while since you did * in a box. I think *home is now http://www.asterisknow.org/ . Another boxed * is Trixbox http://www.trixbox.org/ . Both of them work very well but not exactly for total newbies if you expect to turn it on like an iPhone... (too bad iPhone doesn't yet have a SIP client..). Easy enough and if you like to learn then they are great tools that work very well with the NITs including video.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I thought that googletalk video works from any client?

I wouldn't count out getting video on the NIT with services that offer it. It might come sooner or later. Funny, it works with xmpp (googletalk, jabber etc) and SIP (gizmo etc); both are open protocols and the others are not....

Personally I don't know many people doing any video from any service. So for me it was an easy choice to run my own IM and phone system. The folks with cameras can use them. I don't need to video the millions of strangers on the mega IM systems.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Regarding the original topic, I've done a tutorial on how to set up and use video chat with the built-in internet call client:

http://tabletschool.blogspot.com/200...ablets-to.html

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Why is it that they can only be used NIT to NIT?

I know I'm able to stream from my PC to my n810.

And when I first do Gizmo PC 2 NIT I get the intial frame and sometimes NIT 2 PC works.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

The tablet hardware can technically do NIT to PC, but the built-in software doesn't yet support it.

Basically, Nokia needs to update/replace the built-in video call software.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

Is this Gizmo specific? I didn't notice because over a generic SIP call it works PC-NIT no problem (if the SIP server supports video). Glad I did my own server.... :)

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I think this is wrong. There are a few people on this forum that can do video calls to PCs with the built in software. Using a pure SIP environment.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

One day when I was watching tv a cisco ad came on. I was expecting another "Human Network" ad, but this one was new. I didn't pay attention to the ad, until I saw a guy walking with a n800 in his hand and making a video call. I was like waaattt? The guy was talking in a different language (chinese i think?) but that ad got me thinking.

Re: Wow, video chat on the tablets is amazing...
 

I think that is referring to Gizmo calls. Gizmo is SIP sorta but not as generic as many. I use the SIP client all the time and have little trouble doing video to NIT or PC.

I just noticed the handle "bluesubaru". Here's mine "silverbaru":
<way off topic....>
http://spda-online.ca/modules/xoopsg...8886.sized.jpg