Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

I wasn't trying to find information, I was trying to make a suggestion. A glance at the project activity graph shows no activity. It's possible that is not true and that there is fevered activity. If so, great. In the meantime, nothing has been released for the N800 or the N810.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

If it needs an increased software quality, i'd rather like to get a bug report or an email about those flaws than finding it being listed in some wiki under "needs fixing". And if it actually needs fixing, i really wonder why it got listed there in the first place.

This is open source. If you or someone else thinks that going the maemo way is necessary, then this person is invited to contribute and do exactly this. This is how OSS works. If noone is interested in actually doing this then there's either no benefit of doing so or there's not enough interest in that project. That also would indicate that this project does not fall under "remarkable projects".

I'd really appreciate a "list of cool software". But e.g. limiting it to projects following certain maemo rules by 100% will very likely make it only contain projects i already know.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

If you notice, most Linux distributions tend to recommend to their users applications hosted in their centralized repository (and there are rules to get there), while they are reluctant to reccomend anything else.

This is how open source gets organized around distributions, usually.

You app was listed because a user thought it was worth having it there. You should be happy!

I really don't want to argue or upset you. Your critique is good for a better maemo.org Thanks!

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

It's true that most distros host everything in their own repositories. But they just do it themselves and don't list projects they don't consider acceptible for being not in their repos. Another thing is that these distros choose from a huge pile of mature software. Maemo isn't there and most apps are either non-hildonized ports or are just are early versions (like gpxview and e.g. even modest and microb). I'd rather put some focus on interesting projects rather than the repositories they reside in or if they are easy to install. As i said: You'll end up with the well-known group of Maemo-Mapper, Canola and friends. Not that i don't like em, they are great, but they don't need to be protected from being forgotten.

If someone thinks that gpxview would benefit from being moved/copied to maemo extras, just go ahead. I really appreciate contributions. But i don't see a benefit that is worth spending my own time to move it there. But if someone else thinks it is important and is worth the effort, just go ahead and live the community idea by doing so ...

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

To be a little constructive, here's what i think is needed (just my personal view of course):

Don't make a proper install file and the project being in maemo extras a prerequisite. Instead make this the goal. Don't limit the projects in any way, but list them to get people involved. There sure are projects that people love, but that never got an install file or never were properly hildonized. Why don't try to achieve this via this wiki page? Something like "people love project xyz, so we encourage you to make it ready for prime time".

This might even be closer to what you intended to achieve as this might indeed save some nice projects from getting lost.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

I love it. The best Maemo apps that you may no know about.

Work with the developers to get it into the download section or even extras so that everyone will know how to get it.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Try Festival? Don't know if it's a decent reader IYHO or not...
It's available on the tablets now, courtesy of PB.

To me, an even more major and glamorous project is possible, but nobody's trying yet: Speech-to-text. At least in the limited-vocabularity sense of understanding voice commands, this should be doable in terms of processing power. But nothing's really been done yet. (I know, I know, that means I should get busy, doesn't it? :))

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Bringing this thread back on topic...

Isn't https://wiki.maemo.org/Task:Remarkab...unity_projects accomplishing what you just said?

- Applications without proper install file are listed there, only not on the top. There are good reasons not to recommend application without working install file to average users.

- Same with being in maemo.org extras.

- Listing the interesting projects there no matter what pointing what is missing for prime time helps getting people involved, especially if we all agree the page is useful and needs awareness.

- "Hildonized" is not a requrement at all in that page. Finger/thumb ready UI and "decent design" are the factors, and they are by no means tied to Hildon only.

- "people love project xyz, so we encourage you to make it ready for prime time" - The current text says "Getting a list of these projects would help to * Improve their quality and promote them as ready to primetime. " Close enough, but it's an open wiki page and anybody can improve the current writing, including yourself.

I still fail to see why you see this page as your enemy and not your friend.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

I believe he just meant that the applications at the top of the page do not need kudos/exposure, they are already well known. The items at the bottom of the page will not magically jump to the top just by being listed there.

I think he just meant we should be concentrating on those items at the bottom of the page, not the top.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

This is pretty much what i meant. It puts focus on the usual suspects we all already know.

This page isn't my enemy. But it's also not my friend. I don't see any benefit a project has from being listed there. The page focusses on the fact that there are projects complying to certain political rules and others that don't. But that's by itself rather boring as users typically don't care about the repositories they download software from. This is especially true since maemo has mechanisms to make installations from other repositories rather simple.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Er, political rules? :\

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Are you kidding? ;)

I don't know why a finger-driven UI is a must requirement, but, I still can't believe no one has mentioned the different GUIs and window managers that have been ported and ported well to Maemo. KDE 3, XFCE, Open Box, etc... have been ported?

I think these are huge community projects and should been mentioned as such.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Sorry, just few people know them in this big big world.

These applications are usual suspects for a % of people buying a Nokia Internet Tablet, which is not a very big % of the people that actually do install and use third party software in their PC / laptop / mobile device.

Do your friends and relatives know about "Canola", "Maemo Mapper", Numpty Physics"...? Do the people interested in mobile software development or linux development know them?

Maemo will keep growing and more awareness will be generated around this platform. It is the interest of the platform to promote their best applications and it is the interest of these applications to be promoted near the platform.


As said, up to you.

What do you mean by "political" and what looks political to you there? The intend is to list criteria to enforce certain quality and user experience level.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

This was discussed until exhaustion at [RESTARTED] Internet Tablet Talk Software Section.

Users don't care about repositories but they care about error messages when trying to install applications, slow performance, drained up batteries, system crashes, alpha quality apps available in their Application Manager and etc.

Multiple repositories without build quality assurance, static links to libraries, binary-only packages of open source components and similar practices are in theory not bad per se and might work well for a single application in a single go. Add more applications and update them over time in a system and the differences of risks for the user are clear.

Again, it is not a coincidence that the best open source distributions are build around central repostories with certain quality criteria to differentiate what is integrated and stable from all the rest. Or do you also see "politics" behind the principles and processes of e.g. Debian or Ubuntu?

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

(qgil / maemo / nokia) I for one applaud your efforts to bring some sort of orginization to the chaos. I know however I seem to sometimes be the cause of such chaos.

I guess the reason I have hesitated to put things like KDE or other ports in, is its just me hacking. I love the fact that many people love KDE. I would love it even more if SOME DEVELOPERS decided to take on this project. (or any NON-MATCHBOX Window Manager environment) I am not a developer, I am a hack at best ;)

It would take me a long time to put all the 100+ applications into individual debs and create all the dependency links and source debs and my head just hurts thinking about it.


There are apps that can be made for primetime that are currently not available in repos. I just dont think my works are one of them. I think my stuff is great "proof of concept" but it needs real developers to be ready for repos.

The tablet community is ready for an alternate window manager supported by maemo team. This would spur on much more developemnt in my opinion.

Anyway, thanks again Quim, This past year has been much better with Noika/Maemo team taking a more active role in community developement. Thanks for all your efforts :)

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

It took me hours to figure out that the gtkhtml2 and hildon-help lib in maemo extras are exclusive and an application using both will crash once it's trying to use the help system ... This is in todays extras repo.

I never complained about maemo extras. I complained about the wiki page and the way it's differentiating between good software in the extras repo and bad software in other repose which needs to be moved to extras to "meet certain criteria".

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Just for informational purposes, there's discussion of the issue in bug #3245.

Re: Listing the remarkable projects around Maemo
 

Help me to help you .. to help me.... o help me :)

I applaud nokia/maemo team for bridging linux power with user friendly, but there's little visible support on this forum to support such endeavors. So this is triage (which is ok)... if it veers into guilt/encouragement maemo team should invest effort in a forum since this is really for their benefit.

How can i help you to help me to help you? :)

Diablo seems great btw.. loving browser speed and wifi stability so far... excellent continuation to all my ITs... my old n800s have never run so good compared with their OOB os. It really is impressive what it can do with its OS footprint.