Diablo named properly
 

Well, Diablo is named correctly - it is pure evil.

Nokia communicates with no one so developers/users get screwed.

Modest is crashing and not ready for prime time.

Developers are told it should only take an hour to get their stuff building, but that's more like a week.

Canola doesn't work (again, Nokia's fault for not doing beta releases - *****s).

I think it's time to deep six this POS and get something that does work!

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Welcome! It isn't too bad for your first message in ITT.

Modest works for me.
I have almost all my stuff in diablo extras yet.
Canola works for me. I use it everyday.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Ah, whiny idiots are fun. :rolleyes:

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Modest works for me with googlemail/imap, too, but crashes SOMETIMES.
You can use the "old" chinook stuff, so why rebuild???
Canola2 is working for me, too, like before.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Canola2 works, just make sure not to update python. Then it crashes and burns big-time

Re: Diablo named properly
 

No big loss on our end, if this first post is an indicator of the usefullness of your postings, please "deep six" away


I really tried not to respond to this post, but its such BS, I could not stay away!!

Re: Diablo named properly
 

I don't know what i did because I'm a newbie, but everything is working for me, including Canola2 and more than 20 applications I already used in Chinook.

Maybe I'm just lucky.

Modest crashes sometimes (Internal error message), but it was the same in Chinook.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

The Diablo SDK was released AFTER the Diablo OS update not many months prior. As a developer of one application, I did feel blind sided by the release as others must, otherwise why would any one need to use any chinook repositories for anything but abandoned applications. But since on the day that Diablo was released, the extras repository was completely empty, I don't think that's the case.

Modest does crash for me, I've used one beta build that didn't, I wish I could go back to that one.

It's my choice to upgrade to Diablo, nothing forced me to.

Frank

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Nokia handled the transition poorly, but this is Nokia that should be no surprise.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Reflashed this morning, and there are two things I've noticed: 1) an app is rock-solid stable when running, but when in the background 2) I've had the tablet crash on me twice (lock up, or auto-reboot.) Quite interesting, but the overall feel of Diablo is better to me. :D Maybe I need to extend the memory?

Re: Diablo named properly
 

I upgraded a couple of days ago. Have had no success reinstalling any applications (from restore function). All downloads failed. Finally decided to re-flash while skipping restore, then manually reinstalled all applications. Now everything works. Cheers!

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Did you bother to try and solve the problem? The solution is literally plastered all over the web.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

For those of us who haven't been following every thread in every ITT forum for the last month would you mind saying what the solution is?
I just dropped in to see what's going on lately and I haven't even seen a thread that explains why I would or wouldn't want to upgrade to Diablo.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

The solution is to add chinook to the maemo extras repo under distribution (I think that's the category).

Re: Diablo named properly
 

or less messily, in terms of future updates, add a copy of the extras repo info with that little change. that way one do not have to wonder why some update people are talking about do not show up at their end...

Re: Diablo named properly
 

I'm not going to lie, I'm a little surprised myself that it was released so early, after a few weeks of using the pre-release versions, I didn't think it was anywhere near prime-time.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

I find it odd that Nokia released Diablo with so many open and high-priority bugs still outstanding. I also find it strange that they released it the same day that Nokia announced the creation of the Symbian Foundation. It is questionable their reason for doing this. I'd really like to know really why it was literally rushed out the door with no supporting applications and still a lot of outstanding bugs that are still outstanding. The N810 is a great device, but Diablo is really getting on my nerves. It won't tether to my phone anymore, the application manager still randomly crashes, the OS freezes from time to time, and other small things seem to be plaguing this OS. Maybe Maemo should be rolled into developing a Mobile Ubuntu and the propreitary software components be sourced so we don't have to work around bugs (like the craptastic GPS capability of the device) and the WLAN/Bluetooth drivers. Also, is Nokia is so gung-hoe the device, why not pay for a OGL ES license? The hardware is there, but Nokia is unwilling to pay or at the very least implement it.

C'mon guys, pull your heads out of your asses and give the consumer what they want.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

By the way, I'm a Sprint Customer and have a lot of personal contacts with Sprint's product development. I don't want to cause a headache for you, but if you keep failing to deliver on these features or try to pass up devices on features they already support, I'll have no choice to raise issue. I've already made HTC's life a little harder for failing to deliver advertised features on the Touch, don't make me do the same for Nokia.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

"High-priority" is pretty meaningless in the current bugzilla, as there isn't really a good triaging process for priority in place. Anything specific in mind?

Personally, I rather doubt a simple maintenance release had anything to do with any Symbian announcements. :\

"No supporting applications"? What does this mean? Diablo is almost entirely backwards compatible with Chinook stuff, so I don't see the issue. Yeah, Diablo Extras could've used a couple weeks notice to allow time for people to get their stuff through the autobuilder, but if you want perfectly smooth upgrades, you're generally better off waiting a month or two before installing them. This applies to any platform (just look at what happens with some Apple point releases). :)

It tethers fine for me, here and Application manager is rock-solid compared to the Chinook version. I haven't seen a crash yet.

Huh? Ubuntu Mobile is targeted at MIDs, which are x86 and generally more powerful (and more power hungry) than our ARMs. It doesn't make a lick of sense to merge the two.

Have you played with agps-ui? It seems to greatly improve GPS performance for a lot of people.

Nokia has looked into it. The drivers suck (i.e., crash frequently), and the performance isn't great is the word I heard from LinuxTag. Now, I don't know about you, but releasing drivers that suck *** and don't work right to consumers isn't something I think consumers want. But, hey, that's just my opinion.

What the "consumer" wants is coming with step 5. 'course, I might consider myself a consumer, and I quite like what I have in my hands right now. So maybe that should read "give me what I want or I'll issue ultimatums!", hm?

Note, Nokia isn't here. You're just talking to a bunch of enthusiasts, and we (well, me, anyway) don't really care about your ultimatums. Try contacting Nokia directly if you're really that bothered by it.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

People will always have to complain.

Every device out there will always have a dark side.
It's impossible to make a device that pleases everyone.
The only devices I ever read positive comments all over the web, are always the ones that aren't shipped yet.

When the device ships, it's a matter of minutes before people start complaining that the device doesn't do what they wanted from it.
The problem is:

a) they didn't even know what they wanted from the device they got
b) they didn't read the specs of the device
c) even if they did, they were reading what they wanted to read, not what was actually written.

I personally think it's the same for the Nokia tablets.

For me, as a customer and developer, it's the most amazing device out there.
It allows me to actually develop on it, I can talk with the people behind it (and not only the developers), it gives me enough openness (and still they're improving it) and bla bla bla...

What the heck, be happy with it and be constructive, for a time, on the first device you can actually be constructive about.

The "big companies playing evil" is now a cliché. Forget about it.
Or at least think about Nokia just as a logo on the device, because who's actually behind the tablet is the Maemo team.
And they're for sure not evil at all (even tho they have just released the diablo).

Re: Diablo named properly
 

It's interesting to note that the OS2008 user site choose to go with the devil direction for the Diablo advertising.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Are you really serious that Nokia has nothing in place to triage bugs? Their developers just work on what they feel like? Here are a few that I have personally witnessed since "upgrading".

• Modest where crashes range in level from annoying to frustrating as it takes out hildon-desktop. ( they have had this problem for MONTHS without resolution ). Bugzilla just upgraded this bug to "high priority" this morning.
• RTCom updates? This is one of the more stable Nokia software products and it somehow missed the cut.
• VoIP still seems to need prodding to produce volume. This is on top of the purely functional issues with the VoIP and messaging UI's.
• Year old firefox render engine
• GPS, now with an unstable A-GPS support that effectively brings down the GPS subsystem when it fails
• browserd which will consume 100% of the memory in the unit, doesn't handle keyboard shortcuts properly
• Failed connections to networks will leave the network in the connections list until a reboot

And these are all bugs that I have run into since flashing to diablo. Each one is either a) because of new Nokia software or b) an existing, well known bug from Chinook.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

No, they have an, apparently, quite nice internal tracker that is well triaged and managed (you can see references to internal tickets in the Alias field). :) My point is that a "high" priority on bugs in bugzilla don't necessarily reflect the bug priorities on the internal tracker. Many bugs have submitter-set "high" priorities, which have nothing to do with any real priority.

See bug #630 for some background, but Andre has been working his way through the entire almost-4000-bug bug-list and triaging each and every one of them (which includes linking them to internal bugs and reporting back any relevant information from them), and working on changing the way Nokia engineers do business with relation to bugzilla. So while things are looking up moving forward, a "high" priority in bugzilla shouldn't necessarily be taken as an indicator of any internal priority.

Apparently the tinymail threads are crashing for some reason or another, it's being worked on and some of the fixes should have made it into the svn. johnx compiled it yesterday, and I'm certain he'd be willing to share a binary if you asked.

rtcomm was upgraded with Diablo, just the Telepathy plugins didn't make it in. I hear this could've had something to do with Nokia not having talked to those providers yet. Not really sure, though.

I personally don't have a lot of problems with volume and VoIP, but, yeah, the volume as a whole for the entire platform is a little low for what the hardware is capable of.

This one has been covered a lot already. But I'll explain it again here. Major code changes are frozen 2-3 months before the release, and merging with the latest Firefox code is a non-trivial task, which means there was not enough time to merge with one of the RC releases (and definitely not with the final release) and the code that was available to make the timeframe simply wasn't worth "upgrading" to. Unfortunate, yes, but those are the facts.

Now, from what I can tell a lot of the big Diablo bugs have been fixed internally, so if you want try your luck with the svn (which, actually, I think was merged with trunk a week or two ago) I'm sure you'll find it to be quite a bit nicer (probably want to install osso-software-version-rx*4-unlocked for the non-strict dependencies, first, though).

Yes, that's why the AGPS support is beta, and doesn't ship with Diablo. . . .

Is that top consumption? Because top consumption is entirely meaningless. :) Install htop and get back to me on that one.

Yes, icd underwent a fairly significant upgrade (WiMAX stuff) and didn't seem to get enough testing before it hit release. Saved connections seem to be a problem, and it sometimes crashes out and the GUI wont be able to reconnect to it for some reason.

. . . and yet, I've found Diablo to be a net positive overall. Application manager is much more usable, overall system stability is improved here, virtual input methods are much more consistent system-wide, and much of the phantom typing in the fkb and vkb seems to have been eliminated.

The thing to keep in mind for Diablo, though, is SSU. The good news is that a lot of the issues seem to be getting fixed internally, and all that's needed is a couple of SSU pushes to get them to us (well, or you can try out the svns for the open stuff if that's your thing)—no waiting 4 months for another big firmware release. ;)

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Thanks, but the "fix" has been in the svn for months, I'm not going to hold my breath or expect that this binary would fix anything.

No, when answering a VoIP phone without a headset on you often have to adjust the volume before it suddenly "kicks in".

So that's why Modest was being worked on up until the last minute?

It's one of the hyped features of this release directly from Nokia. Writing it off as "it's just a beta" doesn't cut it. The whole system is beta if that's the case.

No according to top it's using 120% of the memory.

Better than their previous release... well.. I don't know how much that's saying.

Um, that is a complete red herring because Nokia has been able to push out updates this whole time ( Maps in the Chinook release for instance ). SSU may expand the number of packaged under proper management, but they have always had the ability to push an update for the system software.

SSU, as we have already witnessed, will encourage more half-baked releases from Nokia.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Eh, I chatted with the developers a bit a few days ago, they say there've been improvements. I'll take them on there word

Er, the specs for a shipped product are different than for a un-shipped product. Notice MicroB received frequent releases right up until Chinook shipped.

The "hype", if you want to call it that, has been from 3rd parties. The only real "hype" I've seen from "Nokia" was a few words in the maemo.org announcement.

Again, top provides completely meaningless memory consumption information. Use htop.


Technical issues aside, the process wasn't in place for that. But, whatever, you're obviously set on condemning Nokia. Far be it from me to try and stop you.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

If you wish to ignore how poorly Nokia has handled the development, release, and support of the ITOS it's no skin off of my nose.

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Sorry for my too late question. What means whiny? :)

Re: Diablo named properly
 

People who whinge and complain a lot. :)

Re: Diablo named properly
 

Thanks. Sometimes I am displaced because my bad english ;)