N97 or N900?
 

A friend of mine asked me yesterday if he should buy the N97 (as he intended to) or wait for the N900; he had actually read the rumors elsewhere, I didn't tell him. ;)

My first impulse was "N900, because it's free software..." - but then I realized that this was exactly the one thing he doesn't care about. He's a gadget lover. He'd even buy Apple if they had something that he thought was cool.

So what I thought was odd is that besides Maemo being the politically correct OS, I couldn't find much in favor of the N900. Quite on the contrary: the N97 is smaller, by far not that heavy (150g vs. 180g for the N900), has a D-Pad, hardware buttons on the front cover, .... and, not to forget, it runs an OS that has a long history as a reliable and successful phone OS.

I can't say much in favor of the N900 in direct comparison. Higher resolution, yes, but I doubt you'd notice at 3.5".


Is there anything I missed? Anything that would shout "Wait until the final specs of the N900 are revealed" to an average consumer who simply loves high-tech-toys but certainly doesn't care about free software?

None of the two devices are what I expect of a phone myself, so I never cared to really gather information about the N97. Is there something in the specs that would put one device clearly ahead of the other? (In case you love bricks, that is ;) ...)

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Wait until the N900 is totally revealed, and then make the decision. If there's a need for such a device now(-ish), then get the N97. It will have ample value by the time the N900 comes out that it will be suitable to make that comparison and then move/not-move then.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

It depends on how close N900 turns out to resemble the speculation that was leaked. If N900 comes out as leaked there is very little size difference. The length/width have slight difference due to slightly different aspect ratios of the screens but both are still 3.5".

IF the N900 is indeed a phone:

The N900 is going to come with far superior hardware with OMAP3430 and 256MB of RAM and this is the one reason I'm excited about it. The N97 is running a 434MHz ARM 11 core with 128MB of RAM.

I'm excited to see how Maemo is used on a phone.

N97 supports US 3G for AT&T and not T-mobile but it looks like the N900 will support T-mobile and not AT&T? 3G support is a must for me personally and the lack of support for AT&T 3G could be a deal breaker for me personally with the N900. Hopefully there are multiple versions as there are with their current phone.

You need to compare the software repository between S60v5 and Maemo. S60v5 is slowly getting more and more support from vendors as they support the new touch version of Symbian. Is Maemo going to get more or less support for application ports? Yet to be seen.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

I too will be disappointed if there is no 3g for the N900 with AT&T in north America. :(

Why not get an Android phone over the N97, I have heard Google will soon be taking over Europe… http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/0...-years-end/?em:D

Maybe we will all want the “The Google Experience” after seeing the N900 and how tightly T-mobile has it locked down....:(

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Yep, Android is nice for gadget lovers. And the G1, while being a thick brick, is still a thinner brick than what the N900 is expected to be. :)

Re: N97 or N900?
 

so nothing in favor of the N900. (the faster cpu doesnt count... performance-wise they could be equal if maemo needs more resources than s60, which i think it does)

Re: N97 or N900?
 

A framework generally doesn't consume significant CPU resources during activities where it matters (e.g. games, videos, etc). It very much counts.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Watching the maemo-developers mailing list, I'd say the Maemo team is still months away from a polished final release, so if you want something sooner rather than later, go N97.

The N900's OS, I think, will look "swishier" and very next-generation, with lots of transparency, 3D effects, swishing and swooping windows, etc. That tends to appeal to gadget hounds.

I think the N900 will be a very nice device, nicer to use than the N97, and probably with a very good set of apps out of the box...

...but it will really shine for all of the edge cases that excite us geeks; it will be able to handle open codecs (like ogg, flac, etc), it will have a command line, you'll have all the freedom of the current tablets to hack away at everything and anything....

But that isn't interesting, as you said, to gadget hounds.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Yes, I got the same impression myself. The suggested July launch for the US would be nothing short of a miracle. The September-October timeframe seems more realistic :(

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Just in time for Nokia World Conference in September...http://events.nokia.com/nokiaworld/home.htm

Re: N97 or N900?
 

I bet you know exactly the sinking feeling I got in the last few days as I read about broken widgets in pannable areas and broken dialogs in portrait mode ... and then I started to get responses to my inquiries about OpenGL... I set my rose-coloured glasses down very slowly, very sadly. :(

Boy, I was hoping for that July release, too. But I think it would be insane for them to release in a month.

Some little piece of me hopes there's an ace up the sleeve here, but I doubt it. I just can't see it.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

1. Faster processor OMAP generation 3 (N900) compared to generation 2 (N97)
2. Double RAM memory 256 MB (N900) compared to 128 MB (N97)
3. 3D applications and OpenGL (3D fast games) supported by N900 processor
4. OpenOffice and KOffice (Word, spreadsheet, presentations PPT) for free in N900 compared to 30$-40$ QuickOffice in N97
5. Hundreds of free good applications for Maemo N900 and potential more hundreds from Linux community (including potential to have Google G1 application framework ported to Maemo) compared to almost not many good free application on Symbian.
6. Very good internet browsers FireFox , etc on Maemo, compared to not very performant browser on Symbian.
7. Full Java support for Maemo not only a subset like is for Symbian.
8. Full Flash support for Maemo, not just a mobile version like is for Symbian.
9. Easy to program Maemo compared to hard to program Symbian Carbide C. - more applications for N900 in future.
10. 800 x 480 resolution means VGA videos will not be shrinked, which is better quality watching videos and all the games and applications. (N900 has 800x480 and N97 has 640x360)
11. Command line is very important, because you can package quickly anything, run a Pearl or a shell batch file and you can install anything, you can update libraries and modules, install frameworks and do a lot of stuff.
12. Video recording is 800x480 on N900 which is better than 640x480 on N900
13. qole noted that Maemo 5 is "swishier" and very next-generation, with lots of transparency, 3D effects, swishing and swooping windows, etc. That tends to appeal to gadget hounds.
14. Linux is a solid OS, where Symbian is only a mobile OS.
15. Linux community is greater than Symbian's
16. Linux Maemo has many Virtual Machines (VM) which can run from Windows to different other systems.
17. Maemo has better remote connection applications, and with bigger resolution of N900 and much more memory (needed here) N900 will clearly subclass N97 in this category.
18. More printer drivers and other drivers in Linux.Maemo than Symbian. Linux cames from computer to mobile so it has more USB capabilities.

This what came to my mind right now. Maybe there are many other advantages. One advantage N97 has is the tilt screen, which is very nice. :-)

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Puh-lease. :rolleyes:

The OMAP3430 is easily 2-3x faster than that ARM11 for most tasks, and orders of magnitude more for the more specific tasks that benefit from things like DSP acceleration, 3D acceleration, and SIMD (NEON). Symbian's RAM usage sure isn't anything to write home about as my 5800 has to regularly close applications due to memory constraints whereas my N800 never does.

You're severally deluded if you think Linux somehow negates that kind of performance bump compared to Symbian.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

If nokia was going to announce the phone in september, would they let developers get a glimpse of it so early? I think we can expect the n900 sooner... but i am not sure if it will have gsm.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Looks like Sept-Oct will be here sooner than later. Hehehehehe.

http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1319081

Re: N97 or N900?
 

What? Nobody was saying the N97 was months away. We knew that one was coming very soon. In fact, that's the major selling point for the N97 right now.

It's the device that will make the N97 look like a kid's toy that's going to take longer...

Re: N97 or N900?
 

I just hope you're right. I hope they don't wait for NokiaWorld, or even worse, OSiMWorld... But... how will they get everything done in time?

Re: N97 or N900?
 

This question stems from your in-depth analysis of Fremantle's progress based on . . . a couple of public mailing list posts whose scope is limited to a single package? . . .

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Yup. Call me Dr. Gregory House.

No, it's not Sarcoidosis. It doesn't explain the gtkhtml pannable area problems.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Buy N97 now and when N900 finally comes out, sell N97 and buy N900 if that looks more interesting to your friend. Who knows when N900 is going to be in shops, it's not even officially announced yet..

Re: N97 or N900?
 

...
19. No application signing required
I have a N810 and 5800 and I notice that the N810 is more mature as well and prefer this for webbrowsing.
OTOH, do not expect much of a builtin camera, a 'real' camera (compact or SLR) perform much better as the sensor is larger.
Shame that the N900 has a smaller screen (3.5") than the N810 (4"), I'd expect a larger one such as the Archos 5 or upcoming Apple Media tablet.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

If anybody can comment on Java framework on Maemo/Symbian (point 7) and also on Flash (point 8) framework on Maemo/Symbian. I am not 100% sure I was right on my points 7 and 8 above.
What about QR frameworks on Maemo/Symbian? Are they exactly the same or is one better that the other? What about KDE - is KDE ported/portable to Maemo?

Re: N97 or N900?
 

There is one option, but I dare not call that anything less than the speculation of the century. Here it goes, just for the SherlockHolmesing...

All the supposed 'early launches' were through telcos, europe and unsubsidized hinted as coming later. Note that the task switcher a bit of a mystery... What if this Rover thingy is a dual platform device ? Like, the early, July launch telco subsidized versions would run actual symbian, and the later, unsubsidized ones launching in Sept-Oct would be Maemo devices (maybe even running simultaneously or switching between Symbian and Maemo). That way you get two devices in one punch - a Symbian one for folks who like the hardware but don't care about Linux, and a Maemo one, for linux folks. And you manage to cut costs for HW R&D for free. Wild, ace-up-sleeve enough ?

If there is one unsubstantiated wild speculation, this is it. If I get this one right, I just wasted my chance of achieving world peace or finding the cure for cancer.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Since N900 is months away from release you should not only wait for final N900 hardawe specs to compare, you should also wait for the specs of the 2 or 3 other touch S60 Nokia phones expeted to be released this year, I'm sure one or more of them will use the same hardware platform N900 has if thats a main concern for you.
I have a N810, 5800, and N78 and the only thing I prefer from S60 is Nokia Maps and that'll be the main factor tha will decide if my next gadget will be S60 or Maemo based, even more seen what Nokia maps 3 beta can do.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Do you think an average user who wants to read and/or write documents or spreadsheats would like to use a KOffice or OpenOffice.org interface? I don't think so. The interface has to be optimized for the Maemo OS.

Application signing can be seen as positive too. You could do the same with GPG and APT.

Bottom line is because both aren't released it is very difficult to speculate, and we don't know how long we wait for one of these two new devices.

(Other points I agree with.)

I experienced the entire opposite with my N810. Never enough RAM to do much useful. Multiple MicroB windows open was an issue, or would be dog slow due to swapping.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

Many of theses comparisions are valid with the n97. But it is completely different when compared with palm pre or iphone v3. I would expect most of the things to be equal if not more compared to these two. The only advantage i see is open source and free applications(which the iphone has thousands).
Basically the n97 with a very sluggish processor and less ram is not going to compete anywhere with those two competitors.

Re: N97 or N900?
 

It just goes to show you exactly how useful the personal anecdotes that are frequently employed in these sorts of discussions as fact really are. ;)