Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

To defend the asking price of this unit you will need a lot of 3rd party software.

For people to want to develop software they will want to earn money, to earn money they will need a lot of users, to get a lot of users you need a unit lot of people will buy, for lot of people would want to buy the N900 you will need portrait mode..

End of story..

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Coming back to the subject, do you think that will be possible to see one portrait mode release before the end of the year ?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

sure, im confident Nokia is thinking about it...as they said, if people will want it really alot, theyll put it in..i mean, they must if they want good sales

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Now that I've had time to get over the initial lust, I've really assessed my mobile style on the go. I will definitely get the N900 if possible just because of its unprecedented power and versatile package. But the lack of universal automatic screen/UI rotation will severely limit the N900's role in my mobile life.

In my busy and hectic life, I always take time to exercise my 78 lb. pit bull Raki. I don't allow that to stop my productivity, usually keeping my N95 8GB in my right hand for posting to the Symbian-Freak site and forums, checking and updating my MySpace page, checking and responding to email and messages, and listening to the FM radio for sports news simultaneously. My dog's powerful dragging never stops me from carrying on my online errands and tasks.

The N900 will be a great device, but unless they embrace T9, preferably via a hardware keypad in portrait mode (and not the intrusive onscreen T9 option from S60), and in turn automatic screen rotation of the whole UI, its utility for highly active users will be limited.

Nokia seems intent on pushing QWERTY on the smartphones on the high end, and keeping T9 only for midrange devices. This will be a mistake, and ignoring the N95/N82 fans who have waited over 2 years for a suitable hardware upgrade. Many of us FAVOR T9, and Nokia and the community should really think of the direction going forward.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Without ASR, the N900 is a too small laptop. Still to cumbersome to use while active or on the go, more for quick pit stops. Shame

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Sometimes when I want to use my n800 one-handedly, I just bring up the full screen keyboard, and hold the device sideways, and I have all the characters on the right side of the screen.

Though it is annoying to have to see all the characters sideways, but my thumbs can reach them all.

If we can just re-use that keyboard, and just turn all the keys 90 degrees, at least that would be a start.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Does the N900 have Automatic scree rotaion like the Iphone or dont ?
because in all the videos the screen can't rotate only in the phone call it does...

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

@DaKing: I think it only does that in picture viewer for the time being. If you're talking about technical support to do such thing, then yeah, it has 3D accelerometer that's required to detect the movement.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

A sort-of mockup of my previous idea:

Attachment 4040

I only changed the Q W and A keys.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

With as surprised as Nokia was at the N800 sales and with the huge amount of purely positive attention the N900 is enjoying right now, I gotta disagree with you.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

ok, i think i've got something here. I found on a forum (http://maemofr.org) that Fennec Beta 3 is now release and that the final version will be release with the N900. I gone on Mozilla.org to ask them directly about the portrait mode of their browser. Here is the mail :

On Sep 8, 2009, at 1:23 PM, Gaëtan Goddefroy wrote:

I would like to know if it's supporting the portrait mode ?
That will be very important for the Nokia N900 device ! :)


Hi Gaëtan,

Fennec will definitely support portrait mode. As an example of how the UI changes, the set of browser tools icons will be across the bottom of the screen rather than along the side when in portrait to save screen space.

Madhava
_______________________________________________
dev-platforms-mobile mailing list
dev-platforms-mobile@lists.mozilla.org
https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-platforms-mobile


--
Madhava Enros
User Experience Designer, Mozilla Corporation


And this on symbian-freak :

http://www.symbian-freak.com/images/...ec_n900_00.jpg


It's seems that something good is on the way ;)

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

This is great news! Nokia is already making the portrait mode available for a couple of the builtin apps.
And i´m pretty confident than when n900 is being sold the community will want more portrait compability, nokia want be late to answer that.

A good example is the new 2.0 ui that they made for n97, after request from the consumers mostly. (?)

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Time will show..

More is always better.. My 20+ employees company prefer the iphone as long as no portrait on the N900.

Stupid to let a software issue stop this unit from being a word wide success..

Don't forget, the iphone was not fully established when the N800 was released..

Competition these days is fierce, if the N900 is to take up the competition with the market, I firmly belive it has to implement portrait mode as well.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

tangs hey that is really great !!! thanks for the news :cool:
now I'm really getting the N900 1000% :D

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I suspect some apps will support portrait and some wont. The developers that really want a large install base (which generally care about ui, user satisfaction, etc) will be more likely to include this feature. Stagnant apps that update once per year, may not be so quick to include it.

The jury's still out regarding whether or not the UI will support portrait in the future.

{:^(~

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBKSBAaJpc8

;)

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

any opinion ?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

There IS portrait mode on n900. Just like there IS landscape mode on the iPhone. It's just not everywhere around. Stupid to not read what others are writing.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

If you guys would produce a list in order of priority of what you would want to be in portrait mode, perhaps Nokia could use that for help in prioritizing work.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

By the way, is there any way to bring this issue in Nokia's attention? Or have they already noticed the demand for it?

edit:

But hey, Konttori, aren't you one of the Nokians?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Not that I believe t.m.o is the perfect cross-section of users to determine this, but for what it's worth, I started a poll with most of the mentioned apps here.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Wow, it seems that portrait mode really is a largely desired feature for users. I've now heard it mentioned in quite a few videos, and read about it quite a few blog-comments (unrelated to this forum).

I often wish my N810 had more portrait mode. Sometimes I just don't want to use two hands...

}=^[~

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I've looked through this thread and could not work out if this has been answered.

When using the phone application in portrait mode do you have access to your contacts and if so how do you search through them?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I think that the contacts are portrait as well (could be wrong about this).

}X^D~

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

There is access to the contact list (through a specific portrait designed dialog) in portrait mode for the call UI, yes.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

A limited, but finished, release for SMS, Phone and Calender would work just fine for me too.
Ofcourse this means that the dashboard too would probably need to rotate.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Desktop and dashboard MUST support portrait, because when you unlock the device it will be in landscape and then the app you open will be in portrait and the dashboard again in landscape and so on ..... :confused::confused:

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

This is just a concept that shows that a portrait mode keyboard could indeed be usable (with keys that are not too small). The positioning of the keys is not indicative of actual key placement (I just whipped this up pretty quick). The other options are kind of squished on the side, so I'll have to figure out something about that.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3420/...eb9a062c86.jpg

Any suggestions?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I'd start with the iPhone's portrait keyboard. And the longer I think about this, the more I realize my left hand doesn't really know my device very well. I will need portrait badly, or my dog walking and working will no longer coexist. I have a feeling Nokia will get the GUI fully rotational in no time.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Good effort.. but probably will not please the one-handed guys :)

Not to mention that there will be a learning curve involved to get used to a non-standard layout. More fodder to those who want to pan the product.

Much rather prefer the T9 solution. Most Nokia users will anyway be used to it

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Personally I just found out the n900 wouldn't be supporting portrait for key apps. This is disappointing enough to make me seriously reconsider buying what looked to **finally** be the perfect smartphone for me (call it what you want but it perfectly fits the definition of a smartphone that the rest of the world uses).

I have an HTC touch pro currently, which is a similar form factor, it also has a similar slide out keyboard, though it's a bit smaller.

A few points about single handed use:

1a. Even with the TP's smaller screen it's impossible to reach the whole screen or the whole keyboard with my thumb with the phone in landscape mode, held from the side.

1b. Holding from the bottom is very unstable and uncomfortable for accessing the screen and keyboard with my thumb. Maybe on the n900 you can reach the whole screen with the KB out, but I suspect you can't, maybe not even with it in. I think I'd get cramp in my thumb if I used it for more than about 30 seconds like this.

2. I use a huge amount of apps in portrait despite buying this device because of its keyboard. I really find it quite irritating that people are arguing that portrait just isn't needed. Frankly I suspect that most of these people have never actually had a smartphone that worked portrait only and would soon change their mind with regular use. Even if that's not the case, just because you find it ok doesn't mean everyone else does. I can state categorically that more than half of my usage of my TP would be extremely cumbersome if I had to use its landscape mode.


3. Use cases (these are real *every day* ones for me):
- a. Can't use two hands:

- Holding a bag
- Holding a support bar on the metro (very common for me)
- Smoking a cigarette or drinking coffee while on a break from work (all the time this one...)

- b. Speed of use:

- I can check an SMS that's arrived by quickly pulling my phone out of my pocket (while unlocking with the same hand) and pressing the screen once. Usually I just need to know what the message says, often if I don't have a hand free that is enough so I know if I need to respond or not, often I don't so I can just put the phone back in my pocket. This is probably the biggest problem for me.
- Same is true of email.
- Same is true of changing track on a media player.

- c. Portrait is more efficient for reading longer text:

- This is why magazines and books are portrait. I don't think I should have to say much more here. Our computer screens are typically landscape mainly for historical reasons (CRTs) so software tends to be optimised for this orientation, but that doesn't make it the best one. Try a portrait monitor for web-browsing sometime... It's amazing.
- I don't know if the Mozilla (Fennec?) based browser supports reflow like Opera mobile, but on my phone I find web pages much easier to read in portrait. Less scrolling
- Same is true of RSS
- Same is true of basically anything involving a lot of text.

Finally, regarding the keyboard. The Touch Pro's on-screen keyboard is too small to use in portrait mode really (though the Touch HD, almost same size as n900, with no fancy algorithms is fine to use), however even without using any on screen keyboard (except for phone), I still use the portrait mode for the majority of usage, as most usage is reading not writing, if I need to write I flip it to landscape for a minute, usually going straight back to one handed portrait mode when I'm done.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Thanks slight, great post from someone using a similar device.
I worry about this point a bit. Even if portrait mode is implemented in N900, will the unlock button on the bottom be a problem, thinking about trying to unlock with one hand? Is there an alternative onscreen unlock control, like on the iPhone?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

You could hold the phone button on the upper edge and flick it with your thumb. Or you could just slightly open the keyboard and close it immediatly with one hand.

But i think nokia should implement some way to unlock the screen just with the touch screen.

How about using the twirling circular motion to unlock a device??

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Slight; - I couldn't agree more!

Good valid points!

I currently have a Nokia N82 and a HTC Touch Pro, and my girl-friend has an iPhone.

I hope I am not forced to buy the iPhone instead of the N900 !

Luckily the iPhone is sold-out where I live, so I still have som time to decide. (See what happens with portrait mode on the N900)

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I did try it. It's amazing if you don't mind constantly scrolling left and right to read everything.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Yeah, sorry, but this is such complete ******** that it is funny. Aren't you one of the five people still using microb as their main browser? It's time to get off of your high horse and start using a browser that actually knows how to layout a page.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

I'm talking about Firefox on a regular Windows PC with widescreen monitor rotated to portrait mode, so how about you start climbing down your high horse before telling me to climb off mine, thanks.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

The dude was talking about Opera mobile, and you're talking about Firefox on a PC?

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

Maybe you should re-read the part of the text I quoted again. Opera mobile wasn't mentioned in it, nor before it, only afterwards. Also I'm not aware of Opera mobile running on too many devices that find themselves attached to *monitors* on a regular basis.

Re: Portrait mode use cases
 

What people seem to be forgetting is that web pages are created for a certian pixel width. I use fbreader in portrait mode but would never use the browser in it - first, pages are designed to be scrollable vertically and not horizontally. Second, there is no screen that allows viewing pages in portrait mode without zooming. Third, even if we had screens that had a 800-1000pix vertical, the content would be microscopic. I understand the iPhone approach - you would be zooming no matter how you hold it, so then why not do it in portrait, but the advantage of the NIT-s is/was exactly that - see web pages in full width.

As for portait mode desktop browsing, the same applies there, too - it works if your vertical is big enough - try portrait surfing with a 1024x600 screen and you'll see what I mean.

I'm not saying no site can look good in portrait or zooming cannot be reasonably painless, but landscape browsing does have a case on high-res MIDs.