maemo.org - Talk - liqbase calendaring ideas

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- - liqbase calendaring ideas (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=33327)

liqbase calendaring ideas

I received an email earlier today which included some seriously impressive ideas for the calendaring UI.

I will reproduce the mails here with images and see what discussion can be expanded upon.

Quote:

Kalle Lievejärvi to me show details 1:33 PM (2 hours ago)

Hi!

I have seen your work (only in youtube, though) with the liqbase and can't wait to test it on my N900 (come on Nokia...) I am extremely interested on the calendar application, because it is something fresh and new. At least can't remember seeing one before...

I know you are quite busy right now. But I just couldn't help myself to pitch you some ideas I would like to see in handwriting calendar app. I understand that your way to go is very clean, efficient, straight forward and intuitive. And I have tried to maintain this approach.

In attachment there is a zip -file with illustrations of my ideas.

Have fun!
Kalle Lievejärvi

the slides:

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...background.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...minbuttons.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...navigation.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...4_panningn.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...antelation.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id...6_portrait.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id..._monthview.jpg

http://liqbase.net/liqbase_cal_UI_Id..._monthedit.jpg

Quote:

kalle,

liqbase runs on the n810 :)
it should be just as happy running there as on the n900
I just updated liqbase-playground on the maemo.org extras-devel repository.

my apps are not perfect, and liqbase has its share of problems, they are just ideas about how I see natural computing.

huge thanks for your input, its better to talk about ideas and try new things than just accepting the default.
your presentation style is a million times better than mine.

I have spent some time reviewing them and made some notes below.

perhaps we could open up this discussion publically, I am thoroughly impressed by both your style and thinking and if it spawns other ideas and apps to improve the platform, all the better.

if you don't mind, I would like to host these pictures on liqbase and make a thread about them on talk.maemo.org with your full permission and credit of course.

ui1: white background hours view - i find white with black awful and at the moment liqbase cannot draw thick lines natively (its related to scaling issues and needing to spend time coding up the extra functionality - patches welcome)

i like the hours underlay - look at liqpostcard, that has similar to this principle.

ui2:
i have tried various combinations over the months with many many ui tests
the simple UI i have on the screen for sketching (4 buttons) is the minimum determined is needed from much testing, a way to write away what you are doing, a way to undo what you are doing, a way to clear what you are doing and a way to delete what you are doing.
this ui can easily be adapted for anything though and your idea could work equally well

ui3:
no invisible/magic ui
this application is designed to be used by people who are not the iphone generation.
it should be intuitive and workable and gestures and swipes are silly and confusing and non intuitive.

ui4:
same again, i dont want to be working on something and accidentally slip in the wrong area
it induces iphone curse, "click damn click damn, slide ahhh" ... no thanks!

ui5:
yes :)
the latest version in extras-devel can operate in windowed mode.
however it does not composite correctly so needs work when zooming out.

i agree entirely though :)
i need to know when i get important phone calls too so fullscreen is rarely used for me on my n900
(there is an aspect ratio bug at the moment tho)

ui6:
nice, agreed but the XV subsystem does not allow me to do this at present
its a bit broken

ui7+8:
i like that, i was trying to suss out how to just draw on the months
it fits with another thing im scheming too, that will emerge soon.

Thank you Kalle :)

Gary

finally now, kalles reply

Quote:

You sure are fast as hell !-)

I understand that liqbase is a playground. But it is starting to be a very impressive and mature application(s). So you should start to consider it as one, too.

Permission to use the pictures the way you want.

And some counternotes:

ui1: Actually, it is not quite white :-) But if you can set the background and pen in preferences, you can have different "themes" quite easily. Then we both are happy :-) Narrow line shouldn't be a problem, because background lines can be in lighter shades. I was using 2px line just to make sure it is visible on 37% zoomlevel (my screen hasn't the same ppi as N900, you know ;-) And the background should be just a background, not a part of the sketch itself.

ui2: While not being able to use it myself, I'm not quite capable to debate. Still think saving should be automatic (maybe it is?) and at least delete is not necessary (you can clear and save). In my opinion, when seeking after "natural computing", all buttons like "save" and "delete" should be avoided as long as possible. They are a part of "computing nature" - something we have used to, but originate from computer, not from a human.

ui3: Visible buttons, then :) If used as calendar, it should be easy to go atleast to next/prev day "Today is not good for me. Maybe tomorrow ... no ... no ... Saturday should be good". Ability to change +/- seven days would be also be a good possibility: "No, this friday I can't. What about next friday?". To go through month -view is fast (in your app) but confusing. And when used as a calendar, you probably write something that is not readable in month-view.

ui4: Fair enough.

ui5: Good :)

ui6: Not an urgent issue. Portrait would work fine with hour -layout, but there are other things that need to be solved before this is current (background, canvas bigger than screen, panning...) Just to motivate you with the background -idea :-)

ui7+8: sounds interesting..

Kalle

Now, its your turn, what do you guys think?

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

Disclaimer: don't use liqbase but calendaring was for some time my hobby.

1. Don't like any magic as magic areas, strokes, etc.
2. Quick menu with navigation physical and logical is necessary - but not sure about relying on Fremantle menu. I am left handed and Hildon UI is designed for right-handers with no option to switch sides which prevents me from effectively use tablets with thumb of one hand and stylus in the second.
3. Good idea with various colors of pen (another thing for quick menu).
4. Apart from month view good thing is "next x days view" - in this case 3 (today, tomorrow, day after) fits best.
5. If not whole day will be visible some sort of indicators for elements outside of viewport are necessary.

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

Those renderings do look very appealing..

I think the colours (black on white) and the background graphic help at least my brain to make the connection to paper and a "real" calendar. Makes me feel like the screen is just a viewport to a real paper calendar and also makes me want to doodle on it.. :)

Love the freehand drawing/writing in month view as well.

Don't know if it fits the grand scheme of things, but how would an eraser mode similar to what's in Xournal work instead of the undo/clear buttons?

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

I like the wall as it is. It organizes all your drawings into date order automatically. I also like the black background, I find it more readable during the day and less glare at night. I soon got used to its limited non "paint" like functionality. I loved the way you can pick the colours, so elegant. My kids just picked it up and got it. The kinetic scrolling is amazing even when it has loads of pictures.

Blimey it seems pretty perfect as it is :D

Oops thats not the calendar. Some great ideas here

Mike C

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

mikec,
why do you think i left liqbase as it was.
it was a number of months before i moved totally into the playground :)
and only now am i starting to feel at home there, its doing what i thought it would do.
it took some getting going and still needs more :)
(color select on one or other of the sketch editors like classic will come, but theres reasons why I haven't implemented them yet and hopefully they will come together soon.

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

Since liqbase is not an application but a framework is frikking impossible to came out with something that make 100% sense. Gary/lcuk should begin to decide at least where want put some element of a primitive interface and give a bit of coerence trough the single modules. I put together a draft interface example for various elements: angular buttons on each corner, button/title bar, status bar, promotional bar, random drop shades & collaterals...
In hope that will open more discussions & ideas:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3499/...c6eec9cd_o.png

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

ciroip
theming and flipping between black/white and white/black may be a potential problem
especially as soon as we implement syncing - where my black board, white ink is used and you get it on yours with inverted.

having said that, its a great layout and I think its practical to consider what you suggest.

The only thing I think is potentially an issue is the B/F corner cutouts you have indicated.
they take up physical space and throw off the UI to looking odd.
the small icons I have in those corners currently does not really impede anything whilst remaining practical and useful.

what functions are the icons for on the left hand side?

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

Quote:

Originally Posted by lcuk (Post 357781)

Everything there are just raw ideas: calendars and every single applications layouts are tied to the code.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lcuk (Post 357781)

having said that, its a great layout and I think its practical to consider what you suggest.

More than the graphics and colors I was just trying to show a possible set of different 'interface items' to reuse trough the different applications. the idea there is to have a couple of different 'logical layers' to play with:
* the grey bar that just 'steal' space to the real application playground (the shade just trick the user perception and make it look like the application background)
* the gold bars: the question here is if liqbase can manage an alpha composities for the shadow or for made the bar partially translucents
* 4 angular buttons (navigations? menus? home?). Nothing should overlap them (again they could be translucent to let see the behind sweetness )

Quote:

Originally Posted by lcuk (Post 357781)

The only thing I think is potentially an issue is the B/F corner cutouts you have indicated.
they take up physical space and throw off the UI to looking odd.
the small icons I have in those corners currently does not really impede anything whilst remaining practical and useful.
what functions are the icons for on the left hand side?

Agree, everything there is pretty odd: as I said above there is no real sense in this: just a general layout to play with (working with a vector program, or with a sage layers use in pshop/gimp, make possible to simulate pretty well how the single parts should be translated and implementated in a real interface).
Just a grid to begin to limit and have a direction of things: how many buttons availble and how much space they need, titles, messages) and then: colors, fonts, specific layouts.
There is nothing there definitive (and not a lot that deserve to be keep anyway).
Everything there is ready to be used and pimped :)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2513/...1193e10b_o.png

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

I like the look of what you have there. I think we could all use a little more oddness in our lives.

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

There's a slew of liq-somethning in the app manager.
What should an interested party download to try out what has been built? (and is it in extras devel?)

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

I will bump this thread today, I had not forgotten about it.
There is the Maemo-Barcelona Long Weekend event happening next month and liqbase calendar has been selected as one of the apps to be worked on for concepting and possibly following further.

anyone interested in the weekend in general or helping thrash out the calendar can sign up for this event and some may also get sponsorship to attend (see the wiki)

http://wiki.maemo.org/Maemo-Barcelona_Long_Weekend

Re: liqbase calendaring ideas

A useful, standalone application may actually emerge from the eternal liq-playground? What's next? Pigs flying over a frozen hell? :D