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-   -   Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=34120)

marcinw 2009-11-09 21:41
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by range (Post 370296)
Maybe you can apply for a pony later.
I don't really see what that has to do with openness or Nokia not being open source friendly.
A lot. When open source device is treat worse than close source device, than sorry... It's possible to have technical/human/time resources limits, but solution is simple - writing, that thing "X" will be available later. No excuse here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by range (Post 370296)
I can understand that you are miffed, because Nokia didn't support your project(s) - that still doesn't explain the hostility you show in this thread.
Not only mine... If you think, that something was wrong in my words, please show it. I say generally only, that Nokia is not taking care enough about own customers once again and they're making similar actions like in the past.

wmarone 2009-11-09 21:53
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcinw (Post 370307)
A lot. When open source device is treat worse than close source device, than sorry... It's possible to have technical/human/time resources limits, but solution is simple - writing, that thing "X" will be available later. No excuse here.
I don't get your point. I believe that for things like portrait mode support (in some applications) and MMS support, they -would- be coming later. I don't see how the N900 is being treated worse than a closed device.

Quote:
Not only mine... If you think, that something was wrong in my words, please show it. I say generally only, that Nokia is not taking care enough about own customers once again.
Please clarify how this is the case.

myrjola 2009-11-09 21:57
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Marcinw, if you are honest and do really appreciate Open Source projects, then stop whining and trolling on this community board.

We got your message already.

Alex Atkin UK 2009-11-09 22:05
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcinw (Post 370307)
A lot. When open source device is treat worse than close source device, than sorry... It's possible to have technical/human/time resources limits, but solution is simple - writing, that thing "X" will be available later. No excuse here.
So what you are saying is to support open source they must write ALL their own code? Because they couldn't just say "MMS will be supported on X date" if their own developers are not the ones working on that support. The nature of open source is that a lot of people are doing it for free, so you cannot pressure them into getting MMS support finished and Nokia staff are busy fixing the core functionality.

They also made it pretty clear the N900 is not meant to be the perfect phone, its a transitional device. Its basically a case of "get something to market now to promote interest". The whole idea being that by Maemo 6 things will be more complete. That to me is actually a pain for the end user for a very open source way of doing it, rather than doing everything behind closed doors.

If anything my personal biggest complaint is that Ovi Maps is not as complete as the version on cheaper Symbian devices, but that in fact seems to be caused by focusing more on open source than commercial support.

marcinw 2009-11-09 22:05
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmarone (Post 370324)
I don't get your point. I believe that for things like portrait mode support (in some applications) and MMS support, they -would- be coming later. I don't see how the N900 is being treated worse than a closed device.
Sorry, but on all Nokia pages there is still info, that supported messaging is "IM, SMS" (no MMS). There is no FM Radio too (of course, some of you can say, that's unofficial, etc. etc., but....)

Quote:
Originally Posted by wmarone (Post 370324)
Please clarify how this is the case.
You buy device X and you want to sync it from your Linux. Sorry. You buy your N900 and want to use functions available in your 7 years old Nokia. Sorry. These are maybe details, but...

Thor 2009-11-09 22:20
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcinw (Post 370307)
When open source device is treat worse than close source device, than sorry...
So if Maemo/Nokia are not as open as you like, who are? Apple? Windows Mobile? Android?

Some things will stay closed and proprietary... Nokia are not a charity, and what would stop other phone companies from ripping off their software ? They need to hold something back to be able to sell the hardware, while giving enough out (especially compared to others) so people can do what they want with their device.

marcinw 2009-11-09 22:20
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Atkin UK (Post 370335)
So what you are saying is to support open source they must write ALL their own code? Because they couldn't just say "MMS will be supported on X date" if their own developers are not the ones working on that support. The nature of open source is that a lot of people are doing it for free, so you cannot pressure them into getting MMS support finished and Nokia staff are busy fixing the core functionality.
I'm saying, that they're treating Open Source phone a little bit less serious than closed source phones. They could write: MMS will be available in future firmware release (without giving concrete date). Paying one good developer for making it (during few months in worst case) shoudln't be very expensive (I remind, there are Open Source codes and Nokia has got already own sources too). Speaking, that Maemo 5 is transition only is excuse for me.

marcinw 2009-11-09 22:24
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thor (Post 370347)
So if Maemo/Nokia are not as open as you like, who are? Apple? Windows Mobile? Android?

Some things will stay closed and proprietary... Nokia are not a charity, and what would stop other phone companies from ripping off their software ? They need to hold something back to be able to sell the hardware, while giving enough out (especially compared to others) so people can do what they want with their device.
nobody said about full opening. but when I compare all of them (Apple/WM/Androing/Maemo), Android seems to be the best.

livefreeordie 2009-11-09 22:25
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcinw (Post 370336)
You buy device X and you want to sync it from your Linux. Sorry. You buy your N900 and want to use functions available in your 7 years old Nokia. Sorry. These are maybe details, but...
So your whole argument is basically that 10 years ago Nokia didn't support Linux and all the work they've done in between doesn't count because Maemo isn't feature complete?

mikec 2009-11-09 22:25
Re: Why should I believe Nokia ? Why should I work for Nokia for free ? ... again
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcinw (Post 370348)
I'm saying, that they're treating Open Source phone a little bit less serious than closed source phones. They could write: MMS will be available in future firmware release (without giving concrete date). Paying one good developer for making it (during few months in worst case) shoudln't be very expensive (I remind, there are Open Source codes and Nokia has got already own sources too). Speaking, that Maemo 5 is transition only is excuse for me.
marcinw Symbian has now been Open Sourced. Qt has been Open Sourced for a long time, and drives the KDE desktop on Linux. Qt will be the strategic dev platform for both Symbian and Maemo.

Mike C


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