Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

My laptop has a speaker and microphone on opposite ends. You just can't hold it in your hands as easily. :p

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Heck, my N810 is a skype phone.

Re: N900 is not primarily a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

So, if it is an internet tablet, its alright to have a "bad calendar"? I would reckon the calendar to be a pretty important part in any internet centric device, regardless of what label you put on it. The lack of the abovementioned features doesnt exclude the N900 from the fact that it is a phone. Even Nokia's website says it is. However, its not really important what you call it. I dont have the N900 myself yet, but the missing or incomplete features you mention can in no way be explained with the "N900 is not a phone" argument. The simple reason being that lack of MMS, missing bluetooth profiles, etc are things that other phones lack as well. iPhone, as we all know, took 2-3 years to get MMS, and Android still doesnt have anything but very basic bluetooth functionality. You coulndt search emails on the iPhone either and dont even get me started on calendars on certain other smartphones. The lack of those features is just as big (or small) an issue for the N900 as it was or is for other phones.

You state that the N900 is not a phone, its a Internet Tablet/Mobile computer with an added cellular radio, but the N97 is a phone, even though you then called it a "multimedia computer". In my eyes, using your logic, the N97 wouldn't be a phone either.

Nokia has explained that most of the issues were simply due to the fact that they just didnt have time for it prior to release, but that we will, for example, see a better portrait mode by the end of the year.

And to all those who want to compare the N900 to a netbook, just because some netbooks have a SIM card slot and a microphone: Its not the same. The Netbooks doesnt comes prepared to make phone calls and (in many cases) text messages. You can off course install software that will enable you to do so, but then its all getting pretty far fetched as I can buy a SIM-card adapter and plug it into my desktop computer, and suddenly start using that as an argument for the N900 not being a phone. A netbook doesnt fit in your jeans.

The N900 is missing some features, but its not the only device in the smartphone market that does.

Lastly, consider if Nokia actually used this argument to wave off all criticism. "Its not a phone", when they advertise it as a phone and even compare it to the N97 and N86 on their websites. I dont think unhappy customers would accept that kind of reasoning and it would actually be an illegal advertisement.

The N900 merge a tablet with a phone, making it both.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

@Untouchab1e They mostly refer to it as mobile computer--even in the press releases. That doesn't mean I'm saying it is not a phone. It's many things. But first and foremost it is inherently a tablet mobile computer.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

The same could be said about the Touch Pro 2. Still, both devices eventually fall into the phone category. The trend we have been seeing over the last 3 years show us that smartphones are evolving into mobile computers. The N900 just got where it is from the other side. Its an internet tablet that became a phone, while, say the HD2 is a phone that can easily also be called a mobile computer.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

+1 for hoping Nokia has sweaty programmers somewhere working out the kinks in the N900 :D

EDIT: And to be more OT, especially when posting here I always feel weird referring to it as a phone. I'd rather not type mobile computer all the time though. It definitely feels more like a tiny computer, which is why I love it. I don't do tons of calling.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

I don;t think n900 quite knows what it is right now. In fact, listening to all this I feel rather sorry for it.

Clearly it comes from a long family of internet tablets. But n900 isn't an internet tablet: in its ambition to become a phone, it has downsized to a point where several users find it simply too small to be a effective tablet.

Nor is it really a phone, yet. It certainly would like to be, but its personal development hasn't quite reached the point where it can pass the grade of phone.

So poor n900 has made compromises on it's tabletishness to embrace its phonehood, and now finds itself astride the fence not quite meeting either need perfectly, but making a passable attempt at both.

With its long history of tablet experience, it doesn't really need help there (Well, maybe apart from its email functions... those are something you'd expect from an internet tablet, no?). But it could use some advice on how to improve its phonehood. Which is really all people are doing - giving suggestions for how to make this device somthing that truly could be not a tablet, not a phone, but both.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

At least in my books the N900 is a far better internet tablet than any of the previous Maemo devices. Better browsing experience, better communication experience for email and chat, better support for various internet services.

Better ability to actually Be There with you, because it fits in your pocket, and it can be your phone, i.e. you have reason to carry it always with you.

So I at least do not think the N900 compromises on the 'internet tablet' vision, it is the best representation of that vision so far. Take this from one person involved in creating on all of them.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Interesting. I have seen other people complaining that it has become to small, and they prefer the older models.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

It's the old eyes, they don't see like they used to ma'am :o

Re: N900 is not primarily a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Yes. It has phone capabilities. I don't think Nokia is saying that it is not a phone.

But it's a bit like saying that the N900 is a mp3 player.

Well, yes. It plays mp3's. In a ok manner.

No, I wouldn't still use that statement too much. Nokia calls it a mobile computer. That statement is rather meaningful, to indicate the primary intended focus.

There are better phones out there. Nokia makes them, also. :)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

...smaller screen that makes my eyes ache...

Re: N900 is not primarily a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

I think this is a useful perspective and I appreciate the point you were trying to make. However, you probably should have said that the N900 is not defined by being a phone. In other words, the paradigm is different. Being a phone is only one aspect of the N900, and not necessarily the most dominant aspect. (But is is an important aspect.)

This is a mobile computer that is sprouting phone capabilities. Therefore, it inherently has more potential power than a phone that tries to tack on some computing features. But its phone capabilities need to mature a little more (for some users). (For me, they are fine!)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Re: N900 is not primarily a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

The above is your opinion and doesn't have to be shared by others - it's certainly not important enough to open a thread about.
Personally, to me, the N900 is indeed a phone. The screen size change alone was, to me, a big step away from a tablet - and towards the focus being on phone-use.

To each his own though.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

After two weeks of use, I do agree that this is a computer that has a lot of features, one amongst them being a phone. The phone is not any more important than any other part of the device. It's just another application like the rest.
All other devices started as a phone, and then it has everything else added. None of the addons for these "phones with addons" are great.
The difference is that the N900 does most applications better than other phones, and it's phone application is quite good, but not great, which is what you find from the "phones with addons".
What blows people's minds, is that this is the first device to NOT put the phone on the almighty pedestal, but make it equal to the other applications on the device. The iphone sort of did this, but it's still a phone first.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Maybe you lot should follow my lead and rather than calling it a "mobile computer", "phone", "handheld netbook" or whatever else you wish to classify it as, simply call it "an N900".

If this sounds silly, consider:
Hoover:Vacuum
iPod:Mp3 Player
Thermos:Vacuum Flask
Popsicle:Frozen Ice on a Stick
Sharpie:Permanent Marker
Discman:Portable CD player
Walkman:Portable Cassette Player

And so on and so forth... :)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

one more minor thing that bugs me is the inability to sort my web bookmarks alphabetically. They appear in a totally random order. That is a sign of being unfinished regardless of what we call the 900.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

The N900 is so open and versatile that there's undoubtedly a way to replace both of your old phones with it.

A small matter of programming :D

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Personally I wouldn't be interested in the N900 if it wasn't a phone as well as a phone-sized modern-programmer-friendly computer.

Shame the phone functionality isn't as good as some other modern phones in some respects, but I'm definitely going to use it more for phone calls and messaging than anything else I do with it :-)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Well *I* agree with you...

Re: N900 is not primarily a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

You sir don't give a damn about the planet, like the idea of open source might give light to resource consumption, closed source operating systems promote selfish greed, get somebody else to sweat and then you slurp their sweat willy nilly because they are more stupid than you.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

The N900 is not a Phone. Well that's not quite correct. It's more than a phone. The N900 is the first true communucations device for the Internet/Cell phone era. It's all due to RTCOMM which built on top of Telepathy. A communcation's framework. To which Nokia has added the Cellular protocol.

When I want to communicate with one of my contacts, I don't have to think about it. I don't have to worry about how I'm going to communucate with him. IM? Need to fire my IM applications. SMS? Well go into the messaging application. Voice? Bring up the phone app and place the call. The N900 elimiates all of that because everything is integrated together. I goto my contact and choose how I can to communicate and the RTCOMM does the rest.

When I finally got my N900, added some of my IM and VoIP accounts, I say the Call Type bar on the Phone App's Dial Pad. I was able to choose how a voice call could be made. That's when it the full ramifications of RTCOMM and the N900 hit me. It's a communication device. We can easily add new protocols by just adding a plugin into Telepathy. Then all of the N900 apps know of it and can use it.

AIM, MSN, ICQ, IRC, Google Talk, Cellular, SMS, etc. All at the touch of your finger on one device, and single applications (i.e. Voice, Messaging, etc). The application integration potential is mind boggling.

I'm very willing to bet I'll see 'telepathy-plugin-google-voice' in the very near future. I wonder who will be the first. One of our own at Maemo or Google itself.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

epage with one ring. ;)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

I don't like the fact that people are touting it as a mobile computer. Its ability to even use it as an email device is painful so far. (Hoping a firmware update will fix some if it)

Its an upgraded Internet Tablet with a phone app slapped on and GSM radio.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Ah, semantics arguments... aren't they fun? :D

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

I think a device has to be classified according to the primary use of the majority. I know on this website you all say it is a geek device, it is not a phone, it is not a mainstream device, etc. But the truth of the matter is the phone function is going to be the most used function. So whether you like it or not it is a phone. Just like the PS3 is a games console even though many rate it as the best blu ray player and many buy it for that purpose and never play any games on it.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

its been marketed as an iphone killer, the whole it doesnt need apps as its got a full browser/you can play flash games/or go straight in to you tube etc

therefore it is marketed as a phone to get sales,also marketed as a computer to make other sales in another market and they can get out of it not functioning well at basic things because its a computer not a phone.(people like the op fall for this big time)

ITS A PHONE END OF STORY, they have marketed it as onetherefore it should act like one first, you can buy it on phone contracts.


and you think people shouold stick with sybiam- wtf is that- maybe they should get a decent phone like err an android or an apple- even maemo 5 is ten times sybiam and its brand new, nokias aim shouldnt have been to out do its rubbish software but at least match the best.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Point out where. I'll wait.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

"theres a browser for that"

i think was the line.

i dont have to explain what that is supposed to mean surely

actually it was 'theres a web browser for that'

its all over the net

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Smart phones are old Millenium 2.0 technology. This is very much 2.01 :)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

i will agree and have been arguing for nokia with its intergration of communications(txt/IM)(cell/voip) that it has raised the bar to a super phone.

but on the other hand it doesnt do exactly what it says on the tin.

i dont need a phone in the traditional sense- if people are not calling the nokia a phone- i also wouldnt call the iphone or android a phone. i would call them all a communication device/mobile companion.

i need something in my pocket that i can email with/ use gps /surf the net/listen to music/watch movies/check my calender/sync my calenderetc/etc.

phone is just one of the functions..

anyone arguing that the nok isnt a phone are arguing that any smartphone(iphone/android/winmo) isnt a phone.

the nokia is not a productice computer, but it is a productive smartphone, but needs to iron out its flaws- as it is a direct competitor to smartphones- not neccesarily netbooks.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

You weren't around for the Nokia Internet Tablets huh?

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

erm yeah of course - i have allways had archos's and i also had a linux one its great fun. (that was more like the nok internet tanblets), the other archos's were media players- moving towards internet tablets.

since all this the intergration is happening phones to media players- media players to phones- games machines to media players- shall i go on. i have owned hacked psp's that can do computer stuff, my linux archos- then nokia tablets were very niche.and the screen's were never as good as the archos's(but i was very tempted at the time).. the n900 is a smartphone with open source end of story.. you can hack an iphone to do the same stuff as well and i know there isnt one person on these boards that will ever tell me thats a computer.



i suppose the only point that matters is what market is the n900 gonna take most from.

phones or mobile computers(which i suppose 99% will be netbooks rest oqo's and open source internet tablets)

stand alone media players will be dead soon so no point including that

i bet not many will be getting rid or they netbooks for this n900- but the vast majority will be getting rid of there phone for it.

the n900 hasnt yet got to the point where we can jack in our netbook or camera for it, but it is closing the gap- it has just like other devices taking the need for many of us to not need a netbook or camera all the time, and has certainly taken away the need for media players. but then so has other phones- and alot of them have also taken away the need for a portable games console(the n900 isnt there yet)

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

@mysticrokks....
and again where is it supposed to be an iphone killer?
because it says "theres a web browser for that"???
sooooo because it has a better web browser it automatically makes it an iphone killer?
so is my laptop an iphone killer?
it has a better web browser as well.......

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

robert its basic marketing- its suggestive.

its not saying simply that it has a better web browser its a play on words

theres an app for that

thers a web browser for that

its a direct marketing suggestion against a competitor.

your pc wouldnt use the slogan 'theres a web browser for that' because its not competing against it.

the fact nokia is using it for the n900 means it is competing against the iphone

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

Yes, it is a phone.

Yes, it is a browser.

Yes, it is an email client.

Yes it is an mp3 player.

Why arw people so incapable of stepping out of 'the box' and understanding that these ultra-mobile computers are capable of being many things at once?

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

@sticrokks. just because a few people beleive its an iphone killer doesnt mean it was set out to be one. Nor was it set out to be a smartphone. yes many people may call it a smartphone but thats not what Nokia wants, they set it out to be an internet tablet which is not even on the same line as the iphone, therefore uncomparable. if it was set out to be a phone, it would have been more obvious. Nokia has said themselves that it will be referred as a tablet.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

The reason why I asked is because the Nokia Internet Tablets were capable of running everything from KDE (thanks to penguinbait) to EasyDebian (thanks to Qole). This let you run software like OpenOffice, GIMP, etc. I bought the n800 as an iPod Touch competitior (I wanted it to do more than browse the web and play media files at the time) and I wound up using it for things I never thought I would.

Other devices like the iPhone have something like that (a mobile version of Office or Photoshop brushes or whatever it's called) but it's not a full desktop like app. That's the reason why some of us call the Internet Tablets here more computer than phone (also why I think of my N900 more as a tablet than a smartphone). Running a hacked PSP, or other devices, I'm not quite sure they come close to the Nokia Tablets (I've only messed around with a hacked PSP myself) and I heard Archos tablets were infamously hard to crack thanks to Archos themselves.

Granted everyone may not have used their n800 or n810 like that. But the potential was there regardless, the closest thing you'll find to that on another platform is a hacked G1 which also has their own Debian project.

Basically I see it this way Nokia is taking Maemo and it's going from computer towards something like a smartphone and companies like Apple and Google are doing the opposite. Taking smartphones and trying to be computers.

The end result I see them both ending up in the future is a weird hybrid between smartphone and computer. In the end that's where all converging devices are going to wind up, it's just the path they take to get there. But that's also why I don't consider the N900 a smartphone considering it's more on the computer path for me than smartphone path.

Re: N900 is not a phone ! Why people still don't get it?
 

the N900 wasnt ever marketed as an "iphone killer" or even "the next big thing".....(unfortunately) nokia's flagship device is still the N97....
nokia was actually quite amazed at the mass response to the n900....and still keeps quoting that the device isnt "meant for the masses".....