I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

I've noticed people say that they love the N800's "instant on" capability. Call me crazy, but my N800 takes about a minute to boot up after being turned off. I WISH I could put it to sleep and wake it as fast as, say, my Mac powerbook (if you're not familiar with OSX, the laptops are awake by the time the screen opened).

Am I missing something? The lock options I get when hitting the power button aren't really sleep modes, imho...the unit is still on and the screen wakes with any tap.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Mhm... I've never read about this "instant on"-thing, but maybe it's got mixed up and relates to the respective feature that makes the 770 so suitable for mobile use: The 770 really has an instant on/off feature (cover on: "off", cover off: "on" instantly).

For the N800 I only heard about a "always on" concept Nokia is trying to impose on customers; this seems to imply the exact opposite of instant on/off.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

The N800 doesn't have an instant-on like the 770 did when removing the cover, but it *does* boot up in about half the time from a "powered off" state. Maybe this is what the other people meant?

If you do a cold boot, power on both devices side by side, there is a big difference...

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

I never shut off my 770 before and I don't shut off my N800 now. I just hit the power button and select "Lock touchscreen and keys" (actually, it's just power button, followed by center D-pad button. It's amazing how quickly this has become an automatism). The screen doesn't wake at all (it's locked, remember?) and I have set my WiFi to disconnect after 5 minutes.

The fact that the processor isn't turned off in sleep mode, doesn't matter much, as the OMAP has some pretty nifty power saving settings on board.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Could some N800-owner pls explain to us non-N800-people what "Lock touchscreen and keys" really does on an N800? There are so many contradictory reports here: Some say it really locks the screen so it doesn't wake at all (see Karel above), others report it behaves axactly as on the 770: Screen is only slightly dimmed and responds to every touch by telling you how to unlock the device again. (The latter option of course isn't much help when it comes to power saving)

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

If it helps, my display settings are:
- Brightness period: 2 minutes
- Switch off display: 2 minutes
- Lock screen and keys: unchecked
- Show LED lights: unchecked

(I uncheck "Lock screen and keys", because it's too much a hassle to go through the power-Dpad-cycle when I'm reading)

(I uncheck the LEDs, because... well, just because obviously)

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

The screen/button lock prohibits input from accidental button presses, but the
screen backlight still turns on with contact/keypresses. I can't imagine that's good for the battery...especially because it's easy for it to happen when it's in its soft case in your pocket. The flip case might help with this, whenever Nokia decides to release it.

The MobileCrunch review yesterday mentioned the "instant on" feature.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

This is what the 770 does when you lock the screen; of course this doesn't come near a powersaving function, let alone some "instant on" feature (which would, of course, require some kind of "off" before :) ).

What seems to be missing is a way to have the screen/button-lock turn the screen completely off as well until you remove the cov-... oh... :(

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

The menu displayed when the power button is pressed is an xml file ( /etc/systemui/systemui.xml ). This file has 2 entries commented out "Soft poweroff" and "Reboot". They can be ordered with the priority setting. "Soft poweroff" shuts off the display and keys completely but does not switch off comms. This needs to be done first.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

It dimms and locks the screen. The screen will still respond to touches by telling how to unlock it. But after the 'switch display off' time has passed (which is set under display settings), the whole display will switch off and the only thing the device responds to, is the power button (again telling you how to unlock).

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

It doesn't do that on my N800, or even on my 770. Tapping "Lock touchscreen and keys" immediately (well, after a quick fade-out) dims the screen and nothing, except the power button, reacts anymore. My display off setting is 2 minutes.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Just tried, on my N800 it works exactly as described by Karel Jansens, on my 770 things are as described by Zuti.
It sounds the way the two devices should work, indeed. On 770 if I like to pause I can just put the hard cover on, on the 800 such a method is not available and the more logical way is to lock the screen and let it not respond to any form of reaction, because it is too simple to activate it with accidental pressures.
BTW IMHO from the point of view of energy saving and battery lasting Nokians are way ahed of competitors.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Ah. I got it! It's because you have your brightness period and switch off period both set to two minutes. I have brightness for 2 minutes, and switch off in 5 minutes. If I set both to the same amount of minutes, the display and device will lock immediately.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

You got it! I just tried and can confirm that's the way it works.

Congrs for your keen eye

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

So I can edit the file to enable these settings (presumably as root)? Sounds promising!

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

There you go.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Just wanted to report that adding those entries back to systemui.xml works beautifully. Now I have a "soft" poweroff, which requires a press of the powerbutton to wake it again...instantly, I might add. NICE.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

I talk about instant-on all the time. The above is what I am referring to. There is no such thing as a REAL Instant On with this as computers are either "off" which require boot time or "sleeping" - Are you referring to this article of mine?

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

This has to be a bug. The screen switches off only when the the brightness and switch off periods are the same, if the periods are different then the screen does not switch off!

Bug #959 raised for this defect.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

I don't think it's a bug: When you select "Lock screen and keys", you essentially override the brightness down setting. My guess is that the OS then deducts the brightness down setting from the off setting and starts the count down from then. I.e.: With brightness down set at 2 minutes and screen off at 5 minutes, it would take 3 minutes before the screen is locked. The N800 simply assumes that you'll allways want that 3 minute lag.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

No, but I was thinking of something else I read about a while ago. Apparently, it would be possible to develop a Linux-specific BIOS that would allow "normal" pcs to boot in under 4 seconds. Can't seem to find a reference though...

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Then that is just poor software design. It's not stated how the device will behave with mismatched time periods, and with mismatched timings it's not how I (and several others) want it to behave. Nokia should add a checkbox to the Display applet along the lines of "Disable screen immediately when locked - Yes/No" as this would then make the screen locking behaviour explicit and easily understood. Without the checkbox the device behaves inconsistently depending on the values used for apparently unrelated settings (ie. the two time periods). If it's not a bug, it's appalling GUI design.

Maybe with the next firmware release Nokia will add the polish that is so obiviously lacking from the N800, which they appear to have rushed in order to get ready for CES. :(

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

I just wanted to add that you don't have to edit any file as root, there's an option in the control panel to set both values, directly from the GUI.
(And someone posted a bug report for the need to set both values to the same, btw. Bug 959: https://maemo.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=959 )

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

fwiw...

I have my N800 set for Brightness Period: 30secs, Switch off: 1 minute.

In this configuration, if I hit the power button and then "Lock TouchScreen and Keys". I see the screen immediately go dim. If I wait 30 seconds the screen goes black.

If I touch the screen within the first 30 seconds, then it goes full bright with a note on how to unlock it. Waiting 30 seconds more will make it go dim. Waiting an additional 30 seconds will make it go dark.

If I touch the screen while it's dark it will NOT come back up. I have to bring it up with the power button.

This seems perfectly reasonable to me.

From a technical point, it looks like there are two timer events running simultaneously. So, Brightness: 30secs, Off: 1 minute is "30 seconds to dim, then 30 MORE seconds will be dark". It's a total sequence length of 1 minute, not 1:30.


Anyway... that said, I do appreciate the new "Soft Poweroff". :) THANKS!

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Can't say I agree... if your have the following settings

Brightness period: 2 minutes
Switch off period: 5 minutes

then locking the device and dropping it in your pocket means the screen will keep waking up for 3 minutes until it finally switches off. I don't know if the 3 minute timer is reset each time the screen is activated, meaning it could stay permanently illuminated in a worst-case situation, but either way it's a bizzare implementation that makes very little sense. :)

I suspect this scheme was implemented by a total geek who doesn't get out much, and wasn't QA'd or peer-reviewed by anyone who lives in the real world. ;)

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

And it's buggy as well. See my new thread in the Troubleshooting section.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

This seems to be exactly what happened to me when I had my display set for 2min/5min and locked the screen.

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Yeah... on 2nd thought, you guys are right, the stock concept of locking the screen/keyboard is hosed. :)

Re: I disagree with the N800 "Instant On" raves...
 

Looks as though Nokia have addressed Bug #959 in the latest 3.2007.10-7 firmware update - bascially, they've stopped the screen from dimming when locked so that it now goes straight to blank. Seems like a fairly simple and pragmatic solution to me! :)