[Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

Hello everybody, i'm a new member...well, i'm medium level user in pc, don't in linux world but it's exciting...

This is my idea...

Could we create a kind of ISO image of a SIM card to use several lines, numbers, operators simultaneosly as we do in PC, creating virtuals drives?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

It's not possible to create copies of so called SIM cards.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

I think that it would be illegal in many (all?) countries

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Why if its your sim card and you pay the bill?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

The biggest problem is the cellular module is closed source

so we can't fake the data that comes "from and to" the sim card and the antenna

of course you can use an usb sim reader and an ordinary pc to get and clone data, but you cant put it back in the sim nor let it work in n900 by software

AFAIK

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

AFAIK, you dont "own" the data inside the simcard, you only has the licence to use it by contract, with terms and conditions, and you pay for that.

you should check what conditions apply for your particular case, but im sure that you cant do what you want

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Well, the fact is that actually there are phones with 2 SIM cards sockets inside, ok...

Right now many of us must carry at least two phones, I have three (Movistar, Comcel and Tigo) phone in my pocket and I think if you buy a powerfull n900, some of us can free many people from this burden ...

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Great Idea.
If the original cellular module is closed source, we could try to create an own cellular module which has this feature build-in.
You'll still have to check your contract conditions anyway.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

There are a few companies that make special sim cards that can be programmed with multiple sets of data from other sim cards. They typically come with a "multi-sim", a sim reader/writer, and some software for a PC and the phone.

The way they work (to my understanding) is they read 2 to 6 sim cards and store that info into the "mult-sim". Then, based on a hidden sim contact entry the card will reply out with one of the known IDs when queried. Usually the software for the phone will let you write/update which profile to use and then either reset the phone or make it think it lost carrier (or tell it the sim was replaced in some way) and the new profile is then re-read and you change services.

It's not an ideal solution, but it works for most people. I'm not sure how the N900 would work with it, since I'm sure it's not popular enough to be a supported phone, but if you contact a company that makes these, they may be willing to let you know some specs on how to switch profiles. Good luck! :)

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Some Software features and procedure:

1) Software makes an "Image" of the SIM card in the internal socket. It stores the internal network ID (telephone number, contract cellular plan and operator's ID) and contacts too if you want it in the memory of the phone.

2) Then, you decide if to use the "phisical Sim" or "Virtual" SIM. If you decide use the Virtual SIM, you can put out the phisical SIM and store it in a safe place. Anyway you are paying the contract bill. Or you can still use the phisical one.

3) Once done, we can turn off the phone and put in the socket another SIM and repeat the operation as many times as we want.

Now, with the "Images" of our SIM in the phone the software can mount it in "virtual sockets" so we can use all the SIM's images simultaneosly or the one we choose.

So I think... if cheap phones can do it well with 2 SIM, why no our Nokia N900?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

It does sound like a reasonable proposal but -

I've worked with smart (credit) cards before, and it's entirely possible that there are challenge/response situations where secret keys are used, within the SIM card, to generate data to authenticate with the network.

I would be very surprised if you could just dump the data off the card and use it in the way you propose.

It's still agood idea and worth investigating, but don't be too disappointed if it won't work.

With that said, I'd be interested to read more about the mulit-sim cards mentioned by the other poster above.

Also, does anyone know if the multi-SIM phones require multiple radios?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

I have seen these phones when I was back on my home town:
1. 2 CDMA sim card active at the same time
or 2 GSM sim card active at the same time
or 1 CDMA and 1 GSM active at the same time.

Catch: These phones typically getting hot faster when its being used.

I dont think I would like to see SIM Card using an image, I can imagine that can be used for fraud.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Oh sure, I've seen multi-sim phones for sale, was just wondering how they worked and if they need multiple GSM radio chips or what.

As I say, I'd be really surprised if software enulation would work precisely for the reason you mention - it would be a big fraud risk and I know other SIM style chips (smart credit cards) have protections against that sort of thing.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

that would be nice to have both att and tmo sim in at time to use att for phone service and tmo for 3g

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Wouldn't this invite the ability to put copies of SIM cards on torrent sites or whatever. People could just download random SIM's at will and use them. Sounds evil to me.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

You can put your credit card info in a .txt file too, but nobody seems to be too concerned...

Being able to rip sim cards and use images of them in the software would be awesome, but I doubt it's possible. Reading and using the SIM is a hardware/firmware-level thing AFAIK.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

would something like this work ?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Have you ever heard of redirect? That at least skips the incoming call problem. Does the N900 gsm chip support dual lines/numbers (single SIM)? If yes does the software support it? If no, is a bugreport/enhancement request open?

There are several ways to have a look at this! One is to buy a china forked n900 with compass and dual SIM card slot but I doubt it that you ever run maemoX or MerY on it.

The problem is to have the GSM run SIMs software based wont work afaik (hardwired).

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

One possible avenue for faking in alternative SIMs would be SAP -- AFAIK the N900 doesn't support SAP, but its existence makes it reasonable that the closed cellular code could permit SIM access other than through the physical socket...

Of course, that doesn't simply allow virtualizing a SIM; the ultimate goal here would require breaking the challenge/response authentication system to extract the SIM's internal key. AIUI, this is the same issue as SIM cloning, which is generally possible in reasonable time on really old SIMs, but not on recent ones (due to now-fixed weaknesses).

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

i can confirm the above. i've cloned a fairly few simcards long ago in the past ( it was nice little earner - i had a lot of customers wanting a cloned sim to use the same number in their car phone. some of you may remember those big handsets on a cable built into armrests in cars)
.
anyway - since the fix to KO security key on simcard was introduced it is almost imposible to clone the sim. i mean you can copy almost entire sim but without the KO key you will not be able to use it in any phone. sorry

as to double sim "N900" from china - first of all - this horrid thing is not even close to real N900 and you can forget running maemo on it. also all of this double sim phones you can see on ebay have 2 radio modules one for each sim.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

It can be done with hardware. There is enough room inside the back of the phone for a multi card adapter like this >>. http://www.simore.eu/en/Dual_SIM-168...M_Platinum.php

Once PR1.2 hits and you can dial USSD codes perhaps their software can be accessed or other software written.

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

data from credit cards in txt files - those are from magnetic strip of the card not the chip itself. there is some info in magnetic strip you could use fraudulently including long card number, this can be used on the internet shops or copied on another magnetic strip of a blank card but can't be used to program a chip on another card. same story as with simcards. security is quite good - i'm not saying impossible to crack, however hardware/firmware to get it done it's not widely available and also time needed to crack the KO code is an issue.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

just to clarify, even with multi sim adapter you will only be able to use one sim at any given time (that is providing you can make N900 work with it). to have 2 SIMs working together you need two radio modules in the phone.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

That is correct young Jedi and no software will overcome that. You need two radios to be able to run them concurrently. Unless you devote all your CPU cycles to some kind of multi-plex scheme or swap soft radios. Even then there is no telling how a network would act if you were rapidly switching. It would pro'ly just drop you completely until the tower received a stable signal.

Motorola introduced quad radios in a handset 2 or 3 years ago. But that was on iDEN and you were still identified by a single electronic serial number (hashed from 1 SIM). The radios were/are used primarily for packet data. Nextel shut their WiDEN system down because of capacity issues but their are plenty of private networks in airports, or on large business, and university campus's that still use it.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

Well, our N900 doesn't have 2 or 4 radios to support multiple SIMs simultaneosly...

The we can use the virtual SIM to switch between operators.
Just do not pre judge the legality of this utility. Consider what would be useful and versatile than the N900 with a software like this.

For peace of all the cellular network does not allow two or more lines or numbers, simultaneously. The second line would be blocked and the operator would contact us to approach his office to review the hitorial calls and data.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

Dual sims do work in the 900,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rh57kQc9DRc

and talking to the gentleman who created the vid, there is a builtin timer you can use to switch back and forth btween cards. using a service like Google Voice; would eliminate the need to switch back as you could forward calls to one or the other sim card.
Since there is only 1 GSM radio in the device having a virtual radio would be the way to go.

http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php...al+sim+adapter

interesting thread on Dual sims.

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

i have been looking for this kind of a virtual sim... this will be very useful for me when i travel - for use in airports and when i go from country to country...

it should allow you to switch to the local country sim card by clicking on some app in the maemo desktop..

any more ideas?

Re: [Proposal pending] Virtual SIM cards for N900
 

first things first. Please go ahead and crack the needed code from a sim-card. Tell us when you are ready and we start crafting new driver to radio chip...

...or of course you can stay in your imaginationland and keep on dreaming and posting here how cool such feature would be...

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

That would be fun :)

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

which part? the part when police comes knocking behind your door after your devices IMEI is blacklisted and therefore your device is gsm/3g bricked for life?

Re: Multiple SIM cards for N900
 

Dont look the problem, see the opportunities, actually it does exits dual sim phones.
Look how other people see the opportunities; http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/21/s...ne-phone-jets/

Think about how an application like this would have a real market demand, especially in bussiness wold.