Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

anybody of you ever checked where the greeks get ther damn warfare stuff from? nobody? make a guess!
germany and france! even the thought of blaming greek public for "spending the money" is ridiculous! but blaming public ist the political way for solving problems! turn off the light when leaving the room to stop global warming! facepalm

(I'm a german tax-payer btw)

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

did that make any sense?

is greece forced to buy warfare stuff? -no
would greece have bought warfare stuff elsewhere if
a) price and b) functionality is sufficient? -yes

who elects the politicians who decide about money spending etc?

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

ever thought about cyprus? imho they don't need it, but greek politicians decide that, not me

no they wouldn't, cause germany and france do not only sell the stuff but also the money, so the greeks are bound to germany and france if they want to go on financing their depths.

it's such a pity that most of the people in germany use their right to elect to clean their *** instead of kicking the right asses

(writing posts on n900 is really great btw)

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

that is only greeces fault. they have messed their things up, no need to try rolling the blame to somewhere else.


whose *** should then be kicked? you are concidering greece as a baby child, aren't you?

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

no i won't consider greece as a baby child. european politicians (especially germ. fra.) *** should be kicked cause we gave the greek politicians the chance to buy our "products" cheap without taxes (we let them get into eu while knowing that their statistics are messed up) and lend them a whole lot of money. we benefitet from that, industry profits pushed the national economy. and now we get what we deserve. and what do we do to solve the problem? right! another bailout....

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Guys taken from BBC
"On Planet Greece, some civil servants get a bonus for turning up to work on time. Foresters get a bonus for working outdoors. At least they show up.

There are civil servants called ghost workers because they never go into the office, head to a second job and still claim a state salary. They can't get sacked, because a civil service post is for life. Unless the incumbent decides to retire in his or her forties, with a pension.

And the government can continue paying for the afterlife. Unmarried and divorced daughters of civil servants are entitled to collect their dead parents pensions. Another lucrative sinecure is to belong to a state committee. The government has no idea how many there are.

It has been estimated that they have 10,000 employees and cost nearly £200m a year, and that includes the committee to manage a lake that dried up 80 years ago."

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

This whole issue really underlies the fundamental flaws in the EU. Brussels are unhappy that the German government won't just play ball and cough up. Democracy [the majority of the German public] getting in the way again!

Why can't the French, Dutch, Belgians, etc cough up the money?

I really feel sorry for the Germans and the fact they are going to have to stomach this. Be clear as well that this is not a loan.

If the UK was in the Euro we'd be paying in as well. I'm pretty sure we are anyway really (through things like the CAP).

UKIP at the polls anyone?

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

hell yeah but they are going to spent 6,7 billion euro for weapons this year! and nobody stopped the greeks while spending all the money, for weapons, but also for public!

instead of that we are all very surprised and angry!?!

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

did they really know that statics are messed up?

as far as I know there were people from USA who played "creative accounting" -game with Greece closed doors...

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Germany has biggest surplus plus probably biggest risks with their banks & Greece.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

save your sympathy, germany has to bear a lot, other countries have to, too. but we are no wizards, able to change **** into money and uk isnt an exception. just wait till after election

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

just forget the weapons. we in Finland have possibly a not working pension system (funds might run out). And here the retiring age is 60+ years, probably 70 when I am 60 years old...

..what were the figures in Greece again?

there is hella lot stupid holes in Greeces fiscal policy. weapons are a really easy target, but things are really messed up in general. selling all the guns and stopping army wouldn't change the situation significantly.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

just clear that up:

swiss: 76 billion
france: 56 billion
germany: 45 billion

(greek depth in euro)

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

I´m sorry but it´s Greeces business to do whatever they want to do with their money. If people chosen by democratic process decide to put all the money on military then be it. It´s not sellers problem to be interested on buyers economic status after they have managed to pay their bills.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

osse we share the same destination, gonna be retired with 70 (earliest). and the greeks have to, too. but the incessant propaganda blaming the greek joe plumber is way too short and weapons is a german topic politicians dont wanna talk about, it's not a very useful argument in german elections...

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

its not the sellers problem? really? if the seller share the same currency and credits the sell with this currency it SHOULD be our problem! cause we want the money back....not the sellers problem...never laughed like that....the greeks don't don't pay theire bills since 2007 but we needed to sell MORE AND MORE AND MORE. and we gave them our money to buy our products

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

I said that if they manage to pay bill then there is nothing else that seller is interested. Why should? Companies are only interested on making money to their owners End of story.

.edit
Do you think that countires could be handled like people who do not anymore have control of themselves?

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

and who is responsible for paying the bill? where did the money came from? herakles? zeus? or "deutsche bank"?!?

face it, its our problem.

i agree with you forasmuch its not the industrys problem because they got their euros....

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

exactly. so guns mean nothing compared to impossible system that ensures people can retire as soon as they reach 50.

and I suggest that you would read a bit more about fiscal stuff. of course a country can buy a lot without paying. the seller just is certain that the bill will be paid at some point. a bit like asking your friend to buy you a lollipop that costs 10 euro cents and say you will pay it next week.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Situation right now is that banks do not care about big picture or macroeconomics. Just profit in couple of quarter year and run. If the situation is that lending money to country is low risk and it gives good profit to owners then money goes there.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

why are you lying to me? you told me second ago you dont concider greece as a baby....

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

sorry ossipenna, reading about more fiscal stuff? the system you just explained ist fine as long as you give me my 10 cents next week. but what do i do, if you tell me that you can't pay me? or anybody? wait! i just give you more money, to pay your dutys in my shop. not to be gracious but save my elected as an let the system go on....

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

you're interpreting my words really wrong here.

please keep in mind that in 2008 no one knew that greece will have big problems in 2010.

think about that for a while and ask yourself are you starting to realize something?

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Everything ticking along in the UK. Im good because i made 30k gbp on a USD/EUR fx spread bet over the last two weeks so if PR1.2 doesnt come out i shouldnt have any cash worries and ill go by an android phone :)

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

I guess Greece have PR1.2 first in EU.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

no one new in 2008 that greek will have problems....can't believe that. will you tell me, that all the things you blamed (retiring early etc) actually were there overnight (just like 1.2 will be) we wanted to be blinded to make our money and the greeks were stupid enough to play the game

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

now you are confusing a lot of stuff.

Greece was the initial party to play the game. It was the classical chair game and the one left standing pays the bill.

until recently there was no problem with retiring age etc because everything seemed to be in order(fraudulent accounting).

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

fradulent accounting always requieres two sides, one dumbass to lie and one dumbass to takes these lies....

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

You should pity your own tax money even more. Finnish aid to Greece is little bit higher on per capita basis than german.

:o or :eek: or :mad: not really sure.


Not saying that we shouldn't bail out Greece. We should. Just pissed off about the corrupt greek system.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

yes. Greece and investment banks from USA. now I am missing the link that makes Germany guilty.

and Rauha, I know. But Finland is already doomed by other aspects too so it doesn't feel so bad ;) and I am keeping my hopes up that Greece will repay completely so no-one looses money.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Greece was just the first one to get hit... Has anyone seen the current status in Spain and Portugal...? Not much of a difference there... And since I've read some really annoying comments here let me, as a Greek, speak out to clear some things...

1. Yes, since 1974 all Greek politicians' priority is to steal money...
2. Greece's banking system remains excellent no matter how hard it's been hit...
3. YES, Greece is in huge need of warfare equipment... You wouldn't never understand of course... But the minute Greece stops purchasing tanks, weapons, fighters etc etc there's a huge chance we'll get invaded... And there are three candidates to do so... We can cope at ease with two of them... But not that easily with the greatest of them... And that is not only Greece's problem... Have you ever wondered why none of you wants Turkey in the EU...?
4. Everyone goes on pension after 35 years of hard-working and mostly low-paid days...
5. We are 10million Greeks... 150.000 people does not constitute a majority... MOST Greeks have accepted ther fate even though they are not responsible for what has happened in Greece for the past years...
6. Over the past years a huge amount of illegal migration has been going on... We have over 1,5 million people coming from Albania, Pakistan etc etc... One of the major reasons why our economy has crippled...
7. And you my dear Germans... Who feel sorry for Greece but say it's not your fault... Does any single one of you know of the loan you charged Greece with when you conquered us 65 years ago...? Are you aware of the total gold bars that once rested in Greece and during 1944 they all 'migrated' to Germany...?
8. Have you seen what the hell is going on in the international market and you think that pushing Greece out of Euro will solve Europe's issues...? Euro as a capital is going to crumble if doing so!

PS: You "ossipena" who so easily said 'fcuk you Greece'... I feel really sorry for you...

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Let´s go offtopic.
Oh. Dear. Are you one of those Doom & Gloom apologists that daily troll in Murobbs and Ap-areena about how everything is going down :) Have you bought couple of tons of sugar already :D

If you compare Finland's statistics to other European countries you will see that our economy is on quite solid base. We can take loan for couple of years (actually it´s good thing to do) but after that we have to look that it slows down. Making this country profitable and interesting for mining, chemical, forest, technology industry etc. is key to success. One part of this is of course cheap electricity :)

Look this
http://yfrog.com/49velkap

We can easily go to 50-60% of our GDP and actually I think we should. Quite many statistic only show from year 2000 on but left most interesting part away and that´s the 90's when Finland went almost to bankrupt. Yes it´s wise to already think about how to start paying it and how to stop taking it, but there is too much dooming around. Yes we will need little "Jumalauta, vittu saatana" mentality but there is no reason to get too worried and throw hands in the air. ;)

.edit
http://www.stat.fi/tup/suoluk/suoluk...ous.html#velka

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Yeah, I agree on most of the points BUT Greeks must also change couple of bad habits:

1) Don`t spent your salary on Bouzoukia ( for non-Greeks, google it)
2) Cut a lot of jobs that are not nesessary....one funny example was a driver at Olympic airlines that he was so fat that he was unable to drive, so instead of firing him they hired another driver to drive him around and he became the co-driver!ahaha
3) Don`t spend so much time at coffee shops....on average Greeks spent more time driking 'frappe' than working.

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Haha! Yeah... Unfortunately we have a tendency for such things... And there are a lot more bad habits actually... But they are not the primary reason for Greece's state for the time being...

PS: I honestly reckon that this thread should be closed as it's turning to political...

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

4. that is no decision for anyone except global markets to make. you greeks tried to circumvent it, what has happened now? money comes from productivity, not 35 years of work...

6. excuses, excuses. what about Germany and ~10% of population?

7. Finland vs USSR. do I need to say more? (excuses, excuses)

8. may be. or may be not. useless speculation. euros problem now is that there are countries in that might go bankrupt.


ps, don't feel, no need to.



and slender: mainly because I have followed comments from our politicians concerning this greece -issue. if so stupid and naive people don't mess things up, it is a miracle ;)

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

to say it with the honorable words of seargent gunnery hartmann:
what the **** is that?

probably, due to my poor english-knowledge, a miss understanding. germany is guilty for borrowing money alrthough either knew or had to know that greek won't be able to pay it back. but we wanted to push the economy of politicians became the whore for getting the money started

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

And people of Greece vote these stealers again and again?

? Probably yes if you make your own statistics :)

Have you been brainwashed? So basically you live under constant fear. Why? btw. In Finland we also have compulsory military service for all men (6,9 or 12 months). Tell us why for example cutting your military budget half would mean that e.g. Turkey or any other you neighbour country got brightest idea to attack Nato country and invade it? Do you have oil? Your economy is highly depended on maritime and shipping of stuff from/to EU. Besides that tourism is the another big money maker. You also think that EU countries that are not in nato would just look you get invaded?

Only thing what I have wondered is why some suggest Turkey to EU. That´s just crazy.

That´s just fck up thing. I hope that people in general realize that it´s not possible to do something like that on long-term.

Yes. I know this and that´s why I understand that there is some quite angry people right now.

No it´s not. Major reason is Greece's Goverments inability to make your country profitable. What I have learnt about Greece in couple of weeks is that your country is quite close to communism. You goverment owns sht load of industry and corporations and keeps them running even when they do not make any profit.

Throwing reason to illegal migration is bit too easy. It´s of course one problem but I doubt that it´s the major one.

This one is interesting stuff. Any links on this. And how much of money we are talking here.

No that will not happen. Only sad thing here is that Greece should not have been never ever got permission to join EMU. But situation is what it is and we have to live with it.

BTW. Quite many finnish people have prejudice (or some might say racist opinions) about people living in mediterranean countries and their way of living and I have to say that recent statistics and news do not dimish these allegations :D

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

these claims need some sources or I call BS.

as I've said it is easy to say now that you shouldn't lended money to Greece after 2008. Could I have said the same in 2008? nope..

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Actually there is a lot of difference. Just look at the debt as % of gdp figures and current deficit.
Also those countries are not as corrupt as Greece (which is only surpassed by Romania in the EU).
And if have more trust in their ability to implement cost cutting programs. Going on strike is not a solution.

Cheers

Re: Greece financial bailout, and the mood of other Euro users.
 

Dear Slender and everyone who commented on my post I promise to answer (with official numbers and not heavy speculations) by night... It's 3:30 here and I'm still working... Greece's economical comeback depends on me... :-P