Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

But you could say the same about MeeGo. Nokia could scrap it tomorrow and make Symbian the one true OS

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

That's the 2012 business plan. But we're set for Armageddon then so it's cool.

A QT 4.6 Meego 1.0 app that doesn't run well, or run at all on Maemo 5 1.3 will prove which side is right.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

well, saying "no commercial meego" for the n900 sounds like we may get some kind of "meego lite" or "basic" that will run on the n900, but only comes with the very basic functions needed to operate a n900 as a phone. for everything else, we have to look after ourselves.

well, sounds like maemo to me.

if you want everything served on a silver tablet, you'd buy apple anyway.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

new meego 1.0 release very soon. look that.

http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900

MeeGo 1.0 for Nokia N900, released at DD/MM/YYYY

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

That's for devs, will not have the MeeGo UX.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

That's the problem. Too many OS'es to manage. Multiple Linux and Symbian variants and Harmattan was dead before it was even released.

Nokia's stated goal has always been to move toward the mix of Maemo / Moblin. Where Fremantle.next was Harmattan, there will be no Harmattan.next. Unclear if work on Harmattan will work toward to MeeGo proper, which means less maturity as a platform.

So if we're counting which has the least shelf-life, what does Harmattan have, -4 months?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

i think the reason why most of us are so disapointed about this news is that nokia told us, that the nokia n900 will be the first device of many following in the future with the (new) os maemo 5 which will be THE os for the next high end devices... that was an official statement before the n900 was released... and that is a lie! meego will be the new os and without the support of meego for n900 it is still a lie...

and THAT is the problem!

now, after this news is official, what makes meego different to maemo? in a year, nokia could say that meego wont be supported anymore, because symbian will be the only platform supported by their fture touch phones? no one knows... and that makes me scared because i loved nokia phones since they exists...

If you guys think that nokia will still support maemo, that they will bring out more updates, believe me, it wont be more, it will be less... ask the guys in the other device-threads... its some kind of poor for nokia imho...

nokia always says, that they listen to the community... but i donk think so... and maemo.org will be... in the near future... never be the same... like every time when nokia stopped supporting a nxxx devices (and 770) in the past...

for me, this will be a big lesson. never buy a nokia nxxx... it wont be supported long... maybe, my next device will be something that talks moore@home... if feel this kind of desire... or again a nokia? i dont know... :(

just my 2 cents

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Apple OSX Mobile released on June 29 2007, still on going support (updatable)
Nokia Maemo 5 released on November 2009, No longer support after PR1.2 (The End, GG)

lol Horay!!

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Who said that there is no support for N900 after PR 1.2?
Besides, so what. I was gonna buy the meego device anyway later. No point for keeping the same phone for over a year since technology advances so fast these days :D

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

No, Nokia clearly, publicly laid out plans that included Maemo 6 (Harmattan) following right behind Maemo 5 (Fremantle) when details of Maemo 5 were first introduced. Maemo was to be the high end platform, yes, but Nokia never said they were halting development at version 5 of the OS. You misunderstood.

EDIT: In fact, more than a year ago, well before the release of the N900 and Maemo 5, qgil was publicly searching for an "i" wind name for the Maemo release after Harmattan.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

sjgadsby is correct. N900 was associated with Maemo 5 and there were expressly no guarantees that it would support the successor to Maemo 5. Maemo 5 was always the penultimate step in getting to the real crowd-worthy Maemo. Yes, things changed in that now Nokia is heading onto the MeeGo track. But all along, the N900 was still part of a sort of long-term beta program that began with the 770. The next step in the Maemo evolution was the one that was to have real longevity. (Which is one reason why I stayed with the N8x0 series.)

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Wow, hardly surprising news.

I for one am glad.

It means nokia can concentrate on giving the best support for future hardware, not wasting time supporting legacy hardware that already has it's own OS to start with.

Everyone wants something for free these days.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Nokia never said that the N900 would get Maemo 6, so what difference does it make if it doesn't get Meego?

The only OS Nokia promised for the N900 was Maemo 5.

I still don't get why people are getting so upset about this.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Once upon a time, I purchased a computer with Windows 98se installed and it came with a coupon for free copy of Windows ME (when released).....:eek:......I didn`t use the coupon.

Time passed, and I purchased a shiny new note book with a copy of Windows XP installed it too came with a coupon, this time for Windows Vista! Nope didn`t get that either.:cool:

I`m not putting MeeGo in the same class as those other clunkers, but I am skeptical of the unreleased OS. I always like to give new OS`s a chance to be digested by the public at large before I jump on them. If by chance, it is the best thing since sliced bread, then I`ll re-visit MeeGo. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy maemo`s strengths.;)

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Given your logic, the N900 was dead in the water before it was released, considering that work on Harmatten was known at that time. I wouldn't be shocked if that was a big reason why you decided to pass on the N900.

That being said, a Meego device isn't all that close to being released. In the meantime, apps need to be written for the device. With Maemo having the same framework and strongly related to the core of Maemo, it makes a good starting platform for these applications.

Until a comporable Meego product is announced, the N900 isn't "dead". Even when that does happen doesn't mean that the device is useless.

In the meantime, I will continue to enjoy my device. When a new device comes out, I may consider it. But it won't be because the N900 is "dead".

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

AAVA will be next device that will fully support MeeGo http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/N...a-Mobile-Aava/

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

When this Aava is expected to be released? Looks much better than Nokia's designs.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Nevuary 1st?

Looks like vapourware to me

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

True, Harmattan was never promised. What was disconcerting was that a large number of legitimate bugs / issues that were prevalent in Maemo 5 were pushed to Harmattan. You can track the bug submissions. Disappointing. Usually people do that at the end of a product cycle of at least a year or two. This was done after months.

Not a good track record for support.

While at the same time MeeGo gets announced that will superceed Maemo 6 / Harmattan / (soon to be called MeeGo 1.0).

So while the world only had Maemo 5 and 6 there was some potential that the support life of Maemo 5 would extend more than just a few months. With the advent of MeeGo (Maemo + Moblin) and them just renaming Maemo 6 to MeeGo 1.0 the likelihood of support for Maemo 5 for the next year is just wishful thinking at this point.

I don't know if this was speculation but we were told that a lot of people on the Maemo team have moved to MeeGo. Not a surprise really. Great, for MeeGo. Sucks to be us.

I hate harping on this but Adobe 10.1 which was promised so long ago and was a huge selling point is still not available and there is no indication that Nokia will deliver it. I think that is a good indication of the level of commitment they have for Maemo 5. We knew that Maemo 5 was rough around the edges but the goal was to iterate it and make it better. Now they're just putting it on life support.

If Nokia said, "Don't worry we will continue to support Maemo 5 with updates and feature enhancements for the next year or two" I think many would not be so concerned about having Harmattan (MeeGo 1.0). But that's not going to happen. Nokia is trying to get out Symbian ^3 and ^4 AND also going to support Maemo 5 and 6 (MeeGo 1.0) and MeeGo (Maemo + Moblin)? Nokia is a big company but not that big and not in todays competitive world.

Short of Nokia re-dedicating publicly to the Maemo product the only option left for us to make sure that we have support that lasts more than a few months and so Maemo 6 / MeeGo 1.0 is our shot at lasting support.

If the delays in 1.2 are any indication, Nokia has deprecated the N900 and Maemo 5 and put it on the back burner of support. I can go on all day about how hard it is to make these releases but I would bet you good money if people hadn't left for MeeGo the delay would surely not have been a long.

I'm not saying that focusing on MeeGo is a bad decision. I just want to make sure that we get the right level of attention and right now jumping on the MeeGo bandwagon is the only way we'll get a little love from Nokia. I'd love to be proven otherwise.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Flash 10.1 probably won't be "... about ensuring that you have the best possible experience designed for the features on your Nokia N900 device". Steve Jobs would be proud.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Please ask questions to be posted or updated at http://wiki.maemo.org/What_can_we_realistically_expect and I will do my best answering them. Hopefully this will save some of the confusion and repeated arguments seen in this thread.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

So nobody wants to ask questions?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

What will be the difference between official MeeGo and community MeeGo?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Will Flash 10.1 land on Maemo 5?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Will MeeGo on the n900 have flash 10.1?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Is it possible that an official, unique name can be given to a hybrid Maemo/MeeGo OS to distinguish it from pure instances of either?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Yeah give it a name :D It will avoid confusions in the near future.

How about MeeMo? :D

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Can we first address nomenclature and at least try to be more clear what we are running when we speak of MeeGO?

Are we referring to the platform MeeGo(non-release specific), including core, hw adaption, UX and 3rd party software.

Or are we referring to Harmattan / MeeGo 1.0 that's just MeeGo compatible only

Or are we referring to the Post Harmattan release of Maemo 6 + Moblin 2.x instance which is the first real bonafide version of MeeGo.

Can we also say that when we refer to anything that runs any version of MeeGo we mean the full stack, otherwise we specify that it runs the MeeGo 1.0 Core or the MeeGo 2.x UX and etc.

As for the questions:

Is there a codename for the Maemo 6 + Moblin 2.x version of MeeGo?

What is the expected support duration for Maemo 5. 1 more month? 6 more months, 2 more years?

How many more dot releases can we expect for Maemo, and in what interval?

Can we expect bugs being pushed out to Harmattan to be brought back into Fremantle?

Why are many of the bugs in Maemo 5 deferred to be fixed in Harmattan and not addressed in Fremantle?

Will OVI Maps 3.x be available for Maemo 5 natively or via some version of QT that is supported in Fremantle

And of course the favorite, when will Nokia make good on its promise to release Flash 10.1 HW accelerated on Maemo 5

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

I scratch my head about this one, because the wait really wasn't that long.

Time between initial release and 1.1 - 2 months
Time between 1.1 and 1.1.1 - 1 month
Time between 1.1.1 and 1.2 - 3 months

The "delays" in 1.2 (if there were really delays or if it took that long to write or test everything. People talk like there was a release date to hit that everyone knew about) doesn't say anything either way about Nokia's support of Maemo.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

"official MeeGo" = the release of an open source platform by the MeeGo project at meego.com. A community effort, including (soon) the tools to make all kinds of customizations.

If you mean "What will be the difference between the MeeGo-Harmattan release from Nokia and the MeeGo-Harmattanm release from the community", the answer is: nobody knows today. At this point nobody knows what will and will not work. Technical discussion, R&D experimentation and official MeeGo-Harmattan releases need to come first in order to tell.

The main points to watch are: hardware adaptation for the N900, impact of hardware differences between the N900 and the new target device from Nokia, software performance, possibility to redistribute Nokia binaries and possibility to redistribute 3rd party binaries (being each 3rd party a different story). Probably another piece to look at is the security framework and what can or can't be done with devices that didn't have it originally installed.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Nokia never promised Flash 10.1, it was demoed on an N900 and actually if you go to that same TBS site shown on the demo on your n900 you will see that is works with flash 9.4.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

There are questions about future releases of Flash. Skype and other 3rd party components with "consumer brands":

Regular Nokia employees are not supposed to speculate or even announce any news about third party software being supported or not in future releases. The initiative corresponds to the companies owning that software or, alternatively, to an official Nokia channel well in sync with those companies. Due to these reasons, please understand if Nokia guys like me will systematically bypass these questions.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Yes! Give us some time to come up with the official name. In the meantime, and for the sake of simplicity in these discussions, let's just use

"MeeGo-Harmattan" = released by Nokia, open+closed components, deb based.

"MeeGo" = released by the MeeGo project, 100% open, rpm based.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Yeah, you're absolutely right. Probably doesn't mean anything in and of itself, but the fact that they're tacking the No MeeGo support onto its release I think indicates the direction they're headed.

Apple has indicated that for each device they will be supported for 3 releases. The original iPhone has had OS updates up until 4.0 which is releasing soon. 2+ years of software updates. Not bad by any measure.

Will Nokia do the same?

What hope do we have that Nokia will continue to make updates to our product even a year from now. Isn't MeeGo our only option?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

what's the difference between rpm and deb?
why isn't MeeGo deb based?

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Questions about further updates of Maemo 5:

The Fremantle program is working and busy preparing a next update. I'm not the person to give more details, sorry. http://conversations.nokia.com/ is the default channel for such announcements and asking there might be more effective.

If you have questions about specific bugs please ask them in those bugs. CC me if you expect my answer there.

This thread and this forum is about MeeGo & MeeGo-Harmattan, and this is the area where I hope to be more useful.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

Quim you have made me a very happy (and relieved) man with that reply, in more ways than one.

:)

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

The idea was to address the persistent question about MeeGo and/or MeeGo-Harmattan official updates from Nokia for the N900. Another approach would have been just to wait for the MeeGo-Harmattan announcement, a logical spot to explain the N900 support plans. Any day scratched from that deadline indicates (at least to me) more transparency from Nokia to N900 potential and actual customers. This extra time is also useful for the MeeGo-Harmattan community edition effort.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

deb and rpm are different package systems that offer virtually no differences to end users.

The MeeGo project has done plenty of technology decisions, one of them being choosing rpm for packaging.

No matter what, the fact is that MeeGo is rpm based and MeeGo-Harmattan will still be deb based since its development when MeeGo was announced was in a no-return point in terms of packaging.

Re: Official: No (commercial) MeeGo for the N900
 

As Qt develops, will Qt on s^3, s^4, Maemo 5 and MeeGo/MeeGo-Harmattan be updated simultaneously?

For instance, if there is a Qt 5.0 release, will all OSes receive such upgrades?