Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

i no this display was out a wild now but why phone manufactures import then to they devices, is base on a resistive technology able to do multitouch u can able to do a lot with it , more then capacitive and resistive here some links:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Msfxd...x=5&playnext=3

http://www.stantum.com/en/

if only nokia can inport them to there smartphone devices :rolleyes:

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

this was.is great tech but the apple bio sphere wont let anything but capacitive live ... sad day for a better tech.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

How come, this tech is way advance then capacitive and resistive it should able to do a lot with this tech , able-ling to do multitouch on resistive finally and no one is looking in to this tech I'm really disappointing but i still looking a head with in this tech, this is the future of touch technology

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

why this thread talk like cave man.

hahaha

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

hahahaha you a funny one :D

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Because not everyone in the world learns English as their first language. However, unlike most English speakers, they actually learn English enough to be understood, while English speakers sit around expecting everyone to conform to their language.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Actually, just came across something (was browsing Stantum's website in the hope of having something to pull me out of the depression at the prospect of *****ic business decisions continuing to obsess over capacitive screens) that may be cause for optimism:

http://www.stantum.com/en/medias/videos-demos (Namely the first one, which is recent - at least to me - and of special interest to this board because it says it's using MeeGo)

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Sorry for being complete noob, but is this software or hardware approach? If it's software i'd like to see it on my linux box :)

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Hardware. But on that page they have a demo of x.org having multitouch support, so you may be able to see if you can order one of their screens for a desktop... *Shrug* I honestly don't know how much Stantum actually has in way of consumer products. Their website certainly doesn't suggest they sell straight to consumers, but it's possible if you gave them a call and were willing to accept a warranty-less, support-less purchase, you'd be able to buy a screen. (Honestly, I have no clue as to how feasible that is.)

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

I'd doubt that they actually make screens themselves (beyond a handful of test/demo models). They'll be looking to license the technology to others instead - probably for significant sums, which is likely why we're not seeing anything using their screens. It's either that or there's some technical issues which actually make it less useful than they're claiming.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

There is of course another advantage of capacitive over resistive.

Durability!

The screens are able to be made of glass, they are stronger, less prone to scratches, don't get 'clicky' after a few months of use, still work if the screen is shattered, can withstand heat (say an ember from a cigarette floats down onto your phone screen).

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

If the glass is so durable and scratch resistant, why wasn't flexible glass invented?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flexible_glass
http://www.technologyreview.com/computing/25429/?a=f
It could be used for resistive screen ;)


:)

First, resistive screen is already based on two flexible sheets, and we don't finger the motherboard.
The problem was that flexible and glass are incompatible, and the glass is the most scratch-resistant material for a screen (or described so) and is used in capacitive screens, so I asked why there is no flexible glass.

Second, it's true that manufacturers cannot afford to produce immortal devices and most consumers don't want their devices to be immortal (because they would have to find a way to upgrade their processors, RAM, camera, and other modules in order not to be left behind), and thus immortal devices become very rare and expensive.

Third, the watch you described is a ludicrous luxury. Not customisable? Not repairable? I already have mechanical watch and normal non-digital compass; if I find mechanical barometer, I will be able to see altitude, too. Without capricious electronics.
Though I would like to have all these mechanical watch, magnetic compass and barometer miniaturised and put inside a finger rind, where I can look at them through a Stanhope lens
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanhop...tical_bijou%29
It would be convenient, require no electrical power, compact, and well-protected against viruses/electromagnetic waves. At maximum, the compass could be confused by magnetic fields. And it would probably last longer, than tactile screen. The main problem would be miniaturisation of mechanical watch, I think.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Except not really.

The 'durability' of a capacitive screen is a very limited one. It won't VISIBLY scratch, but microscratches (real 'micro' scratches - the microscopic ones that you won't see ever without special equipment) are going to screw up exactly how the current passes through it. That combined with other changes to resistivity/conductivity of the screen material basically mean that a capacitive screen is GUARANTEED to get less accurate over time. Where-as resistive screens are only really screwed if you have blatantly visible scratches. And even then they still WORK just as well unless the scratch/damage completely cuts a section of the grid, albeit at that point they aren't pleasant to look at.

Of course, better screen materials mean that over time, it becomes easier to make the screen even harder, thus more resistant to microscratches, and other changes could be made that improve resistance to changes in conductivity/resistivity or the surface.

But by the same token, improvements in resistive screen materials also would lead to greater durability at the aesthetic macro level.

So we're back to them having different disadvantages, of which I personally see the resistive screen as being the better off yet again.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Because you'd be fingering the motherboard if the screen would be flexible. :D

We have the technology to make immortal screens, it's just that none of us can afford it. Diamond surfaces are achievable and are virtually immune to scratching assuming you have a cash fountain you no longer need.

Or, assuming you can live with a less-than-one-inch screen. Watches have very-very-tough screens since forever.

Tissot used to sell a sapphire screen with touch for a watch, IIRC. <Google>. Here we go. "By simply pushing the crown and then touching the tactile crystal at different positions these functions can be activated. Touch the screen at two o'clock and your current altitude appears on the digital readout. Touch the crystal at six o'clock and the hands move around into position to become a compass". About a thousand USD, before you ask. ~30 mm diameter, before you ask.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

English is not my first language, but i speak (not to mention write) way better than many native speakers (or so i've been told), english not being your first tongue is no excuse to suck at it.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

@wikiwide

Glass is better than plastic, true, but don't believe the hype. The reason most capacitives last longer is because they don't work by harn on hard surface. If you took a dusty pen and kept on sweeping you'd nuke that too. Plus, the deeps scratches are unavoidable.

I'd like a phone with a user-remvable touch so you can buy them like covers. They are not so expeensive. I heard quotes in the 50$ area. I plan on a screen replacement at some point.

So it's also a price thing. If a glass screen would make the device 50$ more, it would not be feasable. Personally, I like my screen, I only wished I knew exactly how hard or easy it would be to scratch.

Oh, and you can feel scratches with a pen, you can't with a finger. So there's that.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Somthing that would totally make me cream myself on the spot would be a screen where for at least each pixel there would be a distance sensor (kinda like Project Natal's camera but the imaging sensor instead of being a grid behind a lens it would be a grid the size (and resolution) of the screen laid on the screen itself)

Of course, also detecting multiple touch pressure with assorted materials like Stantum's would rock. Hell, since i'm dreaming high, gimme also one of those baterryless wireless Wacom stylus with 1024 levels of pressure sensitivity on the tip and two side buttons, popping out of the device itself like the N900's stylus.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

its more accurate it can be used with std materials and the like. stantum has a real solution without the two touch limit. the idea is though that capacitive is better. there are no, zero techinical advantages to capcitive. ESPECIALLY in light on the higher res of these screens. the higher the pix.densith the more accurate a touch needs to be. you can order stantuns overlays and screen matrix, and chipset but no one has. i would ddef like to see this used over cap. i still dont know why everyone goes apeshit for cap.


ps: ive worked outside in my life i have rough hands and thick skin on my finger tips i have a handicap when it comes ro conductivity so i suppose im bias. hence why i pick hw keyboards and pressure sensitive ts screens. i got really lucky with the n900 and it seems to be as pinnacle of my needs tech wise as everyone has abandoned resistive.

i never saw a review stating why the n900 should have cap screen just a buncha of whining neophites complaining about something they dont know about. instead of using the screen and seeing how well it worked depite its percieved obsolesence.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

i only expect them to learn english if they are going to live where english is the language...unfortunately in the USA, though you make that comment, there are areas i go to and they look at ME like,... Cant you just f'in learn to speak MY language!? lol


backwards.
ok now, back on subject.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Capacitive displays have several advantages:
* Better light passthrough. Without a matrix and embedded metal, a capacitive lets ~100% light through, whereas a resistive eats up to and around 50%. As a result, same image means more power consumption for a resistive.
* Forces one to use finger, which protects the surface. No hard pen means longer life. It's questionable, but there it is.
* Since there is no bending involved, the screens can be hard, which allows for harder materials. Glass is a lot tougher than soft, bendable plastic.
* Allows multitouch

Resistive has its advantages:
* Precision
* Allows pen and pointing devices, including handwriting, drawing, etc.
* Can be touched lightly without registering.

That being said, I want resistive for me. I tried capacitive and my finger is HUGE compared to a pen. Makes screens seem small. Even a 24 inch at the office is hard to use, because every now and then you need precision.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

I'm really not sure it's 50%, but I'll take your word for it until I can get around to looking it up. If that is true, it is an advantage: But it's also very much a materials-progress thing - I honestly don't need more brightness/vibrant-ness than my N900 screen puts out - but even so, the better materials can be manufactured, the more resistive screens can be made to filter out less light.
If it's questionable, then it's not really there, now is it. It's possibly there. I mean, if that's an 'advantage', then you can CHOOSE to use your fingers on a resistive screen. I rarely ever use the stylus - for precision presses, the callouses on my fingers and/or fingernails are 99% enough. And already that's more precision than a capacitive screen gives you, with the same 'soft' surfaces. Then if you want, yes, you can break out the harder pens/styli. But I don't see how that's a capacitive advantage, when a quality resistive screen doesn't actually stop you from using touch.

This reminds me of this anecdote I read by some jeweler, who was ranting about how people have this irrational expectation that diamonds can't be cracked by impacts against hard surfaces.

There's a major difference between hardness of the type that has to do with bending, and the hardness that has to do with scratching. From a scientific perspective, they're two different things and actually DON'T have to correlate. A diamond might be the hardest substance known (other than what happens if you compress or molecularly rearrange diamonds, in which case you get even harder diamonds that can't be scratched by normal diamonds, but whatever).

Anyway, you could actually have a flexible surface that is also very scratch resistant. It hasn't been done, but it's not like there aren't improvements in that area. At the same time, the aforementioned thing about microscratches screwing up conductivity of the capacitive screen decreasing accuracy is just as much of an issue. One's just less visible, so we ignore it, because that's how humans work.

Also, now that I think about it, with stantum's spacer dots idea, the fact that you could probably decrease distance between screen layers even more would presumably mean that you can opt for somewhat harder (as in scratch resistant) materials, and not loose sensitivity. (If I'm actually right about the spacer dots enabling smaller gaps. Logically it makes sense to me, but I may be missing some key aspect of the problem, due to lack of any real experience in the subject.)

Isn't the whole point of this thread Stantum screens, which do the same?

Not really trying to rag on you specifically, or rejecting that capacitive has advantages - though more and more I'm arguing that modern technology means the advantages of capacitive screens are rapidly withering away.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

this is one of the biggest advantages for me. it's just ridiculous how often i have to press "cancel", "back", "get me out of here", "exit" etc. with a capacitive screen because the damn thing just hysterically responds to each and every unintentional touch. There's no way to use it except you're sitting on your couch and concentrate. Text input with an onscreen keyboard while in the back of a cab? No chance. The same with a resistive screen? Easy.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

Come on man, train your digits. It ain't that hard. Tens of millions of other users have mastered such skill!

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

I agree with Benny. It's way easier with resistive. Also, capacitive in current implementation has an angle issue, you only have precision in a birds's eye view.

Re: Stantum's Multi-Touch resistive display
 

I like the N800 and N810 screen better for stylus, because the touch surface is very close to the screen. On N900 there's a big gap, so the tip of stylus on screen seems different depending on the angle you view it from.