Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

The Poll is to try and get more behind the Community in an effort to see if there is a way of getting Nokia to release the much wanted source code for the N900 so that further development can carry on by this Community.

I alone can do nothing and the very reason it has to start somewhere and the reason for this Poll so please ask the Community what to do and not me alone, how about you put some idea's forward for everyone to read?.

A Poll is to establish who is for and against and is completely open for everyone to see and now is up to the Community to put idea's forward, the Poll will give everyone an idea how many want progress by the yes or no vote.

As of this post the count stands at 319 for and 14 against Nokia releasing the complete source code of the N900 os.

The only thing that baffles me is why the no vote because that would mean they do not want to progress further development for the N900 or is that there reason?, please post the reason you voted a no.

I have edited my opening post once again to give further explanation for this Poll.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Done that already several times - please follow the thread.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Before you vote, there is text added by the forum code that says "Be advised that this is a public poll: other users can see the choice(s) you selected."

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Perhaps it's personal, given your history here?

I'm all for encouraging Nokia to hand over the source code but that doesn't mean I have to participate in your poll.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Don't waste your time here, Andre.

The poll is also completely useless, who does really answer "no" to this kind of question? "Would you like the full source of Fremantle, for free?". Pointless.

More interesting would have been "Would you dedicate X months of your time to clean up something that resembles a full release of Fremantle source code?" "What would you do with full Fremantle source code?" etc. etc.

Also, you abill_uk fail at polls -- this should have been a _single selection_ poll!

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Heh. Another center shot for Jedi. Stop using the force, Luke, that's cheating.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

you are misinterpreting your pool results. If you look closely, i am in the "yes" list too.

So, technically, i you look who is with you, i DO support your petition.

Stay positive!

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Please report the misake so it can be removed and thankyou for your support !.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

@ abill.... you keep saying things like you "will contribute to CSSU/Maemo once 50% of the closed components are opened" and you will "contribute to Meego DE when it is worth contributing to". Assuming you actually have something to contribute besides whining (doubtful).... WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR????

We don't need another petition or another discussion about the "sad state" of Meego/Maemo - we need action! Meaning get in there and get your hands dirty or STFU.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

May be, a convenient way for both Maemo and Meego on N900 is to try a confluence of both approachs.

That is, apps and services for Maemo should be written taking into consideration Meego, so, if we switch, we will have a lot of excellent apps working.

A question for stskeeps,
I have a "C3 Beagleboard (with Android installed ;-)", and here there are instruccions for installing Meego.

Do you know if it works with SF2011 DE?

Regards,
Àngel

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I voted both yes and no because this thread is stupid and I thought it deserved an appropriate response.

ps. I love the tags on this thread. So appropriate.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Ahaahaha, you can vote both yes and no... lmao

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

In theory it shold allow this :)

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I may be missing something, so correct me if I am wrong, but there are open source components out there for the many closed source components in maemo (like the telecommunication in openmoko), so is it not possble to use these?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

So... since there are so many that are keen on opening the source...hows about some of you work out what you're asking for?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Yeah, thanks to Nokia before M$ epoch. But it is over and question is how long DE team will have the inertia to continue. Can you guarantee that it will be after DE is as useful as Maemo is now?

Great. And how exactly your access to Maemo5/6 source code differs from allowing those who choose not to leave the ship to have access to the same code? Or DE team is a kind of chosen ones?

Me. Do you mind? Let me be old-fashioned, I like it that way. I am sure above statement is because you really like what you are doing and you strongly believe in Meego's future, but not everyone shares your enthusiasm. And isn't linux about the choice?

To be honest I can't believe I am advocating abill_uk. But his point that we need discussion on Maemo 5 future seems valid.
It is not that I need full source code - there are several components (Conversation UI, Calendar, ...) that will make life much easier to those who choose to contribute to Maemo 5 , not Meego.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

there is little to no point in working on Maemo IMO. the code and components for Meego are much cleaner, more scalable, and almost 100% open. if you truly enjoy Maemo 5, support Cordia (which is focused on making the familiar hildon desktop environment run on top of the Meego core).

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

What is really needed is a full GSM linux implementation (drivers,modules,etc.) and source to really have a open source environment on the n900. It would be better. How about a lean Debian mid with call and cellular data working, similar to Android and Wing? Yea, create a beast like that, and say "Hey, Nokia, how you like them apples now?...

hey, I bought a Q1 Ultra, oh it has a sim card holder, bah, doesnt work in ubuntu.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

And where are skype, flash (9) , microb, navigation software, etc... in Cordia and Meego? Don't get me wrong, I fully support those efforts (yes, I do), but also I want fully functioning device in my pocket. And the only OS that gives such functionality for N900 till now is Maemo 5. I do not understand that consumer way of thinking - there is new toy (OS, car model, whatever), lets put our current one in trash and hurry about new one.

And please, do not tell me that we should ban evil companies(Skype/M$, Adobe) by not using their services on our FOSS devices.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I am not saying everyone should jump ship now - Meego is obviously not ready for primetime. I am just saying that efforts are better spent working on Meego IMO.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Ever heard of Meego!? Only different with above and Meego is the package manager the rest of the stuff you say is already in n900DE

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

1 I hate RPM,s gives me the PMS.
2. The point of have that the gsm part open is so you can have your phone running with any linux os you want and have a working phone at the same time. I mean, when Maemo dies, do you really want to install another closed source os? isnt that like ahh again?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I don't think anyone thinks this petition will work. I think it is intended as an excuse for inaction. If it did work, Nokia would be aiding a revolt against Nokia that might affect the sales of Nokia by encouraging some of its customers to follow Maemo instead of Nokia.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

This thread was about opensource Maemo OS. And the above apps is no way near to be open sourced anyway, And too me its kind of wierd discussion from abill and now you.

First you want everything open. Then people complain when there IS open alternatives to use, Meego. "Because its not ready"?

Why doesnt people get this straight:

Open Source will only be "ready" if people contribute! There is no "fast way".

Personally I doubt those who have voted yes ever will contribute anyway. Its much simpler to click a damn button in a forum than actually contribute to the open source. I know I am not that good to contribute myself for years :-( So dont get me wrong but...


IMHO. If you prefer Maemo. Stay with Maemo and accept the facts that some components/drivers etc will never be open. Or help improve a great new OS.

I am sure the community can, with help of alot of people, make Meego a killer OS on N900 if people contribute to it instead of sitting in this forum and cry about some deprecated codebase from Nokia.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Again MEEGO!

but about GSM:

http://ofono.org/

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

You very clearly don't understand that phones are NOT like PC's.

You can't just install different OS' and get full functionality from them all...

The ONLY OS that will ever be usable on a day-day basis allowing us to fully utilise our N900 is Maemo 5. MeeGo will NEVER get to where Maemo is now on the N900. On new phones made for MeeGo it could potentially be amazing.

But MeeGo at best will struggle on our N900s compared to Maemo 5.

With opened source code we could make Maemo just that bit more perfect for our N900 as we dont want to contribute to MeeGo as no matter how much effort we put in, nothing good will really come to our N900, only for the new Nokia and other manufacturers phones designed for MeeGo will benefit from our work.

If we had source code to Phone,Conversations and Calendar. We could implement working portrait support that is bug free or almost bug free and improve alot of UI related things after the main code has been cleaned.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Yes, very cool

And Nokia is even a proud sponsor of the movement, yet they dont release gsm code?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

1. Phone:

Not sure here but cant the phone functionality be accessed via libofono or via dbus like in Meego? I dont see any reason the backend must be opened? What will that help you? You have too have the technical specificaions for the modem to if you want to implement what stuff it is missing or is buggy.

2. Conversation ("app" made by thirdparty if I remember correct so maybe not Nokias decision):

Again better make a new app based on Qt(Quick) and also port to Meego with full portrait/landscape support instead of continue "stupid gtk hacks".

3. Calendar

I guess syncing is bigest issue here? But there was a guy working on the Meego conference working on a "syncapp" for Meego would be better backport his app for Maemo instead of use some deprecated sourcecode?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

What will you personally do with some halvbacked GSM code from Nokia? Do you think it help to get it "open source"? I doubt, you need technical specs too. And if they exist public its better write module for libofono than use Nokias deprectated codebase.

libofono is enought to make GSM work in Meego so I dont see why we cant use it in maemo too.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

lol what makes you think i didnt know the vote was public, i read that long ago... as to why i voted no... just cause i am quite happy with my device, does what i need and how i need it.

I dont need to go crying all the time about something that is obviously fantasy(asking for the closed sources)... i can recount lots of projects that never got the source code... you can even see them on TMO...

What i dont understand from you... is that few days back you were bashing the cssu people... have you finally realized the great job they are doing?? i cant stop wondering... The same with the meego DE team, they had no reason to adapt it to a "dead"(like some people call it, but not me) phone like the n900 yet they chose our phone. To both teams i am trully grateful for the great job you guys are doing.

PS: I see more future in a poll asking people in TMO if we should ban "some_uk" whiner... although in the end my poll will be as useless as this one as i plan on doing nothing with the poll results

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

What makes you say this? Seriously, you and abill_uk seem to be making similar points, both in the tone and in the lack of information backing them up.

Can you do what he refuses to, and explain what you mean?

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

its a steep hill to climb, but i truly believe Meego will get there. and sooner than most think ;)

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

And because it seems You have some information which others are missing, will you please share it with us, i.e. what makes you think that n900 will have Meego distro comparable (if not better) than Maemo 5.

I don't get it guys, the thread was about Maemo 5, why out of the sudden it became some kind of flamewar? Again, it is about the choise, not about which OS is better. And for those who choose to stay with Maemo 5 it will be much easier to fix and improve things if source code is available. What has Meego to do with it? And all this nonsense that those who continue to develop for Maemo 5 is wasting his time. WTF? It is my time, let me waste it in the way I like, please. Thanks.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Why does everyone insist on wrapping this in circles? I, long ago, asked abill_uk to explain one of his points, and I would like godofwar24 to explain why he thinks MeeGo cannot ever be a replacement for Maemo 5 on the N900.

Please, I am asking those making assertions to support their point.

This is not a flamewar. There are a number of points that have been brought up about this topic:

• abill_uk insists that there are missing drivers, but refuses to explain this point
• this sort of request has been made for years, repeatedly, to little success

abill_uk's response has been a concerted effort to not answer my question, and to accuse others of attacking him and promising to report people who question his assertions.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

My two cents.

I like the N900 and Maemo, but I don't see future for this niche.

I day will arrive when my belloved N900 will die, and I will need a substitute.

So the question is: Maemo will continue after the N900s era?

I think the response is no, so I need to consider other ways. Meego? Ubuntu?

As I exposed before, the CSSU work is fundamental at this phase, but we need to focus the effort in the future enhancing the present (Maemo).

This situation could be similar to others like Qtopia, openmoko, familiar ...

Regards,
Àngel

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I won't answer... I'll let the Nokia-hosted MeeGo conference about N900 DE explain it for me:

http://vaibhavsharma.files.wordpress...on-demo-10.jpg

Please read line one aloud: "This is and will not be for regular end users." Period. You can read the whole text and see more slides by clicking here.

Even the presenter, near the end of the demo video, notes that the camera still has issues, and overall "it needs work... But is surprisingly overall good." Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

Don't get me wrong. I would love to see MeeGo on the N900. I'm glad it's being worked on and developed. But it's simply not in a state to replace Maemo and still be a functional, stable, every-day full-use device. Maemo has that right now, and even it took time to get there. Do you really expect people to punch the reset button and go back to PR0.8 stability for an OS that's not supported and may or may not every be fully solid and released?

If anything, I see source from Meego DE being pulled by the community udpate teams to be adapted and replace Maemo closed-source code, not the other way around. Again, I'm not discouraging code from flowing in either direction. This is just what I predict. And I could be wrong (wouldn't be the first time)!

In the end though, it would be much easier to make a renewed appeal to Nokia to open parts of Maemo. That's been going on, but has stalled as Nokia shifted its attention to WP7. A large community campaign may get their attention, and rattle the cage enough to get their attention. Worst case, they'll do what they've been doing: Continue to ignore the end user and consider the old product line mothballed.

I see no harm in trying again. I don't expect a different result than before, but I don't see any harm in trying. If you think it's a wasted effort, so be it: Don't participate in it. Want to see real wasted effort? There are people still hacking OpenMoko on the FreeRunner. Go check out that effort and tell me asking Nokia for source is more futile. :rolleyes:

I say go for it. Ask again. Make a petition... Picket an office if it will help. The worst case scenario is we get nothing more than we have now. I don't see a reason to discourage it if someone has the energy to try again. Smash into that wall again... who knows, it may crumble this time? Or not...

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

The NITDroid had ALOT of momentum behind it, and gave us a very good implementation of Android for the N900.

Yet it is still not even near able to replace maemo and even if it had full phone capabilities it will never be more usable then maemo is now.

MeeGo is getting there, but all the work in the world and its not going to get to the sort of level that maemo is at the moment.

Maemo 5 was made for the N900 and the N900 only! MeeGo was just adapted for the N900, the minimum specs requirements of MeeGo are higher then the internals of the N900.

When I say release code for the 'Phone'.
I simply mean that they should release the source for the Phone application, not the actual modem. The bugs are within the Phone application NOT the modem driver.

Also the closed sections being open would also help with possibly updating the Kernel, GFX drivers ect.. resulting is fixing some little issues we have atm such as screen tearing.

You just suggested making a open source replacement using Qt?? Seriously??

We can't easily make open source replacement without the ORIGINAL source of the app. It would mean writing the application from scratch which could take MONTHS! With the original code, we could extract the relevant code and then is would take a number of weeks/days to make our open source replacement.

The main reason for releasing the code is so that we can easily make open source replacements without loosing functionality or spending extreme amounts of time on it.

Actually its both syncing AND the fact that there is no such option for usable portrait in it. Also it has very awkward time settings for alarms and im sure there are loads of other features people might want in the calendar app.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

I don't need to. I was there.

You've just done the same thing. You've said "It can't ever be good" but not given any reasons. The DE is not intended for regular end users. It can be a base from which a version for regular end users could be developed, however. Yet the question, which still has not been answered, is why this is not possible.

It's certainly more possible than getting the last closed bits out of Nokia.

And NITDroid is Android, which IMO can't compare to MeeGo or Maemo, no matter how hard they try (never mind the fact that Android will never work with any of the closed bits required for hardware support, due to Google using a custom libc.)

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

You keep repeating yourself. Why must you be right all the time?

You have a very clear inability to take other peoples opinions. Who are you to say fixing maemo is pointless and that MeeGo is the future for the N900?

Maemo works NOW as an end usable platform, with the source code, the final tweaks and bugs can be fixed making maemo complete for us using our N900's.

MeeGo is going to, at best. take 6 months+ to get to even a PR 1.0 status for end users. Whereas Maemo could be almost perfect within a couple of months.

Just understand that NOBODY is saying MeeGo is crap or worse then Maemo. Just that atm it cannot compete with ANY mobile platform purely because its still really in alpha stages.

Re: PETITION to Nokia to release the full source code of the Maemo OS to this Community.
 

Personally, I've always disliked meego. The main reason being ugly rpm based packaging system. I've always preferred emerge and debs, and having installed meego 1.1 on asus 1005 Hag has shown how slow rpm is compared to debs (running on n810).

The debate weather the maemo is to be abandoned in favour of meego is pointless. The important thing is to make vendors stop abusing open source projects by limiting them through critical closed sourced code pieces (drivers, daemons, and similar).