Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

The two of you or 3 of you can argue but why drag TMO into the mud? Nobody owns TMO so nobody is a representative of TMO...

Your donations are of course appreciated by everyone just like everyone else who donates or helps with the Community being independent of Nokia but that doesn't mean its a valid point to say "its a shame for TMO" when debating with someone else...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It all seems to have been a misunderstanding, further dialogue here too:
http://www.allboutn9.info/2013/01/fa...13464675553884
What they've done in-fact helps with the initiative discussed/planned here.
I look forward to any further contributions they may wish to offer...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

@shmeri Every upcoming device (in what ever industry it is) causes people to ask similar questions. They always sound pretty much the same. Thank's for the list, I'll have a look at it.

@thedeath I'm sorry if I was misunderstood - I meant pretty much the opposite & part was related on comments on our page. I have a big appreciation for TMO and was sad to see rants from TMO users.

But I also expect some respect from concerned people towards our website. We're not a small player in the N9 general user base & social media and what we do (2 people) is a hobby - we're not a company which tries to play out another one.

Furthermore my choice of words was also influenced by "upsetness" & disappointment - which is more than logical in this case.

@jaylist Thanks - good to hear that from you. I know you're long-times efforts concerning N9... at least since I talk to you a long time ago in that Australian forum (no clue what my username was back then ;) ).

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I've temporarily re-enabled both docs (see my sig) for anyone to contribute to...
N.B. they will be locked again VERY SOON, as shmerl will be condensing both into formal docs for Jolla/Sailfish.
Anything that's already cleared-up we'll eventually move to a wiki, probably maemo.org, assuming it's working now.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I sent the questions list to Jolla (skipping already answered questions). See the attached file for reference. Now let's wait for their answer.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Well done, much quicker than I anticipated!
What about the concerns/criticisms doc, or should that be left till we know a bit more?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I missed it to be honest, since I thought that we decided to join them into one at some point, so I didn't keep track of the second document... (the last time I looked at it - I transferred all the questions from there to the first document).

What do you propose, to wait for the answer and then send the second set? I think most important questions went into the first document anyway.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Always felt it made more sense to break it into those two areas...
If you read the def. headers of both docs it makes sense (assuming they're still there).
But for now I guess we can leave it be....
I've PM'd you two other email addresses stskeeps recommended we CC.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Stskeeps explained why Mer (and derivatives like Sailfish in turn) use old version of coreutils - it's because of GPLv2 restriction on certain core packages. What could be good if one could have an updated version as optional.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Any response from Jolla Press & the other contacts yet?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Not yet, they must be processing the long list still :)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Given how Apple's entire corporate strategy revolves around copying features from other smartphones, it's not in Jolla's interests to reveal a lot of this until June.

Indeed, they might not even have finalised the SoC yet.

It's not just Apple. BB OS 10 has all but cloned Harmattan.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Why specifically June? I don't remember them talking about any months, except may be something about Q1 (and that's only about the SDK).

Some of the questions are possibly against their interests to answer yet, while others aren't. I'm sure they can find something in that list to answer on at this time already.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Apologies, looks like I was misinformed.

They're actually talking about this quarter:

https://twitter.com/JollaMobile/stat...61581395603456

SDK isn't a product is it?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Interesting finance-oriented article. Jolla think they only need to sell 200,000 phones to break even:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/parmyols...d-alternative/

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It's not so easy to sell 200k devices.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

They've said constantly that they'll reveal much more about the product[s]* (possibly everything), & the entire dev. approach/methodology during Q1.
They've said people will be able to start ordering the product[s] during or at the end of Summer (northern hemisphere).
But that will only be in a very limited number of countries, China being one of them...
They haven't said anything about some sort of online ordering system for people who aren't in those countries, many are hoping they will offer something like that.

*most info. has pointed to there only being 1x device for starters.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

@shmerl I also don't remember them talking about June. But they've mentioned to start selling first phones "before summer 2013" (what market that will be is unknown...maybe even China first?). So probably June came up since the astronomical summer begins towards the end of that month...who knows. Personally I wouldn't expect anything before that though, rather end of summer as mentioned by jalyst.

@jalyst I'm sure Jolla will lift some secrets (including developer infos & programs) on February 25-28 - not only Marc Dillon will be present there. Before that probably not. Hopefully we'll also hear more about market availability. We only know that US won't have a priority initially, but what about/where/how in Europe etc?

With a low BEP of 200'000 devices (depending if initial distribution costs are included) we certainly won't be able to just walk into every network operator store and get a Jolla phone ;)

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Stskeeps said that Jolla is working on the questions list, so we just need to wait.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Waiting...

Damn it. I forgot to ask if sailfish handles .m4b?

Everybody freeze!

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I hope its not STEricsson who is pushing money to Jolla. Because if thats the case Jolla is doomed.

Ericsson very well KILL the Novathor platform because the company is bleeding...

Atleast what they say in swedish media...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

It's not...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I expected that ST-Ericsson is at risk. Jolla didn't say so far what is going on with their SoC choice and plans, so there is no point to speculate.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

https://twitter.com/thp4/status/297712780528730113
https://twitter.com/netvandal/status/297719334334238720

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Sailfish Alpha SDK releasing by end of February...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

That is great news, finally some info. But I'm not sure how the get end of Feb as early Q1:confused:

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Since when was "early Q1" a hard date, it was always a guesstimation, how are they supposed to know "exactly when".

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

If you don't know. You say you don't know. If they are guessing they could type that why not just say Q1 if the were clueless? It like saying: we release the phone early 2013 and release it Jun 30. Would you defend that as early of the year?

Well it Dosent matter now we can wait until end of Feb.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

If you're being pressed constantly to give a rough estimate, you give a rough estimate & explicitly say it's rough.
Which they've always maintained, by the very fact that they gave a vague date, & explained it as such...
Now they've given a very clear-cut date, if they don't meet that, I'll be the 1st to b1tch about it, before you Dave.
Especially since Ubuntu has already beaten them in getting their qt-creator plugin into the public's hands.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

@shmerl

Heard any whispers yet?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

No answer still. I guess they were busy with Fosdem, but should be back now.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Was there any news their presence at Fosdem??

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

MWC is theyr last and very small chance....

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Can you elaborate?

Thp posted about it
http://thpmaemo.blogspot.com/2013/02...-2013.html?m=1

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I just give my personal opinion about this, and I dont like it but:

There is a mobilewar going on out there. Not between IOS, Android or even WP. Personally I dont give a **** about those three OS:es. To me they are plain crap.

BUT now I have five other choices that can be of intrests for those who prefer new stuff (==geeks):

BB10
SailfishOS
UbuntuMobile
Tizen
FirefoxMobile.

Now, one or two may have a chance to survive. And history has shown that its not always the "best" who survives. Almost always it is the companus that has the biggest MARKETING campaign that wins the wars. That is not only on mobile markets its everywhere in bussiness world.

Now take a look at those five OS:et above. Whom of those five has got most attention so far? I definitivly say BB10 and Ubuntu Mobile.

Personally I dont like it. Especcially because I think SailfishOS is the best choice for me I I also thinks the core bits is most stable OS too because of its history.

But got damn they have to deliver. I dont want to be rude about Jolla as company. I would mind even working for them but still facts stands, its all about marketing! The bussiness is rude as hell.

So my point about MWS is: Firefox and Ubuntu will get alot attention by media. It does not mean Jolla have to announce a phone, but atleast "steal back the show" in some way...

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

I don't see it as a war. There is a lot of room for collaboration. Wars are the agenda of evil empires. Open source projects should have better goals.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

When are they going to answer some of our Qns goddammit, can we give them a nudge soon?

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

They aren't going to answer. They are uninterested in us.

Re: Sailfish(Jolla): Ideas/Qns & Concerns/Criticisms
 

Take it easy people; the questionnaire is in the process of being answered and with FOSDEM taking up their time + illness (Stskeeps) its not been easy :)

So relax and wait for it; the answers will come definitely... They care ;)