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-   Jolla1 & TOH (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=56)
-   -   #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90142)

jalyst 2013-08-25 14:15
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Does anyone else find it odd that Ars only ever has eyes for Ubuntu Touch? They're well aware of the MeR derivatives, but the coverage is almost 0.
Just the latest example of their love-in with Canonical....
http://arstechnica.com/information-t...e-ubuntu-edge/
Their coverage of Tizen is a little bit better than Nemo/Sailfish, & FFOS gets almost as much love as Ubuntu...
And so it should, it's already shipping, the same can't be said for Ubuntu Touch, yet that doesn't seem to matter at all.

Dave999 2013-08-25 14:32
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
What about firefox. Do you ignore them. FF rocks. In fact, jolla device is closer to FF than a high tech device. Maybe jolla shouldn't try to build premium devices but rater say that the going for cheap tech. I would rather buy a 199 euro jolla device than 399 euro.

Fuzzillogic 2013-08-25 14:49
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Both FF and Tizen (read: Samsung) are a bit better known than a small Finnish company which as of yet released only a t-shirt, some pics and vids and an SDK.

It would have been nice tho if they named Jolla as an alternative for the Edge. The Edged shares more tech and concepts with Jolla (Qt, QML, full Linux with native apps) than with the primairly web-based FFOS and Tizen.

jalyst 2013-08-25 14:53
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369240)
What about firefox. Do you ignore them. FF rocks.
My post mentioned FFOS.

Quote:
In fact, jolla device is closer to FF than a high tech device.
Maybe jolla shouldn't try to build premium devices but rater say that the going for cheap tech.
I would rather buy a 199 euro jolla device than 399 euro.
ROFL...

Dave999 2013-08-25 14:54
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
True. Also, the edge was more of a mobile computer than Jolla. It's like the edge was more about n900 and jolla more like n9.

Mobile computer vs smartphone :D

jalyst 2013-08-25 14:57
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1369245)
The Edged shares more tech and concepts with Jolla (Qt, QML, full Linux with native apps) than with the primairly web-based FFOS and Tizen.
In some ways, Tizen is more akin to Sailfish though, Samsung's contributing quite heavily towards Wayland, as is Intel.
And native dev is fairly heavy emphasis, it's just not "front & center" like Sailfish/Ubuntu...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369247)
Also, the edge was more of a mobile computer than Jolla. It's like the edge was more about n900 and jolla more like n9. Mobile computer vs smartphone :D
You've no idea what you're talking about, you're funny though, funny in your "cluelessness"...
It's funny that you're so clueless that you don't even understand that the Edge was never meant to be a mass-market device, it had a fixed ceiling.
Canonical is in a very similar position to Jolla, it's hw partners absolutely cannot afford to sell phones with equal specs to top-end Android phones, at similar prices.
The whole point of a limited edition phone like the Edge....
Was to give Canonical some more bargaining power in that game, so that it's real Ubuntu phones can move closer to Android phones when it comes to the specs/$ ratio.
That's why I don't think this is the last we'll hear about the Edge (or something similar) from Canonical.
Either they'll have another run at crowdfunding (but probably not with a fixed donation model), or Mark will simply stump up the cash.
It remains to be seen whether it'll have the effect Mark hopes for, even if it doesn't another possible +ve is drawing more attention to it's normal Ubuntu phones.
And even if they don't have another run, it's been a one big advertisement for Mark, something that can't hurt when it comes to negotiating with relevant parties.

Dave999 2013-08-25 15:36
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1369248)
In some ways, Tizen is more akin to Sailfish though, Samsung's contributing quite heavily towards Wayland, as is Intel.
And native dev is fairly heavy emphasis, it's just not "front & center" like Sailfish/Ubuntu...



You've no idea what you're talking about, you're funny though, funny in your cluelessness...
Why not explain it then when you going on a attack like that? Or are you too noob to back up your words?

jalyst 2013-08-25 15:53
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369263)
Why not explain it then when you going on a attack like that? Or are you too noob to back up your words?
Look above....

I attack you because you constantly maintain silly ideas that should've been jettisoned long ago, as their poor logic has been pointed out countless times.
I can only assume you do so because of poor reading comprehension, intellect, or because you simply like a good troll session, take your pick.

shmerl 2013-08-25 16:04
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
The Edge was a pure marketing PR stunt. It was never anything real. Jolla has a real device. So don't be surprised that media cares about some empty bubble PR because Canonical made an insane crowdfunding goal knowing it will never succeed but will attract the interest, but it doesn't care to pay attention to actual practical projects because Jolla doesn't scream about it on every corner.

Dave999 2013-08-25 16:04
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Jalyst, Let me explain it again so you might understand. So the main thing with edge was to make it a pocket able computer so you could make it a computer. I'm pretty sure edge wouldn't be the best smartphone but with other cool capabilities. Jolla will be much more of a smartphone with a clean smartphone OS and capabilities.

You still don't back up your words. Just useless words again. Clueless!

Ofc it was part of the marketing but...
1.if enough people had bought it, they would have to deliver and that would have pushed the device spec fast.
2.if jolla have something real. Let's think what the could do with a campaign. Why don't launch some smart marketing campaign?

jalyst 2013-08-25 16:23
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369270)
Jalyst, Let me explain it again so you might understand. So the main thing with edge was to make it a pocket able computer so you could make it a computer. I'm pretty sure edge wouldn't be the best smartphone but with other cool capabilities. You still don't back up your words. Just useless words again. Clueless!
It's you who don't get it....
Canonical themselves explained clearly from the outset that it was a concept series, the real drive was to come with their range of Ubuntu phones through hw partners.
They are a sw/services vendor, get that through your head...
Now that range of Ubuntu phones will have similar "docking" abilities*, but comparatively speaking they would've been far more hobbled for that purpose.
Especially with the first version of Ubuntu Touch coming Q1, which will still be based strictly around X/Xmir.

*& that's even putting aside solid arguments out there that such convergence devices are simply "flavor of the mth", & little more than gimmicks, at least for the foreseeable future

Dave999 2013-08-25 16:28
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1369273)
It's you who don't get it, Canonical themselves explained clearly from the outset that it was no more than a concept series, the real drive was to come with their range of Ubuntu phones through hw partners.
They are a sw/services vendor, get that through your head...
Now that range of Ubuntu phones was/is to have similar "docking" abilities, but comparatively speaking they were to be far more hobbled for that purpose.
(and that's even putting aside some of the solid arguments out there that such convergence devices are simply "flavor of the mth", & little more than gimmicks LT)
Especially with the 1st version of Ubuntu Touch coming Q1, which will still be based strictly around X/Xmir.
Yes, it was a vision like lots of cool tech on Indiegogo and kickstarter. Still, if they got enough money they would have deliver a cool device. Sure, Ubuntu don't go down with this device, it was great PR. Still, the idea of a pocket able computer will come sooner or later, just not in the form of the Edge unfortunately.

So far you haven't said anything that I didn't know so still don't understand what you mean with clueless . feel free to explain. You should probably get down from you high horse and don't assume the you are the only one that knows what you are talking about :D it isn't pretty.

jalyst 2013-08-25 16:54
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369270)
1.if enough people had bought it, they would have to deliver and that would have pushed the device spec fast.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369275)
Yes, it was a vision like lots of cool tech on Indiegogo and kickstarter. Still, if they got enough money they would have deliver a cool device.
Yep, as I feared you still don't get it, can someone else please have a go at explaining it to Dave, I'm done.

Dave999 2013-08-25 17:15
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1369280)
Yep, as I feared you still don't get it, can someone else please have a go at explaining it to Dave, I'm done.
Fine, maybe you learned something from this. Don't call people clueless unless you can explain what you mean in a simple way.

Ok. Back to jolla.

Thoke 2013-08-26 07:44
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Ok, I'll bite.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369270)
Ofc it was part of the marketing but...
1.if enough people had bought it, they would have to deliver and that would have pushed the device spec fast.
2.if jolla have something real. Let's think what the could do with a campaign. Why don't launch some smart marketing campaign?
Problem with #1 is that their idea was just a concept, they've no idea what problems they might face building the device. I know this, back in spring I backed a technology project in kickstarter, a cool device, just like Ubuntu Edge. Now, this month they said that the original design was impossible to achieve due to necessary hardware upgrades needed to fulfill the main objective of the device. The new design was HORRIBLE, and they've received a lot of comments from angry backers (including me) since then.
(Also, fun fact: in their campaign they've said they had everything ready, that they'd just need to order the parts and compile the device. Turned out to be not the case...)

Also, developing a real device from just a concept takes time and money, and even MORE time and money if aforementioned problems occur.

That's what can go wrong with CONCEPTS.

#2 I think you're confusing their announcement-mindset with their intention to release the device.

You say: they don't market the device = they don't intend to release the device, but I think it's more like: they make announcements when they know for absolute certainty that their announcement won't be false. No promises = no deception, and I respect that a lot. They can't have a kicstarter/indiegogo campaign because then they would have to make promises without absolute certainty they'll be fulfilled.

And this has a lot do with #1 too, when you promise something, you'd be better to deliver or your reputation will be hit big time. Making promises to deliver a CONCEPT phone might take unimaginable amounts of money (and time) if problems (look #1) occur. Jolla hasn't too much of $$ so better not sell promises, right?

I think Jolla phone is past the concept-only stage as its OS SDK and partial phone specs have already been released. But not yet 100% real though... But at least over 50% real if you ask me :p

Also, other than kickstarter/indiegogo campaigns, marketing isn't cheap.

Dave999 2013-08-26 09:39
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1369420)
Ok, I'll bite.



Problem with #1 is that their idea was just a concept, they've no idea what problems they might face building the device. I know this, back in spring I backed a technology project in kickstarter, a cool device, just like Ubuntu Edge. Now, this month they said that the original design was impossible to achieve due to necessary hardware upgrades needed to fulfill the main objective of the device. The new design was HORRIBLE, and they've received a lot of comments from angry backers (including me) since then.
(Also, fun fact: in their campaign they've said they had everything ready, that they'd just need to order the parts and compile the device. Turned out to be not the case...)

Also, developing a real device from just a concept takes time and money, and even MORE time and money if aforementioned problems occur.

That's what can go wrong with CONCEPTS.

#2 I think you're confusing their announcement-mindset with their intention to release the device.

You say: they don't market the device = they don't intend to release the device, but I think it's more like: they make announcements when they know for absolute certainty that their announcement won't be false. No promises = no deception, and I respect that a lot. They can't have a kicstarter/indiegogo campaign because then they would have to make promises without absolute certainty they'll be fulfilled.

And this has a lot do with #1 too, when you promise something, you'd be better to deliver or your reputation will be hit big time. Making promises to deliver a CONCEPT phone might take unimaginable amounts of money (and time) if problems (look #1) occur. Jolla hasn't too much of $$ so better not sell promises, right?

I think Jolla phone is past the concept-only stage as its OS SDK and partial phone specs have already been released. But not yet 100% real though... But at least over 50% real if you ask me :p

Also, other than kickstarter/indiegogo campaigns, marketing isn't cheap.
Agree with you on first statement. It wouldn't be easy for Canonical to deliver.. But as a backer, you could always cancel your Ubuntu edge if you was unhappy with something.(at release, not during campaign)

Related to jolla. You can do lots of stuff to be seen and heard without spec or finalized product, just look at Canonical. I don't want or expect jolla do make promises they can't deliver but sou can do so much to boost the brand and recognition. It won't cost you much, post stories, video blogs, do interviews, start some kind of countdown, post a post one every month on a few selected forum to show intresset in you customers, Web pages/updates that makes blog to write about it... Lot of stuff can be done almost for free. It's a one man mission.

Let hope jolla doing well in the end.

Thoke 2013-08-26 14:56
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1369444)
Agree with you on first statement. It wouldn't be easy for Canonical to deliver.. But as a backer, you could always cancel your Ubuntu edge if you was unhappy with something.(at release, not during campaign)
Oh, I didn't know that. At least in kickstarter you usually don't get a refund before (or after) delivery.

Quote:
Related to jolla. You can do lots of stuff to be seen and heard without spec or finalized product, just look at Canonical. I don't want or expect jolla do make promises they can't deliver but sou can do so much to boost the brand and recognition. It won't cost you much, post stories, video blogs, do interviews, start some kind of countdown, post a post one every month on a few selected forum to show intresset in you customers, Web pages/updates that makes blog to write about it... Lot of stuff can be done almost for free. It's a one man mission.

Let hope jolla doing well in the end.
Yes, true, but here comes one more problem again: If they'll reveal too much and haven't patented all the tech, it'll get ripped. Well... No-one can protect their UX (Apple and Android will surely copy every innovative UI feature), but everything else can be.

But apart hardware development blogs, they have been active in social media, but I take it you think they should do something else for a change? Like Mark Shuttleworth's Reddit AMA? Maybe, I can't disagree. A little something different for a change wouldn't hurt anyone :) (they did the t-shirt contest recently though, but I personally aren't into that kind of things)

Dave999 2013-08-26 15:51
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1369515)
Oh, I didn't know that. At least in kickstarter you usually don't get a refund before (or after) delivery.



Yes, true, but here comes one more problem again: If they'll reveal too much and haven't patented all the tech, it'll get ripped. Well... No-one can protect their UX (Apple and Android will surely copy every innovative UI feature), but everything else can be.

But apart hardware development blogs, they have been active in social media, but I take it you think they should do something else for a change? Like Mark Shuttleworth's Reddit AMA? Maybe, I can't disagree. A little something different for a change wouldn't hurt anyone :) (they did the t-shirt contest recently though, but I personally aren't into that kind of things)
Well, it doesn't matter now. No Edge and I'm refunded as well.

REddit is one cool way, but there is so much more they can do. They sky is the limit. But again, its their product, their choices and no one can blame them. Just disagree with some of their choices :D

The t-shirt competition was great. I don't care for that as well, but it's simple stuff like that they have to do to reach even further. It can't cost them that much, maybe a few brain cells during the workshop for ideas ;)

since they are a small company without money, why not contact university and get a few smart students to create a few campaigns? simple...

willi6868 2013-08-28 09:25
Jolla released some nice system sounds :)

http://www.jollausers.com/2013/08/jollaringtone2/

Thoke 2013-08-28 17:05
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
They have also changed the layout of their webpage.

Fuzzillogic 2013-08-28 19:38
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by willi6868 (Post 1370003)
Jolla released some nice system sounds :)

http://www.jollausers.com/2013/08/jollaringtone2/
Most are too musicy for my taste. I like my notifications (and being called is also a notification) to be notifications, not some overly long overly elaborated composition. I want a ringtone, not a ringsong.

I think Nokia got it quite right on the N9, for most part. Sure the default Nokia ringtone is the first thing to be changed, but the "Blip" ringtone is just right. Very audible without being too intrusive. (Yeah, and occasionally a whistling bird outside makes me glance at the standby-screen :D)

Also, those default touch and gui-tones should be OFF by default. Whoever actually wants to hear those tones is a sociopath.

I'm sure there will be many tones to choose from, but I hope there will be nicer ones than those released now.

soryuuha 2013-08-29 04:29
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
looks like jolla removed chinese page.

Thoke 2013-08-29 08:50
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by soryuuha (Post 1370293)
looks like jolla removed chinese page.
What? I still see the links to their weibo and t.qq channels. Or did you mean something else?

soryuuha 2013-08-29 09:06
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1370334)
What? I still see the links to their weibo and t.qq channels. Or did you mean something else?
http://www.jolla.com/
previously at top right, you can choose english or chinese.

now fin or english only

Morpog 2013-09-03 18:32
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
First real life picture of second prototype:

http://abload.de/img/btqalmtcyaak3ig.jpglai8upm.jpg

Dave999 2013-09-03 19:09
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
How do we know its the new one?

camera lens?

bill_klpd 2013-09-03 19:23
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpog (Post 1371759)
First real life picture of second prototype:

http://abload.de/img/btqalmtcyaak3ig.jpglai8upm.jpg
I didn't know anything about jolla and sailfish until yesterday! After seeing some videos, I can say that I really want this phone :D
Unfortunately I don't think that I 've got the money right now.... :(

Morpog 2013-09-03 19:53
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1371777)
How do we know its the new one?

camera lens?
centered camera

mikecomputing 2013-09-03 19:56
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill_klpd (Post 1371782)
I didn't know anything about jolla and sailfish until yesterday! After seeing some videos, I can say that I really want this phone :D
Unfortunately I don't think that I 've got the money right now.... :(
this is exacly why Jolla need more marketing power...

...and thats why I make people pissed on the swedish mobile news sites especially today cause of the Nokia news. Every news about MicroNokia I have posted a link to http://join.jolla.com :cool:

Artyom 2013-09-03 19:59
Nice. :D

-via Maemo Talk app

Morpog 2013-09-05 16:56
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpog (Post 1371759)
First real life picture of second prototype, featuring Jolla employe Carol Chen.

http://abload.de/img/btqalmtcyaak3ig.jpglai8upm.jpg
....and another new real life pic. This time with Jolla CTO Marc Dillon.

http://abload.de/img/btawli3cyaevjya.jpgla03uv6.jpg

minimos 2013-09-05 17:03
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
From @JollaHQ tweet:
Quote:
Wanna see a "next build of Jolla" demo? Check out @SmartDevCon, registration ending soon! http://smartdevcon.eu/

Thoke 2013-09-05 17:09
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
I think the start of the second pre-booking campaign is nearing... Smartdevcon is held 12.-14.th of this month, meaning next week from thursday to saturday. I think either the campaign starts then or shortly after that.

shmerl 2013-09-08 07:06
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
By the way, Carol Chen can be found in Diaspora. So for those who don't use Twitter, G+ and other closed networks, it's a good point of contact.

https://diasp.eu/u/cybette

Thoke 2013-09-08 17:37
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Some small pieces of info:

Jolla will reveal the delivery date of the pre-booked devices "later in autumn".

Jolla isn't aiming for high production volumes right from the start, instead they are planning to increase it gradually.

Source: http://www.digitoday.fi/mobiili/2013...a/201311544/66

It's in Finnish, so you non-finnish folk just have to trust my word ;)

PS: Google Translate usually sucks, especially when it comes to translating to or from Finnish.

PPS: Jolla is translated to 'Which' in Google Translate :p

mikecomputing 2013-09-08 22:44
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1372932)
Some small pieces of info:

Jolla will reveal the delivery date of the pre-booked devices "later in autumn".

Jolla isn't aiming for high production volumes right from the start, instead they are planning to increase it gradually.

Source: http://www.digitoday.fi/mobiili/2013...a/201311544/66

It's in Finnish, so you non-finnish folk just have to trust my word ;)

PS: Google Translate usually sucks, especially when it comes to translating to or from Finnish.

PPS: Jolla is translated to 'Which' in Google Translate :p
WTF? Hasn't NSA learnt google howto translate finish language got damn... :eek:

mikecomputing 2013-09-08 22:47
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shmerl (Post 1372823)
By the way, Carol Chen can be found in Diaspora. So for those who don't use Twitter, G+ and other closed networks, it's a good point of contact.

https://diasp.eu/u/cybette
not to be offtopic but I hope jolla will have some kind of diaspora client even if the damn diaspora API is far from ready.

shmerl 2013-09-09 01:11
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikecomputing (Post 1373003)
not to be offtopic but I hope jolla will have some kind of diaspora client even if the damn diaspora API is far from ready.
That's tricky, since Diaspora is in the process of major federation and API redesign. It prevented even Mozilla from integrating it into their social UI. Even though they write:

Quote:
A Diaspora user is surfing the Web and doesn't want to miss any new posts from his friends back at Diaspora. Firefox has a convenient sidebar where Diaspora sends news updates so he never misses his friends' updates.
Other than that, I wish Sailfish would have such client integrated. I'm tired of seeing all those omnipresent Twitter/FB which I don't use anyway.

jalyst 2013-09-09 05:37
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoke (Post 1372932)
It's in Finnish, so you non-finnish folk just have to trust my word ;)

PS: Google Translate usually sucks, especially when it comes to translating to or from Finnish.
PPS: Jolla is translated to 'Which' in Google Translate :p
Again with messaging "1st & foremost" to Finland, **** the rest of the world... >.>

They're mad if they don't focus their support on FB/Twitter etc, having said that, I do still hope there's also strong nascent support for Diaspora/Others.
If they make that support as open as possible, the community can provide much of the ongoing dev/support, & they can focus on the necessary evils.

Morpog 2013-09-14 10:31
Re: #JollaLoveDay - 20th May - device announcement
 
veskuh just confirmed in his keynote on smartdevconČ that the Jolla is using libhybris to utilize android drivers. So no native GPU drivers.


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