Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I cant afford IT right now. What to do sell a kidney?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

The price is a little higher than I expected, but I'd still buy it nonetheless :) #physicalkeyboardftw

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Can I have one without wooden back?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

possible answers:

- yes
- no
- maybe
- not yet
- why?!

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

To go back to quality again ... I really don't think many people want a keyboard (for general use as opposed to dev work) for the sake of having a keyboard, or if they do they'll be disappointed if they go back to one that isn't great.

Though having said this, legibility of the Jolla's screen in daylight is so poor, having ANY keyboard would be great for text entry when not dark / indoors.

Personally, I still dream about the awesome keyboard in the Nokia E71 (though obviously of a different type and layout).

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Could you also give percentages about response options?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I was also pondering this, out of curiosity. I might take one without lastucase if it lowered the total price :D (or might not, that wooden skin doesn't look bad...)

PS: Great job on keeping us updated. Even though I personally won't order before first reviews hit the web I nevertheless appreciate your efforts on this. This is a must have TOH if it's done right! So far so good! :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

The why is obvious. The wooden back makes the keyboard a "look at me I'm beautiful"-OH, just like shiny golden iPhones. The phone will already by thick enough to be noticed by many people, I don't want to attract their remarks and questions more than that. I don't want a luxury phone, just a useful and discrete one with as much open source and Linux chunks as possible inside. :)

There will be two groups of customers of course, those who want a beautiful keyboard, and those who want a keyboard on a "don't look at me, I'm normal"-phone. Both are right, both are wrong!

Perhaps it will change the price too, but I don't know it yet so that's not the decisive part for me. And anyway, it's too early apparently, just answering to the "why?" and seconding that wood-less keyboards would be cool. :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I miss typing on a physical keyboard. Jolla's keyboard is pretty good for an onscreen keyboard, but it's just not the same. I don't do dev work (on the go) but general typing (WhatsApp, web browser, Twitter, etc.) is just so much better with a physical keyboard. I still keep my HP Pre 3 near. I don't use it anymore since I switched to Jolla, but sometimes I just look back at it and think about the happy times I had typing on that wonderful physical keyboard.
Landscape like TOH rev2 will be a bit different at first, I guess, but any physical keyboard with non-flat keys will be better than onscreen for sure.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Software question to Kimmo: is it reasonable to expect key combinations for some system-wide features, or is it impossible on the software side? I'm thinking about features like Ctrl+C/X/V with (hopefully) system-wide clipboard, Alt+Tab (or Ctrl+Backspace like on Maemo), and so on.

Those shortcuts are a huge part of the better typing experience with hardware keyboards compared to touch ones.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Any way to get this bundled with jolla the phone? Would be nice if jolla could subsidize part of the keyboard if you buy it together with a phone. Especially if you buying your second Jphone. (yeah, I'm always dreaming ;))

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

^Great idea...

Heck they still haven't delivered any decent TOH's themselves, so why not get behind supporting TOHKBD rev2 in a far more committed way.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

iirc copy cut paste works even now, others (change app etc) can be tricky and needs tinkering. - basically anything is possible that you can do generally software-wise. ctrl-alt-del can even reboot.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Would it be possible to have some kind of protection on the base part for the exposed keyboard connector(s), so when using the phone without kbd part they are not too.. exposed?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

that will not be an issue

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

There is also one practical reason for NOT having a lastucase back on the device.
I have never held one in my hand, so I cannot vouch for this, but one owner of such a thing warned me against Lastucase; I was told that it feels oily/filthy and it smells really bad.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

the one i have here feels, looks and smells fine.

to make things easier: the wood piece will be on the back. i will not be delivering half a product. if you want to rip it of and replace it with something else, be my guest.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

to further clarify, this will be the connectors on the phone side.

https://dl.dropbox.com/s/f5qh6bm0h7l...140923_002.jpg

https://dl.dropbox.com/s/nd3zaccwbj7...140923_003.jpg

two remarks:
- screws and connectors will be completely flush with surface
- that purple area will obviously be white in final product

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Shortcuts work already when you connect a bluetooth keyboard to the Jolla phone.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

What's the build quality on this keyboard compared to rev1? Has it undergone extensive testing? I know a lot of the original rev1 devices were flaky enough.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

to quote myself:

Quote:

Originally Posted by dirkvl (Post 1424569) -Will it be usable for everyday use? Yes

rev1: proof-of-concept product with very limited life
rev2: consumer-ready product that will not be released untill it is reliable, polished and thoroughly tested

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Base PCB should be done, some test pieces are on the way.

https://644db4de3505c40a0444-327723b...2Y/large_i.png

also, ordered a shitload of these (in white)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Are the heads of the bolts/screws protruding from the surface?

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

yes, the pointy side of the screw will extend 5mm on the outside.


..


or scroll back 1 page (wow, so much reading!) back to find this:

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I'd prefer to have a pointy-TOH. Is fine for autodefense. Maybe better add a complete swiss knife XD XD XD

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

That's why I asked...thanks for the heads up :)
So making it flush is still in the pipeline. Clear.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I already have that feature.. it's called: my fists ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

And then you accidentally forget to close the knife part and put the phone back in your pocket...:(

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

it is called filling my thread with offtopic posts. ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I was replying to his autodefense 'pointy-TOH' and 'swiss knife'. and my auto defense is my fists, so that TOH shouldn't be necessary.

so, off topic? no.. not at all ;)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Some update here;

in the process of making/designing a few complete protos with all components. these will have 3d printed keypad (draw symbols with sharpy) and all other components in place. hopefully in a few weeks these will be done.

--

keypad production seems harder than it is... for an acceptable quality keypad, the tooling costs are extremely high. would need to make few million to get the price per piece down.

alternatives:
1. quit
2. go for silicone keypad slab (like the one in rev1)
3. go for 3d printed keypads (use sharpy to draw symbols)

--

i am running a bit low on 'dough', so that also slows down developments. if you feel the urge to support, order some awesome stuff from my site. i will put it to good use!

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

1. hope not
2. I don't think that's what people wanted
3. I think you might lose your mind, etching by hand, and it might not look great

I assume the cost would push it above the €120 mark previously mentioned?

Why not set up an indiegogo? Not for the finished product, but to finish production, and people pledging a certain amount get a % discount on the final product? If this was less than successful, it would probably be an indicator that proceeding with the project would likely result in losses due to poor sales / lack of interest.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

How much of a donation would you need to speed things up? I'd be happy to donate a whole lot of money to you :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Nooo not the end! :(

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

it would mean you would get a blank keyboard (white) and everyone draws own symbols. if i would go for this option, then all parts are accounted for and pre-orders can open. but my mind cringes from the idea of doing it this way.

Going for professional keypad, yes. Probably an order of magnitude higher. ;)

Maybe, but those guys also take a few percent and I don't like the idea if doing this before the design is complete and I am confident about the production of all parts.

I don't know. The thing is that i *think* that when I open pre-orders, there will be enough demand for me to be able to start ordering all parts etc. But again, all parts must be accounted for in terms of production, otherwise it is complete BS to start buying expensive stuff.

Unless of course you have enough to spare to put an engineering team together to produce a Nokia/BB quality level product.


--


This is a very weird stage of development to be in.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Whilst I guess it's not a very likely outcome, maybe you could speak to Jolla about them licensing your basic design and they could take care of production. It would remove your financial constraints and allow for a high quality KB (hopefully), allow for much easier localisation and perhaps importantly for them, offer a convenient way to save face from the disaster that TOH has been so far.

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

I wouldn't say it's a disaster. In fact, it opened up all sorts of talents within the community. Aside from Dirk's funky colors, we've had a TOHLED, SolarJolla and Shapeways crazy stuff so far. I really like the community spirit that went into these TOH's :)

@Dirk: Well, I could help cover (part of) your costs that are needed to get things rolling if it saves me a spot on the pre-order list (because I really want TOHKBD rev2 and don't wanna miss out on it!) :) Let me know, maybe we can work out something :)

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Hi, dirkvl.

can you use the same material as N900's keyboard?

and, please don't quit, you have come so far on this project. I really in need of physical keyboard for my Jolla

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

Yes! (:

Re: TOHKBD rev2
 

At least this way it would be easy to get a QWERTZ / AZERTY / DVORAK / Whatever sort of weird keyboard, as long as you can set up the keyboard layout in software.


Only problem - if I start painting the letters on my keyboard myself, it will look very unique, but NOT very professional...