Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Maltron, coleman or dvorak-p. But please NO QWERTY!! (it should die long ago)

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Argh....
Maltron?
I'd rather take Voltron...

I created my own variant of a splicing of JCUKEN (uses the cyrillic alpha) and old school Prussian....
I call PUKEn
hahaahahaha

seriously though...
and I know that seriousness and endsormeans always go hand in hand ....
but..
actually I think that really really REALLY ...someone should start adopting layouts that are sane...
Not pandering to one or another group that are fixated on perpetual layouts that are ALL damaging to the body...

I would make a suggestion ...
(since I know full well that it amounts to that...perhaps less...considering people get just as fixated on layouts and get just as entrenched in their particular cubbyhole of comfort-level ...regardless the physik damage they are doing to themselves...)
I would suggest someone...
ANYONE finally start adopting a health conscious option like Carpalx

edit:
Let me be a bit more direct in an example...
I have for most of my life since a kid now...
under my grandpa's tutelage ...
a carver, painter, harp, violin (and other sundry instruments) maker...
5 things he always cautioned me
- Eyes
- Ears
- Hands
- Mobility
- Back

overall health in general...
One could say..
but he stressed ..the need to care for the bits one tends to over abuse ..over use...and forget about...just pushing them to perform...

.a layout that is gentler on the hands ..
for me...
It means the lifespan of my hands to continue using them ...
extends years longer ...
I know artisans far younger than me who have destroyed their hands due to poor choices of their care....

Don't know about anybody else...
but a choice of aiding in deliberately crippling up my hands years in advance ...due to something easily changed ...
has never been and will never be on my agenda ..
My whole life I have been careful with making sure that I treat my body properly,



naturally ...
7 hours and counting and zero comment from anyone ...
for an approach that is a sane health based alternative...

forget even for the time being ...
such application to this qwerty project....
Carpalx is something anyone using x11 could simply download and use..
to save one's hands...



I am not at all surprised ...that there appears to be a number of closet masochists here I was unaware of...
who must be determinedly in love with their entrenched ideology that is actually physically damaging to the hands...

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

You mean, there are too many layouts?

https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/standards.png

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

hahahaahahaha
ah gawd
pichlo...
you made me laugh...

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

endsormeans is the new Dave999

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I don't know, why so many here complaining and speculating about this and that. Who cares? Chen has told, that he is planning to build a qwerty-device without crowd funding probably capable of running SailfishOS. That's it.

If Chen succeeds, it's fine and I will probably will buy one or two devices (depending on the OS that is running on it in a as daily driver usable way). If not, I have nothing lost.

Chen is cheating you? How? If he keeps to his promise, that it is not a crowdfunded product, he hardly can. If there will no product at all, what have you lost (besides your hopes)?

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Noone is complaining and Chen is not cheating us as far as i can see. Speculation? Yes, sir. I’m doing that. I’m guilty of speculation. It might be a crime in some counties. But not here. No.

So I’m just here for the circus while waiting chenPhone. That’s the official name, right?

However, I am afraid that Chen is betting againt the market though. Hopefully he got it covered.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=Dave999;1546725]Noone is complaining...:eek:
That is realy a great joke
All i can see is people complaining about an amazing project that someone is trying to bring to us
Even if it goes wrong he (Chen) has done much more than anyone else ;)

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=deutch1976;1546727]Where?

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=Dave999;1546728]To many posts to paste here :D

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=deutch1976;1546729]Complaining and speculation is not always same thing.

Imagine there's no qwerty
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no chenPhone too
Imagine all the people living life in peace,
You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope some day you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=Dave999;1546730]If in the end there is nothing, at least Chen tried ;)

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=deutch1976;1546731]Probably . I’m not sure what he is doing so I can’t really tell.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=Dave999;1546732]He is trying to revive an old dream from many of us :rolleyes:

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I'm not sure what you mean here. We know exactly what he is doing from this very thread: he is working to deliver a hwkb handheld device designed by his company, and has already said here that they are currently is in the prototype building stage and are not counting on crowdfundnig.

Of course there are many details we don't know yet, for instance the final specs are unknown, and we are all curious about them and very much looking forward to seeing what the final product will look like, but none of those details are necessary to know what Chen is doing.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

[QUOTE=Dave999;1546728]Well you are right, if I were Chen, I wouldn't see this post as a complaint but as an rude insult.

If that wasn't your intention, what are you trying to say with this post? It's just senseless ranting, and you even were aware of it.

Are you hoping to get more information on this basis? Believe me, quite the opposite will happen - And for good reasons.

Maybe the next time you consider, to think before you write.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

criminy!
there is no way I could to aspire to such heights...(or is it depths?) as the illustrious Dave999
There is only one Dave999

Although...
I am waiting for his alter ego to show up at the forum..
His nemesis ...
then...it should get interesting...
Guy will be pretty obvious...
Bet his username will be something like 666Evad..


wow Fellfrosch...
well...you DO realize it is Dave you are referring to right?
Dave still has some unresolved Jolla-angst he needs to work out..
Let him vent...
I believe that his "rant" wasn't quite a full-blown Dave rant...
It was more on the "two-sock-puppets-arguing-with-each-other" dialogue ...in a humorous way...kind of venting..
Not really ranting...
(even though Dave himself mentions ranting...)
when Dave is full-blown upset...
and just making his point come across...
there is no humor.
In this case specific, I don't think any should feel offended or upset with Dave's words. I would consider it a humorous interlude in thread conversation.
When he involves no humor in his post at all.
Then most certainly he is serious-serious.

Most definitely Dave is suffering from the embarrassing affliction known as "Project Itch" ..
contracted by intimate contact...most likely with Jolla...
the problem with "Project Itch" as bad as Dave's ...
Is that even the slightest contact with a potentially successful project can cause sudden unexpected flare-ups...
and the potential for spontaneous combustion..

I suggest Gold Bond Friction Defense...

https://www.sheswanderful.com/wp-con...ng-480x480.jpg

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I'm sure Dave999 is not the only one needing that :D

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

You might. I don’t. I don’t really care of specs, design and what not at all atm. All that is completely irrelevant to me currently. Do we even have a project? How is he planning to bring this to the market? Do he have it worked out or do he plan to prototype this and after that looking for support?

I’m not saying chen shall disclose it. But that is something that is more important than technical issues and specs so what’s you thought about that?

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

some fair questions...

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Man, stop trying to be me :D

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Well if you ask me:
It's up to him, if he want to share those details or not. He doesn't owe me ANY information, even though I'm looking forward to any Information he gives.

But reading your posts, it seems, his biggest mistake was, that he shared his plans in this forum at all.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

It could be. Depends on your position. I’m not talking about chen. Since it’s no crowdfund he has absolutely no obligation to to share more than he wants.

I’m talking about your views. You think it’s better do develop this in secret without sharing anything?

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

OK now I just have to nitpick...
There are numerous people here who have released both nice SW and HW, so I'd like you to be a bit more specific.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I don't need to be more specific than this ;)

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

You are right that we do not have this information, but your message was suggesting that the statement that Chen "is trying" could be questioned. I don't think we need to look into the books of the company or their development and marketing strategies to tell whether or not they are trying to reach the goal, that is all.

Chen is regularly telling that this task has not been abandoned and that progress is currently being done, he initially polled the community in this thread to check the demand, came up with hardware ideas and shared mock-ups of the theoretical device. Now, he stated that the prototyping stage has started, and he has confirmed/altered some of the initial specs in his later messages. If that is not a project, then I don't know when a project can claim being a project.

One can of course doubt the very premise that Chen is telling the truth, but since he is a famous 10-year member of our community, who on top of that has succeeded producing his previous keyboard mod, the least we could do is to spare him skepticism about his honesty. Especially as he is not even asking money to develop the product he wants to show us. Chen doesn't need anyone to defend himself, but come on, our fragile community should be more welcoming when someone is willing to invest time, sweat and capital into something we want. I would not find a great motivation into doing so if that kind of ambition is rewarded with skepticism and ranting from the community itself.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Chen has been a busy guy...
And has done some good stuff...
But I beg to differ on the whole "more than anyone" line...
There are a good number of guys long gone who have done quite a bit...
And it will take years and years and years more for Chen to stack up the accolades to go toe to toe with their accomplishments ...

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Yes, and we are here supporting him. What is the issue? Waiting for information whenever it’s available. Could it be that you have misread the thread? To me atleast it’s obvious that all are hoping that chen will succeed.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Now you are just being facetious. Like a teenager who has been told off for leaving dirty bits on washed dishes and exclaiming, "alright then, next time I won't wash anything!"

I, personally, agree that Chen is under no obligation but he certainly is not managing expectations very well. "I am doing something and it will be absolutely fantastic" is a very bad way of handling it, simply because if whatever comes out at the end is even a smidgen below someone's idea of "absolutely fantastic", he will get the flak for failing to deliver on promises.

There are only two ways of handling it properly. Either keep quiet and surprise everyone with a ready product or keep the development absolutely open. Black or white. Gray is an invitation to speculations. I hasten to add that speculations are not Chen's fault but if there is something he can do to prevent them, then why not.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Not to stray into the realm of speculation...

But I know what is going on...

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Chen's statement is obvious....

"I am doing something and it will be absolutely fantastic"

There is no project ...
He has simply been kidnapped ...
and now...
Donald Trump is here impersonating him..

:eek:

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

you call me facetious because of something you just agree with, some lines later :eek:
...well than I'm happy to be facetious :p:D

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

You went from comparing (multiple times) Chen's project with yet another Jolla tablet drama, then irony on the impossible schedule and unfeasible goals, then a cynical and skeptical ranting (I got it that it was written to be funny, but your point was still clear), then suggesting that whether or not Chen is actually trying to deliver the product remains to be proven, then admitting that he doesn't have to disclose what is deemed NDA or sensible before there is a prototype to show, and now you are claiming that we are all clearly supporting him. Altogether, those posts are very hard to reconcile and I'm sure I'm not the only one to be a bit surprised by this vision of support.

Also, a search on "Chenliangchen" in this thread quickly shows that he disclosed much more than just "I will deliver something absolutely fantastic. Close your eyes and have trust." Please try, and remember that this thread was just opened exactly one year ago. Chen has postponed his initial plans to work on the device as soon as last year because he decided to finish the Moto Mod first, probably to better allocate time and ressources, get better visibility in the media, and have a demonstrated proof record. Coincidentally, he went away from the initial crowdfunding plan and started prototyping the device without our money. Causal relationship? Absolutely no clue, but at least the change of plan did not compromise the project. Therefore, we are most likely just a few months into development, yet he shared more about his intentions and the final product he is aiming for than with any other non-crowdfunded project. Actually, I'm not even sure all crowdfunding campaigns disclose this much information at such an early stage: they usually have prototypes and images to show before they try to raise funds from the public, but remain silent until that point, meaning the backers know about a project months or years after it was started internally.

In the end, maybe there are only two ways to properly manage expectations (I personally am not convinced it has to be that binary but that is just one opinion and it is not the point), but I find it pretty harsh to call this project closed and secret. The only major interrogation from a user's perspective is the OS, but it's reasonable to assume that compatibility and/or partnerships remain to be confirmed when a first functional prototype is built and the possible user base can be assessed. How Livermorium plan to secure production and finally hit the market is up to them (I suppose they will need to check anyhow what the demand is the beyond niche-TMO to see if it is reasonable to commit to producing thousands of units), and it is our right to have concerns because we hope the device ends up in our hands, but how many companies share their economic strategy to the public and to competitors?

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I’m not dancing around the projects like a fanboy. I’m more like a tornado that twisting around the project I support. That is how I role. Nothing new.

That doesn’t mean I don’t care for success for qwerty slider and chen.

How do you think we best support the project right here, right now with the info we got?

I think it’s a great idea to keep this thread bizzy until chen arrives.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I think Chen is doing the smart thing.
given the nightmare of how things turn out here...

rather than incremental updates for everyone to pick over.

Showing and making available a product ...
after it is done..
makes sense.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

Yeah. If it’s done. No need to drop something half baked here unless he wants to make some new potential customers, advice or just hangout.

But most of the time it usually ends up with different feature request :)

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I wouldn't worry about people being rude too much, Chen has been here long enough to know how to use the ignore list... I doubt he even saw the post.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

I’m not sure what post you are talking about. But if you consider any of my post rude you are right. He use ignore list and seems to be happy with that so that is excellent.

Now we just have to wait for some kind of release date or announcement of some info. Will see what happens next.

Re: The new QWERTY device project
 

... oh how refreshing to read through 3 pages of posts where 2 frogs and an endsor speculates about speculation... ;-)

Re: The new QWERTY device project