Thank God you didn't ask for Obama's quality, otherwise you'd be executed at where you live while he'd be looking at your panic face on a big screen remotely.
You can go shooting people around before having Nobel prize first. It is not a proper thing to do.
I wonder how much it would cost Nokia to buy the (C) for all the code they are probably simply not disclosing because it had been done by subcontractors. Then OTOH evidently things like MCE were NO PROBLEM TO DISCLOSE for meego, just they decided to disclose a version that's incompatible with maemo's kernel, and also they left some plugins out. So PRETTY PLEASE explain to me why this was possible to disclose for meego, while maemo wasn't worth the effort?
On an irrelevant sidenote: I offered to sign a NDA and scan that ugly make-my-eyes-bleed code *for free* (modulo my own expenses) and to see what can be done with rewriting header files and general documentation so community could implement replacements without doing weird RE and disassembling, of course always getting review and allowance from $NOKIA for every bit I'd plan to contribute to community knowledge from that - reaction: you guessed it ... ...
Honestly this STINKS
@texrat: don't tell me you must not tell details about WHY Nokia allegedly can not disclose the sources. "It's too ugly" COME ON!!! Are you kidding? We're adults, most of us. And obscure statements about the world in general don't help either to make anybody feel more informed and agreeing on the case, whatever it might be.
To make it a bit more easy for you, *I* wil do it here and now, I'll say the word: PATENT INFRINGEMENT. Now you can either deny there's any such problem, and we're rid of at least one point you possibly aren't allowed to say, or you don't say anything at all and those looking for a new field to patent-troll have found their new target (honestly there's NO patent troll out there that would need anybody saying "Nokia might be afraid of patent trolls" to get the idea they actually were. Anyway now *I* did, so you can do as well and confirm, or you tell us better reasons)
I wonder how much it would cost Nokia to buy the (C) for all the code they are probably simply not disclosing because it had been done by subcontractors. Then OTOH evidently things like MCE were NO PROBLEM TO DISCLOSE for meego, just they decided to disclose a version that's incompatible with maemo's kernel, and also they left some plugins out. So PRETTY PLEASE explain to me why this was possible to disclose for meego, while maemo wasn't worth the effort?
On an irrelevant sidenote: I offered to sign a NDA and scan that ugly make-my-eyes-bleed code *for free* (modulo my own expenses) and to see what can be done with rewriting header files and general documentation so community could implement replacements without doing weird RE and disassembling, of course always getting review and allowance from $NOKIA for every bit I'd plan to contribute to community knowledge from that - reaction: you guessed it ... ...
I (personally) think that was doomed to fail, given that you were calling Nokia employees idiots left and right and behaving a bit erratically at the time. That does not inspire confidence to allow something like that to work.
Let's be realistic about what can work in reality and what cannot - we're dealing with real business here.
Let's be realistic about what can work in reality and what cannot - we're dealing with real business here.
This is sad to read as you are putting a definitive gap between Maemo and MeeGo, have you any idea how people would react if you actually helped in any way the cause for Maemo?.
This is for PR1.1. The figures hasn't really changed much in PR1.2, except that MCE (a later version), a ofono-based telephony stack for N900 modem, camera-firmware and some other things were open sourced. Some bits previously under strict licensing are now redistributable binaries for non-commercial purposes (BME, wifi/bt firmware, pulseaudio codecs/filters for 3GPP compliance, wifi calibration) and redistributable binaries in general (3d drivers).
There are probably some other examples but jetlag keeps me from remembering.
Brilliant, I'm embarrassed to say the domain name didn't click that you were behind that handy audit.
I only got my first N900 in mid 2010, and my second in late 2010, and only had the time to dev on it for the last few months, so kinda missed out on all the discussions pre-PR1.2.
That way it's clear what needs to be focussed on to improve matters. There's surprisingly little info about how the components fit together on the wiki, which makes figuring out component interactions more work than it needs to be.
Do I have your permission to duplicate that audit to the wiki? I don't have the nous currently to find out the historical licensing changes, but getting it up there would be a good start.
To make it a bit more easy for you, *I* wil do it here and now, I'll say the word: PATENT INFRINGEMENT. Now you can either deny there's any such problem, and we're rid of at least one point you possibly aren't allowed to say, or you don't say anything at all and those looking for a new field to patent-troll have found their new target (honestly there's NO patent troll out there that would need anybody saying "Nokia might be afraid of patent trolls" to get the idea they actually were. Anyway now *I* did, so you can do as well and confirm, or you tell us better reasons)
/j
Well, there are maybe other reasons for keeping it closed source...
1. competition
2. patent infringement
3. platform control
4. Pure Specilation: One that comes to my mind is close-sourcing of open-source code.
Has anybody consulted Richard Stallman and FSF people on this subject?
It may be interesting to inspect the compliance of GPL code within maemo versions, and see if Nokia broke any rules. Given the shear number of people working on the project there must be at least one GPL violation.
In past FSF was successful in enforcing the GPL license terms. It took some time, but nowdays I think it would go much smoother.
I (personally) think that was doomed to fail, given that you were calling Nokia employees idiots left and right and behaving a bit erratically at the time. That does not inspire confidence to allow something like that to work.
Let's be realistic about what can work in reality and what cannot - we're dealing with real business here.
Sorry, but I simply MUST NOT answer what I think would be appropriate
If somebody acts like an idiot I feel free to name that fact. If I think a system looks like it's been designed by fools on crack then I'm telling that, and I give links and evidence to my notion. And when we're talking about real business, OH REALLY?! Then how comes all this feels so childish ("source too ugly"), or maybe just like *real* business, the one where you get a kick in the back on leaving the cashier's desk. I'm totally realistic about what *could* have been done, and there's no need to trust any fool like me (who's been doing this crap for other companies, and there's been no issues with trust, neither with rather harsh words sometimes, when it's been about *things*, not *persons*), no - really no need for anybody like me or you, Nokia could have done the right thing from beginning, and they obviously still *can* do when meego aka you are asking them. They may **** in *my* garden, but I wonder how many customers will follow when somebody is going to ask for REPAIR of the things a normal phone should do, even when it's not written on the box ("you don't need a hammer to press the knobs of this phone" - haha you lose, dear customer, it's not a guaranteed feature of the device). In Europe we got 2 years warranty, you know? So I honestly suggest Nokia darn better does the right thing about maemo *now*, or they give some better rationale than "we don't support maemo anymore, you're supposed to buy a new meego device anyway, as we'll never going to make that maemo thing work like it should. Just wait another 2 years for it to come"
