So, what should a qwerty other half look like? - Page 3 - maemo.org

misterc | # 21 | 2013-06-06, 19:05 | Report

Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post

-
[...]
- How many different localizations of the hw qwerty would be needed only in Europe? Are there any 2 European languages that have the same kb layout?
I wonder if that could be one huge barrier for Jolla, that may make them rethink twice doing their own qwerty half, because I imagine the many localizations would be a bigger cost factor in production and maybe also require a larger effort to integrate software-wise than having just a (crappy f***in'-stupid old) vkb.
[...]

maybe the cost of manufacturing the other half hardware keyboard (not only QWERTIES...) would be the same as... it was to produce N900s with different localisations.
only, instead of having a component of the phone to localise, you have to localise that other half.
not likely to cost more

as to the software side...
no matter what OS you are using right now, very likely it has regional settings, including keyboard layouts.
N900 has it, N9 has it (even without hw kbd)

Originally Posted by pichlo View Post

[...]

That red "button" is in fact a nipple and is used for controlling the mouse cursor. Kinda like a tiny joystick. It was used on laptops before touchpads were invented.

the "pointing stick", originally called trackpoint by IBM it still available on most (if not all) Lenovo (who bought the Personal Computer division from IBM in 2005) laptops as well as a number of high end (usually CAx oriented) laptops (e.g. Dell Precision or HP Elite) or even not so high-end lappies like Toshiba's...

The Following User Says Thank You to misterc For This Useful Post:
Wikiwide

bennypr0fane | # 22 | 2013-06-06, 19:21 | Report

Originally Posted by nodevel View Post

To be more illustrative:
grab your N900 in portrait mode and imagine the screen is Jolla and the keyboard (the actual device) is the other half and you have the camera placed on the front part. With keyboard closed, there's no way you could take pictures.
Now open the keyboard - you would be able to take pictures if the camera was on the right side, but guess what... Jolla has it on the left.

Hmmm yes, I read you wrong there. I also see the problem now given that that camera is actually on the left, well observed by you.
Do you remember that bluetooth-keyboard available for the Iphone (and others) that is attached to it as a slide-out, and the community wanted to get the same thing fitted for the N9? This one has a hole in the back where the Iphone's camera is when in closed position, so it's possible to take a picture.
The hole in the keyboard is no problem when you slide it out, because it remains covered by the overlapping portion of the screen.

The same keyboard (or one with the same build), attached to the Jolla, would cover the camera when in closed position, but it could be fitted so as to have the hole over the cam when in opened position. That would be pretty awkward, needing to slide out the qwerty to use the cam.
Some more ways I can imagine it:
- To use the phone in landscape mode, it is tilted to the right (unlike any other phone out there, haha), the qwerty half working just like I described above with that Iphone kb with a hole in it, and everybody would hate having to adjust to doing things the other way round.
- Normal tilt-left-for-landscape:
The qwerty half is not as wide (or tall) as the Jolla, so it doesn't reach the left (or top) edge and won't cover the lens. That would make it a bit funny to hold, might have a lop-sided feeling to it, but the difference in width wouldn't need to be more than 2 cm I guess - maybe still in alignment with the actual edge of the screen, depending on width of bezel - as the lens seems very close to the left (or top) edge...
- Thinking more gimmicky, James-Bond-like, the leftmost column of keys functions as a lens cover. When you wanna use the cam, that leftmost column (or even only its lower part, just wide enough to uncover the lens and flash) can be pressed down (or to the right) to vanish into the rest of the qwerty (which is in closed position). That would be the gesture with which one usually opens a standard lens cover :-D
Sounds fun, doesn't it? Someone has to make a sketch of this...

The Following User Says Thank You to bennypr0fane For This Useful Post:
Wikiwide

kingstu | # 23 | 2013-06-06, 19:30 | Report

I get the feeling that if Jolla were to produce a qwerty keyboard it would be a portrait keyboard. The OS seems designed to be used in portrait mode and a landscape keyboard doesn't seem to go with their whole design. But if they did produce a landscape keyboard there would be no problem with them putting the camera on the right. The design we saw was just a prototype so if the bezel size, screen technology and SOC can change then there is no reason the camera placement cannot change also.

The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to kingstu For This Useful Post:
bennypr0fane, minimos, Wikiwide

misterc | # 24 | 2013-06-06, 19:31 | Report

Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post

[...]
- Normal tilt-left-for-landscape:
The qwerty half is not as wide (or tall) as the Jolla, so it doesn't reach the left (or top) edge and won't cover the lens. That would make it a bit funny to hold, might have a lop-sided feeling to it[...]

even if the keyboard part of the other half is not the whole height / width, it doesn't mean the other half can't be - and have a hole for lens & flash...
would simply require to place the flash and lens aligned to the long edge of the device...

The Following User Says Thank You to misterc For This Useful Post:
Wikiwide

nodevel | # 25 | 2013-06-06, 21:15 | Report

Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post

...
Some more ways I can imagine it:
...

Yeah, I thought of those (except for the Bond one, that sounds pretty cool

), but at the end I think the best solution would be if they placed the camera on the other side (sliding to right is unlikely - pun not intended

).

Here's a quick sketch how it could look like if they put the camera on the other side.

The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to nodevel For This Useful Post:
Ariadeno, bennypr0fane, MJ m, OVK, Rauha, Wikiwide

stickymick | # 26 | 2013-06-06, 21:16 | Report

This is partly the reason why HW/QWERTY is shied away from by all manufacturers now. You can't change the layout of a physical keyboard without remodeling the device to suit. Onscrean boards are just a "one size fits all" solution with a quick change in the settings you can go from QWERTY to AZERTY.

As for a "Other Half" keyboard I'd like to see a double slider like the N95 was. Slide down for the keyboard, slide up for media controls.

The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to stickymick For This Useful Post:
Amboss, bennypr0fane, Wikiwide

onethreealpha | # 27 | 2013-06-06, 21:53 | Report

Originally Posted by bennypr0fane View Post

...Jolla are big giant a***oles if they don't make a proper qwerty and I'll never forgive them if they don't. Every single fan page out there is stuffed with requests and questions about hardware qwerty! I'm sure like 80% of people who already know about Jolla and are interested want a qwerty, and they just go like "yeah, whatevs". Company that listens my a*s.

wonder if People at Jolla are sitting back thinking "all these punters demanding a h/w keybaord are just big giant ***oles if they don't appreciate the need to deliver a mainstream touchscreen candybar to establish commercial viability and market penetration and allow us an opportunity, as a business to grow and develop more devices... We will never forgive them if they don't forgive us the need to actually run a business"

there is no reason whatsoever a good quality, slim h/w other half couldn't be produced, either by Jolla or a 3rd party.

The Following User Says Thank You to onethreealpha For This Useful Post:
Wikiwide

DeeGee | # 28 | 2013-06-06, 23:58 | Report

Originally Posted by stickymick View Post

This is partly the reason why HW/QWERTY is shied away from by all manufacturers now. You can't change the layout of a physical keyboard without remodeling the device to suit. Onscrean boards are just a "one size fits all" solution with a quick change in the settings you can go from QWERTY to AZERTY.

As for a "Other Half" keyboard I'd like to see a double slider like the N95 was. Slide down for the keyboard, slide up for media controls.

If I remember correctly, N900 had the same hardware/number of keys and position of keys for all country variants, just the keymap was different and the "keys" (just one piece of plastic, that was easy to change) had different keys stencilled on it.
But yeah, there are quite a few issues with making a slider qwerty "other half". Camera position being one big problem. And aren't the power/volume keys also on the "wrong" side?

The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to DeeGee For This Useful Post:
nodevel, Wikiwide

onethreealpha | # 29 | 2013-06-07, 00:16 | Report

there you go.
10 mins on gimp (with two screaming toddlers yanking on my leg) and a cut and paste of the existing BT keyboard assy from the Minisuit case and board for the iphone5

The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to onethreealpha For This Useful Post:
Ariadeno, bill_klpd, Dave999, MJ m, nodevel, OVK, Rauha, Wikiwide, zlatko

Dave999 | # 30 | 2013-06-07, 14:35 | Report

http://www.droid-life.com/2013/06/06...eout-keyboard/

You can transfer Galaxy S4 to a keyboard device. This is what jolla trying to do. But like the Galaxy, Jolla's will be pretty bad too. I don't believe in extensions.

Would rather see a galaxay keyboard device or jolla keyboard device!

Last edited by Dave999; 2013-06-07 at 14:37.

The Following User Says Thank You to Dave999 For This Useful Post:
Wikiwide