pichlo | # 311 | 2015-01-30, 13:44 | Report

Yes, that's what I would have thought two months ago, before I looked into that. The short answer is, they can't.

Let's say there is a hypothetical construction company, Holla Construction Ltd. This company once said, "We are going to build a 32 story skyscraper." It may not be stated explicitly but it is implied that the scryscraper will comply to building regulations.

Now Holla Construction Ltd is saying, "The company providing the lifts has a monopoly. We are not going to support them so we are going to build the skyscraper without lifts. People wanting to reach the top floors can use the stairs."

Whilst technically they may have built a skyscraper, it does not comply with the regulations and the moment a building inspector sees it, he will ask them to fit the lifts or demolish the non-compliant building.

I'm out of this discussion.

rcolistete | # 312 | 2015-01-30, 13:59 | Report

Wow, so a company listened to the community voices in a crowdfunding project, implemented part of the features asked by the community, and now it is not a trusted company ? Let's remember :
I'm also very disappointed with part of this community, with repeated (non-adult) behaviour like this : "due to one minor feature that isn't exactly like I want, I don't trust Jolla anymore, I won't buy anything from Jolla, blablabla".

I read TMO since Nokia N810 days. I've seen many here complaining that Nokia haven't implemented all N810 features in N900 (screen size, keyboard with 4 rows, etc), saying they wouldn't buy N900. But the majority bought after seeing that N900 was not the perfect, but a good device for Linux users. Then the same behaviour about MeeGo Harmattan and Nokia N9. Many here opposed to have MeeGo Harmattan and Nokia N9 sections in TMO at all ! Some said they wouldn't buy N9 as it as just a consumer device, lacking many features of N900. But many bought after seeing that N9 was not the perfect, but a good touch smartphone for Linux users. With Sailfish and Jolla, again we have had many opossed to have discussions here in TMO, etc.

What is the lesson ? It is impossible to have a device, smartphone or tablet, with all great and minor features asked by all the community members. There is no perfect device, no perfect car, no perfect house, etc.

About Jolla Tablet : it's a crowdfunding project with changing features. It was and is stated since the start of project. It is just one tablet model, it can't satisfy all the wishes of this community.

If anybody here want a tablet with frozen specs and almost exactly features he/she wants, then search among the hundreds of iOS, Android, Windows, etc, tablets and get the one with closest specs ! It will be delivered in some days. But this tablet (with Android, iOS, Windows, etc) won't have Sailfish OS, the "unlike" feature of Jolla Tablet. It won't have features implemented by listening to the community, as Jolla already done since 11/2013. It won't have the Sailfish community.

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Last edited by rcolistete; 2015-01-30 at 14:43. Reason: Typo fixed

aegis | # 313 | 2015-01-30, 15:03 | Report

It's not that. The "Jolla community" have voted for NOT HAVING A FEATURE as a feature even after people have paid to get that feature.

It's like buying a sports car and then finding it comes with only three wheels because some nutter has decided that even though cars come with four wheels as standard, Reliant got away with only three in the 1980s and you could use a motorcycle licence instead of having to pay for a full car licence.

We wanted this



We got this

rcolistete | # 314 | 2015-01-30, 15:14 | Report

Nope. Jolla Tablet still supports 128GB cards, but not with your choice of file system (exFAT) builtin. Options : use EXT4, BTRFS, etc, or exFAT can be added by the user.

nodevel | # 315 | 2015-01-30, 15:18 | Report

So, by your logic, what was the stretch goal about? Did the tablet not support 128GB cards before announcing and reaching the stretch goal?

Drekkie | # 316 | 2015-01-30, 15:22 | Report

Didn't someone from Jolla say explicitly somewhere that the stretch goal money was specifically to pay for the Microsoft license? I can't recall where I read that, whether social media, jolla's site etc, or if that's even an accurate statement. If so, that is specifically what I think Benny and others are unhappy with, it was very specific.

And since that is how I remember it, why would I argue at the time with a bunch of FOSS culture warriors who want it changed when it seemed this is what the stretch goal was? It was stated and re-affirmed in that statement I speculated about above (i wish I could find it now to know if I'm being accurate, if I'm wrong then I can stand corrected). Point being, any statement that this 'what the community wanted' is not accurate, there may have been a silent majority like myself who thought this was all set and that you can't change the stretch goal. The question was never asked in a way to get dependable results (it was never even a question).

My only horse in this race is I don't want to see jolla become another dead product like my beloved N9 which I still haven't found a worthy successor for, simply for catering to purists and making practicality and usefulness second class. (I realize that's not why the n9 is dead).

The selective outrage here about openness when Jolla is closed in significant other areas is weird.

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Last edited by Drekkie; 2015-01-30 at 16:30.

rcolistete | # 317 | 2015-01-30, 15:29 | Report

No. Jolla smartphone doesn't officially support 64/128GB cards, so you can't complain if some microSDHC/XC card doesn't work (with any file system). With 128GB card in Jolla Tablet specs, you will have the right to complain if a 128GB microSDXC card can't be used (if formated to something other than exFAT, like EXT4 or BTRFS).

Remember that microSD card readers can be incompatible with newer specs & sizes :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_...#Compatibility
So Jolla is stating that the Jolla Tablet will have hardware compatible with 128GB cards.

abyzthomas | # 318 | 2015-01-30, 16:10 | Report

This is the whole point of Jolla and Linux. Only include open source in the distribution. Give users choice to install proprietary stuff if they want it and make it easy as possible.

Stop fighting for this MS standard that they bribed the SDXC standard group to include in the standard. There was no reason for them to say only MS was supported. Every vendor, including your camera manufacturers would have chose the open source solutions, instead of paying MS.

This would have forced MS to support other filesystem. They thrive by ignoring every other technology by not supporting it and choking people who whants choice. As long as people like you (edit: sorry, not you rcolistete, but people who wants MS standard) cry about supporting MS shandards, this will never change.

Linux is about choice. This is not the first time a Linux distribution taking the choice not to include proprietary made-up standards and pay for license.

Paying like $300K, just to include the technology to read the dumb exfat on an opensouce distribution is stupid. Especially for Jolla. There are many bugs and features that we really could use this $300K to fix.

Would you think MS will include a driver to read EXT2, EXT3, EXT4, BTRFS, or any other Unix filesystems in Windows, in the next 10 years?

By not including in the distribution, both people who wants exfat support and people who wants open source only can be served. If you include it, people who does not want anything to do with M$ Windows could not be served.

Jolla or community can easily come up with support for exfat. Just package it and host it on the store as an app. Call it "Support Windows Disks" or something like that so.

As long as we can make it an easy solution to install it, it should be fine for most users.

I agree with Jolla's choice 100%.

rcolistete | # 319 | 2015-01-30, 16:53 | Report

US$300k for the exFAT licensing, or volume-based for some devices.

Drekkie | # 320 | 2015-01-30, 17:54 | Report

This was indicated last year while the stretch goal was active. Which is why I am trying to remember if/who said the stretch goal money would help go directly to that. Perhaps it was a forum member and not a Jolla employee.

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Last edited by Drekkie; 2015-01-30 at 17:59.