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pk11 is offline pk11
2008-08-07 , 22:15
Posts: 8 | Thanked: 2 times | Joined on Jan 2008 @ /dev/random
#1
If Nokia could release a beta of Silverlight this evening, that would be rather timely. NBC (USA region only) is only streaming Silverlight, with no flash fallback, or any other codec.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/video/faq.html

Sigh.
 
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danramos is offline danramos
2008-08-07 , 22:45
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#2
Originally Posted by pk11 View Post
If Nokia could release a beta of Silverlight this evening, that would be rather timely. NBC (USA region only) is only streaming Silverlight, with no flash fallback, or any other codec.

http://www.nbcolympics.com/video/faq.html

Sigh.
heheh Won't happen.

My understanding, correct me if I'm wrong:

1) Silverlight is never coming out for Linux. The Linux version of what is supposed to be 'compatible' with (but isn't truly 100%) Silverlight is called Moonlight.

2) Moonlight is heavy on the .NET. You will need to port .NET over first. .NET compatibility is vaguely (also not truly 100%) available with something called Mono.

3) ALL of this is deep in closed-source code which isn't made for ARM based devices (even Moonlight contains proprietary binary code for things like video codecs).

4) I suspect Nokia is probably as far away from being the responsible party to port this over as I can imagine.

5) Even if it was ported over and available and, by some amazing chance, the codecs were ported to ARM and everything was as 'perfect' as Moonlight running over Mono with the closed binary blobs--no wait.. better: Silverlight itself... Microsoft and NBC have agreed to ONLY make the the video coverage available to Silverlight running under Windows Vista (not even Windows XP). ie: http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ista-only.html


On the other hand, I DID hear that NBC is allowing YouTube to air some limited coverage of the Olympics. :P
Last edited by danramos; 2008-08-07 at 22:48.
 
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Traecer is offline Traecer
2008-08-07 , 23:15
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#3
1) & 2) are completely true.

Originally Posted by danramos View Post
3) ALL of this is deep in closed-source code which isn't made for ARM based devices (even Moonlight contains proprietary binary code for things like video codecs).
Untrue. The different pieces of Mono are licensed differently, but all of Mono itself is licensed under either the GPL, LGPL, or MIT license. Commercial licenses are available from Novell for those that don't want/can't work under those licenses. I'm sure Mono/Moonlight supports proprietary codecs, but one doesn't have to use them of one doesn't want to.

Yes, one can point out that both Mono and Moonlight are implementations of Microsoft stuff, but I'm just reporting what Novell says about Mono itself, not about what Microsoft may do to Novell or others.

4) I suspect Nokia is probably as far away from being the responsible party to port this over as I can imagine.
Well, Nokia and Microsoft have been chummy with codecs lately, but Novell owns Mono and Moonlight, and they don't seem to have a relationship, so probably not.


5) Even if it was ported over and available and, by some amazing chance, the codecs were ported to ARM and everything was as 'perfect' as Moonlight running over Mono with the closed binary blobs--no wait.. better: Silverlight itself... Microsoft and NBC have agreed to ONLY make the the video coverage available to Silverlight running under Windows Vista (not even Windows XP). ie: http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ista-only.html
At the risk of offending the Microsofties, that does sound like M$. It also sounds like a Big Media company like NBC. This Olympics/Silverlight deal was a match made in heaven, wasn't it?
 
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danramos is offline danramos
2008-08-07 , 23:28
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#4
Originally Posted by Traecer View Post
Untrue. The different pieces of Mono are licensed differently, but all of Mono itself is licensed under either the GPL, LGPL, or MIT license. Commercial licenses are available from Novell for those that don't want/can't work under those licenses. I'm sure Mono/Moonlight supports proprietary codecs, but one doesn't have to use them of one doesn't want to.

Yes, one can point out that both Mono and Moonlight are implementations of Microsoft stuff, but I'm just reporting what Novell says about Mono itself, not about what Microsoft may do to Novell or others.
That was my understanding, yeah. I suppose my wording was off--I was talking about the portions that would need to work to get Silverlight/Mono to show this piece of NBC+Microsoft Ausschluss. Those portions ARE binary blob portions (codecs, DRM, etc.) and very much closed, to my knowledge.
 
sckmcck is offline sckmcck
2008-08-07 , 23:52
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#5
Read this recent interview with Miguel:
http://derstandard.at/?url=/?id=1216918402134
regarding implementing Silverlight and codecs. Microsoft will be offering codecs via it's website separately. Since the codecs are proprietary (and not owned by Microsoft), they won't be packaged with moonlight, but MS is going to pay licensing fees and will offer them for free.
Also, remember this?
http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1197788
 
jhoff80 is offline jhoff80
2008-08-08 , 00:12
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#6
5 is actually incorrect. The NBC Olympics on the Go service is a Windows Vista Media Center plugin. That has absolutely nothing to do with the main website coverage.
 
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danramos is offline danramos
2008-08-08 , 08:42
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#7
Originally Posted by sckmcck View Post
Read this recent interview with Miguel:
http://derstandard.at/?url=/?id=1216918402134
regarding implementing Silverlight and codecs. Microsoft will be offering codecs via it's website separately. Since the codecs are proprietary (and not owned by Microsoft), they won't be packaged with moonlight, but MS is going to pay licensing fees and will offer them for free.
Also, remember this?
http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1197788
On ARM? Or is this still x86 only? What about .NET being ported to ARM?

Originally Posted by jhoff80 View Post
5 is actually incorrect. The NBC Olympics on the Go service is a Windows Vista Media Center plugin. That has absolutely nothing to do with the main website coverage.
But isn't the available coverage mainly highlights and live streaming? I'm to understand that the whole point is that you can't just pick and choose programming to download--isn't that what the ironically-named 'NBC Olympics On The Go' is all about?

I'm going to have to admit to being a bit confused by all these articles flying around giving me that impression.
 
jhoff80 is offline jhoff80
2008-08-08 , 08:52
Posts: 228 | Thanked: 20 times | Joined on Oct 2007
#8
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
On ARM? Or is this still x86 only? What about .NET being ported to ARM?



But isn't the available coverage mainly highlights and live streaming? I'm to understand that the whole point is that you can't just pick and choose programming to download--isn't that what the ironically-named 'NBC Olympics On The Go' is all about?

I'm going to have to admit to being a bit confused by all these articles flying around giving me that impression.
Well, yes, you can do that with the NBC Olympic on the Go addon. The reason that its Vista Media Center only is because its really just the TVtonic application, which is written in the MCML language. I'm not entirely sure what type of content is included, I know you can choose a sport to see whichever type of content you want, but I'm not sure if its the full event or not (I already have two addon strips on my Media Center start menu, and two is the maximum, so I won't be using it.) Then again, its basically just a podcasting type application for MediaCenter, so I'd think that the same content should be available on the website.

Though, I believe the "On the Go" part of the name comes from the fact that you pick the events you want and it downloads them automatically without any user input, so that when you come back to the computer, everything you want is there.
 
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allnameswereout is offline allnameswereout
2008-08-12 , 13:12
Posts: 3,397 | Thanked: 1,212 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Netherlands
#9
DRM, my friends. Do you want to support DRM? I don't. I can watch on TV without DRM. Even if we could pay for a port of a working codec there is still a big issue with the DRM. Heck, I wonder about the overhead of DRM.

Microsoft said they will provide these codecs not for free because they had to pay royalties for them. Which does make sense, but if you look at GStreamer, these folks also provide codecs, and with these codecs (I bough them) you can watch almost any video format, legally. In all countries, even if the patents are valid. Although DRM isn't supported.

Sun is working on a Java competitor to Flash/Moonlight.

Youtube contains videos too, for countries which haven't licensed the Olympics.

DVB might be an option if you have such on your phone. Its broadcasted here for free, I wouldn't even need a subscription to watch over DVB.

Now, NBC is a for-profit corporation, so I say vote with your wallet. However if a state or publicly sponsored network is using DRM to broadcast such crippleware, you should contact your representative because of the vendor lock-in.
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bunanson is offline bunanson
2008-08-12 , 18:41
Posts: 4,030 | Thanked: 1,633 times | Joined on Jul 2007 @ nd usa
#10
Originally Posted by jhoff80 View Post
Well, yes, you can do that with the NBC Olympic on the Go addon. The reason that its Vista Media Center only is because its really just the TVtonic application, which is written in the MCML language. I'm not entirely sure what type of content is included, I know you can choose a sport to see whichever type of content you want, but I'm not sure if its the full event or not (I already have two addon strips on my Media Center start menu, and two is the maximum, so I won't be using it.) Then again, its basically just a podcasting type application for MediaCenter, so I'd think that the same content should be available on the website.

Though, I believe the "On the Go" part of the name comes from the fact that you pick the events you want and it downloads them automatically without any user input, so that when you come back to the computer, everything you want is there.
I also installed the TVtonic thing, and tried to schedule for taping to watch it later. I only get a blank screen with the olympic logo. Anybody knows how to schedule for taping using TVtonic?

bun
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