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attila77 is offline attila77
2009-04-16 , 15:15
Posts: 3,319 | Thanked: 5,610 times | Joined on Aug 2008 @ Finland
#171
Also, don't mix maemo (as a platform) with exact devices. Maemo as a platform would be foolish not to support styluses at any level. The devices themselves OTOH may or may not have a stylus (as the stylus/mouse comes across to me as a compatibility device), I can see it going both ways. It will be mighty funny using Claws, Pidgin or Abiword on a stylusless devices (and these are not Fremantle stars, so I don't see a massive effort making them figer/fremantle friendly). OTOH liqbase *is* a FS participant, and it does rely on stylus input quite heavily so barring extreme lcuk shenanigans, at least SOME of the devices should have precision input.
 

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kanishou is offline kanishou
2009-04-16 , 15:34
Posts: 341 | Thanked: 607 times | Joined on Dec 2008
#172
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
Also, don't mix maemo (as a platform) with exact devices. Maemo as a platform would be foolish not to support styluses at any level. The devices themselves OTOH may or may not have a stylus (as the stylus/mouse comes across to me as a compatibility device), I can see it going both ways. It will be mighty funny using Claws, Pidgin or Abiword on a stylusless devices (and these are not Fremantle stars, so I don't see a massive effort making them figer/fremantle friendly). OTOH liqbase *is* a FS participant, and it does rely on stylus input quite heavily so barring extreme lcuk shenanigans, at least SOME of the devices should have precision input.
How would you even define stylus support by the famework? If it's finger-usable, it's stylus-usable. The only way not to support stylus input is something like a capacity screen, which doesn't recognize the touch of non-human objects.

And silence of Nokia employees cannot be taken as confirmation for anything. Nobody will risk their job by talking about unannounced hardware details, no matter how safe it might seem.
 

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attila77 is offline attila77
2009-04-16 , 16:03
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#173
Originally Posted by kanishou View Post
If it's finger-usable, it's stylus-usable. The only way not to support stylus input is something like a capacity screen, which doesn't recognize the touch of non-human objects.
It's not that difficult to make a (pencil shape) stylus incompatible UI. Multi touch operations, gestures, pressure patterns can all make stylus use very difficult, if not impossible.
 
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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2009-04-16 , 16:16
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#174
Originally Posted by kanishou View Post
How would you even define stylus support by the famework? If it's finger-usable, it's stylus-usable. The only way not to support stylus input is something like a capacity screen, which doesn't recognize the touch of non-human objects.
Quim also pointed out somewhere (which I can't be bothered to find) that one or two of the Fremantle Stars (i.e. liqbase) work best with a stylus.
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kanishou is offline kanishou
2009-04-16 , 16:18
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#175
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
It's not that difficult to make a (pencil shape) stylus incompatible UI. Multi touch operations, gestures, pressure patterns can all make stylus use very difficult, if not impossible.
Good point about multi-touch, but the other two don't seem stylus-incompatible to me. And all those things are usually complementary actions, so it should not get in the way at least. Although the multi touch pinching on the iPhone might be fairly essential to the browsing experience.
 
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ARJWright is offline ARJWright
2009-04-16 , 16:30
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#176
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
It's not that difficult to make a (pencil shape) stylus incompatible UI. Multi touch operations, gestures, pressure patterns can all make stylus use very difficult, if not impossible.
Its not impossible, one just has to think about a stylus as an additive to UI-input, rather than the primary.

I've written about it here: http://tabletui.wordpress.com/2008/0...lus-driven-ui/
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daperl is offline daperl
2009-04-16 , 16:44
Posts: 2,427 | Thanked: 2,986 times | Joined on Dec 2007
#177
Originally Posted by kanishou View Post
And silence of Nokia employees cannot be taken as confirmation for anything. Nobody will risk their job by talking about unannounced hardware details, no matter how safe it might seem.
It seems that you're interjecting in the middle of a conversation and thus your context is incorrect. The chronology of events is this:
  • Nokia employee makes a presentation with the bullet item "Removal of stylus keyboard"
  • Nokia community members comment
  • other Nokia employees remain silent or do not refute presentation
It was their silence after the non-silence that some have found telling.
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lemmyslender is offline lemmyslender
2009-04-16 , 16:47
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#178
Fair enough, I should have taken into account NDA's.

However, I think that I've seen a strong bias towards the "finger-friendly" portions of the UI.

Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
What exactly happens to usability outside of Maemo-optimized/default applications is yet unclear to me.
I agree wholeheartedly with this. There has been a disturbing lack of information in this regard. Combine that with information from the presentation, and it certainly seems as though at least one new tablet will (possiibly) be stylus free. Given my wants/needs I fear that a stylus free model would be one that I would otherwise be interested in.
 
mobiledivide is offline mobiledivide
2009-04-16 , 17:31
Posts: 751 | Thanked: 522 times | Joined on Mar 2007 @ East Gowanus
#179
What part of certain projects that Nokia are helping developers with use a stylus do users not understand. This stylus vs finger input business is bordering on crazy-talk. Its a resistive touchscreen, Nokia are expecting us to use Liqbase and Numpty Physics on it, if the device ships without a stylus and only a plectrum so be it buy an aftermarket stylus for $1.
I for one will be using my fingers and a stylus on the RX-51 and looking forward to QT cross platform applications delivered over the Ovi store as well as my 'pearls' such as FB reader and Liqbase.
If the device is as easy to use as an iphone and also has the versatility of my N810 running Diablo who is complaining? I must be not getting something here maybe someone can explain to me?
 

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ragnar is offline ragnar
2009-04-16 , 18:35
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#180
Originally Posted by daperl View Post
It seems that you're interjecting in the middle of a conversation and thus your context is incorrect. The chronology of events is this:
  • Nokia employee makes a presentation with the bullet item "Removal of stylus keyboard"
  • Nokia community members comment
  • other Nokia employees remain silent or do not refute presentation
It was their silence after the non-silence that some have found telling.
Perhaps you find it telling, but it is not supposed to be telling.

The things that Kate writes in her powerpoint are valid as such, but reading "more" or between the lines is speculation, and commenting on speculation about hardware, be it positive or negative commenting, isn't really advantageous to us Nokians.
 

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