You are all aware that one of the biggest groups "ever", started out by winning the ESC.....

ABBA - with Waterloo

Ahh, Eurosong. The stuff that is so bad it starts to be good

But seriously, you're the (at least) two distinct phases of the ESC - the 'old', traditional ESC, where a mix of public figures and musicians used to give scores, and the current one, which is the 'panem et circem' approach. You can't be too much of anything in today's ESC (kooky, sexy, you name it). I also came to the conclusion that 90% of contestants conformed to the 'idiot or babe' matrix, with rare exceptions, mostly from countries that did not elect by popular vote. Also, ESC proves an interesting insight into European migratory patters.

About the competition. Competition can be friendly, if done right. Yes, only one can win the show, but ESC has helped a LOT of (actual) performers to gain attention, and it IS about fun, laughter with (something occasionally resembling) music. The voting model IS flawed, but that's not the point - I like watching it with friends, it's just hilarious, the ONE continent-wide manifestation where EVERY country can afford to show something silly.

Never EVER try to take it as serious artistic/performer contest or your faith in European culture and tradition will be shattered. I remember when two years ago I had a friend here from the US at the time of ESC. What can I say, she was beyond shocked

EDIT: Ah, yes, and if you are into that sort of humour, go for the BBC version with Terry Wogan (is he still doing it BTW ?). The prepared speech thingy is dead boring (yes, that guy in your local language is most likely reading a prepared written translation of the presenter's speech, not adding anything of entertainment value).

Actually, it's more complicated than that.

The old, old approach with juries was phase one: juries in each country. Then they experimented with televoting and we had a phase 2 where some countries used juries, others used televoting. Phase 3 was televoting only (with backup juries). Then came phase 4 with semi-finals, which introduced a new aspect because a lot of crap-crap got filtered out... except the crap-crap-crap that was so good you had to see it a second time. Then (phase 5) they started to re-introduce juries for the semi-finals: Only 9 of 10 finalists in each semi are chosen by the audience, the 10th is a pure jury decision. This year we're starting with phase 6: In the final, 50% of the points will be determined by the audience via televoting and 50% will come from professional juries again.

So.... while with Nokia we're still waiting for step 5, Eurovision has reached step 6 now.

I never liked the kind of aggressive and disrespectful "humour" Terry Wogan added to the show. It's very simple and low-level... Anyway: No, he's not doing it any more. See http://www.esctoday.com/news/read/12636

There's a particular kind of music style called "ESC music". Very bad for your health. I watched the sum-up (the short clips before voting started) of yesterday's semi final, and only two of the songs were non-ESC. The rest of them were made over the ESC template, which equals horrible in my opinion. And as 10 songs passed it means there's not much to look forward to for the final.. (but I didn't watch the first semifinal, so who knows.. but I'm not optimistic.)

That's what I meant when saying it's very unlikely that a song is successful on the Eurovision stage and in sales charts.

You have to impress an audience with a three-minute-song that they hear once. And your competition are 23 songs that face the same challenge.

The only thing you can do is be memorable, one way or another.... The consequence is - well, unusual customes and stage performances, but also songs that are made for one time listening. A normal music production would take into account that people listen to it several times, and it should sound fresh and interesting even after 3 months. That's not what Eurovision songs try to achieve. They have to please once - and fail afterwards because they're not made for being heard a 2nd time.

So you get this typical Eurovision style. There not very much composers can do to achieve all this, and all songs try hard, so they all use the same patterns.

(Of course, it's totally different with me: I listen to the songs weeks before the competition, so my favorites are usually not the ones that win. )

Have to say that for me Terry Wogan's commentary was the highlight of the Eurovision. Grham Norton is now doing it, so it'll possibly be OK, but I'll probably give it a miss this year for that reason, although usually it ends up being the best thing on live TV on the night.

Best thing is not to take it too seriously!

This somehow reminds me of the "stylus vs. finger UI"-debate.... I'm alone against the rest of the world.

But I'm used to it. It was like that when I started working for my current company. Now people are informed about this years songs, have their favourites, discuss all the little scandals, watch the show, send me the votes from their ESC-parties, ....

I'll get you there. Just give me some time. In 2-3 years, the Eurovision fanfare will have replaced the Nokia tune on Maemo devices.

Yes, that's what I was trying to imply with the 'at least' comment, listing the two extremes.

... and that's why I put in the "*IF* you're in that kind of humour". ESC would be characterised a low-level attempt at comedy by many, anyway But, there is plenty to choose from, especially if one understands English or is bi/tri/quad/etclingual

True, but many DO break this template, especially in their local countries (at least that's how it worked in the past around here in mid-south-east Europe). Roughly one of two becomes a hit regardless how they do/rank in the final ESC chart, but there are those that actually do well on ESC at the same time (for example Marija Serifovic's (2007 ESC winner from Serbia) song was a HUGE hit in the whole region.

Actually, I do that, too. ESC songs are nothing like my 'usual' music taste, so I guess once I year I can consume something like that without permanent consequences I usually do 1 or 2 passes of all, and then narrow down at the (not that numerous) favorites I actually find catching. But then again, that has nothing to do with the ESC as a show.