Adobe Flash Player 10: When will the update arrive? Is it coming at all? - Page 8 - maemo.org

aironeous | # 71 | 2010-02-04, 03:26 | Report

This is the closest to a monopoly as you can get without being a monopoly.

We are in a total effect situation Adobe cause---> us effect

Go to Wikipedia.org and look up defintion of monopoly and flash 10.1 meets all the criteria except the money making parts.

Flash < 10.1 does not count in this world as every website upgrades.

Online environment is a different one than the real world and so monopoly definition should modify for online presence.

We have no way to eliminate Adobe's stranglehold on our devices. We are not able to play 90+% of flash video websites because we are not a priority OS as determined by Adobe.

They can basically take a dump on our face because the whole internet converts to flash 10 and we can't.

Last edited by aironeous; 2010-02-04 at 03:28.

aironeous | # 72 | 2010-02-04, 03:39 | Report

Originally Posted by konfoo View Post

I was up at Adobe for a partner summit last week and got to speak to the Flash on devices guys.

Naturally I asked where I could obtain the 10.1 beta for testing, since there was discussion about availability for testing on other handhelds, and the response was that yes it does exist and will be coming to the N900, but it is up to Nokia to release it as part of a future firmware update.

I'm sorry to be rude If I am being so but next time you see those guys stand up for your OS and tell them that we are important too and make them explain why Nokias OS, the largest phone supplier of the whole world gets ignored by flash.
Totally stupid to ignore the largest mobile market on the f'n planet.

Ask them if they have their heads up their *** and if they realize everything is going mobile and WM is not where it's at so WTF?!!

gerbick | # 73 | 2010-02-04, 03:45 | Report

Originally Posted by danramos View Post

So then, my question then becomes, first, "why isn't it released then?" Is it still being tested or something? Did they promise it would come out or will it never see the light of day?

It's being tested on WebOS and Maemo as we speak. It's not yet released due to ARM modifications as well as getting it ready for simultaneous release for desktop (or close therein)

It's still beta on the desktop/

Originally Posted by

My next question is then, "why is everyone bellyaching over it so much?"

Two reasons... Hulu and other folks that for no real reason all of a sudden require it. I'm a Flex dev and Flash Builder 4 (Flex 4) makes the jump to FP10. So this is a necessary update for a lot of reasons.

Originally Posted by

If it's been pretty much promised and it's being tweaked or tested, then why grumble? The N900 only JUST came out, give it time.

Because they can?

Originally Posted by

I guess I'm just a little confused by all the fuss.

No need to be confused. With Adobe moving rapidly ahead with Flash Builder 4, Adobe CS5 Suite, Adobe Flash Catalyst... the need for this is rather imminent due to the tools pushing everybody to the newer flash player. Just wish that the communication from the Adobe Open Screen Project was more... forthcoming. But patience is required since it's been demoed before during Adobe MAX last October and more comments about it since then for the Palm Pre and Maemo...

Hope that helps.

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aironeous | # 74 | 2010-02-04, 03:52 | Report

Originally Posted by sjgadsby View Post

Because Adobe didn't release/isn't releasing the final verson of Flash 10 to manufacturers until Q1 2010. Following that, Nokia needs to do testing and integration.

It's Q1 2010 man.
Who is testing this huh? Nobody.
Is there some other place on the internet that we can find Nokia employees testing a flash 10 beta? No there isn't.

If there was anybody in the f'n world testing a flash 10.1 beta for N900 we would have atleast been given a heads up by some of the members here that they were testing a beta version.

Adobe flash 10 is a monopoly.

They do what they want, when they want, how they want and if your OS doesn't like it too f'n bad.
So many online websites and interaction depend on them yet they are in a dictatorship position.

Laughing Man | # 75 | 2010-02-04, 03:57 | Report

Q1 2010 isn't Jan or Feb. It's a time period (till March or April.. I can't remember since different companies use different time periods)

As far as we know Nokia could be testing it and just not mentioning it. They don't always involve the community in testing new firmware and new things (sadly). By the time the community gets to it, it's usually close to release (like the firmware 1.1 update).

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gerbick | # 76 | 2010-02-04, 04:07 | Report

Originally Posted by aironeous View Post

It's Q1 2010 man.
Who is testing this huh? Nobody.

Wrong. QA testing is in private beta. When it comes out, it'll land on labs.adobe.com - but due to the nature of the install, I doubt it'll exit private beta until it's "ready"... which is about the same as it is on other embedded systems.

Originally Posted by

Is there some other place on the internet that we can find Nokia employees testing a flash 10 beta? No there isn't.

Again, it's all internally Adobe. Just like nobody is testing PR1.2 except Nokia right now. It happens. Same with Silverlight by Microsoft on the Maemo OS. Only MS is testing that.

Originally Posted by

If there was anybody in the f'n world testing a flash 10.1 beta for N900 we would have atleast been given a heads up by some of the members here that they were testing a beta version.

Wait for it to get out of private beta.

Originally Posted by

Adobe flash 10 is a monopoly.

Yep. So are a lot of things.

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Thesandlord | # 77 | 2010-02-04, 04:14 | Report

I am guessing they want to release it on all smartphone and desktop platforms at the same time. And Flash is NOT a monopoly. That does not even make sense... They just control the market. Its proprietary, yes, but not really a monopoly...

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gerbick | # 78 | 2010-02-04, 04:18 | Report

Originally Posted by Thesandlord View Post

I am guessing they want to release it on all smartphone and desktop platforms at the same time. And Flash is NOT a monopoly. That does not even make sense... They just control the market. Its proprietary, yes, but not really a monopoly...

I once argued that here... since then, never again.

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aironeous | # 79 | 2010-02-04, 05:20 | Report

^ Q1 means first quarter.
It's Feb 2nd now, we are almost in the middle of first quarter.
If they were going to release it in the next month and a half then someone here would have said, "hey my fellow Nokia employees are testing it now, just be patient" or something similar to that.
So stop pretending.

Anybody can say "wrong" and anybody can say "doesn't make sense."

One more time since you said "doesn't make sense" without actually pointing out how it doesn't,
I said Adobe flash meets all the criteria of a monopoly except the money making parts.
A few excerpts from wikipedia about monopoly:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly
"Product differentiation: There is zero product differentiation in a perfectly competitive market. Every product is perfectly homogeneous and a perfect substitute. With a monopoly there is high to absolute product differentiation in the sense that there is no available substitute for a monopolized good. The monopolist is the sole supplier of the good in question.[19] A customer either buys from the monopolist on her terms or does without.

Number of competitors: PC markets are populated by an infinite number of buyers and sellers. Monopoly involves a single seller.[19]

Barriers to Entry - Barriers to entry are factors and circumstances that prevent entry into market by would be competitors and impediments to competition that limit new firm’s from operating and expanding within the market. PC markets have free entry and exit. There are no barriers to entry, exit or competition. Monopolies have relatively high barriers to entry. The barriers must be strong enough to prevent or discourage any potential competitor from entering the market."

Show me a substitute for flash 10.1 that works atleast 90% as good and I will say I am wrong.

Last edited by aironeous; 2010-02-04 at 05:23.

ohwut | # 80 | 2010-02-04, 05:28 | Report

Originally Posted by aironeous View Post

^ Q1 means first quarter.
It's Feb 2nd now, we are almost in the middle of first quarter.
If they were going to release it in the next month and a half then someone here would have said, "hey my fellow Nokia employees are testing it now, just be patient" or something similar to that.
So stop pretending.

Anybody can say "wrong" and anybody can say "doesn't make sense."

One more time since you said "doesn't make sense" without actually pointing out how it doesn't,
I said Adobe flash meets all the criteria of a monopoly except the money making parts.
A few excerpts from wikipedia about monopoly:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly
"Product differentiation: There is zero product differentiation in a perfectly competitive market. Every product is perfectly homogeneous and a perfect substitute. With a monopoly there is high to absolute product differentiation in the sense that there is no available substitute for a monopolized good. The monopolist is the sole supplier of the good in question.[19] A customer either buys from the monopolist on her terms or does without.

Number of competitors: PC markets are populated by an infinite number of buyers and sellers. Monopoly involves a single seller.[19]

Barriers to Entry - Barriers to entry are factors and circumstances that prevent entry into market by would be competitors and impediments to competition that limit new firm’s from operating and expanding within the market. PC markets have free entry and exit. There are no barriers to entry, exit or competition. Monopolies have relatively high barriers to entry. The barriers must be strong enough to prevent or discourage any potential competitor from entering the market."

Show me a substitute for flash 10.1 that works atleast 90% as good and I will say I am wrong.

The problem is the content you're viewing, thats like saying "Oh, F1 Cars have a monopoly in the F1 racing world" In actual accounts Flash does have a MAJORITY share, but hardly a monopoly. Flash only accounts for 70% of web videos and 75% of web games.

It's perfectly acceptable for people not to be testing software outside of Adobe, this is Adobe software we're talking about here, not Nokia. Sure it would be in Nokia's best interest to have involvement in the QA process but they don't need to be involved, and this is a Nokia/Maemo forum so you can't expect Adobe running around posting updates for us. Adobe can released Flash 10 regardless of Nokia's involvement or opinion assuming they can give us an update without requiring a full OS flash.

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