But you can't buy apps from the Android Market unless you have a Google account. I have one, obviously (and a lot of apps that make me happy on Nitdroid) I'm not saying that I don't buy stuff - I do - but I also had an unlocked G1 a year ago that was unusable until I figured out a way to log in with a non-T Mobile account. That didn't endear Android to me. I gather that iPhone is similar when you go the jailbreak path.

That's kind of my point, though. Both Google and Apple have backdoors into devices that make them vulnerable and I don't like that on principle.

The best way to convince other people to buy N900 is to show them this background:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyFGXmrfPqc

On Nitdroid, I found that getting an xterm was about impossible, or at least very difficult. The response that "well, you CAN get xterm somehow" is kind of like saying that a jail isn't a jail, because some people escape from jail. On the N900 you don't have to do anything special to get an xterm, just click.

I'm not sure I entirely follow you. If I format the data and cache on my phone (basically, reformat the phone's NVRAM containing my info) and then install a clean OS on it (say, Android 2.2), if I avoid logging into Google, I can run it just fine and it works as expected. I even install a bunch of apps without the Android market just fine (I just can't install purchased apps, but that obviously goes without saying). I've actually done this and let it stay that way for a good half a day to see what it's like--and it worked just fine without ANY Google interaction whatsoever. Stability was the least of my any problems I could have even considered.

If you intend to use paid apps, you DO need to log in to authorize those purchases, but if you intend to use purely open-sourced apps (like the one I linked to in my last reply to you) or free apps, you don't need the Android Market at all.

If I'm misunderstanding the situation, please let me know. I'll definitely agree that life is much easier if you agree to use Google and the Android Market, though, but you aren't forced to use it to have a usable phone with applications.

I don't want xterm, I want a good terminal. Like e.g. Guake for GNOME.

Is there not such a thing for Android? Isn't it possible to use SSH client on Android? Or run a SSH server?

I don't have time to query xda-developers but last year it was definitely the case that if you didn't log in to Google, there were phone features that were not guaranteed to work. I spent a lot of time flashing Cyanogen roms and reading the forums. But Android 2.2 is definitely better than 1.6 in most ways. It's faster and more stable, so maybe that isn't an issue anymore.

However, even if you can use Android without Google, I personally wouldn't bother because apps are one of the main draws. But technically, yes, you can.

The N900 is still more standalone friendly. It isn't much of a selling point for most people, though. Eye candy and apps still win there.

Terry

damn thats very nice.
does someone know where i can get these strip live wallpaper?maybe with a chick with bigger boobs?

You can add repositories without having a Google account, without logging in to Android market. You caneven run your own custom firmware sans Google software.

Excuse me? Backdoors? Sounds like FUD.

This, if true, is a good argument to not use Google, and there are tons of others, but Google is not the same as Android.

Pretty much the same conclusions I pointed out, so we're in a lot of agreement. Except that the N900 with the super-secret SMS registration and the Ovi store makes a mess of the standalone-friendly elements of Maemo, but you would be comparatively right.