Active Topics
-
Which is the best N95? What software modifications could be made to it? (3)
to General by Kalatti - 6 hrs, 23 mins ago -
Installing CSSU Stable in year 2024 (2)
to Maemo 5 / Fremantle by teroyk - 13 hrs, 52 mins ago -
Porting apps to Leste (34)
to Maemo 7 / Leste by Arno_11 - 23 hrs, 27 mins ago -
[ANNOUNCE] CSSU-thumb thread - stable Thumb2 on N900 (2,266)
to Maemo 5 / Fremantle by pali - 2 days, 15 hrs ago -
Firefox with Leste (7)
to Maemo 7 / Leste by teroyk - 2 days, 19 hrs ago - more...
|
2007-09-06
, 14:21
|
|
Posts: 65 |
Thanked: 6 times |
Joined on Apr 2007
|
#102
|
I was initially excited for the Touch - then turned off because it junked the camera and bluetooth and didn't have the Classic's HDD. But the more I think about it, the more I'm not interested.
We know the thing's locked down. So there's no expandable memory. No hope for googleGears or even Firefox. No hope for mososo. No hope for internet apps that Apple doesn't care about: VNC, IRC, ssh, UPnP media streaming (kinda necessary with only a few gig of storage), hell: chat is still up in the air. No hope for generic data sharing. No hope for sync'ing media files however-the-hell-i-want. No hope for expanding media format support. No hope for games; aside from what Apple wants to sell.
It's just... well it's not a very good platform. It's a large and expensive PMP with a browser and not alot of storage. You could softhack the thing to get around some of its limitations, but that's alot of extra work just to put yourself back in the hands of a smaller and newer community.
I've got my gripes about the n800 too, but it has the ability to grow. It has the necessary pieces and the right approach to ensure that it gets better over time.
Honestly, all Nokia needs to do - is get a better camera, better default media player and better UI performance. (GPS wouldn't hurt) Goosed-up overall horsepower would be nice -- I know that's a contentious issue around here, but it's imperative that the UI get faster. The true strength of the touch UI is merely its responsiveness (and the proximity-weighted spelling correction. we seriously need that).
We know the thing's locked down. So there's no expandable memory. No hope for googleGears or even Firefox. No hope for mososo. No hope for internet apps that Apple doesn't care about: VNC, IRC, ssh, UPnP media streaming (kinda necessary with only a few gig of storage), hell: chat is still up in the air. No hope for generic data sharing. No hope for sync'ing media files however-the-hell-i-want. No hope for expanding media format support. No hope for games; aside from what Apple wants to sell.
It's just... well it's not a very good platform. It's a large and expensive PMP with a browser and not alot of storage. You could softhack the thing to get around some of its limitations, but that's alot of extra work just to put yourself back in the hands of a smaller and newer community.
I've got my gripes about the n800 too, but it has the ability to grow. It has the necessary pieces and the right approach to ensure that it gets better over time.
Honestly, all Nokia needs to do - is get a better camera, better default media player and better UI performance. (GPS wouldn't hurt) Goosed-up overall horsepower would be nice -- I know that's a contentious issue around here, but it's imperative that the UI get faster. The true strength of the touch UI is merely its responsiveness (and the proximity-weighted spelling correction. we seriously need that).
 |
|
2007-09-06
, 14:30
|
|
Posts: 1,245 |
Thanked: 421 times |
Joined on Dec 2005
|
#103
|
Originally Posted by Texrat
I don't mean any disrespect, but actually, this is one of the few cases where the ignore feature doesn't work. You can't just put everyone on your ignore list once they start reacting to your bait. It puts a damper on any pre-existing discussion. Even this response is proof of this, so I'll keep it brief.
And I'm sorry if the hints grate on you. Based on the feedback I've received, you're in the minority, and I tend not to pander there. As I've told the few hardcore malcontents here (not saying you are one), if anyone has any trouble with me or what I write, the Ignore feature works very well.
Yes, a good many people may appreciate your "hints," but I for one prefer to focus on current development, not wild speculation based on someone's "I know something you don't know" mantra, especially in the middle of a reasonable discussion. So, do us a favor and post your "hints" in their own posts, so that you don't poison other threads, and so that those of us that don't find it amusing can just ignore the hint threads instead of adding everyone involved to our ignore lists.
|
|
2007-09-06
, 14:38
|
|
Posts: 631 |
Thanked: 1,123 times |
Joined on Sep 2005
@ Helsinki
|
#104
|
Originally Posted by Roc Ingersol
There's been a lot of interesting discussion in this thread certainly, I think Roc has a very interesting post.
I was initially excited for the Touch - then turned off because it junked the camera and bluetooth and didn't have the Classic's HDD. But the more I think about it, the more I'm not interested.
We know the thing's locked down. So there's no expandable memory. No hope for googleGears or even Firefox. No hope for mososo. No hope for internet apps that Apple doesn't care about: VNC, IRC, ssh, UPnP media streaming (kinda necessary with only a few gig of storage), hell: chat is still up in the air. No hope for generic data sharing. No hope for sync'ing media files however-the-hell-i-want. No hope for expanding media format support. No hope for games; aside from what Apple wants to sell.
Honestly, all Nokia needs to do - is get a better camera, better default media player and better UI performance. (GPS wouldn't hurt) Goosed-up overall horsepower would be nice -- I know that's a contentious issue around here, but it's imperative that the UI get faster. The true strength of the touch UI is merely its responsiveness (and the proximity-weighted spelling correction. we seriously need that).
There's kind of two things.
1. What can I do with the device? Does it do the things that I want it to do?
2. How is the UI for doing the things that I want?
Well, actually three things.
3. Bang for buck. How much does it cost? Is a great UI worth so and so much more in cash.
(I'm a Nokia employee, just to state again, this is now my personal opinion.)
I think the iPod Touch is great in the department 2., but I'm not too sure about 1. Or 3. I've been playing around with the iPhone now for some time. The UI isn't perfect, but then again nothing is. It delivers a very nice user experience in nearly all the critical fronts. Kudos to Apple.
Well, but then the iPod. I carry my current 30gb iPod around, and use it to listen to music. It's a focused device. Remember everyone praising Apple for creating focused devices? I guess it also does photos and games and something else, but I never use those features. The scrollwheel is quite nice UI for my iPod. It's "good enough".
The Touch isn't really a focused device so much anymore. It's a media device / web device.
But as a web device it's not really a Great web device. There's no email support, no proper chat support, no voip support, no Flash support etc. The browser has a great UI, but its functionality is limited.
As a media device... Well, do I really need to flip and pan the lists with a touchscreen? It doesn't really improve my music listening experience all that much. It has less capacity for a higher price than just the iPod. For videos it has a bigger screen, but "nobody is watching" videos with that size anyway. (Although the Youtube experience is very nice, yes.)
What is between a focused device and a general multipurpose device? A semi-purpose device?
It's increasingly hard to hit the sweet spot of consumers between giving A Couple Of good features in a competitive package. Especially with a closed solution. With an open solution, and with multiple solutions available, the users can make that choice. With the iPod Touch Apple is making that choice for the users. You want to have the browser, photos, videos, contact book (with no email), calculator, clock... and that's it.
The question can be also phrased in this way: why wouldn't I get the iPod classic, or then the iPhone?
 |
|
2007-09-06
, 14:59
|
|
Posts: 729 |
Thanked: 19 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
|
#105
|
What I find ironic are all the Apple fanbois over at Engadget babbling on about how they need the iPod Touch to have bluetooth to view the pics from their camera phones on a bigger screen, use BT DUN for web browsing on the move, the possibility of VoIP and A2DP, etc.
Gee, if all those features are "important" to them they why the phuck didn't they use Google or something and get an N800 already?
I'll tell you why....because they AREN'T important to them. They want the Touch thing to do MORE than Apple intends it to do and they will be sorely disappointed with it. THOSE are the people Nokia needs to be selling ITs to.
Gee, if all those features are "important" to them they why the phuck didn't they use Google or something and get an N800 already?
I'll tell you why....because they AREN'T important to them. They want the Touch thing to do MORE than Apple intends it to do and they will be sorely disappointed with it. THOSE are the people Nokia needs to be selling ITs to.
 |
|
2007-09-06
, 15:21
|
|
Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
|
#106
|
Gotta agree with ragnar and iball. I'm really thinking the touchscreen for a media player may turn out to be not only overkill but a mistake.
What's so nice about the classic iPod? You can easily navigate features blindly by touch alone. The control is that simple and intuitive. With a touch screen (and here's some irony) you're going to have to look at the device often to navigate. With a computer-class device like the N800 (or similar) that's an expectation and no big deal. With a dedicated media player it just might be.
Again: more hype than practicality in all of this so far. But I'm going to wait-and-see. I have no grudges against Apple or their products and actually hope they do well. If nothing else they certainly inspire and goad other companies...
What's so nice about the classic iPod? You can easily navigate features blindly by touch alone. The control is that simple and intuitive. With a touch screen (and here's some irony) you're going to have to look at the device often to navigate. With a computer-class device like the N800 (or similar) that's an expectation and no big deal. With a dedicated media player it just might be.
Again: more hype than practicality in all of this so far. But I'm going to wait-and-see. I have no grudges against Apple or their products and actually hope they do well. If nothing else they certainly inspire and goad other companies...
|
|
2007-09-06
, 15:26
|
|
Posts: 11,700 |
Thanked: 10,045 times |
Joined on Jun 2006
@ North Texas, USA
|
#107
|
Originally Posted by gnuite
Bait???
I don't mean any disrespect, but actually, this is one of the few cases where the ignore feature doesn't work. You can't just put everyone on your ignore list once they start reacting to your bait. It puts a damper on any pre-existing discussion. Even this response is proof of this, so I'll keep it brief.
Yes, a good many people may appreciate your "hints," but I for one prefer to focus on current development, not wild speculation based on someone's "I know something you don't know" mantra, especially in the middle of a reasonable discussion. So, do us a favor and post your "hints" in their own posts, so that you don't poison other threads, and so that those of us that don't find it amusing can just ignore the hint threads instead of adding everyone involved to our ignore lists.
Another misconception.Tease? Sure. But I'll take your condemnation into consideration, gnuite. There's never been any intent on my part to bait anyone with hints. Just a little playfulness. And although I'm loathe to pander to a minority, I'm not the ******* you and a few others seem to think. I'll rethink my... baiting.
|
|
2007-09-06
, 15:27
|
|
Posts: 334 |
Thanked: 55 times |
Joined on Aug 2007
@ Eastern Ontario, Canada
|
#108
|
Originally Posted by heavyt
I am surprised that no one has picked up on this point.
I wonder when Nokia will cut the price on the N800.
Apple has put them in a position were the N800 will collect dust on the selves if Nokia does not move fast!
I lusted after a NIT for a long time, but I only recently bought one when the N770's went on end of life sale. At $400 they were out of the question, at $149 it became a no brainer for me. I suspect there are lots of folks in this category.
I _hope_ that a $299 Touch will force Nokia to announce an N900 (with at least 8 Gb built-in) for a lot less. And do it soon, Nokia needs to compete for this year's Christmas sales.
I think that it needs to be priced at $199 - Nokia must be able to mass build these devices at least as cheaply as Apple.
Don.
|
|
2007-09-06
, 15:29
|
|
Posts: 729 |
Thanked: 19 times |
Joined on Mar 2007
|
#109
|
I also like the "can it play Doom" comments over there on Engadget.
My N95 plays Quake perfectly, who cares about Doom anymore?
Getting Quake to run on a device is the new standard.
So...who's going to get it to run on the N800? Looking at you, ArnimS.
I have a nice 60GB 5g iPod that usually sits in my car when I'm not loading it up with tunes or changing playlists. I never use the N800 for music or video, I use it for the occasional game but mostly for web browsing and email (Claws mail 3.0) and Skype. Since none of Apple's current or even near-future offerings will do anything of that nature then I'm not buying one.
I would work harder at porting stuff over to the N800 if working with Scratchbox wasn't such a pain-in-the-*ss.
My N95 plays Quake perfectly, who cares about Doom anymore?
Getting Quake to run on a device is the new standard.
So...who's going to get it to run on the N800? Looking at you, ArnimS.
I have a nice 60GB 5g iPod that usually sits in my car when I'm not loading it up with tunes or changing playlists. I never use the N800 for music or video, I use it for the occasional game but mostly for web browsing and email (Claws mail 3.0) and Skype. Since none of Apple's current or even near-future offerings will do anything of that nature then I'm not buying one.
I would work harder at porting stuff over to the N800 if working with Scratchbox wasn't such a pain-in-the-*ss.
|
|
2007-09-06
, 15:31
|
|
Posts: 225 |
Thanked: 68 times |
Joined on Feb 2006
|
#110
|
hey texrat, I wasn't calling YOU blind, I was saying nokia appeared "blind-sided" by Apple, which is a phrase that means something akin to "taken by surprise".
I do actually pay close attention to what you write (one has to in order to read between the lines, no?) - but in this particular case perhaps you should have read my twopenceworth more closely
I do actually pay close attention to what you write (one has to in order to read between the lines, no?) - but in this particular case perhaps you should have read my twopenceworth more closely
If Microsoft had been smart, they would have made the Zune highly-skinnable so that there was no need to introduce that... thing... just sell skins.